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NBA Trade Deadline (rumours and discussion)


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Fortunately, there will be a trade deadline to fuss over, as the NBA trade deadline is Thursday at 3 PM ET. Sadly, it isn't like the NHL where there's 20+ trades on D-day alone, not to mention other moves on the days leading up to it. However, there is some hope that there will be some deals of significance tomorrow. Here's some of the stuff being rumoured:

- Carlos Boozer to the Lakers for a package including Caron Butler.

- Michael Redd is being pursued by no fewer than 8 teams that I know of, Milwaukee wants expiring contracts in return.

- Donyell Marshall to either Miami, Philly, and now New York is reportedly in the mix (big surprise there). (Don't believe the NO rumour, it makes no sense for Toronto, and very little for the Hornets either.) Toronto reportedly wants either a good young player, or a first rounder. Eric Williams also may be moved, Seattle may be interested there.

- Miami wants to sign Alonzo Mourning, but they need to move a player to get him. Expect either a 2 for 1 deal, a player for pick move, or a buyout of Wesley Person to come in the next little while. The Heat are reportedly interested in acquiring Steve Smith from Charlotte, but don't have much to offer up salary wise.

- The Knicks are looking to add another proven scorer (with a hefty contract of course). Possible fits include Toronto's Jalen Rose, or Sacramento's Chris Weber. They reportedly also want Redd, but have nothing that Milwaukee would want, unless they'd be willing to part ways with Mike Sweetney.

- Atlanta's Antoine Walker is on the block, but he has a big contract, so suitors outside the Knicks are limited.

- Other prominent names that may be moved: Gary Payton (BOS), Latrell Sprewell/Sam Cassell (MIN), Damon Stoudamire/Nick Van Exel (POR), Keith Van Horn (MIL)

Here's a link that brings us all the up-to-date rumours. Currently being shown are a blockbuster between the Bucks and Blazers including Redd and Abdur-Rahim, a multi-player deal between the Raps and Pacers (where'd that come from?), and the Knicks supposedly close to acquiring many stars for junk (don't believe it).

http://www.hoopshype.com/rumors.htm

Hey, it may not be hockey, but it's trade talk at least. Tomorrow (or Friday), I'll update this with a list of deals made. If another mod wants to do it ahead of time, go ahead, but keep the rumours up as well, I'm curious to see how many come to fruition.

[Edited on 2005/2/23 by dlbalr]

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C-Web is now a Sixer

"Philadelphia got Weber, one of the NBA's elite power forwards and a five-time All-Star, along with reserve forwards Matt Barnes and Michael Bradley. The Sixers gave up relatively little in return, sending veteran forwards Corliss Williamson, Kenny Thomas and Brian Skinner to the Kings."

Surely they could have gotten more for C-Web. I know it was hard to move his contract, but surely they could have made a more even deal than this.

With regards to the Michael Redd situation, the Cavs make the most sense. He was born in Ohio, played college in Ohio, and would love to play second fiddle to LeBron (so he has said). Redd is an UFA after the season and it is very likely he'll sign with the Cavs. That leads me to believe they would offer the most for him, so they can both make a run this year and have the good possibility of resigning him,

[Edited on 2-24-05 by Fanpuck33]

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You're a bit off on the lineup sakiqc, remember, Thomas was traded for C-Webb.

PG-Iverson

SG-Iguodala

SF-Korver

PF-Weber

C-Dalembert (or Jackson)

10 trades in total today, I'll add them in a bit, and my comments on each too.

[Edited on 2005/2/25 by dlbalr]

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1) SAC trades F Chris Weber, F Matt Barnes, and F/C Michael Bradley to PHI for PF Kenny Thomas, F/C Brian Skinner, and F Corliss Williamson. 76ers waive F Kedrick Brown, place F Josh Davis on IL.

