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Commandant    604
6 hours ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

I'm not blaming you for not acquiring a top 4 defenseman. I'm staying the obvious by including someone who wouldn't conventionally fit in the role since we don't have one. Non matter who we put there, they don't belong there. Alzner is the best candidate but that doesn't help initiate offense for our better lines and then our other pairings are weaker as well. 

 

You are the one blaming me for trying to come up with a solution. Do I think Streit is a top pairing guy? I don't. Do I think he belongs in the top 6 over Davidson? I do. Do I think Streit might be scary on a pairing with Petry or Benn? I do. Of course it's not an ideal situation trying to cover someone's deficiencies by placing him on the top pair. That I understand. But if we're going to play the cards we're dealt, I don't think it would be the worst option.

 

If someone can show me, once again, more BALANCED pairings with Streit on the other pairs, I'm all for it. 

I get that you're high on Schlemko but San Jose exposed more of their defensemen compared to other teams for a reason. I expect decent things out of Schlemko but he is worse offensively than Streit. Defensively and offensively combined, you'd have to give the edge to Schlemko and thus sums up my point of trusting him with Petry or Benn more than I would Streit.

 

I misunderstood your question of "what is your solution", i thought you were asking what external player i would acquire to solve things.  I apologize. 

 

As for the pairs I'd make, at this point they'd be: 

 

Schlemko - Weber

Alzner - Petry

Streit vs Jerabek - Benn

 

Looks like the best solution to me (short of another acquisition). 

 

Its not ideal, but i do think Schlemko is the 4th best D on this team, so I put him with my #1 and as Weber to carry the pair. 

Streit and Jerabek fight for the last spot beside Benn.  They get the advantage of not playing against top lines. 

 

If they are even close to equal, I'd give Jerabek the spot, hoping that he can develop into something more, he's the wild card that we don't know what he is. Thats not an ideal plan, but if he was close to Streit in camp, I'd start him and see if there can be any growth through experience in the NHL. 

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BCHabnut    153

Petry Weber

Shlemko Alzner? 

 

RR

LL

 

Hard to find too many working combos right now. Other Than pray to christ jarebek is awesome. 

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xXx..CK..xXx    138
20 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

I misunderstood your question of "what is your solution", i thought you were asking what external player i would acquire to solve things.  I apologize. 

 

As for the pairs I'd make, at this point they'd be: 

 

Schlemko - Weber

Alzner - Petry

Streit vs Jerabek - Benn

 

Looks like the best solution to me (short of another acquisition). 

 

Its not ideal, but i do think Schlemko is the 4th best D on this team, so I put him with my #1 and as Weber to carry the pair. 

Streit and Jerabek fight for the last spot beside Benn.  They get the advantage of not playing against top lines. 

 

If they are even close to equal, I'd give Jerabek the spot, hoping that he can develop into something more, he's the wild card that we don't know what he is. Thats not an ideal plan, but if he was close to Streit in camp, I'd start him and see if there can be any growth through experience in the NHL. 

Yeah I do admit that there are a couple of wild cards who could drastically change things. I also get that Streit was a healthy scratch for a lot of the playoffs but they were the cup

winning team, after all. There's no doubt that I'm having wishful thinking thoughts when Streit is only being paid 700k for a reason.

 

You won't hear me talking anymore about Streit in such a seemingly positive way. I didn't even care much about the signing. But wishful thinking aside, I do get a slight feeling he may be able to to do a little more "back home" than he has recently.

 

Three seasons ago he had 2 more points than Markov. 52 vs 50. Since then, I haven't followed him much but it seems he got injured and then fell off a cliff due to his age. I guess Markov just aged better.

 

The only issue I see is that if he's not given a chance, he will end up that press box player that many are predicting. If he is given an opportunity to have a good partner, he might be a contributing 700k player.

 

I mean, we did sign him so which one do we want?

 

Jerabek is the wildcard because if he is a similar to better talent, then I'd agree with Schlemko and Alzner in the top 4 and then Streit a healthy scratch.

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Link67    106
17 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

If Streit is your 6th defenseman, then Schlemko should be your 4th or 5th. You seem to be arguin a point I'm not trying to make. What I'm saying is that I'd rather have Streit on the top pairing than Schlemko.

