Jump to content
dlbalr

Permanent Trade Proposal Thread

Recommended Posts

Habsy    30

Let's face it, this lottery pick stuff is not how we roll. This website would implode, but what if we trade our 1st round pick for a bonafide number one center? It's a proposal thread, so I'm proposing. I'm not suggesting it's the right thing to do, but Cole, Gionta and a hopefully healthy Markov are not getting any younger. To do such a deal, the player would ideally be signed long term, and I suspect the Gomez contract would have to be dealt with to make the numbers fit. Now that would be wild.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JMMR    91

Let's face it, this lottery pick stuff is not how we roll. This website would implode, but what if we trade our 1st round pick for a bonafide number one center? It's a proposal thread, so I'm proposing. I'm not suggesting it's the right thing to do, but Cole, Gionta and a hopefully healthy Markov are not getting any younger. To do such a deal, the player would ideally be signed long term, and I suspect the Gomez contract would have to be dealt with to make the numbers fit. Now that would be wild.

Yes who would that guy be?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
lafrous10    0

Yes who would that guy be?

I do it for Eric Stall,but it would take more

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Habsy    30

Ok, say Rick Nash. Off the top of my head. He's said he'd waive his no trade. It would give C-bus two high picks. It would be very complicated to pull off, he might not even want to play here. And, no doubt, we can all find stats that say he's not worth it. Just a thought....ok, Nash is a winger, but...

I do it for Eric Stall,but it would take more

Exactly

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JMMR    91

Ok, say Rick Nash. Off the top of my head. He's said he'd waive his no trade. It would give C-bus two high picks. It would be very complicated to pull off, he might not even want to play here. And, no doubt, we can all find stats that say he's not worth it. Just a thought....

Exactly

Nash is winger not centre.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hab29RETIRED    159

Let's face it, this lottery pick stuff is not how we roll. This website would implode, but what if we trade our 1st round pick for a bonafide number one center? It's a proposal thread, so I'm proposing. I'm not suggesting it's the right thing to do, but Cole, Gionta and a hopefully healthy Markov are not getting any younger. To do such a deal, the player would ideally be signed long term, and I suspect the Gomez contract would have to be dealt with to make the numbers fit. Now that would be wild.

There are only two types of teams that would be willing to trade a top centre woud be a team like Columbus who has Carter, but they can'[t make a deal for just draft picks - they need a warm body to sell to their fans and they already have the top pick (although a chance to get the two russians may intrigue them).

Even Anaheim, is not going to deal a Ryan or Getzlaf for a just a first round pick. It would be SUbban plus a first round pick.

The other option would be to make a deal with a loaded team like the Flyers who have Briere, Giroux, Schenn, JVR (playing as a winger) and see if you can snag a Schenn or a JVR. However, I don't see them wanting a draft pick at this stage when they can use those guys for the playoff run.

Unless you are dealing with a team like Columbus or trading the first round pick to a good team would be an option only in the off season, so that doesn't help us now anyways.

This year is done. This team sucks. I'd suck it up right now, clean out the Gill, Moen, Campoli, one of Weber/Diaz, Darche (not that anyone wants him) and look to next year by stocking picks and prospects.

I don't think we are that far off. I'm not in favour of trading AK46 - I'd trade Bourque before I trade AK46. I really believe that we would regret that deal for the next 5-7 years.

If we do take advantage of the value some of our excess dman and UFA's will have for teams looking to go deep in the playoffs, we can stock pile our youth the way Boston and Philly did and look pretty good next year if can dump Gomez and keep the following:

Cole - NEW CENTRE - Gionta

AK46 - Eller- Leblanc

DD - Pleks - MaxPac

White - NEW CENTRE - NEW WINGER/Blunden

Markov-Subban

Gorges-Emelin

Two new dman + one of Weber or Diaz

Price

New backup

Ok, say Rick Nash. Off the top of my head. He's said he'd waive his no trade. It would give C-bus two high picks. It would be very complicated to pull off, he might not even want to play here. And, no doubt, we can all find stats that say he's not worth it. Just a thought....ok, Nash is a winger, but...