Sacramento needed to turf Weber and soon. Reports were swirling that he was a locker room cancer, and the fact was, they had too many scorers! Bibby, Mobley, Peja, and Miller all could put up 20-30 nightly. They get a boost to their bench, and boy did they need it. Philly meanwhile, gets Weber, which should give them a push for 3rd in the East.

2) BOS trades G/F Jiri Welsch to CLE for a 2007 1st rounder.

Welsch lost his starting spot to Tony Allen a while back, and with all the youngsters on the Celts, he was expendable. The Cavs meanwhile, desperately needed a quality shooter, Sasha Pavlovic just doesn't cut it. Not a big move, but it's what the Cavs needed, especially since they didn't land Redd.

3) NO trades F Jamal Mashburn and F Rodney Rogers to PHI for F Glenn Robinson.

First off, Mashburn and Robinson are done for the year, so in other words, NO moved Rogers for cap space. Yeehaw.

4) MIL trades PG Mike James and F/C Zendon Hamilton to HOU for G Reece Gaines, and 2006 and 2007 2nd round picks.

With Sura out for a few weeks, the Rockets needed another PG (Rod Strickland is history, period). Nothing else really to say about this, although I'm miffed that Houston moved a full MLE trade exception here as well.

5) Milwaukee trades F Keith Van Horn to DAL for C Calvin Booth, F Alan Henderson, and cash. Bucks waive Henderson the next day.

Calvin Booth, and Alan Henderson, wow, what a pile of useless trash. The cash is minimal, so why'd the Bucks do this? Dallas gets a big steal here.

6) SA trades F Malik Rose and two 1st rounders to the Knicks for C Nazr Mohammed and G Jamison Brewer. Spurs waive Brewer the next day.

Zuh? Am I missing something here? The Knicks want to play Kurt Thomas at C again? 1st rounders are OK, but they'll be 25th or worse most likely, so it's not something to cheer about. All hail the return of Bruno Sundov!

7) Houston trades F Maurice Taylor and a 1st round pick to NYK for F Vin Baker and G Moochie Norris.

Everyone must remember where they were when Moochie was traded. Why? I don't know. I just like the name Moochie. This is a better deal for NYK, but they assume another big contract (Rose's is too), and get another pick. Just a salary dump for Houston's part, they add depth they really didn't need.

8) BOS trades PG Gary Payton, C Yogi Stewart, Tom Gugliotta, a first round pick to ATL for F Antoine Walker.

This is going to be fun. First, Ainge's "Braintyping" says Walker's no good for the team, so he trades him, and then a year and a half later, he gets him back. Payton meanwhile, won't report, so this'll get interesting. As a Raptor fan, I'm hopeful Yogi gets some PT in ATL, I miss hearing "We have a Yogi sighting."

9) Golden State trades F Eduardo Najera, G Luis Flores and a 1st rounder to Denver for F Nikoloz Tskitishvili and F Rodney White.

I'm stunned why Golden State did this, Najera's good, Skitty bites, and White's no good either. Flores meanwhile, is a young guard with some potential, and to lose a 1st on top of this? Ouch.

10) Golden State trades PG Speedy Claxton and C Dale Davis to New Orleans for PG Baron Davis.

Golden State's making a run for something I see. What it is, I don't know. Davis is an elite PG...who gets hurt more than VC did in Toronto, and has 50 mil left on his deal UNINSURED. Davis and J-Rich make a strong backcourt, if only they still had a centre (they've traded both in the last 2 weeks). New Orleans gets rid of Davis, good for them.

11) Charlotte trades G Steve Smith to Miami for F Malik Allen and cash considerations. Heat to waive Wesley Person, to sign C Alonzo Mourning. Bobcats place G Matt Carroll on IL. SAT-Heat place Smith on IL.

Well the Heat got Smith, a proven scorer who adds some depth. That cash consideration must be high though, as the salaries aren't that close.

Other thoughts about other deals that didn't go down:

- It became evident that Redd wanted to play out the year in MIL, he certainly hasn't ruled out re-signing there yet either, unlike...

