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illWill

Habs @ Sens, Dec 6, 19:30

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25 minutes ago, DON said:

Domi 0 pts 4 hits

 

And a nice job baiting Smith into taking a stupid penalty. Although our PP couldn't do much with it ...

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10 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

 

When is Armia due back?

late Dec

 

Petry now 13th in d-scoring.

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44 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

2 points in the last 2 games for the kid with no confidence.

He has 1 goal in his last 17 games and 2 points in his last 8.

 

He had a nice secondary assist tonight, but he made some soft ass plays on the puck too. 

 

Like I said, the last 6 or 7 games, he has looked like he was wearing down a bit

 

I know you're against the world jrs for him, but i think he could benefit from it 

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He seems to be handling everything pretty well so far.

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Lehkonen now five points in the last five games: a significant improvement over the 10 points in the first 23 games. Let's see whether he can keep it up or it's just a fluke.

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Very happy with the past two games.  If we can ever get our PP to be even average, we are going to hang with even the really good teams playing this way with Weber back.

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2 hours ago, Habopotamus said:

Brutal might be a bit strong, but hes been soft on his passes and just not making good decisions.

 

He has regress the past 6 or 7 games, which was bound to happen. I bet he does go to world jr s. 

 

I keep reading people saying he has nothing to prove in the tournament, but it acts as a refresh for him. Let him gain some confidence back and take a break from the nhl grind 

 

 

I've noticed him looking lost at times and he has definitely been bounced around in the past few games, looking very much like a boy playing with men on some shifts.  To be expected at his age/size.

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They completely shut down the opposition in the 3rd again tonight.. since weber’s return, pretty much every game they have held the other team  to under 5/10 shots in the period. This is a huge indication to me that they are really heading in the right direction. 

 

Agostino looked good again as well. Strong on the puck. He might actually be cementing himself on that 4th line. With Armia set to return in 3 weeks a trade or waiver claim looms large.

 

ANd yes, if They fix that PP we could become a really dangerous team, considering we are one of the better 5on5 teams and especially because we draw the most penalties in hockey.

 

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I kinda like what Chaput brings.  And Agostino from time to time as well.

 

Who will be left aside when Armia comes back ?   Deslauriers and Peca ??

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8 minutes ago, JoeLassister said:

I kinda like what Chaput brings.  And Agostino from time to time as well.

 

Who will be left aside when Armia comes back ?   Deslauriers and Peca ??

 

Hudon's in that bubble zone as well.

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1 hour ago, dlbalr said:

 

Hudon's in that bubble zone as well.

True.   Shissh.  Sucks for him.

 

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8 hours ago, JoeLassister said:

True.   Shissh.  Sucks for him.

Your a fan?

He has his good and bad moments, he is a team worst -8.

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2 hours ago, Habopotamus said:

Bergevin said 95% sure Kotkaniemi stays in Montreal( won't loan to finland). "Unless a centre falls in his lap"

Maybe Tomas Plekanec will be interested in playing for the Montreal Canadiens.

 

 

 

 

On topic, I've long thought that Kotkaniemi will be with the big club all year, world juniors included. 

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On ‎2018‎-‎12‎-‎07 at 8:29 PM, DON said:

Your a fan?

He has his good and bad moments, he is a team worst -8.

Tarasenko is -13,  Barzal is -12.   What's your point ?

Kadri, Barkov  they're all -8.    Gotta stop bringing  +/-  to praise or diss a player.

 


Instead, bring up the fact that he only has 4 points in 21 games and I'll be on board...

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11 minutes ago, JoeLassister said:

Tarasenko is -13,  Barzal is -12.   What's your point ?

Those two dont play for Habs, so irrelevant (and both are highly skilled and will produce offense in top six).

Hudon normally doesnt defend very well and his play is inconsistent. SO to dumb it down for ya, having worst +/- on his team helps explain why he is sitting in pressbox and likely will be traded, barring injuries. Because he is too slow for top six and not strong defender, so where would you stick him? 3rd line is it, but all three of them are better than Hudon, so he is pretty hooped.

