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That's way over generalizing and unfortunately that is the major flaw of mock scouting.

I don't think anyone here has said D'agostini, O'Byrne or Stewie are anything but depth or role players... the value here is Andrei and to a lesser more long shot extent is Sergei.

A. Kost is about to show us one of two things. A) he will break out and become the explosive scoring machine he shows flashes of being or B) he shows the exact same thing we have seen for his first few years.... a streaky scorer that can score in bunches.

The Latter sounds like Frolov only he has played with better scorers then A. Kost has.

Frolov has played in 455 NHL games, A Kost 186 games.

Frolov's first two years he played 156 games scoring 79 points.

A Kost played 152 games in his first 2 full NHL seasons scoring 94 points. Who's the enigma?

This is an apples for Apples type of trade with some Oranges thrown in just for kicks.

Let's not forget Sergei could become a star on his own.

Too much.... waaaay too much

Agreed! Trade two enigmas .... if it were One Kost and two fillers I would consider it... but trade both???? nope I preffer to stick to them for a while before I give up on them... damn too early.. and like i said before ... frolov might not even be here come next season.... PUUUAAA stinks

But wait a sec... OMG it makes sense if Gainey cant fill the C hole on the second line he cant get Marleau... nor vinny and he has to use Camm... then it would make sense to trade for Cheechoo and Frolov:

Cheechoo-Gomez-Gionta

Frolov-Camm-(Lats or Pacioretty)

Edited by CoRvInA
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Ah, only one of those other three. That sounds a lot better. My biggest problem is that Frolov will be a UFA. He's going to want a lot more than his current 2.9 million, so we likely won't be able to resign him. I think it would be better to just see what AKost can do with the new core. Given who the Kosts decided to hang around with, however, I wouldn't mind too much using them to overpay for a player.

Agree fully with this. Saved me typing it.

So with Corvina's 2 deals solution we have

Cheechoo-Gomez-Gionta

Frolov-Camm-(Lats or Pacioretty)

BGL/Lats- Lapierre- Moen

Pac/D'ago or Stewart- Chipchura/Maxwell -Metropolit

Markov-Gill

Mara-Spacek

Gorges-Hammer

Henry

Price-Sanford-DesJardins

Seems ok to me, but if Price goes down I am very scared!

Halak, I believe, will eventually win a number 1 spot somewhere.

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sorry guys ...seems my french is getting worse as time goes by.... What RDS was implying is that SanJose would give Ottawa Cheechoo Erkhoff and a first round pick .... and if the Habs are involved ... that would mean we get.............I dont wanna say anything anymore lol :P

http://www.rds.ca/senateurs/chroniques/279641.html

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sorry guys ...seems my french is getting worse as time goes by.... What RDS was implying is that SanJose would give Ottawa Cheechoo Erkhoff and a first round pick .... and if the Habs are involved ... that would mean we get.............I dont wanna say anything anymore lol :P

http://www.rds.ca/senateurs/chroniques/279641.html

When I read between the lines (and also get it spelled out for me in an e-mail), I see it a little differently.

The Sens get Ehrhoff, the 1st, and ___ from MTL

Sharks get Heatley

Habs get...Cheechoo

SJ doesn't want to move Marleau unless they have to (I don't see how they can't, but apparently he wants no part of Ottawa/Montreal either). The Sens want no part of Cheechoo, but apparently the Habs are willing to take him on if the deal's right for them. The question then becomes, what player(s) would the Habs want to send to a division rival that the Sens would accept in the Heatley trade that doesn't constitute overpayment on the Habs part for Cheechoo?

By the way, the link that RDS and TSN based their articles from: http://www.habsworld.net/out.php?7887

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Cheechoo-Gomez-Gionta

Frolov-Camm-(Lats or Pacioretty)

BGL/Lats- Lapierre- Moen

Pac/D'ago or Stewart- Chipchura/Maxwell -Metropolit

Markov-Gill

Mara-Spacek

Gorges-Hammer

Henry

Price-Sanford-DesJardins

Seems ok to me, but if Price goes down I am very scared!

