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There are 14 preds playing in the Stanley cup finals who played for the farm club.

 

I sincerely believe we don't have a drafting problem as much as a development problem.

 

Why is lefebreve (however it's spelled) being held onto? We need a new development team.

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1 hour ago, Meller93 said:

There are 14 preds playing in the Stanley cup finals who played for the farm club.

 

I sincerely believe we don't have a drafting problem as much as a development problem.

 

Why is lefebreve (however it's spelled) being held onto? We need a new development team.

There is one ton of NHL experience in the Mgmt group. For some reason they don't seem to put a lot of effort into farm club being a winner, that is for sure.

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6 hours ago, Meller93 said:

There are 14 preds playing in the Stanley cup finals who played for the farm club.

 

I sincerely believe we don't have a drafting problem as much as a development problem.

 

Why is lefebreve (however it's spelled) being held onto? We need a new development team.

This is really the biggest failing of the MB era, and a big reason why it would not bother me to see him terminated. Not once impact player has been developed in the ahl under MB. 

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5 hours ago, BCHabnut said:

This is really the biggest failing of the MB era, and a big reason why it would not bother me to see him terminated. Not once impact player has been developed in the ahl under MB. 

Hey, don't you know, that's not MB's fault, that's the fault of the players not playing up to their potential.  Besides it's really hard to develop players. 

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5 hours ago, BCHabnut said:

This is really the biggest failing of the MB era, and a big reason why it would not bother me to see him terminated. Not once impact player has been developed in the ahl under MB. 

And exactly which draft picks should of been impact players and haven't been...McCarron?

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15 hours ago, Lovett's Magnatones said:

 

If that's the attitude over at ESPN, they might as well join the Trump pile-on happening in the rest of the media. Parseing a quote from two years ago to staple onto a preconceived narrative is Modern American Media 101.

 Hah! Roger that bud

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1 hour ago, DON said:

And exactly which draft picks should of been impact players and haven't been...McCarron?

 

Its not about exactly which guy.

 

Its that someone should have in 5 years. 

 

If I give you 20 raffle tickets and they all have a 25% chance of winning.... its impossible for to point to the exact one that is going to win, but its statistically improbable that you go 0 for 20

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Drafting and player development have been very disappointing over the past 10-15 years. 

 

 

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48 minutes ago, Chris said:

Drafting and player development have been very disappointing over the past 10-15 years. 

 

 

2012,13,15,16 are what we are talking about, isn't it.

Basically is Galchenyuk, McCarron, Scherbak, Juulsen, Sergachev.

Fucale, Collberg, Thrower maybe not best picks, but at the time most were pretty friggin happy with that years haul and Habs were claimed as one of best fro that year.

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43 minutes ago, DON said:

2012,13,15,16 are what we are talking about, isn't it.

Basically is Galchenyuk, McCarron, Scherbak, Juulsen, Sergachev.

Fucale, Collberg, Thrower maybe not best picks, but at the time most were pretty friggin happy with that years haul and Habs were claimed as one of best fro that year.

It's not just the picks it's the development of those picks.  I didn't like the McCarron (this reaked of the off the board mistakes like Calgary has made and we already made with Fischer), or Fucale.  I do think Galchenyuk and Scherbak (along with everyone else to play for lefebve) is a development issue.  That's on MB.

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2 hours ago, Chris said:

Drafting and player development have been very disappointing over the past 10-15 years. 

 

 

 

It's an issue nowadays for sure. However, the Gainey/Goat regimes left us with Subban, Price, Pacioretty, Gallagher, Plekanec, and some other good players, not to mention the lost lamented Ryan McDonagh and others who 'got away.' Otherwise put, MB inherited a strong nucleus, which means the previous regimes did something right on this front.

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54 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

It's not just the picks it's the development of those picks.  I didn't like the McCarron (this reaked of the off the board mistakes like Calgary has made and we already made with Fischer), or Fucale.  I do think Galchenyuk and Scherbak (along with everyone else to play for lefebve) is a development issue.  That's on MB.

According to you, everything negative is on Bergy. So, exactly how is Scherbak being mishandled and Galchenyuk only had 30g last year didn't he?