- Donyell Marshall, who will not be back with Toronto next year, was not moved, surprising many. Reports in T.O. say that Cleveland made a strong push for him, but they didn't have all that much to offer (Newble, Pavlovic, Diop, maybe the injured Jackson.) Toronto will take the cap space instead, and they need it.

- I'm surprised at Minnesota's inactivity, I really thought they'd make some sort of deal to shake things up, as firing Flip hasn't done too much for them.

- All in all, a pretty exciting deadline, more trades than many expected, given the CBA is expiring in the offseason. Unlike the NHL though, they're actually close to an agreement, and both sides acknowledge it.

(edit: adding 11th trade)

[Edited on 2005/2/26 by dlbalr]

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Originally posted by dlbalr

Sacramento needed to turf Weber and soon. Reports were swirling that he was a locker room cancer, and the fact was, they had too many scorers! Bibby, Mobley, Peja, and Miller all could put up 20-30 nightly. They get a boost to their bench, and boy did they need it. Philly meanwhile, gets Weber, which should give them a push for 3rd in the East.

Even with the team they still have, I don't understand how they didn't get more for him. He is an elite player, and they got nothing close to an elite player in return, not even a future 1st rounder or anything.

Calvin Booth, and Alan Henderson, wow, what a pile of useless trash. The cash is minimal, so why'd the Bucks do this? Dallas gets a big steal here.

It was a wash in terms of money . . . for this season. Henderson's contract expires, while Booth is owed about 6 million. That frees up around 7 million in cap room for the Bucks, who will use the money to try and make sure Redd stays put.

This is going to be fun. First, Ainge's "Braintyping" says Walker's no good for the team, so he trades him, and then a year and a half later, he gets him back. Payton meanwhile, won't report, so this'll get interesting.

I agree, this one is quite strange. I heard Payton's contract will be bought out, will become a FA, and may actually wind up back in Boston. That just doesn't seem fair.

Golden State's making a run for something I see. What it is, I don't know. Davis is an elite PG...who gets hurt more than VC did in Toronto, and has 50 mil left on his deal UNINSURED. Davis and J-Rich make a strong backcourt, if only they still had a centre (they've traded both in the last 2 weeks). New Orleans gets rid of Davis, good for them.

If Davis were insured, this trade would be a steal for the Warriors. Davis is washed up and Speedy is no Baron Davis. Also, they did trade two centers, but they still have Adonal Foyle at C, and with the new lineup they've been using, Troy Murphy may be moving to C.

Bobcats place G Matt Carroll on IL.

That is weird, they just signed Carrol on Wednesday, then all of a sudden he heads to the IL. Disappointing for me, I am a Carrol fan. The man can flat out shoot.

By the way, this was the busiest deadline day in the NBA since 1987.

(Damn the NHL, for leaving me to have to follow the NBA)

[Edited on 2-25-05 by Fanpuck33]

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Don't read too much into the 'Cats placing Carroll on the IL. Because they traded Smith (who curiously was IL'ed when they signed Carroll) for a healthy body in Malik Allen, they had to put someone else on the injured list. Carroll, having been there for all of 18 hours, seems to be the logical choice, rather than IL'ing Bernard Robinson Jr., who's played well lately.

Other info in trades that I missed earlier:

-Spurs trade 2 first rounders to the Knicks as part of the Mohammed deal. The deal now makes some more sense for Isiah and Co.

- Also traded as part of the DEN/GS deal: G Luis Flores also moves to Denver. The trade now makes even less sense to me.

-A few players were waived upon being acquired: G Jamison Brewer (SA), F Alan Henderson (MIL), and Kedrick Brown (PHI). Although it hasn't happened yet, I still can say with surety that someone will be waived from the Heat soon (likely Person), and Mourning will be signed.

These notes have been added to the trade page.

