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Plekanec traded to Leafs

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1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Olofsson (56 overall 2018) Valiev (68 overall 2014) , Rychel (19 overall 2013) for Pleks, that was not a bad trade after all.

 

We have to give Bergevin some credit here

 

If Plekanec comes back to center our 4th line, that may be really good if he can mentor the Canadiens center prospects :)

 

 

 

 

He won't be in the league long enough to make any difference to players drafted this year...although I wouldn't rule out them bringing up Kotkaneimen next season regardless of whether he's ready, so there's that.

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I don’t want plex back.... time to move forward...

 

 

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They should not have signed him to the last 3 year deal. What was like 6 mill for a  3rd liner

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3 minutes ago, Chris said:

They should not have signed him to the last 3 year deal. What was like 6 mill for a  3rd liner

 

He was a legit #2C at the time and the best C we had. The mistake wasn't the contract, it was failing to anticipate his decline (about which I was sounding the alarm in 2015-16), which would have meant, first, developing or acquiring a replacement, and second, ideally trading him away when he still had high value. Either is too much to ask from the idiots in charge, of course.

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46 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

He was a legit #2C at the time and the best C we had. The mistake wasn't the contract, it was failing to anticipate his decline (about which I was sounding the alarm in 2015-16), which would have meant, first, developing or acquiring a replacement, and second, ideally trading him away when he still had high value. Either is too much to ask from the idiots in charge, of course.

The decline in his game was so evident. Everyone still defended this guy to the grave though. 

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Hindsight 20/20, Blah blah.

 

2012-2013: Galchenyuk on LW to learn the NHL game, Plek/Eller/DD at centre.

2013-2014: Desharnais and Galchenyuk switch positions. Plek/Eller/Chuck at centre. Briere not signed, Jagr signed as he wanted to come to Montreal but Bergevin held a grudge.

2014-2015: Montreal trades Pacioretty for a #1A centre, trades Plekanec for a LD. Chuck/New Centre/Eller at centre.

 

Once Jagr ages out we sign Radulov long term. We're weak on the left side but strong down the middle and on the right with a secured top four D. Oh, and when Price inevitably goes down in 15-16, you immediately trade for Reimer instead of relying on a damn rookie and Ben Scrivens.

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13 minutes ago, Machine of Loving Grace said:

Hindsight 20/20, Blah blah.

 

2012-2013: Galchenyuk on LW to learn the NHL game, Plek/Eller/DD at centre.

2013-2014: Desharnais and Galchenyuk switch positions. Plek/Eller/Chuck at centre. Briere not signed, Jagr signed as he wanted to come to Montreal but Bergevin held a grudge.

2014-2015: Montreal trades Pacioretty for a #1A centre, trades Plekanec for a LD. Chuck/New Centre/Eller at centre.

 

Once Jagr ages out we sign Radulov long term. We're weak on the left side but strong down the middle and on the right with a secured top four D. Oh, and when Price inevitably goes down in 15-16, you immediately trade for Reimer instead of relying on a damn rookie and Ben Scrivens.

 

Galy's 'failure' to develop at C has had huge organizational implications. It is truly remarkable how determined this regime has been to shoot itself in the foot.

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22 minutes ago, Habopotamus said:

The decline in his game was so evident. Everyone still defended this guy to the grave though. 

 

You mean it was easy for you to see his impending doom after boasting 60 and 54 point seasons leading into the contract extension? and that his numbers would drop 50% as early as the following season? What the heck are you doing here then? you should be working in the NHL as a salary cap guru and player evaluator.

 

20/20 hindsight is always where people try to sound like genius', but the truth on the Plekanec front is he was producing above his career average the 2 seasons leading into his 3 year deal. He is a career 0.61 PPG player, and had a combined 0.69 PPG in the final 2 years of his previous deal, it was actually impossible to predict he would decline by as much as 50% of that, starting the very next season. It was easy to spot based on his age, a decline would happen during those 3 years of his new contract, and that it was too much money for a player we knew would VERY likely decline past his mid 30's. How much decline, and how much of an over payment it ended up being was impossible to spot without hindsight in your corner.

 

When the deal was made I had no problem with the term, but I had a feeling he would steadily decline to 38 - 40 point guy by the end of the extension, and obviously 6.25 AAV is too much for that. There was no way in hell to know he would crash down as hard as he did with his production, but he still remained the reliable player he always was in the other aspects of his game, he still ended up being a very serviceable 3rd line center who could occasionally fill in the top 6 if needed here and there. He went from very likely overpaid by 1.5 million or so AAV when the extension was announced to grossly overpaid by the end of it. That error lies on the front office for overpaying right off the bat, even if the likely scenario was the one I mentioned earlier, we still overpaid at 6.25 AAV, so when the situation turned worst case scenario, it looked like a major over payment. The problem was with the Management decision, not Plekanec the player, he was following the natural arc in any player's career. He was still obviously a good and useful player during his 54 point season, he deserved to be defended, he was the only player we had capable of doing what he does. He was put in a position he had virtually no chance of properly filling because we continued year after year not addressing our top 6 C need, he was given a contract he had no chance to live up to. But rather than objectively understand the situation and focus your Ire in the right direction, the Vulture's that are the majority of this fanbase find the need to pick at his bones as he enters the twilight of his career, Bravo.