Exactly

Starting point to get Stall is Subban - no way i make that deal. I don't see Stall as ever returning to being a top 5 centre. Subban has the potential of being a top 5 dman.

starting point for Nash is also Subban. nash is also a winger, so doesn't address our centre issue. I'd rather have Subban and Ak46 over Nash. Now if we could get Nash for AK46, Weber and say Leblanc, I'd do that, but no way Columbus would. They are looking to move Carter not Nash and there is no way i move Subban for an injury prone Carter locked up for 10 years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
lafrous10    0

There are only two types of teams that would be willing to trade a top centre woud be a team like Columbus who has Carter, but they can'[t make a deal for just draft picks - they need a warm body to sell to their fans and they already have the top pick (although a chance to get the two russians may intrigue them).

Even Anaheim, is not going to deal a Ryan or Getzlaf for a just a first round pick. It would be SUbban plus a first round pick.

The other option would be to make a deal with a loaded team like the Flyers who have Briere, Giroux, Schenn, JVR (playing as a winger) and see if you can snag a Schenn or a JVR. However, I don't see them wanting a draft pick at this stage when they can use those guys for the playoff run.

Unless you are dealing with a team like Columbus or trading the first round pick to a good team would be an option only in the off season, so that doesn't help us now anyways.

This year is done. This team sucks. I'd suck it up right now, clean out the Gill, Moen, Campoli, one of Weber/Diaz, Darche (not that anyone wants him) and look to next year by stocking picks and prospects.

I don't think we are that far off. I'm not in favour of trading AK46 - I'd trade Bourque before I trade AK46. I really believe that we would regret that deal for the next 5-7 years.

If we do take advantage of the value some of our excess dman and UFA's will have for teams looking to go deep in the playoffs, we can stock pile our youth the way Boston and Philly did and look pretty good next year if can dump Gomez and keep the following:

Cole - NEW CENTRE - Gionta

AK46 - Eller- Leblanc

DD - Pleks - MaxPac

White - NEW CENTRE - NEW WINGER/Blunden

Markov-Subban

Gorges-Emelin

Two new dman + one of Weber or Diaz

Price

New backup

Starting point to get Stall is Subban - no way i make that deal. I don't see Stall as ever returning to being a top 5 centre. Subban has the potential of being a top 5 dman.

I see Stall being top 5 again if paired with Cole and/or Pacs

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Habsy    30

I suppose it's the rumored offer from the Leafs for Nash that got me thinking. None of it excites me, from a Columbus perspective. And it really helps the Leafs long term. Provided it's true, and actually happened. You start negotiations by saying Subban is untouchable. You want our 1st round pick, what else, to get desired player? Didn't anyone see Moneyball? Good movie...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Trizzak    413

Let's face it, this lottery pick stuff is not how we roll. This website would implode, but what if we trade our 1st round pick for a bonafide number one center? It's a proposal thread, so I'm proposing. I'm not suggesting it's the right thing to do, but Cole, Gionta and a hopefully healthy Markov are not getting any younger. To do such a deal, the player would ideally be signed long term, and I suspect the Gomez contract would have to be dealt with to make the numbers fit. Now that would be wild.

I think I'd want that deal done at the draft instead of the deadline. At the deadline, there are too many games you can lose and not enough information on the player who could be available at your draft position. The value of the pick is still varying.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hab29RETIRED    159

I suppose it's the rumored offer from the Leafs for Nash that got me thinking. None of it excites me, from a Columbus perspective. And it really helps the Leafs long term. Provided it's true, and actually happened.

I'd love to see Nash in Montreal, but not at the price of Subban and i'd to see toronto get Nash. For some reason, there are Gm's who really like Schenn and I could see the leafs offering up Schenn/Kadri and maybe Grabs for Nash and be able to make the deal. If we PG had signed Ak46 for 4-5 years last summer, we could have offered up a similar type of package that included Ak46, Weber and some of our better prospects like Bournvil, but we don't have anyting similar to offer.

I don't want to trade Emelin (first physical dman in a long time), Subban (superstar waiting to break out), Gorges (future Captain), if we were more certain about Markov, I'd even be willing to move Gorges in a nash deal, but again, while I'd rather have Gorges over Schenn, there are Gm's who really over value Schenn, so it would be hard to land him.

