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Game 1 2017 Playoffs Rangers at Habs

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Julien just asked about Galchenyuk at press conference, he said he has had talks with him, has been honest with him and ended their meetings on a positive note.

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I'm happy to see someone out there have the courage to criticize Movie Max*. Marinaro tore a strip off of him. The attitude is almost like you aren't allowed to go there. (I get that he has a good deal. I also get that there are 60 odd millions left and fans are overly worried about cap constraints).

 

I don't know why it's personal. The style of hockey in the playoffs or best on best in general doesn't suit his game. He got his bell rung by Girardi twice in the same shift and that was it. Goodnight, Vienna. He might as well shoot from the third row he was so far on the perimeter. We'll see what happens, but he was drafted ten years ago, and he probably is what he is at this point.

 

 

*Plekanec has always sucked in the playoffs, too, but he's useless now anyways.

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37 minutes ago, THE Bobby Orr said:

trying to find a positive...Maybe its a good thing we lost the first game? most on this board agree it's going to be a long series so, while it's a shame we lost the first game, we were going to lose a few anyway.  This loss could work in our favor - a rude awaking perhaps (just saying).

 

I find it oddly interesting that suddenly ppl on this board are saying AV is a better coach than CJ... why? because of a one goal loss?  or is it because CJ has King playing on the 3rd line?   King is playing because MB brought him in for  his size AND playoff experience. Period. (it's not even CJ's decision).

 

As for Galchenyuk...this kid has been a "petri dish" experiment for 4 years now...its not CJ that started this cluster#### - it was MT and MB.  By now this young man should be at least a #2C on this team (a team that for 4+ years now has had no talent down the middle...why were players like DD and Eller ahead of him!?!) instead, #27 is struggling on a fourth line and somehow this is CJs fault??!? If we tried to look at Galchenyuk through the coach's lens (instead of a fans rose-coloured glasses), we will see a player who does more things wrong than right. Maybe just maybe, Chucky is not as coachable as we think he is?  Maybe he doesn't listen to his coaches?  Maybe he just "shows up" at practices and goes through the motions?  Backchecking can be taught - but his backchecking is piss poor...why?  taking face-offs can be taught - but he's not good in the face-off circle...why?  Being responsible without the puck can be taught - but he looks lost out there when he doesn't have the puck...why?  Fly- byes can be stopped - but he is the team's fly-by expert...why? oh yeah i forgot..he's 23 - well then, maybe its time this very young talent spends time on a 3rd or 4th line while he learns to play the game. Btw Arturi is 21 and is a more complete player BUT Arturi is not going through what Chucky has gone through.  As far as i am concerned the Habs "player development" team have botched this player's progression. He has not only moved back and forth (C to W and back) BUT up and down (top line to 4th line)...a proverbial "yo-yo".  when was the last time we saw something like this with such a high draft choice?? 

 

   

 

 

Your reading of the Galy disaster may be 100% accurate. The trouble is, he is absolutely a key element of the Bergevin rebuild, just as Price and Patches were indispensable components of the Gainey rebuild. If he is not a legitimate top-line NHLer, and preferably a C, then we have to accept the fact that the current core will never be heavy-duty contenders. And if that is indeed correct, then radical surgery is needed on the lineup. Galy HAS to succeed, or else Bergevin has to try a bold, Hail Mary-type managerial play to make this team a contender. What that could be, I have no idea.

 

I'd also add that if the only players your organization can properly develop and retain are guys like Gally and Lehkonen - who arrive as fully marture 200-foot players - you're unlikely ever to win anything. Look at Chicago riding out Kane's many 'issues.'

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33 minutes ago, THE Bobby Orr said:

would love to have heard that conversation...glad to hear it ended on a positive...

 

Chucky: "Are you SURE i'm a fourth line winger?"

