REV-G Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 We're hearing that Atlanta is trying to resign Ilya Kovalchuk but that they have a self imposed deadline for signing him. If they aren't able to sign him it is reported they will trade him so they don't lose him for nothing like Hossa. So if they are not able to to resign him, and really this should already have happened, I wonder what it would take for us to get him. Would a 1st round pick, Halak plus one of our top defencemen not named Markov get it done? Would it be do-able for us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 While he is UFA and that makes a player's value less than normal, I'm still not sure that's enough to get it done. More to the point, we couldn't do it because of cap considerations. There's no way we could even attempt to resign Kovalchuk unless Hamr was the defender going the other way, and even then it's marginal at the very, very best. I don't think Bob would make that decision unless he had the opportunity to negotiate with Kovalchuk before the trade, anyhow, because I don't think this is the year to gamble for the Cup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bar Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Can there be a conditional trade be done, taking into account if Kovulchuk resigns with us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Can there be a conditional trade be done, taking into account if Kovulchuk resigns with us? There are a few possibilities in that regard. One would be that a draft pick comes our way in the way. If he resigns, we get a low pick or no pick. If he doesn't resign, then we get a higher pick. Another possibility would be us sending Atlanta a pick. It would obviously work the opposite way. The best option, in my opinion, would be to get permission to talk contract with him before finalizing the trade and have everything all lined up at once. All that being said, I see this as being extremely unlikely unless Gomez and Hamrlik are both involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir_Boagalott Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 If Atl self imposed deadline is soon as apposed to waiting for the trade deadline it would be stupid IMHO. At the trade deadline theres more desperate teams and teams knowing they can make a legit run at the Cup who would be willing to pay a higher premium at the deadline for such a player. Kovalchuck is most likely the most coveted UFA this summer. Even at 10 mil/year I wouldnt be surprised if his agent is the most contacted guy on July 1st. Kovalchuck could literally pick anywhere he wants, theres not many teams that would say no, even if they have cap issues, other people would be moved to fit him in. I'd love to see him with the Habs, but I highly doubt the Habs would win any bidding war trade wise or UFA bidding wise unless he truly wants to play in Montreal, which could be possible. Dont forget S Kosts is going to call him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehjay Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 I think another side of this move that needs a little attention can be viewed as: Can we get him for peanuts (or for something reasonable, note of bad e.g.: Pens in the Hossa move) and keep him like Calgary did with Bowmister (many apologies for my many mistakes in speling) ? Cuz IF as a player he wants: to play for a cup contending team, well honestly HE would make us a legit one (once Markov is back And Gionta AND...) a team with a winning tradition... or crazy attention on his game.... or the treatment off a (add name of your hero here)... or want to live in a city that rival some of the best city's in Europe AND in N.A. (please don't forget there is always an exeption that makes this last statement a rule. )... and I honestly believe the list can go on; then he will not be better served then here in La Ville C'est Hockey I will chose to not reserve the same attention to the 'negatives' cuz I think most off it is just bull (french is my fourth language and yeah it took me 5 almost 6 years to understand but...), like I said earlier IF as a player he wants... then he must just come to the realization that most of the 'negatives' are just the realities of having all the things he wants as a player AND the most important part: :hlogo: RULE! So long post short... This move has alot of monatary issues that would need to be settled and value of assets to be dettermined on both sides and agreed upon as exchangeble as fair, in addition to all the queries about nego right pre-trade. As some of my previous posters believe this last asset move (cuz love or hate it this is an asset the opposing team has) can be a deal buster. I think we should try to use it as a token to lower assets going their way (as Calgary did) before the trade. As to post trade well that is a whole other ball game, again the cap space and whole wack of things come in play. Since someone (sorry I do not remember your name) mentioned that we are not cup contenders this year (you should wash your mouth with soap 24 times and rince only with your saliva, kid) then I would like you to remember the the laffs are maybe overnight loosers but they have been working hard at staying that way and for that we should ALL keep laughing at them, and as such MY HABS are cup contenders every year even if Mario Tremblay is behind the bench and Peanut is GM and we get @$$ hair for St. Pat (and YES I still think that we should put an * next to his number up there in the temple, just incase there is one day a player like the GREAT Mario Lemieux OR Bobby Orr that would like the number 33 to give without asking. I'm not saying don't let it hang up there just put an *. Dude, he quit!His words, period for me). HE would make us cup contenders as soon as Markov is back and we manage to have a little miracle in the progression of some kid(s) somewhere, cuz we are gonna have some whole(s) somewhere if not just to welcome his salary. Kovalchuck is a player that would make any team better and if Mr Bob can pull the trigger on him, I am 100% sure he is thinking how to get him to stay after july1st, I just hope tht his plan works. As we have seen in resent past (supposedly: Lecavalier this past summer) there are a multitude of factors that can mess a deal up(Didn't Nylander's wife kill the deal in EDM after it was sgned? And now she wants to go to Russia or is it him? where it's cool too I might add). I trust Bob and I for one would love to be at the table where the speaker phone is at but NO f@#$en' way I want to be Bob, for this deal. I would ask Waddel (is it?) what it was that bust the long term deal there for sure too before I sign anywhere, CUZ you know that there is something funny that happened to bust the long term deal there... And that was my humble opinion/question/comment... ohh s&?% I'm all cnfused now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trizzak Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Nope, don't see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsfan Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 We're hearing that Atlanta is trying to resign Ilya Kovalchuk but that they have a self imposed deadline for signing him. If they aren't able to sign him it is reported they will trade him so they don't lose him for nothing like Hossa. So if they are not able to to resign him, and really this should already have happened, I wonder what it would take for us to get him. Would a 1st round pick, Halak plus one of our top defencemen not named Markov get it done? Would it be do-able for us? You'll never get a deal done for Kovalchuk, unless Markov OR Price go the other way. To get Kovalchuk, the Habs would have to send Markov, a 1st round pick and another promising young forward. Let's not forget that I don,t see how the Habs could fit his 10 million$ salary under the cap! