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Feb. 23, Islanders vs Canadiens, 7:30 PM


dlbalr

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I'm just going to add that this team can definitely win it all with a goalie like Carey Price. I know there have been comments about not needing an elite goaltender in the playoffs but one can look at the fact that Price hasn't played his best hockey yet this season in a positive manner as well. I don't see Price as necessarily being the best goalie in the world to completely steal a game, but he can definitely steal a series. So I don't fully share the view of the doomsdayers. We need to make a move, short term, or long term, but this team will go as far as Price takes it. Despite his play so far at times this season, that's a good thing.

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i have to believe CJ can prepare this team for a playoff run...i just think MB waited too long to fire the genius...then again his options were limited until CJ became available.  20 games to sort things out is at the limit of what it should take...

 

And i also think it's to our ADVANTAGE that CJ does not know much about our prospects (Hudon, McCarron, Getto, DLR, etc...).  One reason (amongst many) to bring in a new coach is to also bring in objectivity and to completely "delete" the old bias (**this constant interchanging of AHL players never made sense to me...especially when we bring a player up for him to play about 6 minutes in one game and then send him down again...I mean what does this really tell us about the player?).     

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5 hours ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

Our biggest weakness is our forward corps. One can talk all they want about how our defensemen can't carry the puck up the ice but we do have some puck movers on the back end. There was a good discussion about whether or not we should get a #2 defenseman or that elusive top 2 center and for me, the answer is the top 2 center if we can only get one or the other. We've needed that for way too long and it needs to be solved already. It also depends on the player. Shattenkirk would be mighty nice.

 

This team can not score in transition, when was the last time they scored off the rush.

 

Pacioretty used to score off the rush, and get breakaways all the time.  It doesn't happen now.  If you don't think switching Subban (who had more assists on Pacioretty goals than any other player, including forwards)... for Weber (who has done near nothing 5v5) makes a difference there, I don't know what to say. 

 

Its not just Pacioretty though, Galchenyuk scored a bunch off the rush.  So did Gallagher, and Plekanec, and others too.  But the pairing who plays the biggest minutes for the team has no puck moving and transition. 

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15 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

This team can not score in transition, when was the last time they scored off the rush.

 

Pacioretty used to score off the rush, and get breakaways all the time.  It doesn't happen now.  If you don't think switching Subban (who had more assists on Pacioretty goals than any other player, including forwards)... for Weber (who has done near nothing 5v5) makes a difference there, I don't know what to say. 

 

Its not just Pacioretty though, Galchenyuk scored a bunch off the rush.  So did Gallagher, and Plekanec, and others too.  But the pairing who plays the biggest minutes for the team has no puck moving and transition. 

I completely agree with you. I remember Pacioretry getting a breakaway every game. Despite the hate, however, Markov, Beaulieu, Petry and even Weber and Emelin are all capable of sending decent outlet passes. Even Barberio was really good at that and Nesterov can handle the puck as well. Pateryn and Emelin may be the weakest. 

 

I'm not trying to debate that we have a hole but with the players we have, Markov should be on the top pairing if we're looking to improve our transition on the top pair. Markov is just as good as anyone at setting players free on a breakaway. Some people seem to overlook that we have neither of last seasons top 2 playing in that role this season, not just one. It's just as possible that we get less breakaways because the coaches changed our system; or perhaps more players are actually applying the system. Which, in turn can also be less exciting.

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Guest Stogey24
33 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

This team can not score in transition, when was the last time they scored off the rush.

 

Pacioretty used to score off the rush, and get breakaways all the time.  It doesn't happen now.  If you don't think switching Subban (who had more assists on Pacioretty goals than any other player, including forwards)... for Weber (who has done near nothing 5v5) makes a difference there, I don't know what to say. 

 

Its not just Pacioretty though, Galchenyuk scored a bunch off the rush.  So did Gallagher, and Plekanec, and others too.  But the pairing who plays the biggest minutes for the team has no puck moving and transition. 

100% the biggest issue this team has is the transition. I don't know how many times Subban sent Pacioretty in on breakaways. 

 

C.K, did you watch the game last night? Emelin had a clear lane at Pacioretty for a breakaway pass, but fed it into his skates. 

 

I keep hearing rumours about Pateryn getting traded. Facking move Emelin. He's apparently a #1 guy, on a first place team. So obviously he has value, right? 

 

This team has so many holes it's not even funny. Beregvin lucked out with Radulov. Other than that the guy has done fack all to better a team that may as well have finished in last place, last season.