 

If the top pairing is Alzner-Weber, then Schlemko should be on the second pair and Streit should see limited minutes on the third pair, along with some PP time.

 

If for whatever reason, the coaching staff sees Alzner as a complimentary partner to Petry, then I'd rather see Streit on the top pair than

Schlemko.

 

If you put the younger, faster defenseman against the better opposition, then I'm not sure why we saw Emelin on the top pair last season over Beaulieu. 

 

There are two things we have that other teams don't. We have Shea Weber, who

can make unorthodox players look

competent on the top pair and we also have the best goaltender in the world. What we need is more offense.

 

Statistically, Streit averaged more points than Petry only last year and if he's given a chance, he can get 30-40 points despite his age. Why that's frowned upon beats me. It certainly becomes a worse top

pairing than we had with Markov but it's better than Beaulieu and Emelin on the top pair. Due to the reality that Emelin overtook Beaulieu on the top pair last season, I agree we will likely see Alzner there at this point. 

 

 

I'm not sure what point you think i'm not seeing here but let me clarify my stance on this further.

 

Streit does not belong on the top pair is what I am saying, I don't care how many points he averages he CANNOT and WILL not be thrown into a situation where he sees the best players every night for over 20 minutes a game. You don't sign a 39 year old to a 700k contract to play that role, he is coming in here as the 3RD best LHD on this team, and under no circumstance should he or will he be jumping over Alzner or Schlemko on the depth chart. He has better odds of being bumped by Jerabek than he does of bumping either of the other 2 for ice time.

 

 

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Link67    106
34 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

I misunderstood your question of "what is your solution", i thought you were asking what external player i would acquire to solve things.  I apologize. 

 

As for the pairs I'd make, at this point they'd be: 

 

Schlemko - Weber

Alzner - Petry

Streit vs Jerabek - Benn

 

Looks like the best solution to me (short of another acquisition). 

 

Its not ideal, but i do think Schlemko is the 4th best D on this team, so I put him with my #1 and as Weber to carry the pair. 

Streit and Jerabek fight for the last spot beside Benn.  They get the advantage of not playing against top lines. 

 

If they are even close to equal, I'd give Jerabek the spot, hoping that he can develop into something more, he's the wild card that we don't know what he is. Thats not an ideal plan, but if he was close to Streit in camp, I'd start him and see if there can be any growth through experience in the NHL. 

 

Yep I have to agree, its not ideal but I see it exactly as you do, Its one of two line ups, the one you just posted, or the identical line up with Alzner and Schlemko swapped. Those are pretty well the only 2 viable things to try this season as it stands anyway.

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xXx..CK..xXx    138
7 minutes ago, Link67 said:

 

Yep I have to agree, its not ideal but I see it exactly as you do, Its one of two line ups, the one you just posted, or the identical line up with Alzner and Schlemko swapped. Those are pretty well the only 2 viable things to try this season as it stands anyway.

Schlemko on the top pairing is "not ideal" but that's just fine. Streit on the top pair is "not ideal" and a terrible idea. Read anything about Schlemko which I'm sure you have and you'll see he is just as much of a third pairing defenseman as Streit.

 

You are arguing that Streit does no not belong on the top pair and making that very clear and then replacing him with someone else who definitely does not belong there and calling it not ideal. Next we'll hear that it's the better of two evils but that's up for debate. Streit has been a top pairing caliber defenseman in his career, Schlemko has not nor should he ever have been. "But he's younger".

 

Call me not convinced. The only thing out of it all that I agree with is that Streit is weak defensively at this point. In come Weber and Price.

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Link67    106
1 hour ago, Machine of Loving Grace said:

- I don't like the signing at all. Let's see if his play shuts me up. I highly doubt it. 

 

- Plenty of banged up players still got bidding wars. Komisarek and Volchenkov are the two best examples. Montreal tried to sign Lecavalier after he was bought out, failed, and went for Briere instead. Another bought out veteran with declining skill and injury issues. Worked out great Eh?