Fucale was "off the board", you cant be serious or just not a clue what are talking about I have to assume? 

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Almost every draft by Bergevin/Timmins/Churla is highly regarded when it happens and then there's next to no results after. And then in retrospect you wonder why they only take centres with low picks. And why there's so many defencemen selected.

 

Amateur drafting and development has been an issue. 

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22 minutes ago, DON said:

According to you, everything negative is on Bergy. So, exactly how is Scherbak being mishandled and Galchenyuk only had 30g last year didn't he?

Fucale was "off the board", you cant be serious or just not a clue what are talking about I have to assume? 

Who hired Lefebve?   So it's on MB.

 

McCarron was off the board.  I just didn't like the fucale pick.  We didnt need to blow a second round pick on a goalie prospect when we are starving for goals.

 

How much as Scherbak progressed while in Hamilton?  Where did galchenyuk end up in the playoffs?  On the friggin 4th line.  Mishandled!!!!   He was played as a winger for two years and than magically expected to master being a centre??? Mishandled!!  What part of that exactly do you not comprehend???

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1 hour ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Who hired Lefebve?   So it's on MB.

 

McCarron was off the board.  I just didn't like the fucale pick.  We didnt need to blow a second round pick on a goalie prospect when we are starving for goals.

 

How much as Scherbak progressed while in Hamilton?  Where did galchenyuk end up in the playoffs?  On the friggin 4th line.  Mishandled!!!!   He was played as a winger for two years and than magically expected to master being a centre??? Mishandled!!  What part of that exactly do you not comprehend???

Of players selected after Fucale, which did Habs miss on? (Eric Comrie maybe...but no is a goalie so cant take him, Bowey is a d-man so also no good I assume)

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2013e.html

You whine about Galchenyuk mastering centre, but you assume he is supposed to be a centre (likely mostly because the Habs lack centres, but that isn't any good reason to force a round peg in square hole).

 

Ovechkin was on 3rd line in playoffs, why was that, a hall of famer in bottom six, was because he wasn't scoring.

 

Your the expert, so you tell me how much Scherbak has developed, since you must follow him closer than I do. Who did he play with, how much icetime did he get, did he play PP, what is his biggest weakness?

And exactly how would you of played him different to get more out of him?

 

The only player who seems to getting odd treatment is Hudon, but maybe dlbalr is correct and his skating simply isn't NHL calibre?

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Ovechkin was injured to be fair. 

 

They moved him down the lineup to still use him on the PP, but he didn't have the usual explosive skating 5v5. 

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32 minutes ago, Commandant said:

Ovechkin was injured to be fair. 

 

They moved him down the lineup to still use him on the PP, but he didn't have the usual explosive skating 5v5. 

 

It was also Trotz trying to pull a Sullivan and have three offensive lines. If Ovechkin is playing with Eller, linematching him opens up Oshie/Backstrom/Kuz etc. and Pittsburgh was a weak defensive team. It just didn't work because Ovechkin was hurt. 

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I agreed with the development issue thing but Don brings up a good point in that the sample size is really small. Galchenyuk being

the way he is involves about 15 different factors and not all of those reasons have to do with management. In addition, I have personally been fine with his play in general. As long as Julien handles things well, I expect th negative thoughts towards Galchenyuk from this season to be an aberration.

 

Next, there seems to be a bit of a blurred line when people talk about drafting and our scouts like Timmons versus MB. How much should the picks that haven't worked out be blamed on our scouting, how much should be blamed on our general management and how much should be blamed on our AHL organization and Lefebvre. Of course many will say that all three have to do with our general manager but I don't necessarily agree. Other people have to be responsible for their jobs as well. It seems as though pretty much everyone agrees that Lefebvre is not doing his job but I sincerely wonder how much of that is blown out of proportion as well. I'm willing to be looked at like I'm crazy but I'd like to think if he really were that obviously terrible, something would happen. 

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Galchenyuk was 9th in the league in scoring before he got injured. As a centre.

 

When he returned he clearly returned too early and struggled to get back in rhythm. What did two separate coaches do? Keep him at centres and just protect him? Healthy scratch him until he was 100% healthy?

