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Permanent Trade Proposal Thread

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32 minutes ago, DON said:

99 has much better ring to it, didnt say 99pt/yr, and was mostly for effect...but 79pts/82gms is what he has been, is 27 signed for 2 more years and not sure his size will hurt the Habs in the playoffs (he has 19pts in 30gms) 

 

Appreciate the clarification ... unfortunately some assume that a player having one exceptional season means that he has proven that he is a <insert goals/assists/points total for that one season>

 

Ideally the Habs do need to get some bigger, talented players (i.e., legit top 6) ... but those aren't easy to find ... they clearly shouldn't avoid a smaller player if that player upgrades the club's skill level. 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

 

Appreciate the clarification ... unfortunately some assume that a player having one exceptional season means that he has proven that he is a <insert goals/assists/points total for that one season>

 

Ideally the Habs do need to get some bigger, talented players (i.e., legit top 6) ... but those aren't easy to find ... they clearly shouldn't avoid a smaller player if that player upgrades the club's skill level. 

 

 

Laine would be my number one choice for a winger, but Winnipeg will want a dman going the other way. We’ve got one piece in Domi, but that’s not nearly enough.

 

It’s pretty sad that we’ve had two 50 goal seasons since Lafleur and only both were by Richer I’m the late 80’s.  We haven’t even had a 40 goal scorer since Damphouse in 93’ or 94’.

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1 hour ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Laine would be my number one choice for a winger, but Winnipeg will want a dman going the other way. We’ve got one piece in Domi, but that’s not nearly enough.

 

It’s pretty sad that we’ve had two 50 goal seasons since Lafleur and only both were by Richer I’m the late 80’s.  We haven’t even had a 40 goal scorer since Damphouse in 93’ or 94’.

Build from the goalie out ... or maybe just the goalie?

<sarcasm>

If Vinnie's 40 goals in 93/94 the Habs had an ELITE D corps every year it could be a matter of philosophy of how to build a team to win ... but under multiple GMs they haven't ... nor have they had many 35+ goal scorers (Turgeon & Damphousse in 95/96; Kovalev 35, 07/08; Max 39 in 13/14 & 37 in 14/15 & 35 in 16/17)... 6 times in 26 years ... we hope they may have a high-end D-corps in a couple of years ... but then we can't know for certain or whether Weber and Petry will still be Weber and Petry (or even if Petry will have re-signed) ...  

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10 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

It’s pretty sad that we’ve had two 50 goal seasons since Lafleur and only both were by Richer I’m the late 80’s.  We haven’t even had a 40 goal scorer since Damphouse in 93’ or 94’.

Likely are numerous teams similar (like Bruins).

But do agree they are long overdue to get another Richer or Damphousse.

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2 hours ago, DON said:

Likely are numerous teams similar (like Bruins).

But do agree they are long overdue to get another Richer or Damphousse.

 

Certain there are ... out of curiosity I checked ... from 94/95 forward the Bruins had one 45+, three 40+ and thirteen 35+ goal scorers ... the Habs had zero 40+ and seven 35+ goal scorers ... to make matters "worse", the Laffs had two 45+, five 40+ and twelve 35+ goal scorers ... even the Senators had two 50 goal, eight 40+ and thirteen 35+ goal scorers

☹️

 

 

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21 hours ago, DON said:

Sweet Jesus, SIZE...again?

Will that dead horse ever stop getting beat.

Ya, of course dont want to add a 99pt winger...too small. 

 

Too bad Hughes is only 170lb d-man, if he was big he would have much more than paltry 16pts in 16playoff games...disappearing act smurff! :popcorn:

 

Did you watch Gaudreau play in the playoffs?  If so, you were satisfied with his performance?  There are players who have great regular season stats and disappear in the playoffs.  As a Calgarian, I can tell you that Johnny Hockey is one of those!  Give me a Gallagher (small) any day, but not Gaudreau.

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2 hours ago, Blazer said:

Did you watch Gaudreau play in the playoffs?

No.

Flames 2nd best PP, he had 6pts on the 10 PP goals.