Halak, I believe, will eventually win a number 1 spot somewhere.

Like them lines Johnny!

When I read between the lines (and also get it spelled out for me in an e-mail), I see it a little differently.

The Sens get Ehrhoff, the 1st, and ___ from MTL

Sharks get Heatley

Habs get...Cheechoo

SJ doesn't want to move Marleau unless they have to (I don't see how they can't, but apparently he wants no part of Ottawa/Montreal either). The Sens want no part of Cheechoo, but apparently the Habs are willing to take him on if the deal's right for them. The question then becomes, what player(s) would the Habs want to send to a division rival that the Sens would accept in the Heatley trade that doesn't constitute overpayment on the Habs part for Cheechoo?

By the way, the link that RDS and TSN based their articles from: http://www.habsworld.net/out.php?7887

Good show Dlbalr....so its a matter of $$$ Cheechoo and his 3 mil equates to.... a Habs player(s) that earn close to or as much $$ and we would be willing to give to a division rival!!!!! Holly molly this is getting seriously intense!!! yeah for off season Drama!

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Good show Dlbalr....so its a matter of $$$ Cheechoo and his 3 mil equates to.... a Habs player(s) that earn close to or as much $$ and we would be willing to give to a division rival!!!!! Holly molly this is getting seriously intense!!! yeah for off season Drama!

If the Habs are indeed involved in this, it will be to a small end as is normally the role of the 3rd party facilitator. The musings of Marleau, Pavelski, Michalek, etc I think are overblown at this time.

Personally, the Frolov talks interest me a lot more though I think Cheechoo can still be solid, he's one of those guys who just needs a change of scenery I think.

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Don't want Cheechoo on the roster, even if he was working for free. Give the spot to D'Agostini or whatever.

And since when in Kostistyn an enigma? Sometimes he scores, sometimes he doesn't. You know, like most players in the NHL. What's so enigmatic about that?

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Cheechoo would be a solid pick up if it's done for somebody like D'agostini (we'd probably have to ditch more salary though).

He was playing hurt last year, I would write off his horrible stats. This is THE time to pick up a scorer for your 1st or 2nd or 3rd line - after his off-year, when his value is lowest. I would use Ryder as an example, except the Bruins winded up throwing money at him anyway.

He'll never score 50 goals again but he can certainly be a 30 goal scorer throughout his career, and we could certainly use one - we're missing a top 9 winger!

I think he's better than Ryder (similar, but a bit better), and he was useful enough in his first few years for us.

Cheechoo quickly went from being one of the most overrated players in the league to one of the most underrated.

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When I read between the lines (and also get it spelled out for me in an e-mail), I see it a little differently.

The Sens get Ehrhoff, the 1st, and ___ from MTL

Sharks get Heatley

Habs get...Cheechoo

SJ doesn't want to move Marleau unless they have to (I don't see how they can't, but apparently he wants no part of Ottawa/Montreal either). The Sens want no part of Cheechoo, but apparently the Habs are willing to take him on if the deal's right for them. The question then becomes, what player(s) would the Habs want to send to a division rival that the Sens would accept in the Heatley trade that doesn't constitute overpayment on the Habs part for Cheechoo?

By the way, the link that RDS and TSN based their articles from: http://www.habsworld.net/out.php?7887

Typical Garrioch.

IF the Sharks are to get Heater, they have to shed out 7.5M basically. (well, actually, more than that.. as per NHLnumbers.com, they are already capped with only 9 forwards signed.)

I guess Brucey didn't cover that part.

Not any better than Ek if you want my opinion.

Yes the sharks are a candidate for Heater. and it might be even more tempting since :

-he wants to play there

-they want to change their team

but... if they do, Cheechoo, Erhoff AND minimum 1.4M $ of salary have to get out of the way in order to be at statu quo (i.e. not enough player signed, and already capped)...

i.e. ? well, I guess that if they want do emulate the TBay fiasco, they can have Marleau, Joe and Heat... otherwise, they can't have the 3. (or have to shimm elsewhere : Michalek, Clowe)

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Why trade for Cheechoo --that we're all just gonna hate after a month because he's slow and defensively inept-- when we're already knee-deep into forward prospects who all have better upside, are younger and cheaper?

