JMMR Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 I've said it before, and I'll say it again. I want PK to play here until he's at least 40 years old. He rocks. Why not forever give him a management position when hes done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeLassister Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 Salaries are now just turning into an odd curiosity to me. I don't care what a player makes, just how the player performs. If he doesn't perform, it's up to the GM to do something about it. Overpay, underpay, undervalue, overvalue, it's really useless to worry about. The LA Kings paid Dustin Penner $4.25M last season to score seven regular season goals. He put up a solid post-season enough for the Kings to re-sign him at a million less despite being mostly a disappointment as a King. Compare how much we'll be paying Pacioretty to score 30 goals to what LA pays Penner to score under 10. Drew Doughty gives the Kings a $7M cap hit per year at 21 years old scoring the same amount of points as Subban while posting a negative plus/minus whereas Subban has a positive plus/minus. Do you think the Kings are kicking themselves about it? Nope. Don't forget paying both Richards and Carter nearly $6M per for under 50 points of production each. Doubt anyone cares when it brings results in the post-season. That's the divine comedy of the salary cap. It doesn't matter what one player makes, it's what everyone makes and what result you get out of it. Subban could make Doughty money and it wouldn't matter if he didn't put up 60 points with it. How well did the whole team do? That's all that matters in the end. Micro-managing as a fan is for the fans of teams who don't win Cups. :clap: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 Offer Subban a 6 year 5m deal or a one-way ticket to Philly for Couturier and a pick. I love Subban, but if he's holding out, Philly will eventually offer something bigger than 6yrs @ 5m. Might as well get a good young center out of it. I'd expect Philly to tender an offer before Saturday if Subban isn't signed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 Offer Subban a 6 year 5m deal or a one-way ticket to Philly for Couturier and a pick. I love Subban, but if he's holding out, Philly will eventually offer something bigger than 6yrs @ 5m. Might as well get a good young center out of it. I'd expect Philly to tender an offer before Saturday if Subban isn't signed. You must have read that silly Bertrand article everyone is misinterpreting. Basically, Philly contacted Montreal and said, "Sooo... Subban available?" and Montreal responded, "Is Couturier available?" and both sides stopped talking immediately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Posted September 14, 2012 Share Posted September 14, 2012 Carlson signed in Washington for 6 year, nearly 24 mill. About 4 mill per year. That's what Subban should expect for a similar contract. 4 mill long term deal is reasonable for him. Unfortunately, it will be a long time until any of us see any NHL hockey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 I think Subban is worth more than Carlson and hopes Bergevin doesn't screw this up and gets him signed today. Carlson signed in Washington for 6 year, nearly 24 mill. About 4 mill per year. That's what Subban should expect for a similar contract. 4 mill long term deal is reasonable for him. Unfortunately, it will be a long time until any of us see any NHL hockey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted September 15, 2012 Author Share Posted September 15, 2012 I think Subban is worth more than Carlson and hopes Bergevin doesn't screw this up and gets him signed today. It's not necessarily a screw-up to leave him unsigned. There are pros and cons to either strategy (sign/wait until a new CBA). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaos Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Cam Fowler signed for 5 years $20 Million. Carlson 6 years $24 Million Similar numbers Fowler 158GP 15 G 54 A 69 PTS Subban 160GP 21G 55 A 76 PTS Carlson 186GP 17G 58A 75 PTS Dont matter now with the Lockout Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habscout Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 I thought that was a relatively reasonable contract given what Carlson does for the Capitals, and his RFA status. I'm disappointed that the Habs and Subban's agent couldn't come to a similar agreement before midnight yesterday. Carlson signed in Washington for 6 year, nearly 24 mill. About 4 mill per year. That's what Subban should expect for a similar contract. 