brobin Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Keeping in mind that the team isn't that great, this thread is about who will be this years disappointment, versus expectations.... (I would give that to Gomez last year, even with pretty tepid expectations) Max or Cole loss of production? DD looking more like a third liner? Price? Prust a bust... Plex perplexed? Subban regresses? Markov done? Now I am not looking for goats here, just guys who underperform. Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 My prediction would be the front line. They all had career years and generally speaking, the consensus from a lot of fans is that their expectations are that each player on that line will continue to produce at that level. I personally figure they each will regress from last seasons' point-per-game output (since comparing total points in a year like this would be useless) but that's just me. Ideally, a healthy and improved second line should offset that in terms of total team production but I suspect somewhere along the line there will be discussions about what's wrong with Cole, Desharnais, and Pacioretty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Erik Cole He looked awful last night I think maybe he is ready for retirement. That said its only one game lets see how hes playing in a couple weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Cole was always a slow starter. There will come a season when he loses a step and finds he cannot work his way out of the slow start, and that'll mark his decline into role-player status; but there's no particular reason to believe that this will be that season. I have my worries about Pacioretty. Great that he added muscle, but that makes him heavier and may deprive him of that extra burst of speed on the outside that was so crucial to his impact last season. I always get nervous when successful players muck around with their build in the offseason. I'd keep an eye on him. DD is a smart, smart player, and I tend to expect players like that to be all right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mineral Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 . I have my worries about Pacioretty. Great that he added muscle, but that makes him heavier and may deprive him of that extra burst of speed on the outside that was so crucial to his impact last season. I always get nervous when successful players muck around with their build in the offseason. I'd keep an eye on him. Makes you wonder about Subban. He put on like 15 pounds in muscle this summer too. I think in Max's case it was all in his legs with the goal of improving his burst speed. Certainly didn't show last night, but you could easily tell the players who have been in game shape playing in Europe or the minor pros vs. those gyming it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Makes you wonder about Subban. He put on like 15 pounds in muscle this summer too. I think in Max's case it was all in his legs with the goal of improving his burst speed. Certainly didn't show last night, but you could easily tell the players who have been in game shape playing in Europe or the minor pros vs. those gyming it. By holding out, Subban is making a questionable move for his development. He could be potentially looking at an entire lost season, exactly the reverse of what he needs at this stage of his career. As for his added poundage, it's a legit concern too. Even if he comes back, his timing is likely to be just as messed up as that of his teammates for a few games. I love PK, but the idea that he would have made all the difference last night or that he is The Saviour of The Season seems overstated to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 I don't think he would have been a savior, but he would have helped the transition game. Last night the leafs were keeping the habs outside most of the night, which made scrivens job pretty easy. On the other hand, the leafs had way too many in close chances on Price (who kept things closer then it should have been). The D also struggled keeping the puck in the leafs zone - something Subban has been very good at. Even markov's outlet passed were in the skates of players, so part of it is a timing thing, but I thought the transition game from the defencemen looked horrible, and I thought Kaberle in particular was awful, especially when that is supposed to his one strong point. Before the lockout, I had said one if the big risks of not signing Subban, was that in this stage if his development he needs to play and there was the potential that he wouldn't be playing for the whole year if he wasn't signed by September 15th. By holding out, Subban is making a questionable move for his development. He could be potentially looking at an entire lost season, exactly the reverse of what he needs at this stage of his career. As for his added poundage, it's a legit concern too. Even if he comes back, his timing is likely to be just as messed up as that of his teammates for a few games. I love PK, but the idea that he would have made all the difference last night or that he is The Saviour of The Season seems overstated to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Subban wasn't going to win that game for us. We were always going to be shut out until Gio's goal (with the exception of a laser-eye shot, and while Subban's shots are very hard, they're rarely anywhere near the end boards). Simple fact of the matter is that you have to go to the net to score. You have to get that puck in the slot, shoot, shoot, shoot, and crash the net. We didn't do that at all. Mostly because we couldn't string three passes together to even gain the centre line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbp Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Subban wasn't going to win that game for us. We were always going to be shut out until Gio's goal (with the exception of a laser-eye shot, and while Subban's shots are very hard, they're rarely anywhere near the end boards). Simple fact of the matter is that you have to go to the net to score. You have to get that puck in the slot, shoot, shoot, shoot, and crash the net. We didn't do that at all. Mostly because we couldn't string three passes together to even gain the centre line. I think Subban would have had a major impact on the game. Especially on the powerplay, Kaberle looked beyond useless out there and I was under the impression he forgot that he was supposed to keep the puck in front of the blue line on the powerplay. We needed to create more on the powerplay and while PK's shots may not hit the net people do make sure to keep him covered out there. This would open the ice up a lot more then Kaberle on the point who just startles the announcers when he actually shoots. And as habsretired said he would have helped the transition game. Which was dreadful. So many errant passes, at least PK can skate the puck through the neutral zone. All in all the trickling down effect of Subban in the lineup would be HUGE for the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 I think Subban would have had a major impact on the game. Especially on the powerplay, Kaberle looked beyond useless out there and I was under the impression he forgot that he was supposed to keep the puck in front of the blue line on the powerplay. We needed to create more on the powerplay and while PK's shots may not hit the net people do make sure to keep him covered out there. This would open the ice up a lot more then Kaberle on the point who just startles the announcers when he actually shoots. And as habsretired said he would have helped the transition game. Which was dreadful. So many errant passes, at least PK can skate the puck through the neutral zone. All in all the trickling down effect of Subban in the lineup would be HUGE for the team. To your first point, Subban would have only helped had the Habs gained control in the attacking zone on the PP, and as far as I can remember, they were terrible at setting anything up. There was no sustained play. He may have helped in reaching the zone better, though, since his skating and movement with the puck are above average. To your second point, I agree to an extent. In my post-game post I indicated that him missing was a huge mistake by management, and I think he would have helped a lot with generating more attacking coherence, however the bottom line is that the forwards were ultimately abysmal and no amount of strong passing would have changed the individuality from the red line to the attacking net. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 With respect to the complaint by many that PK's shots not hitting the net there used to be this guy in Calgary named MacInnis (main reason we lost in the 89' cup finals), who everyone agreed had the hardest shot in the league. However, his own teammates were afraid of being hit because for the first 3 or 4 years, his accuracy varied. Over time the guy hit the net with regularity and he became a pretty good dman. This is a key time in Subban's development and progression and mgmt really needs to get him back ASAP. IMO he should have been playing in Europe or Russia during the lockout. I think this year is a write-off for us anyways, but it is an oppertunity for Subban, the two Galy's, Emelin, weber, Diaz and potentially Leblanc further their development for next year. I'm also hoping at the end of this year we get rid of the clown we have and get a real coach. One thing I liked about Carlyle was that he gave lots if time and critical time to his young guys. I think Subban would have had a major impact on the game. Especially on the powerplay, Kaberle looked beyond useless out there and I was under the impression he forgot that he was supposed to keep the puck in front of the blue line on the powerplay. We needed to create more on the powerplay and while PK's shots may not hit the net people do make sure to keep him covered out there. This would open the ice up a lot more then Kaberle on the point who just startles the announcers when he actually shoots. And as habsretired said he would have helped the transition game. Which was dreadful. So many errant passes, at least PK can skate the puck through the neutral zone. All in all the trickling down effect of Subban in the lineup would be HUGE for the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobin Posted January 20, 2013 Author Share Posted January 20, 2013 Somehow we ended up on PK again... Back to the thread... I think Cole and Max will be a bit worse then last year, but DD will disappoint the most, after being one of the best surprises last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 I have my worries about Pacioretty. Great that he added muscle, but that makes him heavier and may deprive him of that extra burst of speed on the outside that was so crucial to his impact last season. I always get nervous when successful players muck around with their build in the offseason. I'd keep an eye on him. I will never forget the interview with Gretzky when they asked him why he didn't bulk up his upper body more to withstand potential checking. His response? If I bulk up, I may lose some of that quickness and ability to tease the puck on a string and lash out inch-perfect passes. +1. Muscle is good. Muscle for the sake of muscle is weightlifting. Perhaps he'll win more battles, but will he still have that burst, or as deft a touch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreegking Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 I truly think its already beginning and thought so prior to the season... Lars Eller Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMELINATOR Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 I think it's gonna be Rene Bourque.. and he will be traded. Book it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobin Posted January 23, 2013 Author Share Posted January 23, 2013 I truly think its already beginning and thought so prior to the season... Lars Eller I expect so little from Eller, he can't disappoint me too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 I expect so little from Eller, he can't disappoint me too much. Why? Are you Pierre Macguire? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyhasbeen Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Biggest diasappointment will be just missing the playoffs and not getting one of either Drouin Jones or MacKinnon. Either play a full 60 like we did vs Fla or just toss the mini season for the betterment of the team down the road. Of course I hope to see a full 60 every game from them, but the prospect of getting another top pick is very exciting too. Pick one player to be a bust? Armstrong or Kaberle. They have been contaminated by the Leafs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bar Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 For me, if Marc Bergevin doesn't get PK signed and instead trades him, that would be the biggest disappointment of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobin Posted January 24, 2013 Author Share Posted January 24, 2013 Why? Are you Pierre Macguire? I view him as an average third line Center who is a bit soft. I never knew why some people thought this guy was going to be a top six player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted January 25, 2013 Share Posted January 25, 2013 I view him as an average third line Center who is a bit soft. I never knew why some people thought this guy was going to be a top six player. Tough to put a permanent label on such a young player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobin Posted January 25, 2013 Author Share Posted January 25, 2013 Tough to put a permanent label on such a young player. I am not making it permanent, although his body of work doesn't inspire confidence from me. My point was simply I don't think I can be disappointed, only pleasantly surprised by Eller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted January 25, 2013 Share Posted January 25, 2013 I am not making it permanent, although his body of work doesn't inspire confidence from me. My point was simply I don't think I can be disappointed, only pleasantly surprised by Eller. Fair enough. Like going to a movie or play or see a band where you expect it to be bad. Worst case scenario he ends up decent your pleasantly surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted January 25, 2013 Share Posted January 25, 2013 Fair enough. Like going to a movie or play or see a band where you expect it to be bad. Worst case scenario he ends up decent your pleasantly surprised. Frankly, I think the worse case scenario with Eller is the Jan Bulis scenario. I've said before, in my opinion this guy could end up as anything from a 2nd line C to out of the league. Therrien's sitting of him does nothing to revise that opinion...it just hardens my suspicion that he is fundamentally a passenger. But if he learns to take some initiative, he does seem to have some nice tools and I don't see why we'd insist on his ceiling being a bottom-6 role. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobin Posted January 25, 2013 Author Share Posted January 25, 2013 Frankly, I think the worse case scenario with Eller is the Jan Bulis scenario. I've said before, in my opinion this guy could end up as anything from a 2nd line C to out of the league. Therrien's sitting of him does nothing to revise that opinion...it just hardens my suspicion that he is fundamentally a passenger. But if he learns to take some initiative, he does seem to have some nice tools and I don't see why we'd insist on his ceiling being a bottom-6 role. Therrien doesn't like him and he doesn't fit into his style of player. Fair or not, I won't be surprised if he gets traded out at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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