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Philly and Boston made some solid moves. I cannot understand Toronto. They gave Carter away for nothing, and they didn't trade Marshall who's a UFA. I know for a fact alot of teams were trying to pick him up. Seems to me like Toronto's GM was scared of moving him simply cuz he was afarid of the criticism.

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Originally posted by dlbalr

Don't read too much into the 'Cats placing Carroll on the IL. Because they traded Smith (who curiously was IL'ed when they signed Carroll) for a healthy body in Malik Allen, they had to put someone else on the injured list. Carroll, having been there for all of 18 hours, seems to be the logical choice, rather than IL'ing Bernard Robinson Jr., who's played well lately.

Still, it seems odd that they would sign a guy and immediately IL him. Was he already injured when they signed him, and they knew they could IL him? The kid was dominating the NBDL, leading the league in scoring and shooting around 60% from behind the arc. (Note, in the NBDl, apparently threes only count in the last few minutes and overtime, making his 38/62 that much more impressive, as he's nailing threes in the clutch.)

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Originally posted by Leafs Suck

Philly and Boston made some solid moves. I cannot understand Toronto. They gave Carter away for nothing, and they didn't trade Marshall who's a UFA. I know for a fact alot of teams were trying to pick him up. Seems to me like Toronto's GM was scared of moving him simply cuz he was afarid of the criticism.

In Babcock's (Toronto GM) case, it may have been he was afraid of the criticism, or it could've been that what he was being offered was bupkus, likely because of the VC deal. Some of the rumblings that I'd heard about was that Miami was offering Wesley Person and another no-namer for D-Marsh. No reason to accept that. Indiana reportedly offered Austin Croshere, a decent player, who also has a fairly hefty contract, which the Raps have enough of already.

I'm sure Toronto tried hard to find a suitable deal for Marshall, but they didn't. What's the worst that happens here-Marshall walks at the end of the year, and the Raps get cap space. And, they get to keep him to try for a playoff spot too. Considering the above alternatives, I'm glad he simply stayed the course.

Originally posted by Fanpuck33

Still, it seems odd that they would sign a guy and immediately IL him. Was he already injured when they signed him, and they knew they could IL him? The kid was dominating the NBDL, leading the league in scoring and shooting around 60% from behind the arc. (Note, in the NBDl, apparently threes only count in the last few minutes and overtime, making his 38/62 that much more impressive, as he's nailing threes in the clutch.)

It's obviously doable, or else it wouldn't have happened, although it is fishy, especially since Charlotte signed another guard today, and waived Jahidi White (who's done for the year.) New York also pulled this off just today as well. Yesterday they signed C Jackie Butler (who?) for the remainder of the season. Today, they IL'ed him and signed G Jermaine Jackson. Why? I have no clue.

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What would be ridiculous is if Payton is able to pass through waivers far enough for the Celtics to pick him back up, assumuning he never puts on a Hawks jersey. That just would not be fair.

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Austin Croshere

That would have been a solid pick up, however the Raps have Cb4 and Bonner at PF.

Miami apprently offered Michael Doleac and Philly offered Sam Dalembert. Dalembert is having a decent season, he's still young and the Raps sure could use a decent C. Haffa is just not doing it. It was a huge mistake to draft him. Imagine the Raps right now with Iguodala?

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Originally posted by Leafs Suck
Austin Croshere

That would have been a solid pick up, however the Raps have Cb4 and Bonner at PF.

Miami apprently offered Michael Doleac and Philly offered Sam Dalembert. Dalembert is having a decent season, he's still young and the Raps sure could use a decent C. Haffa is just not doing it. It was a huge mistake to draft him. Imagine the Raps right now with Iguodala?

From what I read, Philly didn't offer Dalembert straight up, or else I think Toronto may have made the move. However, Sammy is a restricted free agent at year's end, and will command big bucks, more than Toronto could handle. And since he doesn't make much this season, Toronto's cap relief wouldn't have been as high.

