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Habsfan1989

Who's to blame when it comes to Galchenyuk?

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Toronthab    291
1 hour ago, Stogey24 said:

3rd on the team in scoring last year, second in points per game, set franchise record with most OT goals in a season.

 

First half of the season he was a point per game player, second half he was mediocre, no question, but injuries were a contributing factor in that.

 

I wouldn't take it to the extent you did and say his defense sucks and he's not scoring or even turning in noticeable efforts. Unless your talking about the last 4 games.

Hahaha.. great video..

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REV-G    15

I wrote a thread in the summer that basically said "Don't Trade Galchenyuk", but even though it's just 4 games in, I'm wondering, in hindsight, if we should have traded him and to be honest I would today jump at getting Matt Duschene for him

 

For me, what concerns me the most about Alex is his attitude. He seems to be going through the motions other than an occasional spurt. If he was working hard and had a great attitude but the puck just wasn't going in, I could wait that out. But to me he seems dark, sulky, a whole different attitude than even 2 years ago.

 

It makes me wonder if there may be too much going on in his private life and maybe he's gotten into things he shouldn't have. I'm just guessing and I'm not around him but from a distance he just seems like he's changed, for the worse. 

 

Today it was announced that he was back on the fourth line. To me, that's the coach saying, you're not working, you're not giving your all so you're demoted to the lowest position on the team. I think Julian is a decent guy and I think he's frustrated with Alex and in frustration is kind of setting him aside until Galchenyuk changes his attitude.

 

I'm really disappointed in him because at his age he should bite the bullet and give it everything he has and work like crazy to get back to where he once was. For me, very disappointing. I doubt Sakic would take him in a straight up deal for MD. Too bad. 

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BCHabnut    152
15 hours ago, Commandant said:

Byron - Galchenyuk - Lehkonen

 

Just do it.  Give him to defensively responsible wingers who can also score and be done with the dame thing. 

 I hadn't thought about this combo. I like it. Put Hemsky with Plekanec and Hudon

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xXx..CK..xXx    138
2 hours ago, BCHabnut said:

 I hadn't thought about this combo. I like it. Put Hemsky with Plekanec and Hudon

You like it but it's throwing Galchenyuk right back at center. I am the biggest believer that Galchenyuk is a capable center but if you're the coach of Montreal and have been disappointed with his effort, and there's been this huge discussion about how he's not a center, you're not going to just throw him into the role in the worst of times.

 

Perhaps as fans we are right, but it's not likely to happen. 

 

It took Bergevin 5 years to know Galchenyuk is not a center. Can it take us 4 games to see Galchenyuk is not a winger? :lol:

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Commandant    607

He's always produced more offence at centre than on the wing....  this isn't over 4 games. 

 

 

 

 

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DON    23
1 hour ago, Commandant said:

He's always produced more offence at centre than on the wing....  this isn't over 4 games. 

 

 

Too bad he just cant play the position at the NHL level...lets move on. Last game he had 5+minutes on the PP with no luck and your not saying it was because he is not at centre are you? 

We have all seen his passes to no one, cept Price I suppose, plays where Galchenyuk is just standing still or coasting about covering no one and looking just lost out there. He just isn't moving his feet on defense and seems to have zero confidence on offense.

BUT, I still think he will be fine and be very productive (even at wing), maybe even a fluky goal might be enough to get him going.:spamafote:

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Bergevin.

 

Few teams draft a centre in the top three and don't do everything it takes to develop them at centre.

 

Bergevin never tried forcing the hand of his coach by trading Desharnais or any of the other team centres until they were in the final years of their contracts (DD, Eller) and once even added a centre in free agency only to also play on the wing (Briere) because that's Marc Bergevin.

 

Bergevin then made it clear this past off-season that Galchenyuk will not play centre, and we've seen it play out. Even if Julien agrees, at this point it's embarrassing.

 

Is Galchenyuk playing great? Here's the thing. If he was playing great, Bergevin and Julien would be complimented for him being moved to the wing. And if he moves to the centre and plays great, they look like fools. But him playing badly is just their prophecy come true. It's clearly the player? Why give 100% for a GM that doesn't want you?

 

He needs to be traded. Now. Get this charade over with. You don't want him on the team, you didn't have him developed properly, you allowed two coaches to mess with him, you won't play him at the position you couldn't develop him at, just trade him. I don't care what the price is anymore. It's stupid to keep this going on the roster. This is just as bad to me as the Cammalleri/Gauthier debacle. That one was trading a guy mid-game because you didn't like him. This is not trading a guy months after you made it clear he's not welcome as a Montreal Canadien. Absolutely stupid.

