The end of Guillaume Latendresse's career

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Former+Latendresse+Swiss+team/9224384/story.html

A sad end to what began so promisingly. I assume injuries and concussions played a key role, but so (one infers) did attitude. I remember the high hopes when he came up; and I also remember him playing a very effective tag-team role as forechecker/3rd liner with Maxime Lapierre. What a shame. Yet another painful reminder of the lost hopes of the failed Gainey rebuild.

[Neech]

I remember when we would put out Tender and Lapierre with Begin, and Bouillon and Dandenault on defense. You could sense the stirrings in the collective pants of the Quebecois audience.

Latendresse was a victim of the hype to a certain extent, but he never reallly showed that much on the Habs. He might have taken a few things for granted in Montreal and again after his big year in Minnesota, and then he was crippled by injuries and out of the league a few short years later. Goes to show how ephemeral a promising NHL career can be.

[Machine of Loving Grace]

Was a big fan of Latendresse. Loved his number, loved his energy. With limited minutes he hit everything on his shifts and worked hard to develop. He admitted after being traded to Minnesota that his head wasn't in the right place and that it was a good thing he was moved. The numbers were starting to show as well. Then the injuries came. Sadly, my final memory of him will be backing down to Ryan White in the playoffs. In a game about testosterone, that's probably what did him in.

Hopefully he does something good in the future. Does he want to be an amateur scout?

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

I remember when we would put out Tender and Lapierre with Begin, and Bouillon and Dandenault on defense. You could sense the stirrings in the collective pants of the Quebecois audience.

Latendresse was a victim of the hype to a certain extent, but he never reallly showed that much on the Habs. He might have taken a few things for granted in Montreal and again after his big year in Minnesota, and then he was crippled by injuries and out of the league a few short years later. Goes to show how ephemeral a promising NHL career can be.

No kidding. Just as you're starting to grow up, it's over.

However, given what he himself said about lacking maturity in Montreal, it's pretty clear that he was brought up way too soon and should have been left to marinade in the minor leagues for a few years. Who knows, things might have turned out differently had he been allowed to grow into the role of a professsional, learned the value of proper work and conditioning, and been made to appreciate what a privilege it is to be in the NHL. A classic case of bad player development. And a standing warning to those people who argue for just giving NHL ice time to kids irrespective of whether they're ready for it.

[Machine of Loving Grace]

...except of course he wasn't handled properly once up in Montreal. Latendresse was a strong even strength scorer for Montreal despite never breaking an average of 13 minutes of ice time over three seasons. He was rarely if ever given powerplay time and both Carbonneau and Martin always stressed on his defensive play instead of just letting him break out. That's why he went to Minnesota with increased minutes and scored 25 goals. This wasn't an example of a guy who should have been in the AHL. This is an example of a guy who should have been given more minutes in the NHL.

Latendresse was given the bare minimum when he was in the NHL. That was the problem. The Kostitsyn's were always favoured over him. Had he played in the Q longer, then AHL then NHL, we still probably would have played him too little due to his defensive problems. Then Martin almost did the same with Pacioretty until he asked to be sent to the AHL due to his limited NHL minutes.

If anything, it was a recurring problem of Montreal coaches having no idea how to handle power forwards. It took Pacioretty protesting and going to the AHL to play top six minutes to convince Martin to play him in the top six. I honestly don't think Latendresse was ever going to be handled right by Carbonneau in Montreal.

[hab29RETIRED]

Biggest failing of the Gainey rebuild was he has no concept about how to develop players. He and his staff were old school and just expected professionalism from players.

What was curious that while there was bit proper support network for younger players (like the player development personnel that MB brought in), Gainey was willing to play head shrink for veterans, or more specifically become the "Kovelov whisperer".

Too many kids were rushed and than had to deal with lousy communicators like Carbo and Martin.

http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Former+Latendresse+Swiss+team/9224384/story.html

A sad end to what began so promisingly. I assume injuries and concussions played a key role, but so (one infers) did attitude. I remember the high hopes when he came up; and I also remember him playing a very effective tag-team role as forechecker/3rd liner with Maxime Lapierre. What a shame. Yet another painful reminder of the lost hopes of the failed Gainey rebuild.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Biggest failing of the Gainey rebuild was he has no concept about how to develop players. He and his staff were old school and just expected professionalism from players.

What was curious that while there was bit proper support network for younger players (like the player development personnel that MB brought in), Gainey was willing to play head shrink for veterans, or more specifically become the "Kovelov whisperer".

Too many kids were rushed and than had to deal with lousy communicators like Carbo and Martin.

Kovalev whisperer! Love that.