As for Bonner, he may not be back either as he too is an RFA, and will get lots of offers, however, I think Toronto will make an effort to match.

I'm not overly impressed with Hoffa, but I'm not giving up on him. The fact that he continues to start says something, what it is, I'm not sure. I see his ceiling as a legitimate backup centre in a few years. I can see Babcock putting pressure on Aaron Williams to forego his $3.3 mil option to get out of town, and then try to make a pitch at another C in the offseason.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I am sure that NY would have taken Donyell for Nazr straight up. That trade could have helped the Raps. Nazr is having a strong season. They need a C who can play decent minutes. Woods is an okay bench C but not a starter. Haffa is gonna need to have a monster year next year for my opinion to change.

This team could definitely have made the playoffs if:

-Babcock signed a strong defensive player like Theo Ratliff

-Babcock got proper value for VC. I am positive that the Knicks would have caved eventually and TO would have ended up with a decent player or players. Someone along the likes of Crawford, Mohammad and maybe Thomas if you throw in Donyell.

Babcock and Babcock alone in the reason they're not in the playoffs. They have some talent on this team and with the addition of a marquee scorer and a good defensive player in exchange for Carter, I have no doubt they'd be #8 right now (atleast).

[Edited on 2005/3/14 by Leafs Suck]

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Originally posted by Leafs Suck

I am sure that NY would have taken Donyell for Nazr straight up. That trade could have helped the Raps. Nazr is having a strong season.  They need a C who can play decent minutes. Woods is an okay bench C but not a starter. Haffa is gonna need to have a monster year next year for my opinion to change.

The Knicks wanted 1st round picks, they got 2 for Nazr. Donyell is not as good as 2 firsts, and an overpaid PF when your owner has a bottomless pocket. Besides, Nazr's hurt, and seeing very limited minutes, how effective could he have been in Toronto now?

This team could definitely have made the playoffs if:

-Babcock signed a strong defensive player like Theo Ratliff

If Ratliff would've hit the free agent market, I'd agree with you, but he didn't. He signed a multi-year extension worth 9-11 mil per season back in Atlanta last season. Truth is, there weren't many good free agent centres on the market.

-Babcock got proper value for VC. I am positive that the Knicks would have caved eventually and TO would have ended up with a decent player or players. Someone along the likes of Crawford, Mohammad and maybe Thomas if you throw in Donyell.

I agree, the Knicks would've caved, but not for that much. Crawford, Mohammed and KT (there's 2 Thomas's on the team) would've been too much for Carter based on his play at the time. And, suppose they would've caved, even for that deal. It wouldn't have been right away (say 6 more weeks), and by then, the Raps are 15 below .500 (they are right around .500 since the trade, well below before).

Babcock and Babcock alone in the reason they're not in the playoffs. They have some talent on this team and with the addition of a marquee scorer and a good defensive player in exchange for Carter, I have no doubt they'd be #8 right now (atleast).

I agree with most of that, there is a fair bit of talent on the squad, but who'd trade a marquee scorer and a good defensive player for a 15 PPG player who's whining and moaning, AND, has 4 more years left on his deal after this one, at 13+ mil per season (and rising)? No one, and Carter's play wouldn't have risen to the level it's at today.

Babcock wants to build this team around CB4, trading VC went a long way to do that. However, his legacy on this team depends on who the Raps get out of these 2 picks, 1 this year, 1 next. If either of those guys turns into a legit player who can put up decent numbers (12-16 PPG), the trade will work out, as now the Raps have the bling bling to re-sign Bosh in 2 years.

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Well according to the Torotno Star, a Hornet source says New Orleans offered Magloire and Mashburn (salary dump) for VC. BUT Babcock turned it down. Their goes his excuse that "their was no other deals out there". Magloire is the best young C in the East and after Yao, the best in the league. He's a Toronto boy and wants to play here. So why the HELL didn't Babcock make that move? I know why. Cuz making a move like that would admit Haffa is a bust. So Babcock is trying to save face. Ugh, what a disgrace.