 

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I dunno...I heard MaxPac derided as "Max Patio-ready" for years in Montreal...look at him now.

 

Gally had 1 goal and 4 points in 9 playoff games. One could argue that he too "disappeared" in the playoffs. We know that that was because he was hurt. But who knows what Johnny Hockey's story has been when he's struggled?

 

I don't have the answers, but I do think that when a guy with Gaudreau's pedigree becomes available, a talent-starved FW unit like Montreal's has to give it serious consideration. Ditto Laine, of course (although as Habs29 notes, it's hard to see a deal there). As for return, in terms of Gallagher specifically, we also have to ask how much faith we have that his body can continue cashing the cheques he's been writing with it.

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1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

I dunno...I heard MaxPac derided as "Max Patio-ready" for years in Montreal...look at him now.

 

Gally had 1 goal and 4 points in 9 playoff games. One could argue that he too "disappeared" in the playoffs. We know that that was because he was hurt. But who knows what Johnny Hockey's story has been when he's struggled?

 

I don't have the answers, but I do think that when a guy with Gaudreau's pedigree becomes available, a talent-starved FW unit like Montreal's has to give it serious consideration. Ditto Laine, of course (although as Habs29 notes, it's hard to see a deal there). As for return, in terms of Gallagher specifically, we also have to ask how much faith we have that his body can continue cashing the cheques he's been writing with it.

how can anyone not want a player who's nickname is Johnny Hockey?

 

kidding aside he does bring points to the table and thats what we are in massive need of. Obviously the chance to get Laine and others have to be explored as well. Also, if Max is going the other way then we need 2 additions to the top 9. I really think one of those guys will be Kovalchuk on the cheap...

 

Gallagher has been fairly healthy over the years as well... I think his style of play and how that will figure in down the stretch of his career (longevity) is completely overblown... no knee, shoulder, back, leg injuries of any significance... Outside of a couple broken hands, and a concussion he's stayed relatively healthy... digging in the corners and going hard to the net is gonna get you goals not shorten your career. Personally

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2 hours ago, IN THE HEARTS OF MEN said:

... Also, if Max is going the other way then we need 2 additions to the top 9. I really think one of those guys will be Kovalchuk on the cheap...

Don't know that Domi was in the top 6 plans for 20/21 even before the Tournament ... as for Kovalchuck ... at the right price I could see him as a 3rd/4th line winger with a PP role ... he had a GREAT start with the Habs but his production trailed off in the second half of his time with Montreal ... think he is best suited to a more targeted role to optimize his production.

 

2 hours ago, IN THE HEARTS OF MEN said:

... Gallagher has been fairly healthy over the years as well... I think his style of play and how that will figure in down the stretch of his career (longevity) is completely overblown... no knee, shoulder, back, leg injuries of any significance... Outside of a couple broken hands, and a concussion he's stayed relatively healthy... digging in the corners and going hard to the net is gonna get you goals not shorten your career. Personally

Wish I shared your optimism ... in Gallagher's case I'm not certain that not being on the injured list necessarily equates to relatively healthy ... myself and others aren't worried about injuries but about the impact that the bumps and bruises and stress on muscles and joints that having to play with the "pedal to the metal" all the time to offset his size disadvantage will have ... many smaller players have long and successful careers ... but most of those are not trying to play as if they were 6'2", 225lbs ... nobody can know how his style will impact Gallagher's career ... but I would prefer to optimize his value now rather than try to salvage value if his play does decrease.

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9 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

 ... nobody can know how his style will impact Gallagher's career ... but I would prefer to optimize his value now rather than try to salvage value if his play does decrease.

If and when Gallagher loses 1/2 a step, it wont be as bad as when Byron loses 1/2 a step.

Vast majority of Gallagher's goals are right around the net and not beating d-men to the outside, dont think he was ever a quick skater.

So he may get lots of garbage goals for long time.

 

But, am sure numerous GMs would love to add him to their roster and if return package included a young sniper, you would have to think about it.

But, odds must be very low for Habs to trade him, especially given Domi's seeming to be the odd man out.