I really hate us not signing our assets longer. I think its actually easier trading locked up assets, as long as you got them at reasonable cap hits (i.e. richards/carter in Philly). But forever reason, the habs do 1 to 2 year deals and let the player really cash in as free agents, instead of signing them early for home time discounts by locking them up well before they are eligible for UFA status.

I think I'd want that deal done at the draft instead of the deadline. At the deadline, there are too many games you can lose and not enough information on the player who could be available at your draft position. The value of the pick is still varying.

Yep and there are fewer teams that you can trade with at the deadline - anyone trying to get into the playoffs will not offer up a good player for a pick. The other thing is say, we win in the lotter and can pick #2. I'd much rather take future potential Grigerenko over Stall.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hab29RETIRED    159

I see Stall being top 5 again if paired with Cole and/or Pacs

Stall's last 5 year totals were 76, 70, 75, 82 and 70 points. That is hardly top 5 centre production. You have to go back 6 years to get his only 100 point season. He sounds more like a Gomez ,with good numbers in the teir 2 center category and one outstanding outlier year. I don't want to pay $7M for a 70 point guy (mind you, It would be better then paying for $7M for a 15 point guy), but Stall while Stall also sucks this year and is on pace for around 50 points. I think at best he is a 70-80 point guy and only managed over 80 points and 40 goals twice in his career and has been a on a declining path. Again, no way i move a guy like Subban for him. I'd trade Gorges for him, if the canes were interested (they won't be) and even then, they would probably want our first pick - no way I move that right now if that may be Grigerenko.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Commandant    599

Stall's last 5 year totals were 76, 70, 75, 82 and 70 points.  That is hardly top 5 centre production.  You have to go back 6 years to get his only 100 point season.  He sounds more like a Gomez ,with good numbers in the teir 2 center category and one outstanding outlier year.  I don't want to pay $7M for a 70 point guy (mind you, It would be better then paying for $7M for a 15 point guy), but Stall while Stall also sucks this year and is on pace for around 50 points.  I think at best he is a 70-80 point guy and only managed over 80 points and 40 goals twice in his career and has been a on a declining path.  Again, no way i move a guy like Subban for him.  I'd trade Gorges for him, if the canes were interested (they won't be) and even then, they would probably want our first pick - no way I move that right now if that may be Grigerenko.

His 100 pt season is the same year Gomez got 90 and Gio scored 48. A year penalties and PPs were through the roof and a bunch of guys had years that they wont repeat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From whom do I trade Subban? For an elite C under the age of 26 or so, who reliably gets at least 90 points per season (or 80 points with intimidating size and physicality) AND who is locked up long-term.

Other than that, any GM making inquiries can piss off.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hab29RETIRED    159

From whom do I trade Subban? For an elite C under the age of 26 or so, who reliably gets at least 90 points per season (or 80 points with intimidating size and physicality) AND who is locked up long-term.

Other than that, any GM making inquiries can piss off.

I only move Subban for three players and none of them are available - Malkin, Stamkos and Toews.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I only move Subban for three players and none of them are available - Malkin, Stamkos and Toews.

Yeah, that's basically the same dif. Although if Ovechkin's name came up, well, I'd consider it ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hab29RETIRED    159

Yeah, that's basically the same dif. Although if Ovechkin's name came up, well, I'd consider it ;)

I love Ovie, but he scares me now. Its not just his play, its his entire attitude seems different. I think he is a guy that could do with a change in scenery and if Markov his healthy (given their relationship), I this may we may be a great fit for him. But i think he has got like a 13 year deal or something like that, with around 10 years left at around $9M. I'd gladly take Malkin, Stamkos and Toews if they had that contracts, but Ovie's current attitude scares me for that long of a commtiment.

