Game Thread | Canadiens de Montréal vs. Maple Leafs de Toronto | 11/27/07

[simonus]

Is this sarcasm or literal?

I'm going to go ahead and hope sarcasm

[Habsfan]

And once again am very pissed at the Habs giving other teams to comeback at the end of the game.... it's ridiculous, ain't expecting the team to go the playoffs with every single team out-shooting them.

I believe that is the 5th time this season they have coughed up a goal in the last 5 that broke their back.

Pittsburgh, Florida, Toronto, Ottawa and Toronto. They have stolen exactly one point in this season.

EXACTLY! That's at least 6 points they've given up to other teams in their conference by blowing the lead (Toronto 2pts, Florida 2pts, Pittsburgh 1 point, Toronto 1 point) had we not played "sitting on the lead hockey" we could have prevented these teams from accumulating extra points. THese points can come and bite us in the butt at the end of the year!

On another subject, has anyone checked out the Habs players' statitics on ESPN.com? Have any of you checked the +/- column? I am very concerned. WE only have 5 players who are on the + side (Hamrlik, Chipchura, Bégin, Kostitsyn and Brisebois). Bouillon and Kostopoulos are even and the rest of the team is in the "minus" column. This is definitely not good news. Solid players are not doing well (Markov: -6, Smolinski: -5, Plex: -4, Kovy: -3)! Another important point, just before the game, RDS announced that the Habs had scored 29 goals at 5 on 5...they are ranked 30th in the league.

These 2 statistics say alot about a team. How can we exepct our boys to make the playoffs when they are ranked 30th in the league at 5 on 5? A team plays the majority of its games at 5 on 5, if we are ranked 30th, how are we supposed to succeed? Many teams are being told by their coaches not to take penalties against the Habs, and it showed for a little while at the beginning of the month. Another point we can't forget is that we can't expect the PP to continue to run at 30%. Already it has dropped to 26.8% and I expect that by mid-season it will have settled to about 24%, which is still good, but it won't have as much of an impact on the game. Our boys can'T just sit around and wait for PP opportunities, we need to be more agressive...especially when we are protecting a 1 goal lead in the third. I find that our players, more often than not, are too passive in their zone. Toronto spent most of the night in our zone last night. THey controled the puck for most of the game. WE were just lucky that they took too many penalties and Kovalev was on fire last night. WE got away with 2 points when we shouldn't have gotten any!

Some of you might find that i'm being too negative, but I think I'm more of a realist. If the boys don't start scoring 5 on 5, i predict we will have the same kind of "choke-fest" as we saw after Dec. 23rd last year.

I hope it doesn'T happen, but until they figure out how to score 5 on 5...i will remain very worried!!!

Edited November 29, 2007 by Habsfan

[Habsfan]

Lats looked like a run of the mill, 4th line player added to a struggling line. He took poor angle shots all night. He ran around in the corners. He didn't scare anyone. He didn't have any real dangerous offensive moves. He didn't generate changes.

His one goal was the result of Koivu going hard to the net and making a mess of things. Lats merely bashed at the puck and was lucky it trickled in.

While he didn't hurt the line, I hardly thought they were dangerous at all. In fact, the Ryder, Dandy, Chips line was far more dangerous all night int he offensive end.

If people think Lats is the answer to the 1st line in the long term, Lafleur will be right. We need Ryder going and we need Koivu and Higgins to pick up their games. That line should be flying in the other end creating dangerous scoring chances, not just grinding out a garbage goal once in a while.

Even TSN said last night that the Pleks, Kosty, and Kovalev line is the number one line in Montreal. The main reason is because Kovalev is playing like a number one line winger for the first time in a long time.

At the end of the day, they got 2 of the 3 goals (on the PP) and both goals in the shootout.

This talk of Lats reminds me of Leaf fans drooling on about Antropov for 5 years...

WOW! What game were you watching buddy? Lats created some chances for Koivu early in the game. He sent the puck to koivu who was in front of the net, after having fought two leaf players for the puck along the boards. Koivu couldn'T score, but it was a decent chance!