 

tenor.gif?itemid=9872650

 

 

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29 minutes ago, Link67 said:

 

You mean it was easy for you to see his impending doom after boasting 60 and 54 point seasons leading into the contract extension? and that his numbers would drop 50% as early as the following season? What the heck are you doing here then? you should be working in the NHL as a salary cap guru and player evaluator.

 

20/20 hindsight is always where people try to sound like genius', but the truth on the Plekanec front is he was producing above his career average the 2 seasons leading into his 3 year deal. He is a career 0.61 PPG player, and had a combined 0.69 PPG in the final 2 years of his previous deal, it was actually impossible to predict he would decline by as much as 50% of that, starting the very next season. It was easy to spot based on his age, a decline would happen during those 3 years of his new contract, and that it was too much money for a player we knew would VERY likely decline past his mid 30's. How much decline, and how much of an over payment it ended up being was impossible to spot without hindsight in your corner.

 

When the deal was made I had no problem with the term, but I had a feeling he would steadily decline to 38 - 40 point guy by the end of the extension, and obviously 6.25 AAV is too much for that. There was no way in hell to know he would crash down as hard as he did with his production, but he still remained the reliable player he always was in the other aspects of his game, he still ended up being a very serviceable 3rd line center who could occasionally fill in the top 6 if needed here and there. He went from very likely overpaid by 1.5 million or so AAV when the extension was announced to grossly overpaid by the end of it. That error lies on the front office for overpaying right off the bat, even if the likely scenario was the one I mentioned earlier, we still overpaid at 6.25 AAV, so when the situation turned worst case scenario, it looked like a major over payment. The problem was with the Management decision, not Plekanec the player, he was following the natural arc in any player's career. He was still obviously a good and useful player during his 54 point season, he deserved to be defended, he was the only player we had capable of doing what he does. He was put in a position he had virtually no chance of properly filling because we continued year after year not addressing our top 6 C need, he was given a contract he had no chance to live up to. But rather than objectively understand the situation and focus your Ire in the right direction, the Vulture's that are the majority of this fanbase find the need to pick at his bones as he enters the twilight of his career, Bravo.

 

tenor.gif?itemid=9872650

 

 

And that was everyone's defense; Plekanec had 50 pts, so everything was peachy. Which I get, but the way Plekanec played the game started to change. That 50 pts season was the start of his downward slide. 

 

I only read the first part of your post, because I'm not getting invoked in another Plekanec argument. 

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I was concerned about a decline in 2015-16. Go back and read my posts if you like.

 

The fact is that he had long slumps that year, and managed to salvage his totals with some hot streaks. This is often a sign of impending decline - a formerly reliable producer suddenly goes through these longer, impotent stretches. Overall totals can disguise the underlying rot. 

 

That said, I had no problem with his contract. Like I say above, that was not the issue. The real issue was the lack of an effective succession plan for a player entering his mid-30s. Like a lot of dummies, Bergevin seems to assume that a good player will somehow continue to be a good player until he's 40. Smarter people should *assume* a decline sometime in the early-to-mid 30s for most players. 

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16 minutes ago, Habopotamus said:

And that was everyone's defense; Plekanec had 50 pts, so everything was peachy. Which I get, but the way Plekanec played the game started to change. That 50 pts season was the start of his downward slide. 

 

I only read the first part of your post, because I'm not getting invoked in another Plekanec argument. 

 

Time to take it easy on the gifs too 

 

 

Oh my bad, I'll be sure to cater more to your needs going forward

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20 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

I was concerned about a decline in 2015-16. Go back and read my posts if you like.

 

There were a lot of us who felt in 14-15 that Plekanec was getting propped up by Pacioretty and Gallagher, and wondered if that role would be better for Galchenyuk. Or just spread the wingers out instead of making Plekanec look good. Plek was great defensively, still is, but even in 2015 he was losing his offensive ability.

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Wasn’t he signed to a 2 year 6 million deal? Not 3 years...

 

hardly overpaid when considering he was making 5 million  coming off back to back 50+ point seasons and our best C.

 

hindsight as always for our fickle fans....

 

UFA’s don’t want to come here because of us fans! not because of management  or taxes!

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7 minutes ago, IN THE HEARTS OF MEN said:

 

 

UFA’s don’t want to come here because of us fans! not because of management  or taxes!

 

Also a myth, lots of UFAs have come here.

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5 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Also a myth, lots of UFAs have come here.

 

Pretty much. Montreal has been landing a major UFA almost every year since 2009.

 

2009: Cammalleri and Gomez. Gill was highly sought as well.

2011: Cole (top 3)

2012: Prust (who was overrated as hell in 2012 and seriously treated like a top free agent)

2013: Briere (top 10, Calgary and Nashville offered more than us)

2015: Petry (signed with us instead of going to free agency)

2016: Radulov (should have been the most wanted free agent but people were dumb and we could have capitalized on that dumb but instead we were just... partially less dumb?)

2017: Alzner (who was seriously on top 5 lists)

 

Do we have trouble landing "the top free agent"? Yes. I don't think this franchise has ever landed the number one free agent on the market. But I'm sure that's a problem for many teams. But just as a destination for free agents, this isn't 2006 anymore where the only guy we can get is an overpriced Sergei Samsonov. But it might be becoming that due to Bergevin whining about free agents not coming here in the media.

 

Are the fans a problem? For some players. Are the taxes a problem? For some players. Is management a problem? For some players. And while I don't think we're a destination as appealing as Philadelphia or New York or LA (all three teams with high taxes by the way) I don't think we are looked at as a leper colony.

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