 

- I think he's going to play through injuries like he always does and be unable to play meaningful minutes in the top four. He will be a bottom pair defenceman by the following season and a buyout option by year 3.

 

- He was proven the years before 16-17. He wasn't proving anything in 16-17 except that Washington was fine with keeping Orlov over him and no Caps fan would have said that in 15-16.

 

He's more than welcome to show better offensive ability and stay dependable in 17-18 and shut me up. Highly doubt it. Enjoy building excuses for him and Bergevin. 

 

:rolleyes: Of course I am just making excuses for Bergevin, who I didn't even mention in my post and is actually in my doghouse for his cataclysmic failure in the Markov situation, but keep trying to peg me a blind Bergevin supporter.

 

I am however, defending Alzner, who remains a very solid Dman, and who you seem to think is little more useful than Captain Barbossa on skates this year after one Groin/Hamstring injury. You mention 2 players who don't even compare to Alzner in the current situation either, which I find comical. Volchenkov was getting into his mid 30s by the time he started being useless, and Komisarek was a byproduct of Markov, incapable of looking effective without him. Alzner has forged his own way through his career never having relied on anyone to make him who he is and was a top 3 on one of the best hockey teams for years, he is also not 32 or 33, he is 28.

 

I also noticed the subtle impossible challenge for him to suddenly pick it up offensively when that is not at all his style of play and we all know it. Just a little insurance policy on your part so you have something to rag on him for all year? "Nope not even on pace for 35 points, USELESS!" I can hear it already. It is like asking Adam Foote 7 years into his career to show better offensive ability.

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xXx..CK..xXx    138
On 7/29/2017 at 3:00 PM, xXx..CK..xXx said:

 

What I would do:

Streit-Weber (hate on)

Alzner-Petry

Schlemko-Benn

 

What I see happening:

 

Alzner-Weber

Schlemko-Petry

Streit-Benn

 

 

Finally, this was the quote from the end of my original post. If true, the latter is the only formation that matters.

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Link67    106
2 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

Schlemko on the top pairing is "not ideal" but that's just fine. Streit on the top pair is "not ideal" and a terrible idea. Read anything about Schlemko which I'm sure you have and you'll see he is just as much of a third pairing defenseman as Streit.

 

You are arguing that Streit does no not belong on the top pair and making that very clear and then replacing him with someone else who definitely does not belong there and calling it not ideal. Next we'll hear that it's the better of two evils but that's up for debate. Streit has been a top pairing caliber defenseman in his career, Schlemko has not nor should he ever have been. "But he's younger".

 

Call me not convinced. The only thing out of it all that I agree with is that Streit is weak defensively at this point. In come Weber and Price.

 

Ok lets try this way then

 

During the playoffs, a very recent situation, Schlemko playing on the SJ Defense, played every game, was 5th in scoring during that span with 3 points in 6 games, tied for first among their D, and coupled that with the best +/- at +2 on the entire team. Now he played a very serviceable role on their bottom pair, and never had his spot in the line up questioned during that span.

 

On to Streit, who was scratched on a majority of nights on an even less formidable Pittsburgh D, had nothing to show for other than it was pretty clear he was no longer the Mark Streit from 2014, a Mark Streit you still seem to be expecting here in Montreal. If you think he has anything more than Flies Fart of a chance to be a more effective Dman for us than Schlemko at this current time, I simply think you are wrong. Schlemko, regardless where we put him in this line up right now, will be the better option over Streit, hands down, there is no debate. Schlemko may likely not be able to handle top pair minutes in the end, but he certainly has a much better chance at making it work than Streit at this point, the recent comparison speaks for itself really. 

 

Although I do agree, that in the end the most likely scenario is Alzner with Weber.

 

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1 hour ago, Link67 said:

Volchenkov was getting into his mid 30s by the time he started being useless

 

:lol:

 

Volchenkov was 28 when he was signed by New Jersey as a free agent. He was falling apart that first season with the Devils and couldn't stay healthy. His overall play dropped because he couldn't play the way he used to in Ottawa anymore.

 

Why am I laughing? Anton Volchenkov is only 35 years old. He's right now in his mid 30s. He's been out of the NHL for two years now. 