CJ: "Positive"

 

 

:lol:

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10 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Your reading of the Galy disaster may be 100% accurate. The trouble is, he is absolutely a key element of the Bergevin rebuild, just as Price and Patches were indispensable components of the Gainey rebuild. If he is not a legitimate top-line NHLer, and preferably a C, then we have to accept the fact that the current core will never be heavy-duty contenders. And if that is indeed correct, then radical surgery is needed on the lineup. Galy HAS to succeed, or else Bergevin has to try a bold, Hail Mary-type managerial play to make this team a contender. What that could be, I have no idea.

 

I'd also add that if the only players your organization can properly develop and retain are guys like Gally and Lehkonen - who arrive as fully marture 200-foot players - you're unlikely ever to win anything. Look at Chicago riding out Kane's many 'issues.'

hey listen, i'm not saying we give up on Galy...no way.  I'm saying enough with the "yo-yo" approach.  if he turns out to be a Kessel-type player, so be it !!!  I think this is the problem right now...we are trying to fit him into a player-type he simply can't play up to. (I don't know why he was so successful in juniors - maybe he had great wingers playing with him??) - one thing for sure this kid can score!!  if we are going to keep experimenting with him then why not put him on top line as a WINGER?!?....or if that is too radical for CJ, put him on the 2nd line winger...AND 1st line PP...We need goals desperately...

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Chucky played with zero confidence yesterday, and it's hard to picture him regaining it any time soon.  Even when he was playing well we didn't have the depth at C of a true contender, but with him as a fourth line wing it's just laughable.  

 

Radulov was pretty useless as well, and Gally was trying to do too much.  But even with an awful performance, it was a very tight game.  The downside - the Rangers had the better chances with a slew of defensive gaffes, mostly from the bottom pairing.  This has been a problem for us for so long that it's got to be a part of the team identity.  Hard to go too far in the playoffs if you struggle to score AND you consistently turn the puck over in the defensive zone.

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1 minute ago, Neech said:

Chucky played with zero confidence yesterday, and it's hard to picture him regaining it any time soon.  Even when he was playing well we didn't have the depth at C of a true contender, but with him as a fourth line wing it's just laughable.  

 

Radulov was pretty useless as well, and Gally was trying to do too much.  But even with an awful performance, it was a very tight game.  The downside - the Rangers had the better chances with a slew of defensive gaffes, mostly from the bottom pairing.  This has been a problem for us for so long that it's got to be a part of the team identity.  Hard to go too far in the playoffs if you struggle to score AND you consistently turn the puck over in the defensive zone.

nestor needs to sit.  Beaulieu CANNOT play any worse than he did last night..so expect a better game from him.  

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1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

Look at Chicago riding out Kane's many 'issues.'

#1 overall pick

72pts as a rookie (Calder Trophy), followed by 70, 88, 73 pts, then a Conn Smyth year, might have something to do with that don't you think. 

 

 

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53 minutes ago, THE Bobby Orr said:

nestor needs to sit.  Beaulieu CANNOT play any worse than he did last night..so expect a better game from him.  

 

I only saw one huge blunder from N8 last night (may have missed a few), and thought that at least he tried to bring some speed and offence, although obviously he was not great. Nestor the butler can go polish the candelabra for all I care. He is human garbage.

 

1 hour ago, Neech said:

Chucky played with zero confidence yesterday, and it's hard to picture him regaining it any time soon.  Even when he was playing well we didn't have the depth at C of a true contender, but with him as a fourth line wing it's just laughable

 

I'm with you. Galy right now is looking like the hill the 2017 Habs will die on.

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Just now, DON said:

#1 overall pick

72pts as a rookie (Calder Trophy), followed by 70, 88, 73 pts, then a Conn Smyth year, might have something to do with that don't you think. 

 

 

 

OK, let's give up on our 30-goal-scoring 3rd overall pick because he's not a 'complete' player.

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6 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

OK, let's give up on our 30-goal-scoring 3rd overall pick because he's not a 'complete' player.

Why would you give up on him? Lots of good players have had slumps a lot worse than he has had.