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Why trade for Cheechoo --that we're all just gonna hate after a month because he's slow and defensively inept-- when we're already knee-deep into forward prospects who all have better upside, are younger and cheaper?

I've been tossing this one around for a couple hours, and the more I think about it, the more I realize Cheechoo isn't a great fit.

I just don't see him thriving in Martin's system.

But then I think he'd be an upgrade over S.Kost on the 2nd line, so I guess it comes down to the price. If we can get him for Dags and a prospect or something similar, then I am all for it. But if it is going to cost us too much, then forget it.

I like the idea of getting Frolov though... players who actually like their linemates and produce with them... that'd be a nice change!

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Don't want Cheechoo on the roster, even if he was working for free. Give the spot to D'Agostini or whatever.

And since when in Kostistyn an enigma? Sometimes he scores, sometimes he doesn't. You know, like most players in the NHL. What's so enigmatic about that?

Saying no to cheechoo without a real reason is lunacy! Ive said it before and other posters here as well.... If a team like Sanjose needs a shake up... and you happen to be a GM that is reforming the core of a team then you would be nuts not to RISK investing in that garage sale! You wont get these players any cheaper!! its not an exact science! its Hockey!

Enigmatic, not consistent, BIPOLAR wtf!!!! whatever you wanna call it!!!! AK went like what.... 20 plus games without scoring????

this kid is a top 10 pick that should have gone top 5 if not for his illness! He should be fighting for top line duties by now! but this is Hockey and shit happens! so call it what you want the kid needs to get back on track and thats the Habs Coaching staff's responsibility!

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Saying no to cheechoo without a real reason is lunacy! Ive said it before and other posters here as well.... If a team like Sanjose needs a shake up... and you happen to be a GM that is reforming the core of a team then you would be nuts not to RISK investing in that garage sale! You wont get these players any cheaper!! its not an exact science! its Hockey!

Enigmatic, not consistent, BIPOLAR wtf!!!! whatever you wanna call it!!!! AK went like what.... 20 plus games without scoring????

this kid is a top 10 pick that should have gone top 5 if not for his illness! He should be fighting for top line duties by now! but this is Hockey and shit happens! so call it what you want the kid needs to get back on track and thats the Habs Coaching staff's responsibility!

He has only played 2 full seasons now and I think everyone here can agree that last year was anything but a developmental year for any Canadien let alone the BS with the Mob (that the media overcooked) etc etc

Players from Russia/Belarus take a bit of time. They have language barriers to hurdle, a different style game, and a smaller ice surface to adapt to. The mighty Frolov that everyone here wants so badly scored less than Kostitsyn (without the same distractions and linemates) in his first 2 seasons and didn't become a consistent threat until his 3rd and 4th seasons. This will be Andrei's 3rd season... he'll be fine.

Patience people, 95% of the players don't tear up the NHL despite their draft position until they develop and learn...... the other 5% are named Gretzky, Crosby, Lemieux, Orr, Ovechkin, Beliveau etc

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Why trade for Cheechoo --that we're all just gonna hate after a month because he's slow and defensively inept-- when we're already knee-deep into forward prospects who all have better upside, are younger and cheaper?

I don't like d'Ago... but I think we'd be better off crafting a 22 y.o. d'Ago than coping with a 28 y.o. Cheech.

That said, knowing BG (and to a lesser extent, Martin) and how RH are "important", d'Ago might very well end up getting that 2nd line spot only because of his RH shot (or being a lock on the PP), that is, if we don't trade for a Cheech.

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He has only played 2 full seasons now and I think everyone here can agree that last year was anything but a developmental year for any Canadien let alone the BS with the Mob (that the media overcooked) etc etc

Players from Russia/Belarus take a bit of time. They have language barriers to hurdle, a different style game, and a smaller ice surface to adapt to. The mighty Frolov that everyone here wants so badly scored less than Kostitsyn (without the same distractions and linemates) in his first 2 seasons and didn't become a consistent threat until his 3rd and 4th seasons. This will be Andrei's 3rd season... he'll be fine.