I also think that for Ovie to succeed he needs to be in a completely wide open, pedal to the metal (i.e. 70's habs, 80's islanders, 80's oilers) type of system (I think Subban would be much better if we gave him a LOT more freedom offensively and coached him better with that style of hockey). In Montreal, with our system, it would be like oil and water. I'm also not sure how he would handle the pressure here in Montreal. Seems to be struggling in washington with expectations, in Montreal, it would be 1M times more pressure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
lafrous10    0

Stall's last 5 year totals were 76, 70, 75, 82 and 70 points. That is hardly top 5 centre production. You have to go back 6 years to get his only 100 point season. He sounds more like a Gomez ,with good numbers in the teir 2 center category and one outstanding outlier year. I don't want to pay $7M for a 70 point guy (mind you, It would be better then paying for $7M for a 15 point guy), but Stall while Stall also sucks this year and is on pace for around 50 points. I think at best he is a 70-80 point guy and only managed over 80 points and 40 goals twice in his career and has been a on a declining path. Again, no way i move a guy like Subban for him. I'd trade Gorges for him, if the canes were interested (they won't be) and even then, they would probably want our first pick - no way I move that right now if that may be Grigerenko.

I was just giving an example of a big #1 center. It's been 20-25 years since we had a guy with 5 seasons over 70 pts.You sound like it's a common occurence for us. We don't have one player on this team or in the system that's even capable of scoring 70 pts.It's seems forever since Kovy and Pleks did it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Seb    13

Trading Subban is idiotic (unless, like it was mentioned above, you receive Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos or Ovie). People still struggle to see the value in experience. Exhibit A is right in front of you: Alexei Emelin. Guy spent 8 years playing in the KHL. Look at him go! Subban played one season in Hamilton. Give him some time, a leash to learn from his mistakes and some suppport, and he'll reward you in the long run.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
lazy26    58

His 100 pt season is the same year Gomez got 90 and Gio scored 48. A year penalties and PPs were through the roof and a bunch of guys had years that they wont repeat.

If memory serves, that was the year Staal sneaked up on everyone while Brind'Amour was still drawing the top defensive pair from the opposition.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Commandant    599

If memory serves, that was the year Staal sneaked up on everyone while Brind'Amour was still drawing the top defensive pair from the opposition.

Yup, Brindamour was also a 70 pt centre that season, and still considered a number 1 in the NHL.

You also had Thornton and Jagr both go over 120 pts (league leader had 104 last season)

You had Jonathan Cheechoo score 56 goals (37 his career high outside that season.... only 2 seasons over 30 goals in his career).

You had 7 100pt scorers, including 2 rookies. (1x 100pt scorers last season, highest rookie had 63 pts)

You had 5 50 goal scorers. (1 last season, and he scored exactly 50)

You had 14 guys get 90 + pts (5 last season, 14th place in NHL scoring last season had 76 pts)

I think its fair to say that 2005-06 scoring was inflated, and take that into account when we judge Staal's 100pt year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
lafrous10    0

Trading Subban is idiotic (unless, like it was mentioned above, you receive Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos or Ovie). People still struggle to see the value in experience. Exhibit A is right in front of you: Alexei Emelin. Guy spent 8 years playing in the KHL. Look at him go! Subban played one season in Hamilton. Give him some time, a leash to learn from his mistakes and some suppport, and he'll reward you in the long run.

Everyone has a price,including Subban.You think he's the 5th best/most important player in the league/Bright future,but talk about overvaluing our players

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Habsy    30

How did this get back onto trading Subban? We basically all agree. We'd all prefer to keep him, but he's not untouchable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There isn't a single player that's untradeable, but there are players I have no confidence that Gauthier will get the best return for.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
DON    9

There isn't a single player that's untradeable, but there are players I have no confidence that Gauthier will get the best return for.

I would disagree and say Price is untradeable and for Subban, i would want a Tavares/Duschene/Mikko Koivu/Couturier type player, but he aint going anywhere and i bet both he and Price get signed to long term deals.

Gauthier has lots of other assets to trade before thinking of dealing Subban.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
bbp    36

Everyone has a price,including Subban.You think he's the 5th best/most important player in the league/Bright future,but talk about overvaluing our players

Loyalty to players is something players value when looking at an organization. Considering our management is a little rocky at times I would say not trading a player in the middle of a media firestorm about him would be beneficial to future players wanting to sign with the club.

Plus Subban has a certain personality and character I believe most fans are attached to and want to see stay in the city.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×