You say Ryder played well??? Again what game were you watching. Ryder finished the night with a -2, and lost the puck at least 9 or 10 times. Not what I wouold call NHL caliber.

Your entire post gives me the impression that you did not watch the game!

Im not saying that Lats played the game of his life, but he definitely did better than Ryder, and deserves at least a few other games on the first line! Even Higgins and Koivu said after the game that the fact the Lats can play along the boards allows the line to more of an offensive threat. Because before they used to be a "one shot threat", meaning as soon as they manage to take a shot on net, the other team would more often than not take control of the puck. But with Lats playing with them, it allowed them to continue buzzing around Toskala's net for longer periods of time!

[Mont Royale]

Some of you might find that i'm being too negative, but I think I'm more of a realist. If the boys don't start scoring 5 on 5, i predict we will have the same kind of "choke-fest" as we saw after Dec. 23rd last year.

I hope it doesn'T happen, but until they figure out how to score 5 on 5...i will remain very worried!!!

I'm on your side. Although the team has changed somewhat from last year, a couple things remain the same:

- over-reliance on the powerplay for offence

- over-reliance on exceptional goaltending (mind you, I love that Price and Huet are playing so well, but a truly dangerous/contending team has more than that going for them). If one or the other, or both, slip even slightly, so will the Habs.

I thought Lats was OK on the Koivu line, and would like to see that experiment continued. He should get even better as he becomes more comfortable with his linemates.

Plekanecs has more to give, and I'd like to see him start giving it.

I thought Brisebois played with some smarts and composure, defensively. A pleasant surprise.

I hope O'Byrne is progressing quickly, because many of the defencemen we have cannot handle the Leafs forwards.

[Neech]

This was Ryder's best game in a while. Like someone mentioned, the -2 doesn't tell the story.

[BCHabnut]

I thought Lats did his job yesterday. He's a big guy who needs to keep his play along the boards and win puck battles. The more he does that, the more he will improve at it. It drives me nuts when he tries dangling in the middle of the ice like Kovy. If you are alone, take it to the boards and protect until you can give it to Koivu, then get in front of the net. Look at Holmstrom. He isn't fancy or overly skilled, but he is a key guy for Detroit, because he knows how to play his best game. Big in front of the net and strong on the boards. This is how I would like to see Lats develop. Again, I think Lats did exactly what he needs to do to develop his game.

[Wamsley01]

I'm on your side. Although the team has changed somewhat from last year, a couple things remain the same:

- over-reliance on the powerplay for offence

- over-reliance on exceptional goaltending (mind you, I love that Price and Huet are playing so well, but a truly dangerous/contending team has more than that going for them). If one or the other, or both, slip even slightly, so will the Habs.

I thought Lats was OK on the Koivu line, and would like to see that experiment continued. He should get even better as he becomes more comfortable with his linemates.

Plekanecs has more to give, and I'd like to see him start giving it.

I thought Brisebois played with some smarts and composure, defensively. A pleasant surprise.

I hope O'Byrne is progressing quickly, because many of the defencemen we have cannot handle the Leafs forwards.

I think some people are jumping the gun here. Does anybody here expect this team to be contending this year?

I am just looking for positive strides forward. And the only thing that worries me is their flaws from last year seem to be the flaws from this year. I in no way expect this team to be contending.

I want improvement, and if they finish in the exact same spot as last year I will be dissappointed, but if that 10th place finish includes Price becoming the starter, Plekanec getting 20 more points than last year, Kostitsyn getting 50 points, Komisarek continuing to improve etc etc I will be happy.

But this lack of effort, reliance on PP and stand on your head goaltending concerns me.

[Habsfan84]

The Habs should have of won it in regulation but it is still a huge win for us.

[ShortHanded]

But this lack of effort, reliance on PP and stand on your head goaltending concerns me[/b].

yup. That's basically the problem right there.