 

Nah, they put him on the wing. Which is sure to help a guy get back into playing centre.

 

(And before you reply, yes, if even Michel frickin Therrien came out and said, "Galchenyuk is not being scratched for poor play. He's being scratched because even though the doctor cleared him, I feel his game isn't where it should be and he needs a little more rest" I would have been 100% fine with it.)

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1 hour ago, Machine of Loving Grace said:

 

It was also Trotz trying to pull a Sullivan and have three offensive lines. If Ovechkin is playing with Eller, linematching him opens up Oshie/Backstrom/Kuz etc. and Pittsburgh was a weak defensive team. It just didn't work because Ovechkin was hurt. 

 

That explains it. Lars Eller. End the post-mortem.

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17 hours ago, DON said:

Of players selected after Fucale, which did Habs miss on? (Eric Comrie maybe...but no is a goalie so cant take him, Bowey is a d-man so also no good I assume)

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2013e.html

You whine about Galchenyuk mastering centre, but you assume he is supposed to be a centre (likely mostly because the Habs lack centres, but that isn't any good reason to force a round peg in square hole).

 

Ovechkin was on 3rd line in playoffs, why was that, a hall of famer in bottom six, was because he wasn't scoring.

 

Your the expert, so you tell me how much Scherbak has developed, since you must follow him closer than I do. Who did he play with, how much icetime did he get, did he play PP, what is his biggest weakness?

And exactly how would you of played him different to get more out of him?

 

The only player who seems to getting odd treatment is Hudon, but maybe dlbalr is correct and his skating simply isn't NHL calibre?

Trying to make the reverse mistake as galchenyuk with Scherbak didn't help his development.  They have a centre in galchenyuk and didn't let him play centre for over two years and than despite stats that show him having more success at centre are he'll bent on turning him into a winger - despite the glaring need for a centre.  

 

With thy scherbak they have a guy that was a winger his whole career and lefebve wasted his first year trying to make him a centre???  Why not also have him play goal or defence??

 

why Hudson doesn't get more of a look makes zero sense.  The guy is producing.  The habs can't score.  But hey they need to teach the kid a lesson, so send in down and keep trading for more 4th line grunts at the deadline.  For a team starving to score, Hudon should have been given an extended look.

 

 

 

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2015-16:

"Nikita Scherbak: A-: Scherbak’s offensive skill really started to shine in this last stretch of games.  He was moved onto the top line (more or less by default) but was much more comfortable in that role than he was even at the halfway point of the year.  That said, he still struggled in his own end frequently and showed that he won’t be ready to start with the Habs next season.

 

Final Grade: C+: It was a tough rookie campaign overall for Scherbak.  He was a disaster in the defensive zone and injuries certainly didn’t help either.  However, he did look a lot more comfortable with the puck on his stick as the year progressed and since his entry level deal doesn’t start until next season, it’s okay for his development curve to be slower.

 

2016-17: Nikita Scherbak – B-: The inconsistency from game to game and shift to shift is still there at times.  The defensive struggles are still there at times.  However, they’re not occurring quite as frequently while Scherbak also became more of a threat offensively compared to his rookie season.  There’s still a long way to go but he still has two years left on his entry-level deal; it’s not as if he has to be in the NHL right away.  A lot of work is still needed but there is still some upside here."

 

This writer didn't think he should try goal or d, especially as he is still lost in his own end or without puck, but definite improvement from his -26 in 15-16.

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I might be missing how that is a response to the fact it was a mistake to put him at Centre for much of his rookie campaign. 

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30 minutes ago, Commandant said:

I might be missing how that is a response to the fact it was a mistake to put him at Centre for much of his rookie campaign. 

He did, listed in games as RW start Oct, end of Oct...

When did he play centre?

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1 hour ago, DON said:

He did, listed in games as RW start Oct, end of Oct...

When did he play centre?

 

For those of us who watched the games, he played Centre much of the 2015-16 season. Mostly after his return from the ankle injury. 

 

We are not lying to you Don.  You don't have to go on an investigation here.  It happened... they spent several months trying to convert him to a position he never played before, all while he was one of the youngest players in the league, was having defensive issues, and was coming back after missing considerable time from a serious ankle injury.   

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