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18 minutes ago, DON said:

If and when Gallagher loses 1/2 a step, it wont be as bad as when Byron loses 1/2 a step.

Vast majority of Gallagher's goals are right around the net and not beating d-men to the outside, dont think he was ever a quick skater.

So he may get lots of garbage goals for long time.

 

But, am sure numerous GMs would love to add him to their roster and if return package included a young sniper, you would have to think about it.

But, odds must be very low for Habs to trade him, especially given Domi's seeming to be the odd man out.

The potential issue with Gallagher isn't really his speed ... but rather just whether he can physically maintain his play in the corners and around the net.

 

I agree he is unlikely to be traded before 20/21 ... but with his being a pending UFA it perhaps should be the time to consider it if there is ANY concern about his longevity ... unless he signs at a reasonable cap hit with no, are a minimal, NTC his value will never be higher.

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Interesting thought from Hockey30 ... allegedly Taylor hall is BBFs with RNH ... so to entice Taylor Hall sign Habs should trade for RNH ... perhaps a Gallagher for RHN centred trade ... some will say the Habs have to add pieces, others may say 1-for-1 or Oilers add something ... both are pending UFAs ... BG has outscored RNH despite not playing with ANYONE as dynamic as Draisaitl or McDavid ... AND ... it frees up $2.25M for Oilers next season ... so I would propose Gallagher and Poehling for RNH, pending RFA Athanasiou and a 2nd (doesn't there always have to be a second) ... see where it goes,

 

RNH has played a lot of wing recently (only took 3 faceoffs in the 4 play-in games, and was 5th on the team in the regular season) so, conceptually, Habs would gain lose a RW and gain two LWs

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1 hour ago, GHT120 said:

The potential issue with Gallagher isn't really his speed ... but rather just whether he can physically maintain his play in the corners and around the net.

Who is a comparable player?

Gallagher puts alot of rubber on net, always up near top in shots/gm and big reason he has had two 30g seasons.

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1 hour ago, GHT120 said:

Interesting thought from Hockey30 ... allegedly Taylor hall is BBFs with RNH ... so to entice Taylor Hall sign Habs should trade for RNH ... perhaps a Gallagher for RHN centred trade ... some will say the Habs have to add pieces, others may say 1-for-1 or Oilers add something ... both are pending UFAs ... BG has outscored RNH despite not playing with ANYONE as dynamic as Draisaitl or McDavid ... AND ... it frees up $2.25M for Oilers next season ... so I would propose Gallagher and Poehling for RNH, pending RFA Athanasiou and a 2nd (doesn't there always have to be a second) ... see where it goes,

 

RNH has played a lot of wing recently (only took 3 faceoffs in the 4 play-in games, and was 5th on the team in the regular season) so, conceptually, Habs would gain lose a RW and gain two LWs

Gallagher has more value than RNH. If we were to trade Gallagher, i would want one want at least one of the oilers top D prospects (Broberg, Bouchard), and Puljujarvi and a pick along with a RNH and include Domi the other way.
 

frankly though, I think longer term we’d be in cap trouble and I doubt if we could afford to resign RNH, after signing Hall to the $9m+ it would take to get him, without risk being unable to sign our own RFA’s. 
 

I’m open to trading Gallagher, but only if it makes us stronger longer term by filling holes on the wing and D.  I see RNH as an upgrade and Danault, but if I’m trading Gallagher,  I’d want to get younger more impactful players in return for him, rather than a trade on the hope of enticing Hall to sign.

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40 minutes ago, DON said:

Who is a comparable player?

Gallagher puts alot of rubber on net, always up near top in shots/gm and big reason he has had two 30g seasons.

Marchand lite. I think Gallagher has more trade value than any other player in our roster and I think teams that had disappointing playoffs Would probably overpay for him- despite the fact that he only has one year left on his deal.  

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19 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Gallagher has more value than RNH. If we were to trade Gallagher, i would want one want at least one of the oilers top D prospects (Broberg, Bouchard), and Puljujarvi and a pick along with a RNH and include Domi the other way.
 

frankly though, I think longer term we’d be in cap trouble and I doubt if we could afford to resign RNH, after signing Hall to the $9m+ it would take to get him, without risk being unable to sign our own RFA’s. 
 