All I am saying is you cant compare Galchenyuk to a guy who will likely be in Hall of Fame. (28 yr old, 752pts in 740gms so far)

 

I know you are being sarcastic, but if you are gonna be silly about it...

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4 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

OK, let's give up on our 30-goal-scoring 3rd overall pick because he's not a 'complete' player.

its like nobody reads the responses...nobody is saying "let's give up on him"...

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8 minutes ago, DON said:

Why would you give up on him? Lots of good players have had slumps a lot worse than he has had.

All I am saying is you cant compare Galchenyuk to a guy who will likely be in Hall of Fame. (28 yr old, 752pts in 740gms so far)

 

I know you are being sarcastic, but if you are gonna be silly about it...

 

What I am wondering is whether the Habs would have the fortitude to ride out the growing pains. Remember, my original point was that a team will never win anything if the only players it develops and retains are kids like Gally and Lehkonen, who arrive already mature. Kane was used as an example of organizational patience, one we might wish to emulate when it comes to the most offensively gifted player in the entire organization. My point was not that Galy = Kane, a ridiculously obtuse reading of what I said.

 

The problem with the 'it's just a slump' argument is that we don't normally push slumping top-liners to the 4th line. This is what suggests that there's a larger issue going on.

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Well I had a long post deleted after my laptop restarted just as I concluded my post... Why doesn't it save the post when the browse exits? I'll try again but it's never the same!

 

First of all, I'm going to preface this by stating that clearly something is going on considering Galchenyuk finds himself on the 4th line. There must be some internal reason for this to be happening. Whether it's due to his performance or an in game strategy, something is going on. 

 

With that being said, I feel as though much of the discussion about Galchenyuk has been a mirage. An illusion. I've constantly seen statements made that Galchenyuk seems to be the type of person that is hard on himself. "Galchenyuk lacks self confidence in general" would be the type of remark I'm referring to. It seems as though this is just pure speculation based on nothing more than simple body language and facial expressions. Has Galchenyuk himself ever come out and explicitly said anything of the sort or are we coming to this conclusion based on his is on ice play? Of course, if Galchenyuk is playing with his head down all the while trying to stick handle through 4 opposing players by himself, one can come to the conclusion that his on ice mindset isn't right. This doesn't necessarily equate to a lack of confidence though, it could be situational as well. 

 

The one legitimate worry, in my opinion would be those who are concerned that Julien may not have the best impact on Galchenyuk. This is an area that Galchenyuk has less control. When one looks into it, however, Galchenyuk has 15 points in 24 games since Julien took over. He has scored many big goals this season and it will not surprise me when he scores more big goals in the playoffs. This is the mirage I speak of since the statistics don't necessarily back up the perception.  I expect a lot out of him these playoffs if we're going to do well. 

 

While I've long stayed out of this discussion, my opinion would be that it's the way that Galchenyuk has been handled that is the issue and this has probably been said many times before. I once thought that Galchenyuk being versatile was a good thing. Why is it a problem that we have a skilled player who can play both center and wing? This seems like a great problem to have. This versatility should not extend to being able to be placed on any of the 4 lines though. Galchenyuk needs to be placed on the 1st line and then left there for a full series, regardless of the outcome. 

 

 

Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-Radulov

Byron-Plekanec-Gallagher

Lehkonen-Danault-Shaw

King-Ott-Martinsen

Mitchell

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Guest Stogey24

Swap Plekanec and Danault and I like the line up. 

 

Lines were the same in practice today though 

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its not gonna happen...Chuck will not be inserted in the top line as a center...i'm just wondering why he is playing as a 4th line winger.?..surely he can be moved to the 3rd or 2nd line as a winger...and let's not forget the PP.  Chucky on the 1st line PP will open up shooting lanes for Weber etal... it just seems obvious...

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The thing is that just as much as Galchenyuk is not a 4th line winger, Danault is not a 1st line center on most teams who would like to win a playoff series. It seems really obvious to me. One player gets the door only for another relatively undeserving player to get thrown into the role? If we place Galchenyuk on the second or third line, then we have to switch everything around and perhaps even demote players who shouldn't have been. 