4 mill long term deal is reasonable for him. Unfortunately, it will be a long time until any of us see any NHL hockey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Agreed. I think for some unexplainable reason Bergevin isn't sold on PK. I thought that was a relatively reasonable contract given what Carlson does for the Capitals, and his RFA status. I'm disappointed that the Habs and Subban's agent couldn't come to a similar agreement before midnight yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 That Fowler contract cracks me up. He's Patrice Brisebois reborn. Agreed. I think for some unexplainable reason Bergevin isn't sold on PK. This likely has nothing to do with that. It's simply a disconnect in price and term. Again, this happened last season with Drew Doughty. Can't repeat this enough. Everyone barked about how Doughty must want out or the Kings don't like him anymore and it just turned out it was a contract game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Agreed. I think for some unexplainable reason Bergevin isn't sold on PK. I think "isn't sold" is an inaccurate statement. I think it's more along the lines of Bergevin has "no pressure" with Subban. We had the cap space to match any offer he could of gotten. No pressure about an offer sheet. The CBA was expiring and it's looking as if the RFA status will be changing. Puts the pressure on Subban to sign for a low long term deal or wait for the uncertainty. With no real risk of losing Subban, Bergevin gave him an offer, probably on the low side of fair, and put the ball in Subban's court. With so many unknowns Subban is in a situation of, it's the devil you know and the devil you don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsy Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Why not forever give him a management position when hes done. Do I really need to elaborate? I guess so...I like what he brings to the team, and would hate to see him leave. It would be nice if he spent his entire playing career here, old school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patience is a virtue Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 6 years, $30M. We would celebrate that deal as a steal for the duration. MB may have missed the boat with the old CBA now off the table. Time will tell. What Subban did last year, while his offensive numbers were modest compared to potential, was prove that he is a top end defensive dman. That's something at his age. As noted in posts above, he plays in all situations, plays hard, with passion, and without injury. Also, he is bound to mature out of some his young ego issues with solid leaders like Gio, Cole, Gorges and Pleks setting the tone in the dressing room. I find it impossible to pick betweeen PK, Price, and Patches (or Gally) as the cornerstone of the franchise's future, but it gets me very excited to think of all three of these emerging NHL stars locked up affordably long-term. While I sympathize with those who post that they do not care so much about salary, nor think that it is predictive of performance or important to winning, I fundamentally disagree. GMs cannot predict what will happen, but they must do their very best to manage assets with limited resources. They have to crunch a lot of numbers and take a lot of gambles to build a winner. PK is as close to a sure thing as I can imagine in the NHL right now and his value is as low as it is ever going to be, IMHO. All that said, PK gives us the best argument for locking him up: "I see greatness in that organization every day when I go to the rink. I see opportunity. I see an opportunity to win, to bring a championship back to that team. That city is so hungry for another Stanley Cup. And when I look around the dressing room, I see a number of guys that can do it, that want to do it. And I think that my influence on that team can bring a Stanley Cup back to that city," P.K. says, his fervor for the topic rounding the back of the net and picking up steam. "Some guys get it early in their careers, some guys get it late in their careers, but I'm going to get it at some point. And I want to do it in that city because that's my favourite team. I grew up watching them. It's a personal thing. When I step on the ice, it's a feeling. "There have been times when I've been playing games and there's tears almost coming out of my eyes because I want to win so bad there. It's such an emotional city to play in, and I'm an emotional player, so I thrive off that. That's why it's so easy for me to go play 150 per cent every night. That's why I get the response I do from that fan base -- they feel that passion." Do we ever. There is greatness in the young Habs right now. PK will be a big part of its fulfillment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsfan Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 I just read on LaPresse.ca (Written By François Gagnon - see the link) that Bergevin had offered P.K. a 2 year 9 million$ deal. P.K. refused. Apparently he wants a longer term. I wouldn't have a problem offering PK a 5 or 6 year deal worth anywhere between 4.5 and 5.5 million$ per year. He's a horse and will only get better with age. Here's the link to the article...time to brush up on your french boys! http://www.lapresse....ur-la-route.php "I see greatness in that organization every day when I go to the rink. I see opportunity. I see an opportunity to win, to bring a championship back to that team. That city is so hungry for another Stanley Cup. And when I look around the dressing room, I see a number of guys that can do it, that want to do it. And I think that my influence on that team can bring a Stanley Cup back to that city," P.K. says, his fervor for the topic rounding the back of the net and picking up steam. "Some guys get it early in their careers, some guys get it late in their careers, but I'm going to get it at some point. And