I’m open to trading Gallagher, but only if it makes us stronger longer term by filling holes on the wing and D.  I see RNH as an upgrade and Danault, but if I’m trading Gallagher,  I’d want to get younger more impactful players in return for him, rather than a trade on the hope of enticing Hall to sign.

 

I agree BG > RNH ... and totally forgot about Puljujarvi ... maybe offer BG, RP and a 2nd for RHN, AA and JP ... Tartar and Drouin would then available, along with Domi for other trades to upgrade

 

The rumour that Arizona has upped their offer to $68 over 8 seasons makes it hard for the Habs to compete financially ... and rumours that Colorado may pursue Taylor Hall, as well as Calgary, makes the hockey environment a tougher sell too ... MacKinnon is a good way to sell the Avs and Calgary is a Canadian city but with lower taxes

 

All of which is too say, would a RNH centred trade be worthwhile if hall doesn't come ... IMO it becomes more of a wash than a win

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58 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

 

I agree BG > RNH ... and totally forgot about Puljujarvi ... maybe offer BG, RP and a 2nd for RHN, AA and JP ... Tartar and Drouin would then available, along with Domi for other trades to upgrade

 

The rumour that Arizona has upped their offer to $68 over 8 seasons makes it hard for the Habs to compete financially ... and rumours that Colorado may pursue Taylor Hall, as well as Calgary, makes the hockey environment a tougher sell too ... MacKinnon is a good way to sell the Avs and Calgary is a Canadian city but with lower taxes

 

All of which is too say, would a RNH centred trade be worthwhile if hall doesn't come ... IMO it becomes more of a wash than a win

I frankly don’t want RNH.  Prefer some of the of the oilers prospects  over roster players.

 

i don’t see Hall resigning with Arizona. He’s been saying he wants to play for a contender and Arizona has been regular soap opera, but not even close to contender.  
 

i wouldn’t be surprised by the Avs getting him if they can keep the salary under $8M, or $9M on a shorter deal.  But I can’t see Sakic going over that when he will have his RFA’s and UFA’s to deal with in two years.  I can’t see Makar signing a bargain contract like McKinnon did.  They also need a goalie.

 

i still see Calgary as the most likely (go home like Tavares), but again they desperately need a goalie and since the playoffs ended every day on the radio it’s been constant need to change core and Monohon/Gaudreau/Giordano need to go talk.  Not sure if uncertainty over those the core and lack of that goalie may hurt them in getting Hall.

 

 I even read that with Chiarelli gone, Hall back to Edmonton May be a possibility, but they need to move some bad contracts out first and again, they need a new goalie.

 

i think you offer Hall $8.5m/years or $10m/2 yrs and see if he bites on the shorter term deal.  Heck, I haven’t checked the cap space, but if we have room l, I’d even offer $11m for two years.  If we did that, we do need to make some other all-in moves and than move Domi/Tarter to boast the blueline with some young puck movers and go for it.  
 

I think a short term for Hall, buys us time with Caufield.  I still don’t see him coming here, but if by some miracle he does, I do think you need to decide to move one of Petry, Gallagher, or Danault, because there is no way we could sign all three next year and make sure we have room for Suzuki and Kk if they have strong years.  


even if we did go all-in, I’d prefer getting young players in return for some of our older enigmatic players (inconsistent or do show up in the playoffs) like Domi/Drouin/Tatar that would be exempt from the expansion draft. 

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1 hour ago, hab29RETIRED said:

I frankly don’t want RNH.  Prefer some of the of the oilers prospects  over roster players.

 

i don’t see Hall resigning with Arizona. He’s been saying he wants to play for a contender and Arizona has been regular soap opera, but not even close to contender.  
 

i wouldn’t be surprised by the Avs getting him if they can keep the salary under $8M, or $9M on a shorter deal.  But I can’t see Sakic going over that when he will have his RFA’s and UFA’s to deal with in two years.  I can’t see Makar signing a bargain contract like McKinnon did.  They also need a goalie.