 

I like Danault, but let's be just as critical of him. He is our current 1st line center after all. In fact, come to think of it he took the penalty that likely ended our chances of winning last night. Galchenyuk has more high end skill and has without a doubt shown signs that he can be a 1st line center at any given point. It's not arguable. I rarely do and don't plan on ragging on the coach but this might simply turn out to be a mistake.

 

Stogey, I thought about placing Danault on the second as well. I'd be fine with either configuration. 

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if you are CJ, Danault is worth his weight in gold. notwithstanding the bad call by refs, he is involved in all aspects of C responsibilities...he is not a #1C but at least he gives 110% every shift...Galchenyuk looks like a C that has never played that position before...you do realize on the C depth chart #27 is behind Danault, Plex, Shaw, Ott, and Mitchell..he is currently our #6 C... when will this board get it...put him on the top line as a winger and let him shoot...

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Beaulieu was fine last night, Nesterov was by far the worst Hab which did not help him IMHO.

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[Cut to end of Game 4 press conference. Galchenyuk scores the only Habs goals in a series sweep, but never left the 4th line.]

 

Julien: I think Chucky's lack of defensive responsibility was a deciding factor.

 

[99 percent of Habs fans weep. Don nods in approval.]

 

fin.

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As a Montrealer - 690 AM radio is always on in my car (specifically this time of year)...Pierre Gauthier, Mitch Melnick and the other talking heads are baffled by the Galchenyuk situation...Pat Hickey is the only so called expert who believes CJ is justified in his decision to play him as a 4th line winger...the rest are speculating that he is in the doghouse; or something along those lines. Pierre did mention that (and i am paraphrasing) maybe he is not going to live up to the expectations placed on him...which is what i have been saying now since he came back from his injury.  We have a hole at center ....so its normal for us to want a top draft pick to to fill it.  but why?  If we had a hole on the W, we wouldn't be arguing about Chucky being moved to W, would we? MB needs to land a top line C ...nothing's changed in that respect.  And chuck needs to shoot the puck 7-9 times a game from the top of the circle - some will be blocked, some will miss the net...and some will go in...

 

Also i don't think we are all that strong on the W. So while we have a problem at C;-  Surely we could use a sniper like Chucky on the wing... ??

   

 

 

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2 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

What I am wondering is whether the Habs would have the fortitude to ride out the growing pains. Remember, my original point was that a team will never win anything if the only players it develops and retains are kids like Gally and Lehkonen, who arrive already mature. Kane was used as an example of organizational patience, one we might wish to emulate when it comes to the most offensively gifted player in the entire organization. My point was not that Galy = Kane, a ridiculously obtuse reading of what I said.

 

The problem with the 'it's just a slump' argument is that we don't normally push slumping top-liners to the 4th line. This is what suggests that there's a larger issue going on.

And my point was that, who wouldn't be patient with an offensive superstar like Kane (aside from Mike Milbury maybe).. which Galchenyuk isn't. Pacioretty is the most offensively gifted player on the Habs, not Galchenyuk, isn't he?

 

You must agree that Galchenyuk is a defensive liability and Julien is a defense first coach. So, that may be as large as it gets. 

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Just now, DON said:

And my point was that, who wouldn't be patient with an offensive superstar like Kane (aside from Mike Milbury maybe).. which Galchenyuk isn't. Pacioretty is the most offensively gifted player on the Habs, not Galchenyuk, isn't he?

 

You must agree that Galchenyuk is a defensive liability and Julien is a defense first coach. So, that may be as large as it gets. 

Move to the head of the class...

 

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Guest Stogey24

I'm sorry, but do you not realize we didn't score a ####ing goal last night? 

 

Maybe your best point per game player shouldn't be on a line with barely nhl calibre players. Just a thought 

 

Therrien 2.0. Better coach. Same mentality. 

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