They also reported that two other league sources told them that Seattle offered Antonio Daniels and the 12th pick last year for the 8th pick. And once again Babcock turned it down. I know what it was. He thought that someone would pick Haffa before 12 and he just couldn't let'em go. Haffa is projected to be a 2nd rounder. So even if Babcock was stupid enough to take'em at 12, atleast they could have had a solid player like Antonio Daniels.

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Originally posted by Leafs Suck

Well according to the Torotno Star, a Hornet source says New Orleans offered Magloire and Mashburn (salary dump) for VC. BUT Babcock turned it down. Their goes his excuse that "their was no other deals out there". Magloire is the best young C in the East and after Yao, the best in the league. He's a Toronto boy and wants to play here. So why the HELL didn't Babcock make that move? I know why. Cuz making a move like that would admit Haffa is a bust. So Babcock is trying to save face. Ugh, what a disgrace.

They also reported that two other league sources told them that Seattle offered Antonio Daniels and the 12th pick last year for the 8th pick. And once again Babcock turned it down. I know what it was. He thought that someone would pick Haffa before 12 and he just couldn't let'em go. Haffa is projected to be a 2nd rounder. So even if Babcock was stupid enough to take'em at 12, atleast they could have had a solid player like Antonio Daniels.

I agree that Magloire is one of the better centres in the league, but not #2 behind Yao. There's Shaq, Brad Miller, Amare Stoudamire (a PF playing at C now), Big Ben Wallace, and Ilgauskas who are the elite (plus Mags of course), not to mention guys like Camby, Curry, and Dampier, and guys like Duncan and Nowitski who also see time at C as well. But your point's well taken nonetheless, particularly with the young aspect.

As for that alleged 2 for 1, it doesn't work salary wise. Mashburn and Magloire make upwards of 20 mil, while VC's on the hook for 13 this season, all deals must be within 15%. So who else had to be thrown in? There aren't too many guys on Toronto that fit in that 5-7 million bracket (Alston, Marshall, Murray, and Peterson), and only Marshall could be moved (Alston-no good with Baron Davis there at the time, Murray-who wants him, Peterson-couldn't be dealt to NO until July 31/05 after signing an offer sheet there but then was matched...hey, that wasn't a bad move after all by Babs! Wow) :)

In regards to the alleged Seattle offer, it wouldn't have done much good for the Raps IMO. Daniels is decent, but he's backing up Luke Ridnour, who certainly isn't hall-of-fame material, in fact, barely starting material. Moving down 4 spots isn't bad, but let's assume Toronto was picking a C for sure, and Hoffa was off the table. Then, the next best option is Andris Biedrins, who went to Golden State, and has produced less than Araujo. If they had done this deal (if it was offered), it also means they wouldn't have Rafer, I'll leave that to you if it's good or bad.

As for Matt Carroll, as soon as I saw his name go by, the first person I thought of was Fanpuck and how he was pushing for him to get a shot.

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Originally posted by dlbalr

As for Matt Carroll, as soon as I saw his name go by, the first person I thought of was Fanpuck and how he was pushing for him to get a shot.

The only Notre Dame guard people ever talk about is Chris Thomas, who peaked his freshman year. His first game as a freshman, he got a triple double. In a quadruple overtime thriller, he played all 60 minutes with just one turnover. Too bad his sophomore, junior, and senior year didn't go as well. He began to think he was God's gift to basketball, tried to do it all himself.

Meanwhile, while Chris Thomas was peaking, Matt Carroll was finishing up a solid career at Notre Dame, leaving as one of the school's best pure shooters of all time.

By the way, Matt's little brother was Co-Player of the year in the Atlantic 10 this season, a teammate of last year's Co-National Player of the Year, Jameer Nelson.

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