 

i still see Calgary as the most likely (go home like Tavares), but again they desperately need a goalie and since the playoffs ended every day on the radio it’s been constant need to change core and Monohon/Gaudreau/Giordano need to go talk.  Not sure if uncertainty over those the core and lack of that goalie may hurt them in getting Hall.

 

 I even read that with Chiarelli gone, Hall back to Edmonton May be a possibility, but they need to move some bad contracts out first and again, they need a new goalie.

 

i think you offer Hall $8.5m/years or $10m/2 yrs and see if he bites on the shorter term deal.  Heck, I haven’t checked the cap space, but if we have room l, I’d even offer $11m for two years.  If we did that, we do need to make some other all-in moves and than move Domi/Tarter to boast the blueline with some young puck movers and go for it.  
 

I think a short term for Hall, buys us time with Caufield.  I still don’t see him coming here, but if by some miracle he does, I do think you need to decide to move one of Petry, Gallagher, or Danault, because there is no way we could sign all three next year and make sure we have room for Suzuki and Kk if they have strong years.  


even if we did go all-in, I’d prefer getting young players in return for some of our older enigmatic players (inconsistent or do show up in the playoffs) like Domi/Drouin/Tatar that would be exempt from the expansion draft. 

 

Can someone translate this for me please 

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2 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

i think you offer Hall $8.5m/years or $10m/2 yrs and see if he bites on the shorter term deal.  Heck, I haven’t checked the cap space, but if we have room l, I’d even offer $11m for two years.  If we did that, we do need to make some other all-in moves and than move Domi/Tarter to boast the blueline with some young puck movers and go for it. 

 

That's a habit you (and everyone) should try to get yourself into doing when coming up with trade and signing proposals.  By the time the Habs re-sign their players, they don't have room to add someone making $11 million.

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9 hours ago, DON said:

If and when Gallagher loses 1/2 a step, it wont be as bad as when Byron loses 1/2 a step.

Vast majority of Gallagher's goals are right around the net and not beating d-men to the outside, dont think he was ever a quick skater.

So he may get lots of garbage goals for long time.

 

But, am sure numerous GMs would love to add him to their roster and if return package included a young sniper, you would have to think about it.

But, odds must be very low for Habs to trade him, especially given Domi's seeming to be the odd man out.

I love Gallagher, but to your argument : we saw against Philly how ineffective he becomes when he looses his speed , in this case due to the tear in his groin

 

Gallagher makes me think a bit of Shaw. I hope we can keep him long term as a third liner with Danault when he slows down

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2 hours ago, illWill said:

 

Can someone translate this for me please 

Habs won’t get Hall 🤔

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10 hours ago, dlbalr said:

 

That's a habit you (and everyone) should try to get yourself into doing when coming up with trade and signing proposals.  By the time the Habs re-sign their players, they don't have room to add someone making $11 million.

Agree that it’s important. Difficulty is that you just can’t go sign Hall or anyone else for that matter, without determining who else has to move.  I’m commenting on someone else’s proposal to sign him and the only way I see us being able to afford Hall is on a short term deal.  
 

even than, In a cap world can’t just keep sliding other wingers down that will will be displaced by Hall.  You need to consider who you have to move now (IMO, if we are going after Hall, you should be moving at least one if not two of Domi, Drouin and Tatar).  Who and how many you move also depends on whether you plan on resigning Petry, Gallagher and Tatar and the term you want them for.

 

I think if we are set on keeping Price and Weber, we need to take advantage of the 2 to 3 year window that Weber has and 2 to 4 year window Price has to play a high level and go for it, in surrounding Suzuki and KK with more elite wingers. What makes it difficult is that three of our core players will be UFA in a year (Petry, Gallagher and Danault), not to mention some key RFA’s. Signing Hall to huge one year deal allows you to dump whoever you need to from Domi, Drouin and Tatar to make it work.  Signing him for two or more years and you have to have a plan in place for Petry/Gallagher/danault.  Is the plan to roll the dice on them for one year year and than either let them walk for nothing, or hope they sign for a hometown discount (unlikely)?