 

If this is another wasted year(under. 500 since the famous 13-1, is getting close), Molson needs to can Beregvin and find someone who can put a winning team together.

 

How many years do we have to be fed with excuses? Is no one else tired of this? 

 

 

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Guest Stogey24
2 minutes ago, THE Bobby Orr said:

couldn't agree more...he was rummaging thru the castoff pile, 

He's afraid to make a big deal. The ironic part is, it will probably end up costing him his job. 

 

He's managing this team likes it's young top to bottom. 

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2 minutes ago, Stogey24 said:

He's afraid to make a big deal. The ironic part is, it will probably end up costing him his job. 

 

He's managing this team likes it's young top to bottom. 

there are, like you said, a number of issues...but i HAVE to believe we are better than this..CJ has 20 games to turn it around - lets root for our new (old) coach to get it done despite what MB brings.

 

Just some points for what it's worth:

- like just about every other Hab fan; i thought the PK Subban trade was (how do i put this ...) strange?  However Weber is NOT the problem. 

- I strongly believe we are the only  team (in the NHL anyways) that would consider #27 as a #1 C. He simply isn't...maybe he will be one day - but we have a cup to win and i think he should move back to the winger position (or traded away). I know he impressed earlier on, but he was lost out there then too - the puck was going in so we overlooked it..and he is still lost out there now..just brutal

- Weber needs to be paired with Markov from this point onward.

- And Finally, Emelin is not a top 4 D - so why are we pretending he is (the size of his contract i guess)...i give him credit for his ability to hit - BUT he doesn't do it consistently and i sometime wonder if he is "present" in the game...for instance - does he know the score? is he aware of how much time is left in a game? And let's not even talk about his passing skills..

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Stogey24 said:

Petry can look so facking bad at times. Yes, he can play well, but it's so inconsistent. 

 

I know he has a nmc or ntc, but he's a guy I'd look to swap for another D-man. No idea who, but he has some trade value. 

 

 

Just to add to the three goals thing. Montreal has been shutout out 4 of their last 8 games. 

 

I still think he's a good player, but they haven't improved one iota with him.

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I think Weber like Subban as the highest paid player on the team should take a brunt load of the criticism no doubt about it. You are the star player and should play like it and he has been lacklustre on a struggling team just like Subban was last year so I don't mind him catching the heat. I won't jump on the dump Weber bandwagon though he is still our best player most nights but the team as a whole needs to dig themselves out or just keep digging to China.

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There is no 'dump Weber' bandwagon. The problem that critics of the trade are identifying is that the team rather obviously misses the special attributes that Subban brought to the table. Weber is a fine player, but he is not an offensive catalyst driving the transition game. And such a catalyst is exactly what this team needs.

 

The only option is now to go out and try to acquire a blueliner who can bring something of what Subban brought. That's what I mean when I say that the trade created problems but didn't solve any - at least not if on-ice play and results are the barometer.

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Subbans offensive cataclysm didn't stop the team from collapsing last year and we still struggled to score.

 

I disagree that it didn't solve any problems. Defensively we did have a problems that IMO Weber is better than Subban at. While obviously not the whole problem but I think it's silly to put the whole teams offence problems on Weber as he has been paired with Emelin the whole year. He's not the problem at all we just need some help and for a couple players to just start playing better period.

 

 

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46 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

There is no 'dump Weber' bandwagon. The problem that critics of the trade are identifying is that the team rather obviously misses the special attributes that Subban brought to the table. Weber is a fine player, but he is not an offensive catalyst driving the transition game. And such a catalyst is exactly what this team needs.

 

The only option is now to go out and try to acquire a blueliner who can bring something of what Subban brought. That's what I mean when I say that the trade created problems but didn't solve any - at least not if on-ice play and results are the barometer.

This I agree with 112.68%. You do the math

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2 hours ago, Stogey24 said:

He's afraid to make a big deal. The ironic part is, it will probably end up costing him his job. 

 

He's managing this team likes it's young top to bottom. 

You really are doling out the BS today. Did you hurt your ankle jumping off the bandwagon and are blaming Bergevin for that as well?<_<

 

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4 hours ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

I completely agree with you. I remember Pacioretry getting a breakaway every game. Despite the hate, however, Markov, Beaulieu, Petry and even Weber and Emelin are all capable of sending decent outlet passes. Even Barberio was really good at that and Nesterov can handle the puck as well. Pateryn and Emelin may be the weakest. 