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seb Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 You'll never get a deal done for Kovalchuk, unless Markov OR Price go the other way. To get Kovalchuk, the Habs would have to send Markov, a 1st round pick and another promising young forward. Let's not forget that I don,t see how the Habs could fit his 10 million$ salary under the cap! No way, no one would give up a 22 year old franchise goaltender (even somewhat unproven) plus all that to get a guy who's about to be a UFA. He is only dealt if ATL can't sign him, and if ATL can't sign him, his value goes down the drain. That being said, he won't be cheap, but no one will gut their team to go get him. Especially because they know if their team sucks when he gets there, he won't resign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Waddell has been confident that he'd get Kovalchuk signed and I think Kovy likes it there now that he has at least a decent support group. Don't think he'll be traded. If he is, we need to give up Hamrlik, A. Kostitsyn + picks, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Look for Atlanta to want a deal similar to, and probably better, than what they got for Marian Hossa. Traded along with Pascal Dupuis, he netted Colby Armstrong, Erik Christensen, prospect Angelo Esposito, and the Penguins' first-round pick in 2008 (Daultan Leveille). So that's a top prospect, a 1st rounder, and under-achievers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Look for Atlanta to want a deal similar to, and probably better, than what they got for Marian Hossa. Traded along with Pascal Dupuis, he netted Colby Armstrong, Erik Christensen, prospect Angelo Esposito, and the Penguins' first-round pick in 2008 (Daultan Leveille). So that's a top prospect, a 1st rounder, and under-achievers. Armstrong is the top prospect and Esposito the underachiever, right? Dupuis's better than Christensen so let's see it as Hossa for Armstrong (less value than Kostitsyn), Esposito (decent value but known as being a potential bust - probably had more value than Pouliot does because of his age) and a late 1st. This is a price that we can pay. But with us, salary is a problem. One of our big contracts needs to be included and it would almost definitely be Hamrlik. He's been amazing for us this year (and two years ago) but if it can net us Kovalchuk, it's a no-brainer I think. Imagine having Gomez, Gionta, Cammalleri, Kovalchuk, Plekanec, Markov and Price signed long-term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Armstrong is the top prospect and Esposito the underachiever, right? Dupuis's better than Christensen so let's see it as Hossa for Armstrong (less value than Kostitsyn), Esposito (decent value but known as being a potential bust - probably had more value than Pouliot does because of his age) and a late 1st. This is a price that we can pay. But with us, salary is a problem. One of our big contracts needs to be included and it would almost definitely be Hamrlik. He's been amazing for us this year (and two years ago) but if it can net us Kovalchuk, it's a no-brainer I think. Imagine having Gomez, Gionta, Cammalleri, Kovalchuk, Plekanec, Markov and Price signed long-term. Of course, there is another option: signing Kovalchuk to one of those ridiculous 10-year deals where he makes buckets now, and nothing later: cap hit of 4 or 5M, or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Armstrong is the top prospect and Esposito the underachiever, right? Esposito has less than a year away from being drafted at the time. He was still a top prospect. Armstrong hadn't come close to reproducing his rookie season by the time the trade came around, so he was a big time underachiever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCHabnut Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Atlanta is the next Chicago if you ask me. If I was Kovalchuck, I would stick it out. They have been mired in the bottom so long, and some of their young guys are really starting to look good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Atlanta is the next Chicago if you ask me. If I was Kovalchuck, I would stick it out. They have been mired in the bottom so long, and some of their young guys are really starting to look good. They've been saying that for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 They've been saying that for years. So have we. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 So have we. Speak fer yerself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seb Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Either way, contract extensions cannot be signed before January 1st, 2010. Meaning they're not currently in a rush to hammer something out. They've likely had serious discussions, and both parties are giving themselves time to think about it and be sure, and they'll finalize in the new year. That's what will happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 and they'll finalize in the new year. That's what will happen. I do that too when I really want something to happen. You know, to play chicken with the cosmos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Either way, contract extensions cannot be signed before January 1st, 2010. Meaning they're not currently in a rush to hammer something out. They've likely had serious discussions, and both parties are giving themselves time to think about it and be sure, and they'll finalize in the new year. That's what will happen. It's the final year of his deal, they can do his extension at any time. Columbus has given extensions to half a dozen players already this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seb Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 It's the final year of his deal, they can do his extension at any time. Columbus has given extensions to half a dozen players already this season. Ah. There we go, then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafikz Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Not going to happen If Koval leaves, the Trashers will leave Atlanta as well Not gonna happen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redondo Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 I don't see it happening - though we tried hard to get Kovalchuk his draft year (I remember Andre Savard was talking to Weddell up until the very moment he made that pick) and it would be fabulous to have a guy of his talent with the CH, just so many pieces would have to fall into place for this to be consummated. I have to believe that there are a few teams out there that have a better cap landscape, more available pieces and would be in better position to get him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeLassister Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 I don't see it happening - though we tried hard to get Kovalchuk his draft year (I remember Andre Savard was talking to Weddell up until the very moment he made that pick) and it would be fabulous to have a guy of his talent with the CH, just so many pieces would have to fall into place for this to be consummated. I have to believe that there are a few teams out there that have a better cap landscape, more available pieces and would be in better position to get him. Wonder how Kovalchuk would have developed in our system though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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