I want to do it in that city because that's my favourite team. I grew up watching them. It's a personal thing. When I step on the ice, it's a feeling. "There have been times when I've been playing games and there's tears almost coming out of my eyes because I want to win so bad there. It's such an emotional city to play in, and I'm an emotional player, so I thrive off that. That's why it's so easy for me to go play 150 per cent every night. That's why I get the response I do from that fan base -- they feel that passion." When I read this, I knew this kid loves Montreal and the Habs. We have to keep him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Do I really need to elaborate? I guess so...I like what he brings to the team, and would hate to see him leave. It would be nice if he spent his entire playing career here, old school. I agree. I was serious about my comment but I see how it could be read as sarcasm. I want PK for life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 With the lockout extending on, not signing Subban is looking worse and worse. At his age, the kid needs to be playing and without a contract, its too risky for him to sign on with anyone. If the season gets cancelled, Subban will have gone the whole year without playing organized hockey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted November 25, 2012 Author Share Posted November 25, 2012 That risk hasn't stopped players like Jamie Benn and Michael Del Zotto, who are unsigned RFA's as well, from going overseas. Some RFA's are staying but obviously the non-insured situation isn't the only factor. Honestly, I don't think he'd have went overseas even if he had a deal, I get the sense he's content to be close to home and make various appearances while playing in a charity game here and there (as he's doing tonight I believe). We won't know if it's a good or bad decision not to sign him until we see the new CBA and how it affects him. If there remain no restrictions on term (or it's something like 8 or 9 years) with the cap coming down, it could very well work in the Habs' favour. (Of course I'm fundamentally against signing him (or anyone) on a super long deal either way but that's just me.) Or, if the owners get their way, long-term won't be an option but we simply don't know right now whether this will be best for the Habs until the CBA is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueKross Posted November 25, 2012 Share Posted November 25, 2012 That risk hasn't stopped players like Jamie Benn and Michael Del Zotto, who are unsigned RFA's as well, from going overseas. Some RFA's are staying but obviously the non-insured situation isn't the only factor. Honestly, I don't think he'd have went overseas even if he had a deal, I get the sense he's content to be close to home and make various appearances while playing in a charity game here and there (as he's doing tonight I believe). We won't know if it's a good or bad decision not to sign him until we see the new CBA and how it affects him. If there remain no restrictions on term (or it's something like 8 or 9 years) with the cap coming down, it could very well work in the Habs' favour. (Of course I'm fundamentally against signing him (or anyone) on a super long deal either way but that's just me.) Or, if the owners get their way, long-term won't be an option but we simply don't know right now whether this will be best for the Habs until the CBA is done. It makes a lot of sense on both sides to wait and see what the real currency looks like. However, and you can take this to the bank, that the first contracts out of the gate after the CBA is signed will be HIGHLY CONTENTIOUS, especially if the players take a bath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 What's stopping Subban from signing a deal with Hamilton similar to Commodore's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted November 28, 2012 Author Share Posted November 28, 2012 Subban was on Hockey Central on Sportsnet this afternoon and noted that he wouldn't be signing a contract elsewhere during the lockout as he doesn't want to take any jobs away from players in other leagues. Thus, we can finally put to rest any thoughts that him not having a contract is why he isn't playing anywhere at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 I dislike the fact that Subban could potentially spend an entire year without playing competitive hockey. That is the exact opposite of what he should be doing, in terms of his development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 I dislike the fact that Subban could potentially spend an entire year without playing competitive hockey. That is the exact opposite of what he should be doing, in terms of his development. He has a pretty classy reason though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 and hey he is a great pizza maker according to big jim of boston pizza. he could get a long term committment there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 and hey he is a great pizza maker according to big jim of boston pizza. he could get a long term committment there Thats cool when did that transpire ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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