Edited by Machine of Loving Grace

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Commandant    607
11 hours ago, DON said:

Too bad he just cant play the position at the NHL level...lets move on. Last game he had 5+minutes on the PP with no luck and your not saying it was because he is not at centre are you? 

We have all seen his passes to no one, cept Price I suppose, plays where Galchenyuk is just standing still or coasting about covering no one and looking just lost out there. He just isn't moving his feet on defense and seems to have zero confidence on offense.

BUT, I still think he will be fine and be very productive (even at wing), maybe even a fluky goal might be enough to get him going.:spamafote:

 

What does the time playing wing on the PP, have to do with his ability to play centre?

 

How do you get confidence when the coach and gm don't have confidence in you?

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DON    23
2 hours ago, Commandant said:

 

What does the time playing wing on the PP, have to do with his ability to play centre?

 

How do you get confidence when the coach and gm don't have confidence in you?

He is like Patrick Kane and likely many others, who were tried at centre, but just didn't work out neither.

And Galchenyuk actually is playing more so far this year than last, so what more does he need...more praise in the media by Mgmt? Gallagher and Byron do more with less and they don't need to be coddled. 

 

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Commandant    607
54 minutes ago, DON said:

He is like Patrick Kane and likely many others, who were tried at centre, but just didn't work out neither.

And Galchenyuk actually is playing more so far this year than last, so what more does he need...more praise in the media by Mgmt? Gallagher and Byron do more with less and they don't need to be coddled. 

 

 

They are human beings not robots.  Some players may not need to be coddled, that does not mean that every player on the team should be coached the same way.  Some guys need the carrot to succeed.  Some guys need discipline and the stick.  Some guys just need to be left alone.  A good coach recognizes what each player needs and treats them accordingly. 

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2 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

They are human beings not robots.  Some players may not need to be coddled, that does not mean that every player on the team should be coached the same way.  Some guys need the carrot to succeed.  Some guys need discipline and the stick.  Some guys just need to be left alone.  A good coach recognizes what each player needs and treats them accordingly. 

 

Amen. And it seems as though the Habs favour an older-school my-way-or-the-highway approach, which may explain why they work great with guys like Gallagher or Lehkonen but have been unable to make a go of it with Subban or, apparently, Galchenyuk. No non-robotic types need apply.

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Stogey24    237
15 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

They are human beings not robots.  Some players may not need to be coddled, that does not mean that every player on the team should be coached the same way.  Some guys need the carrot to succeed.  Some guys need discipline and the stick.  Some guys just need to be left alone.  A good coach recognizes what each player needs and treats them accordingly. 

Julien is Therrien with a Stanley cup ring and maybe a little more people skills. 

 

Just my opinion. I don't want to get into an argument about the coach, because I don't think that's the entire issue here, but I'm just saying...

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DON    23
57 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

They are human beings not robots.  Some players may not need to be coddled, that does not mean that every player on the team should be coached the same way.  Some guys need the carrot to succeed.  Some guys need discipline and the stick.  Some guys just need to be left alone.  A good coach recognizes what each player needs and treats them accordingly. 

So Therrien, Julien, Bergevin, Muller, etc all don't know this after been around the NHL players for decades and Galchenyuk is a unique case? Is that what you are thinking?

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Actually, in further reflecting upon the OP's question, I think the answer is crystal clear. The blame probably lies with Claude Julien.

 

Think about it. Galchenyuk went from 27 to 31 to 46 to 56 points under Therrien, and then was close to a PPG pace before he got hurt. This does NOT indicate a "failure" for which anyone is to "blame," but rather a gradual upwards progression by a player on his way towards elite offensive production.

 

Then Galy got hurt, and Therrien was fired.

 

He came back to Claude Julien as coach. Since then, his production has dropped precipitously and he has completely lost the plot.

 

Only three explanations are possible. One is that Galy is still injured somehow - not very likely. Another is that he lost confidence when he struggled upon his return and is still trying to restore it. And the third is that he and Julien are just oil and water.

 

I hope the issue is just one of confidence, but the correlation between Galy's struggles and Julien's arrival as coach is pretty stark. And it should probably be the starting point in any discussion over "where the Habs went wrong with Galchenyuk."