[BTH]

I thought the first fourth line did a lot better without Ryder around. Gui played one of his best games of the year. The second fourth line was pretty good, especially on the powerplay. Kovalev was a beast, Kostitsyn worked well and Plekanec played so-so. The third fourth line was pretty useless. Maybe Ryder is the kiss of death? Dandenault gave in the same performance he gave in all the other 23 games, he was flying around. The other two guys on his line played okay but were pretty much invisible. The fourth and final fourth line was good. They were maybe the best line at handling the big forwards down low and even generated some offensive opportunities.

The second backup goaltender did very well and overall, we played a good game and deserved the win, but we've gotta stop handing out those freebie points. When you're winning with 18 seconds left in the game, it's your responsibility to play with some desperation and close it out.

[KoZed]

About Lats vs Ryder...

Ryder = 367:16 total minutes played = 15:18 ice-time per game in average this season = 3 goals = about 1 goal every 122 minutes played

Lats = 275:50 total minutes played = 12:32 ice-time per game in average this season = 5 goals = about 1 goal every 55 minutes played

When the team is struggling to score, go with the numbers...

[Wamsley01]

About Lats vs Ryder...

Ryder = 367:16 total minutes played = 15:18 ice-time per game in average this season = 3 goals = about 1 goal every 122 minutes played

Lats = 275:50 total minutes played = 12:32 ice-time per game in average this season = 5 goals = about 1 goal every 55 minutes played

When the team is struggling to score, go with the numbers...

I find it amazing the heat that Lats takes. The kid is 20 years old, he was picked 45th overall, he put up a respectable 16 goal season as a rookie and has played exclusively on the lower lines this year and is on pace for 17 goals this season. Yet people seem to have labeled him as a career 3rd liner already.

I am convinced that he needs to be placed on a scoring line to make him productive. Neely needed Oates/Janney, Andreychuk needed Turgeon/Lafontaine, Bertuzzi needed Naslund. I am not comparing him to those players in skill but in reliance on someone to get him the puck. Lats is not good with the puck so he needs to go up and down the wing, dig in the corners and get into scoring positions. He has good hands, he is not Kostopolous.

Without a centre to get him the puck he will do all those things with no results, but place him with Koivu and Higgins and the defense keys on them, Lats will then find himself open. I think he is a better fit for that line and am excited to see the results.

Edited November 29, 2007 by Wamsley01

[JMMR]

I agree Wamsley Gui is so young still and bigger players take longer to adapt. Look no further than Jordan Stall how is he doing this year points wise?

I will not beocme critical of Gui for at least another year and a half, as for now I am happy to watch him progress and learn when to pick his spots.

[Habsfan]

I find it amazing the heat that Lats takes. The kid is 20 years old, he was picked 45th overall, he put up a respectable 16 goal season as a rookie and has played exclusively on the lower lines this year and is on pace for 17 goals this season. Yet people seem to have labeled him as a career 3rd liner already.

I am convinced that he needs to be placed on a scoring line to make him productive. Neely needed Oates/Janney, Andreychuk needed Turgeon/Lafontaine, Bertuzzi needed Naslund. I am not comparing him to those players in skill but in reliance on someone to get him the puck. Lats is not good with the puck so he needs to go up and down the wing, dig in the corners and get into scoring positions. He has good hands, he is not Kostopolous.

Without a centre to get him the puck he will do all those things with no results, but place him with Koivu and Higgins and the defense keys on them, Lats will then find himself open. I think he is a better fit for that line and am excited to see the results.

Ppower forwards always take more time to develop than smaller skilled players(john Leclair anyone!?!?! ) Give Lats time to adjust to his new linemates. If Lats plays on the first line all year, he'll score 30!

[BCHabnut]

Ppower forwards always take more time to develop than smaller skilled players(john Leclair anyone!?!?! ) Give Lats time to adjust to his new linemates. If Lats plays on the first line all year, he'll score 30!

He needs to keep his play along the boards when he is in puck posession. Pass it then get to the net. Forget about the middle ice fancy moves.

[BTH]

Latendresse is the right guy for this line. Carbo just has to let them gel for a few games and we'll start seeing results (though I guess we already have since it's 1 goal after 1 game).