 

I'm not trying to debate that we have a hole but with the players we have, Markov should be on the top pairing if we're looking to improve our transition on the top pair. Markov is just as good as anyone at setting players free on a breakaway. Some people seem to overlook that we have neither of last seasons top 2 playing in that role this season, not just one. It's just as possible that we get less breakaways because the coaches changed our system; or perhaps more players are actually applying the system. Which, in turn can also be less exciting.

 

Weber and Emelin are not making those breakout passes.  The thing is you need to able to skate with the puck to make such a pass.  They don't.  They can't skate the puck out of danger.  Any bit of pressure and they bang it off the glass and out. 

 

Markov is not able to play 24 minutes a night on top pairing, and a Markov, Weber pairing would be too slow. 

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4 hours ago, DON said:

Sure wish that Pacioretty could score more goals... but without that prima donna d-man, he just cant and is only on a 44g pace..:bonk:

 

 


You missed the point.

 

He's scoring goals in a new way.  Radulov is really good at controlling possession and making plays.  He scores goals in different ways. 

 

The area that has been lost is the transition game.  And that effects a lot more than just max.  This team used to score a lot of goals on the rush... Max, Gallagher, Weise, Plekanec, Gallagher, etc... all would get their fair share of goals off of 2 on 1s, 3on 2s, breakaways, etc.... we don't get those now. 

 

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I don't see our problems being all about that breakout pass. Too many of the Habs players are bowled over easily, and cannot keep possession long enough in the O zone to create chances is a big problem, small and not so skilled players, relied on to score, but can't.

 

Plekanec, DD, Flynn, Mitchell, Lehkonen, Byron, Gallagher, Lehkonen, and then add the hulking McCarron to the can't score list, and bang, there is more than the PK Subban breakout pass missing, that's 8 of them in the current lineup.

 

Only 4 Mtl forwards have scored in the last 10 games, that's not just a poor breakout pass...

 

Julien said it was execution vs Isles, no tape to tape passes of any kind, and boneheaded defensive breakdowns, especially from Emelin, Beaulieu and Petry, and bang, a close game is lost, at least every second game as of late.

 

Lehkonen is the only one of the smurfs I am interested in keeping at this point, and he needs to be on Galchenyuk's wing, the rest of the players I've mentioned, well, suck at scoring goals in the NHL to be honest, Gallagher being the only exception, and his hand is facked...

 

Team couldn't score enough last year, and nothing's changed other than we have a PP Dman that has scored 14 goals so far instead of 6 all year... 

 

The team is size and skill deprived, and has Emelin in the top pairing, all glaring holes. 

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The Canadiens don't have the centers that can carry the puck. Emelin and Weber, after the first 15 games, has been a very obvious mistake. This isn't 1996 when Peter Popovic is on a pairing with Murray Baron. You almost wonder if MB has made it clear that he's getting a partner for Weber at the deadline and not to bother rearranging tchotchkes?

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19 hours ago, Commandant said:

 

Weber and Emelin are not making those breakout passes.  The thing is you need to able to skate with the puck to make such a pass.  They don't.  They can't skate the puck out of danger.  Any bit of pressure and they bang it off the glass and out. 

 

Markov is not able to play 24 minutes a night on top pairing, and a Markov, Weber pairing would be too slow. 

I'd like to see Markov against Emelin in a foot race because I bet it would be pretty close. The speed thing would be a factor if we weren't comparing Markov to Emelin. The minutes thing is valid and as you know something I've said as well but you have to play the cards you are dealt. If you have to reduce Weber's minutes or have Weber play with another partner in different situations in order to reduce Markov's minutes, then so be it. I really like Markov on the power play with Weber but if Beaulieu is anything at all, he's quietly a power play specialist compared to the rest of his skill set. Half his points are on the power play. If you need to limit Markov's minutes, find a way to pair Beaulieu with Weber on special teams or some other situations. 

 

 

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20 hours ago, DON said:

You really are doling out the BS today. Did you hurt your ankle jumping off the bandwagon and are blaming Bergevin for that as well?<_<

 

 

They stink. They just fired their coach and scored three goals in three games since. Their one win was in the shootout. Discounting two hot starts, they've been a bottom 10, if not 5, team in the league for 1.5 seasons. If Carey Price doesn't keep the other team to two goal, and if Max or Radulov don't score, it's curtains for these moribund losers.

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