I totally agree. Gainey seemed to have all the pieces in place, organizationally speaking, but his blind spot vis-a-vis player development was gigantic and in the end ruined everything. It is unbelievable to me that kids like Carey Price and Chris Higgins were basically let loose to fend for themselves as millionaires in the pleasure domes of Montreal. Madness. Bob only cottoned to his mistake too late, at which point he fire-bombed the entire organization (2008-9). I guess we can, at least, say that player development seems to have gotten far better after that. Too late for Latendresse, though.

[Commandant]

For all the talk that he was rushed lets remember a few things.

1) He never had a serious concussion in Montreal.... His concussions have been in Junior, with the Wild, and now in Switzerland.

2) He still became a guy who scored 28 goals in the NHL.

He was well on his way to a good NHL career despite being "rushed" and he looked like he was living up to his potential in Minnesota before concussions basically did him in.

He may have been in the NHL too soon, but he wasn't "ruined" by the experience as some like to claim.

His injury issues have nothing to do with being in Montreal at 19.

[Neech]

He may have been in the NHL too soon, but he wasn't "ruined" by the experience as some like to claim.

It could be that he was 'ruined' in Montreal, though.

[Commandant]

It could be that he was 'ruined' in Montreal, though.

At the same time, many of the same things happened with Mike Ribeiro, and Chris Higgins, and Andrei Kostitsyn.... all of whom come from different backgrounds, and were given different amount of time in junior and in the AHL.

I think part of what the new regime did is recognize this and install people as "director of player personnel" and "director of player development" positions that we didn't have before as Timmins was responsible for both Scouting and Development. The fact that former NHLers with long careers are now in these roles really should help going forward.

You'll always have busts, but hopefully this helps us have less.

A focus on players in the draft and trades with families who have hockey backgrounds.... see Galchenyuk, Gallagher, Tinordi, Bozon, Beaulieu, Thomas, Geoffrion, Price, and others is also good too.

Remember these are the kids who have had pressure since their first day of minor hockey.... oh you're Mark Tinordi's kid, the NHL player, we know you are gonna be good. Oh you're the son of an assistant coach of the London Knights, yeah, we are gonna expect a lot of you. etc... etc...

When these guys get to Montreal, they understand the pressure, its been something they saw since they were 4 and 5 years old.

[Machine of Loving Grace]

It could be that he was 'ruined' in Montreal, though.

As I pointed out, he was ruined in Montreal because he was never given more minutes. Always limited due to his defensive play. Rarely given PP minutes.

In 06-07, Gui was a rookie. It made sense to limit his minutes. He got a little bit of PP time due to some injuries. He scored 16 goals, 11 even strength. That's just as good (speaking only on even strength goals) as Ryder and Higgins, two behind Plekanec, more than Koivu or Kovalev. Remember, rookie year. His time on ice average? 12:35 which was less than Duncan Milroy. It was also less than failed free agency signing Sergei Samsonov, Andrei Kostitsyn and Mikhail Grabovski.

In 07-08, Gui is now a sophomore. A little bit of PP time due to injury, exactly seven seconds more on average than Gregory Stewart. His TOI/G average is now 12:15, even less than the year before. Garth Murray was on the ice more than Latendresse. He still scores 12 even strength goals in one of the best scoring seasons for Montreal in years, which is more than Koivu and Ryder. It's the same as Andrei Kostitsyn, who gets double the PP minutes on average and more than double in total minutes. Kostitsyn, to be fair, scored quite a bit on the PP with Kovalev and Plekanec. But is it fair to say Latendresse wouldn't have?

Now 08-09. 100th Anniversary. Everyone gets injured at some point in time and Latendresse finally gets an increase in minutes on average! You know, to 13:36. 10 forwards ahead of him. This also leads to the "What are they doing with Max Pacioretty?" as he was behind Lats with 12:37 a game. On the ice, Latendresse scores 13 even strength goals in 56 games. Compare that to Alex Kovalev with 14 in 78, or Kostitsyn with 17 in 74. Gui is still only getting PP time when someone is injured, and is now marked as a "non powerplay player". Maxim Lapierre averages more even strength average ice time than him.

Head on over to 2009-2010 on Minnesota. Latendresse now averages the third most ES TOI/G for Minnesota forwards and his total minute average is up to 16:27. That sits him 7th for forwards on the team due to his lack of SH time. They actually let him average two minutes on the PP. How are his numbers? Try 25 goals, which ties Brunette for the lead (Brunette played 27 more games for the Wild), including 18 ES and 7 on the Power Play. It wouldn't be until next season that he'd be suffered more than the occasional shoulder or back injury and would now deal with consecutive season eating injuries (groin and concussion).

So tell me. Was it because he wasn't playing in the QMJHL/AHL that was the problem, or was it how Montreal handled his minutes?

[Neech]

So tell me. Was it because he wasn't playing in the QMJHL/AHL that was the problem, or was it how Montreal handled his minutes?