 

i know where I stand.  I don’t want to be locked up with Hall long term  or short term.  I’d prefer to move either Petry or Weber for a younger puck-moving dman.  I’d also try and to maximize  Gallagher’s value now and look at trying to build a team with a chance at playoffs for the next two years, but is a solid contender in year 3.  I think we need at least two solid young wingers and at least two young puck moving dmen.
 

The thing is, I don’t see that happening, as I can’t se MB moving Price, Weber or Gallagher and I think he will resign Petry.  In which case he needs to go all in now, instead of this constant bubble team  atatus (no pun intended) that we’ve had for so long.  We say we are going to build through the draft and than we trade Sergechev.  What’s promising right now is the emergence of Suzuki, Kk and the potential contribution of Romanov (if he can contribute in the next year or two like some other young dman have.  If we aren’t moving anyone from the big 4 (Price, Weber, Gallagher and Petry), we need to surround them with more talent in the next two years, because I don’t see any one to replace Petry and Weber in particular.  We either need to move a couple of core pieces to give the team more time, or run the risk of having Weber/Petry no longer being elite dmen and start to  decline.  We’re wasting their prime years.  You look at Giordano, who just won a Norris, has been a very good dman for a number of years, had his best year ever and just had a huge drop in play this year (some here said he normalized to his career averages, but stats aside, there was a huge drop in play and he is one of the players that most feel should  be moved.  They want to avoid waiting to long like they did with Iginla.  I don’t want us to run the same risk with price, Weber, Gallagher and a Petry.  If and when that happens to a Weber, I don’t see us having any prospect in the system that is a clear cut can’t miss 1st pairing dman.
 

id like to get off the perpetual bubble team hamster wheel and either do a significant change to the core, or go all in.

 

yiu can’t figure out the cap situation until you decide which of the three paths you are going forward with.

1) current muddling along and hope to make playoffs and catch lightening in the bottle and make trade as they come along, Or getting rid of a problem, or filling a hole, by creating another hole, but not really having a clear strategy.  

2) go for it now and maximize the elite play of our top players and surround them with more talent. I haven’t seen the habs clearly go this route.  Yes. They appear to have tied themselves to Price, Weber, Gallagher, Petry, but given their age and window, their certainly hasn’t been a go for it trade since they traded for Vanek or Petry.

3) make a change to the older core, while trying to get more playoff experience for our young guns and add elite younger players to that young talent base. That would be my preference. I want to be good for the next 10 years, not “hopefully” for the next 2.
 

You can’t analyze the cap ramifications until you make the larger strategic decision on the large forward.

 

 

 

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On 9/4/2020 at 10:51 AM, hab29RETIRED said:

Sergechev?

 

I haven't spent time thinking about Sergechev because I just can't see Tampa letting a young developing d-man get away. Is there anything we could offer them that could accomplish them getting value for him while also saving $ for their cap issues? 

 

Would they accept a first and two seconds and a d-prospect. Personally I don't think they would. 

 

I just don't see it happening. Teams always seem to find ways to dump salaries so they can keep young d-men like Sergechev. 

 

Would I like to get him. Absolutely. But I don't think he's leaving Tampa. 

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56 minutes ago, REV-G said:

 

I haven't spent time thinking about Sergechev because I just can't see Tampa letting a young developing d-man get away. Is there anything we could offer them that could accomplish them getting value for him while also saving $ for their cap issues? 

 

Would they accept a first and two seconds and a d-prospect. Personally I don't think they would. 

 

I just don't see it happening. Teams always seem to find ways to dump salaries so they can keep young d-men like Sergechev. 

 

Would I like to get him. Absolutely. But I don't think he's leaving Tampa. 

The Sergechev question was in response to a a comment made in the post I responded to saying that he hadn’t seen examples of MB overpaying in a trade.


that’s not to say I wouldn’t want to reacquire him, but the only chance we’d have is an RFA offer.

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