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Link67    106
1 hour ago, Machine of Loving Grace said:

 

:lol:

 

Volchenkov was 28 when he was signed by New Jersey as a free agent. He was falling apart that first season with the Devils and couldn't stay healthy. His overall play dropped because he couldn't play the way he used to in Ottawa anymore.

 

Why am I laughing? Anton Volchenkov is only 35 years old. He's right now in his mid 30s. He's been out of the NHL for two years now. 

 

He was useless when he went to Nashville, which is when he was 32, and "getting into his mid 30's" as I stated. Mid 30's by my estimation are 33 - 37. Also I am glad to note that was the only part of that whole point you tried to knit pick. Fact remains Volchenkov was battling mass amounts of injury problems that were costing him anywhere from 20 to 40 games a season for the final 3 years of his NHL career and accelerated his drop off, a problem that is non existent with Alzner who hasn't missed a game in 5 or 6 years.

 

There is plenty to suggest he can be the healthy version of himself he was before last year. He is plagued by no historical reoccurring injuries, the injury he did have allowed him to still play but at a 70% state.

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hab29RETIRED    163

Hockey news came out of their team management rankings, Habs at 27th.  Only the Avs, Canucks and wings rank lower.  The last comment was on the mark - "Montreal has a good team, but they seem a bit misguided on how to turn it into a great team". And IMO, the only Price makes them a good team with the leaky faucet D and pop gun offence.

 

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/article/front-office-confidence-rankings-part-2-fans-weigh-in-on-how-each-team-is-doing

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DON    24
16 hours ago, Link67 said:

 

He was useless when he went to Nashville, which is when he was 32, and "getting into his mid 30's" as I stated. Mid 30's by my estimation are 33 - 37. Also I am glad to note that was the only part of that whole point you tried to knit pick. Fact remains Volchenkov was battling mass amounts of injury problems that were costing him anywhere from 20 to 40 games a season for the final 3 years of his NHL career and accelerated his drop off, a problem that is non existent with Alzner who hasn't missed a game in 5 or 6 years.

 

There is plenty to suggest he can be the healthy version of himself he was before last year. He is plagued by no historical reoccurring injuries, the injury he did have allowed him to still play but at a 70% state.

Yes, Caps were miles ahead in Eastern standings near end of year, finished by going 8-2 over last ten games and Alzner still played all 82 games and has played every game for past 6 years, so not much of a comparison with that russian d-man.

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huzer    54
8 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Hockey news came out of their team management rankings, Habs at 27th.  Only the Avs, Canucks and wings rank lower.  The last comment was on the mark - "Montreal has a good team, but they seem a bit misguided on how to turn it into a great team". And IMO, the only Price makes them a good team with the leaky faucet D and pop gun offence.

 

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/article/front-office-confidence-rankings-part-2-fans-weigh-in-on-how-each-team-is-doing

Not that I'm thrilled with Bergevin's body of work, but that's from a fan survey. Based on message board opinions, I'm surprised Bergevin is ranked that highly.

 

Just giving my own 2 cents, the lack of foresight is what's most surprising to me. I get not extending Markov or Radulov. (I'm not thrilled with it, but I can understand it). It seems, however, contradictory to the Subban/Weber trade. It's also surprising that the pieces Bergevin added thus far this summer should have been enhancements to the roster. If the Habs added Drouin and Alzner, while keeping Radulov and Markov, I'd be a bit happier. It appears, although I'm sure it's not the case, that Bergevin gets target fixated and can't multitask and each move is made in isolation of other moves. At least he took a picture with my kid a couple of weeks ago. Ha.

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DON    24
3 minutes ago, huzer said:

Not that I'm thrilled with Bergevin's body of work, but that's from a fan survey. Based on message board opinions, I'm surprised Bergevin is ranked that highly.

 

Just giving my own 2 cents, the lack of foresight is what's most surprising to me. I get not extending Markov or Radulov. (I'm not thrilled with it, but I can understand it). It seems, however, contradictory to the Subban/Weber trade. It's also surprising that the pieces Bergevin added thus far this summer should have been enhancements to the roster. If the Habs added Drouin and Alzner, while keeping Radulov and Markov, I'd be a bit happier. It appears, although I'm sure it's not the case, that Bergevin gets target fixated and can't multitask and each move is made in isolation of other moves. At least he took a picture with my kid a couple of weeks ago. Ha.