 

 

 

 

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huzer    54

He did fine initially under Julien, he was at a nearly a PPG pace in the first month of Julien's tenure, The last 2 weeks or so of the season he struggled and only managed a couple of points. The debate around Galchenyuk seems odd to me. It seems to make nearly as much sense as when Therrien would throw Subban under the bus.

 

Julien (and probably most coaches, I don't know) tends to favor the two way players over one dimensional offensive players. Plekanec, Bergeron, etc. The Seguins and Galchenyuks don't fit his scheme. All I can hope for at this point is a decent return on a Galchenyuk trade when he inevitable gets kicked out the door. He probably doesn't want Drouin as a C but has had his hand forced by his GM. Given the limited targets the Habs seem to trade with, pick an older mid tier defensively responsible player from Chicago, Arizona, or Dallas.

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illWill    399
20 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

Actually, in further reflecting upon the OP's question, I think the answer is crystal clear. The blame probably lies with Claude Julien.

 

Think about it. Galchenyuk went from 27 to 31 to 46 to 56 points under Therrien, and then was close to a PPG pace before he got hurt. This does NOT indicate a "failure" for which anyone is to "blame," but rather a gradual upwards progression by a player on his way towards elite offensive production.

 

Then Galy got hurt, and Therrien was fired.

 

He came back to Claude Julien as coach. Since then, his production has dropped precipitously and he has completely lost the plot.

 

Only three explanations are possible. One is that Galy is still injured somehow - not very likely. Another is that he lost confidence when he struggled upon his return and is still trying to restore it. And the third is that he and Julien are just oil and water.

 

I hope the issue is just one of confidence, but the correlation between Galy's struggles and Julien's arrival as coach is pretty stark. And it should probably be the starting point in any discussion over "where the Habs went wrong with Galchenyuk."

 

 

 

 

 

You can perhaps draw a line from Julien's arrival and compare it to Galchenyuk's downfall, but there is zero chance it's the coach's fault for his lack of effort, inability to make a pass, or letting his man go completely untouched in the defensive zone. 

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DON    23

Maybe Galchenyuk should take a peak at Hockey for Dummies for some pointers.

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dlbalr    654
10 minutes ago, DON said:

Maybe Galchenyuk should take a peak at Hockey for Dummies for some pointers.

 

That's a bit harsh, don't you think?

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Commandant    607

No one is saying that the player is blameless. 

 

That said neither is the organization, and a different coaching technique might be worth a try. 

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DON    23
1 hour ago, dlbalr said:

 

That's a bit harsh, don't you think?

Would be, if I wasn't just joking...but 2nd thought, it actually might not be a bad idea (now that I see there actually is such a book).

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They have to trade this guy ASAP before he becomes the league joke.  I see a player that started with a lot of promise but has steadily gotten worse over the last 3 seasons.  No matter who's to blame but he isn't going to pan out in Hab land.  When I see him continually pass the puck to the opponent, I sometimes think he is purposely playing bad so he can get his ass out of there as fast as he can and I don't really blame him.  It's over, most importantly I think it's over in his own mind and I don't think he has the mental fortitude to overcome it.  Trading for Duchene is the best thing that could happen now and Bergevin needs to make it happen soon before his worth is dramatically lower.  He's a one dimensional player with a great shot and with the right centre he could hit 30 again but not in Montreal.

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5 hours ago, illWill said:

 

You can perhaps draw a line from Julien's arrival and compare it to Galchenyuk's downfall, but there is zero chance it's the coach's fault for his lack of effort, inability to make a pass, or letting his man go completely untouched in the defensive zone. 

 

Yeah, maybe I should adjust what I said as follows: "who is to blame? The relationship/dynamics between Julien and Galchenyuk." That seems to me a plausible inference from the fact that he has been atrocious over most of CJ's tenure, where he was not atrocious prior to that. This way of putting it doesn't relieve Galy of responsibility either - but I do think if that a specific coach fails to get results from a player where a previous coach succeeded, that coach has to take a good chunk of responsibility himself. It's his damned JOB to get the most out of what he's got.

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Habsfan1989    4

So how can we trade Him if his market value is low right now.  MB isn't going to get what he wants in a trade right now. His best hope is that he turns it around starts to play good. This way his market value goes up.

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1 hour ago, Habsfan1989 said:

So how can we trade Him if his market value is low right now.  MB isn't going to get what he wants in a trade right now. His best hope is that he turns it around starts to play good. This way his market value goes up.

Actually now is the time to trade him while there is recent memory of a 30 goal season.  If he keeps playing like crap then his value goes down.  If he regains his form, why trade him?

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