Patience people, 95% of the players don't tear up the NHL despite their draft position until they develop and learn...... the other 5% are named Gretzky, Crosby, Lemieux, Orr, Ovechkin, Beliveau etc

The head injury that Andrei suffered had a huge impact on his game as well. With that and all the aforementioned factors, it's no real surprise that he experienced a set-back. It'd be foolish to think he's plateaued based on last season alone.

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He has only played 2 full seasons now and I think everyone here can agree that last year was anything but a developmental year for any Canadien let alone the BS with the Mob (that the media overcooked) etc etc

Players from Russia/Belarus take a bit of time. They have language barriers to hurdle, a different style game, and a smaller ice surface to adapt to. The mighty Frolov that everyone here wants so badly scored less than Kostitsyn (without the same distractions and linemates) in his first 2 seasons and didn't become a consistent threat until his 3rd and 4th seasons. This will be Andrei's 3rd season... he'll be fine.

Patience people, 95% of the players don't tear up the NHL despite their draft position until they develop and learn...... the other 5% are named Gretzky, Crosby, Lemieux, Orr, Ovechkin, Beliveau etc

Couldn't have said it better myself. :clap::clap::clap: Too many people are in a hurry to pull the trigger on any deal just because a promising kid with 2 years of experience hasn't "exploded" for 50 goals!!

Be patient with Ak46. He's having a hard time learning english and that can slow someone's development quite a bit. Also, his head injury couldn't have helped! Last year was a lousy year for 90% of the players wearing the Bleu, Blanc, Rouge.

This year should be different!

Edited by Habsfan
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Couldn't have said it better myself. :clap::clap::clap: Too many people are in a hurry to pull the trigger on any deal just because a promising kid with 2 years of experience hasn't "exploded" for 50 goals!!

Be patient with Ak46. He's having a hard time learning english and that can slow someone's development quite a bit. Also, his head injury couldn't have helped! Last year was a lousy year for 90% of the players wearing the Bleu, Blanc, Rouge.

This year should be different!

Agreed even guy lafluer had 3 years of 25 goals before he broke loose with the 50's.

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He has only played 2 full seasons now and I think everyone here can agree that last year was anything but a developmental year for any Canadien let alone the BS with the Mob (that the media overcooked) etc etc

Players from Russia/Belarus take a bit of time. They have language barriers to hurdle, a different style game, and a smaller ice surface to adapt to. The mighty Frolov that everyone here wants so badly scored less than Kostitsyn (without the same distractions and linemates) in his first 2 seasons and didn't become a consistent threat until his 3rd and 4th seasons. This will be Andrei's 3rd season... he'll be fine.

Patience people, 95% of the players don't tear up the NHL despite their draft position until they develop and learn...... the other 5% are named Gretzky, Crosby, Lemieux, Orr, Ovechkin, Beliveau etc

very much agreed!... and by the way in no way was I making cheechoo and AK involved in the deal... I for one would keep both Kostitsin... My rant was that the team should invest more (and believe thats what Martin's forte is developing the young) energy and efforts should be directed to above all the Kostitsins, latendresse, Pacioretty D'agos and even Lapierre!! I believe this was strike two in BG eyes when it came to see the development that Carbo had done to BG's younglings

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very much agreed!... and by the way in no way was I making cheechoo and AK involved in the deal... I for one would keep both Kostitsin... My rant was that the team should invest more (and believe thats what Martin's forte is developing the young) energy and efforts should be directed to above all the Kostitsins, latendresse, Pacioretty D'agos and even Lapierre!! I believe this was strike two in BG eyes when it came to see the development that Carbo had done to BG's younglings

I wasn't so much picking your comments out to disagree with, it was more for the short sighted fans that would trade 2 potential stars + for a guy like Cheechoo or Frolov.

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I wasn't so much picking your comments out to disagree with, it was more for the short sighted fans that would trade 2 potential stars + for a guy like Cheechoo or Frolov.

not remotely in the same league.

yes for Frolov

no for Cheech

they are not even close.

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