Who you rather see signed long term; Drouin or Radulov, given Radulov got the contract Quebec equivalent of $7.1m/yr with Dallas and sounds like new contract was discussed in Jan between Bergy-agent and agent was asking for huge contract then, so seems Bergevin simply offered what he thought he should and wasn't enough. Same with Markov, dlbalr figured about a $4.5m deal should of been reasonable expectation and sounds like that was likely about the offer. So, aside from fact we all would rather see both playing with Habs this year, it couldn't be at any cost...could it? 

From what is reported, Bergevin is well liked by all (but Jagr?) and nice to hear he was pleasant with your youngin as well:clap: .

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huzer    54
1 minute ago, DON said:

Who you rather see signed long term; Drouin or Radulov, given Radulov got the contract Quebec equivalent of $7.1m/yr with Dallas and sounds like new contract was discussed in Jan between Bergy-agent and agent was asking for huge contract then, so seems Bergevin simply offered what he thought he should and wasn't enough. Same with Markov, dlbalr figured about a $4.5m deal should of been reasonable expectation and sounds like that was likely about the offer. So, aside from fact we all would rather see both playing with Habs this year, it couldn't be at any cost...could it? 

From what is reported, Bergevin is well liked by all (but Jagr?) and nice to hear he was pleasant with your youngin as well:clap: .

 

 As I said, I can see the reason why neither was re-signed, and I'm not as up-in-arms about it as others. It just seemed to me that the team didn't do much to improve, more lateral movements. Drouin/Alzner/Schlemko are hopefully upgrades on Radulov/Emelin/Beaulieu. We don't have a replacement for Markov. Streit is not that person and hopefully is not going to be asked to be. I don't pretend to be all knowing and get into the hypothetical debates of what Bergevin should have done, or that he was x dollars away from signing someone. Speaking for me personally, it seems the chairs on the deck have been moved around, but that's about it. I know the off season isn't over, hopefully additional moves can be made to shore up at last one of the roster holes that remain.

 

I only commented that letting Markov/Radulov walk seems to go against what some folks perceive to be win-now mode.

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Link67    106
34 minutes ago, huzer said:

 

 As I said, I can see the reason why neither was re-signed, and I'm not as up-in-arms about it as others. It just seemed to me that the team didn't do much to improve, more lateral movements. Drouin/Alzner/Schlemko are hopefully upgrades on Radulov/Emelin/Beaulieu. We don't have a replacement for Markov. Streit is not that person and hopefully is not going to be asked to be. I don't pretend to be all knowing and get into the hypothetical debates of what Bergevin should have done, or that he was x dollars away from signing someone. Speaking for me personally, it seems the chairs on the deck have been moved around, but that's about it. I know the off season isn't over, hopefully additional moves can be made to shore up at last one of the roster holes that remain.

 

I only commented that letting Markov/Radulov walk seems to go against what some folks perceive to be win-now mode.

 

I agree, and am pretty well on the same boat, its been a lateral move type of offseason so far, I do think Drouin/Alzner/Schlemko is an upgrade over Radulov/Emelin/Beaulieu, however the loss of Markov has pissed away any gains in that department now. We are going to have to see what comes of this 8.5 mill in cap before we can determine whether we head into next season better than last.

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Toronthab    291

If you want my opinion you haven't been reading my posts critically.

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Stogey24    236
57 minutes ago, DON said:

He obviously hasn't visited here.:B)

Lol, no shit eh

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JGC21    51

In Bergevin we trust.

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nihilz    29

BAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!! Let's tank!!! Hire Quintal and sell everything! Bring back Gainey as President! lmfao smh

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DON    24
7 minutes ago, nihilz said:

BAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!! Let's tank!!! Hire Quintal and sell everything! Bring back Gainey as President! lmfao smh

Some will seriously agree with you after every Hab loss, sorry to say.:tigi:

Image result for images chicken little

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