He would have been getting first line minutes in the minors. As a slower, one-dimensional scorer, he couldn't rack up minutes with guys like Andrei Kostitsyn ahead of him. And A. Kost, as a top prospect who we had pegged as a perennial 30-goal-scorer (oh the regret), deserved those minutes. The fact that his numbers and production plateaued in his first three seasons shows that he wasn't getting a chance to develop in Montreal, of course, and he would have had a better chance in the minors. He could have emerged as a more complete player without every middling outing being scrutinized in the Montreal fishbowl. Time in the minors helped Pacioretty - perhaps he was being misused, but he went down and worked on his game and came back and earned his proper spot. Latendresse never really earned anything.

[Machine of Loving Grace]

All time in the minors did for Pacioretty was remind Martin that he should have been playing in the top six instead of limited third line minutes. With a different coach, Pacioretty never touches the AHL. With a different coach, Latendresse plays up instead of trading for Alex Tanguay or giving Matt D'Agostini minutes with Koivu.

[Neech]

All time in the minors did for Pacioretty was remind Martin that he should have been playing in the top six instead of limited third line minutes. With a different coach, Pacioretty never touches the AHL. With a different coach, Latendresse plays up instead of trading for Alex Tanguay or giving Matt D'Agostini minutes with Koivu.

Your assertion that the time in minors did nothing for Pacioretty is groundless. Considering he came back and played a scoring role under Martin after being sent down, it's reasonable to assume that there was a significant difference in his level of play before and after the demotion. There's no reason to attribute it solely to Martin.

Basically, it looks like you're interpreting the facts to fit your narrative rather than interpreting a narrative from the facts.

[JMMR]

..

Latendresse was given the bare minimum when he was in the NHL. That was the problem. The Kostitsyn's were always favoured over him.

Andrei maybe Sergei never.

[hab29RETIRED]

AK46 deserved to be ahead of Lats. Fats had size had size but rarely used it an didn't look like someone who cared about conditioning. When AK46 wasn't scoring at least he was usually physically engaged and he looked like someone who worked out. When Lats wasn't scoring he was useless.

I think had Gainey put in a decent player development program and given Lats the chance to dominate in the minors, he would have been a better player. Instead the French media treated him like a rock star and that's the way he acted. he rarely showed the dedication to become a hockey star.

He would have been getting first line minutes in the minors. As a slower, one-dimensional scorer, he couldn't rack up minutes with guys like Andrei Kostitsyn ahead of him. And A. Kost, as a top prospect who we had pegged as a perennial 30-goal-scorer (oh the regret), deserved those minutes. The fact that his numbers and production plateaued in his first three seasons shows that he wasn't getting a chance to develop in Montreal, of course, and he would have had a better chance in the minors. He could have emerged as a more complete player without every middling outing being scrutinized in the Montreal fishbowl. Time in the minors helped Pacioretty - perhaps he was being misused, but he went down and worked on his game and came back and earned his proper spot. Latendresse never really earned anything.

[Neech]

AK46 deserved to be ahead of Lats. Fats had size had size but rarely used it an didn't look like someone who cared about conditioning. When AK46 wasn't scoring at least he was usually physically engaged and he looked like someone who worked out. When Lats wasn't scoring he was useless.

I think had Gainey put in a decent player development program and given Lats the chance to dominate in the minors, he would have been a better player. Instead the French media treated him like a rock star and that's the way he acted. he rarely showed the dedication to become a hockey star.

I agree with your assessment of Latendresse, but I think you're a bit generous with AK46. He was one of the most brain-dead players I've ever watched. He might land a hit or snipe a goal, or he might drift around seeming like he doesn't even have a clue a hockey game is going on.

I blame Chernobyl fallout.

[DON]

I agree with your assessment of Latendresse, but I think you're a bit generous with AK46. He was one of the most brain-dead players I've ever watched. He might land a hit or snipe a goal, or he might drift around seeming like he doesn't even have a clue a hockey game is going on.

I blame Chernobyl fallout.

And still AK46 was twice the hockey player, maybe Fats needed more radioactivity and less ice-cream?

[Neech]

And still AK46 was twice the hockey player, maybe Fats needed more radioactivity and less ice-cream?

Don't we all, DON, don't we all.

Although Lats still has a nice head of hair, and it's obvious what's to blame for AK46's enormous bald head.

[DON]

Don't we all, DON, don't we all.

Although Lats still has a nice head of hair, and it's obvious what's to blame for AK46's enormous bald head.

Baby brother Sergei must of been adopted.

[Neech]

Baby brother Sergei must of been adopted.

I always assumed that Andrei just ate all the food off his plate.

[DON]

I always assumed that Andrei just ate all the food off his plate.

[habs rule]

aggh this whole thread is hindsight. Lats got hurt many times and will probably retire due to injury. Whatever happened in midget or when he was 19 or if the habs should have done this or that is crap. He got hit in the head and may have to retire.