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8 minutes ago, DON said:

Those two dont play for Habs, so irrelevant (and both are highly skilled and will produce offense in top six).

Hudon normally doesnt defend very well and his play is inconsistent. SO to dumb it down for ya, having worst +/- on his team helps explain why he is sitting in pressbox and likely will be traded, barring injuries. Because he is too slow for top six and not strong defender, so where would you stick him? 3rd line is it, but all three of them are better than Hudon, so he is pretty hooped.

Sorry, I was editing as you were responding.

 

I agree that he doesn't bring much,  but  I'd never use +/-  to evaluate a player.  Not in today's NHL.   +/-  are irrelevant to me.

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3 hours ago, JoeLassister said:

Sorry, I was editing as you were responding.

 

I agree that he doesn't bring much,  but  I'd never use +/-  to evaluate a player.  Not in today's NHL.   +/-  are irrelevant to me.

Why not? worst +/- on one roster it seems a fair stat and for him it seems very appropriate.

If 5 of the d are +5 and one is -5, care to guess which is likely the weakest link and would not be playing on the PK?

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1 hour ago, DON said:

Why not? worst +/- on one roster it seems a fair stat and for him it seems very appropriate.

If 5 of the d are +5 and one is -5, care to guess which is likely the weakest link and would not be playing on the PK?

There are probably 3 or 4 better indicators than +/-.

Remember that you get a minus 1  if the opponent score 1 second after you came out of the penalty box.

If you turn the puck over and manage to get to the bench before the opponent scores on the breakaway,  you'll get away with the minus  and the guy replacing you will eat it.

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40 minutes ago, JoeLassister said:

There are probably 3 or 4 better indicators than +/-.

As you put it, whats your point?:B)

47 minutes ago, JoeLassister said:

Remember that you get a minus 1  if the opponent score 1 second after you came out of the penalty box.

If you turn the puck over and manage to get to the bench before the opponent scores on the breakaway,  you'll get away with the minus  and the guy replacing you will eat it.

 

Weak argument, 100% of rest of players on team are managing to do better, not just a coincidence or a fluky -1. What you are arguing, that the stat doesnt reflect his play?

 

Off top of your head Joe, what other 4 indicators better reflect his play that has him sitting in the pressbox?:popcorn:

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3 hours ago, DON said:

Why not? worst +/- on one roster it seems a fair stat and for him it seems very appropriate.

If 5 of the d are +5 and one is -5, care to guess which is likely the weakest link and would not be playing on the PK?

 

1) do the two play the same number of minutes?

2) who gets matched up against the other team's top line? who gets matchups of easy minutes?

3) what are the zone starts?

4) who is on the ice when that player is on the ice.  On the Habs, Is he typically playing in front of Weber? or the third pair defenceman?

5) how many of those minuses are actually his fault?  If you do everything correct and your teammate leaves a man open in front of the net or the goalie gives up a soft goal, you still get a minus. 

6) What is the goalie's save percentage when he is on the ice? As I also said on Petry, what are the xG numbers? is the a low save percentage luck, or is he giving up high quality chances... Same with a high save percentage?

7) How many minuses did he get due to empty net goals against when the team was pushing to tie in the last minutes?

 

All of these are reasons why we have a million better stats than +/- today.  There are more too. 

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18 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

1) do the two play the same number of minutes?

2) who gets matched up against the other team's top line? who gets matchups of easy minutes?

3) what are the zone starts?

4) who is on the ice when that player is on the ice.  On the Habs, Is he typically playing in front of Weber? or the third pair defenceman?

5) how many of those minuses are actually his fault?  If you do everything correct and your teammate leaves a man open in front of the net or the goalie gives up a soft goal, you still get a minus. 

6) What is the goalie's save percentage when he is on the ice? As I also said on Petry, what are the xG numbers? is the a low save percentage luck, or is he giving up high quality chances... Same with a high save percentage?

7) How many minuses did he get due to empty net goals against when the team was pushing to tie in the last minutes?

 

All of these are reasons why we have a million better stats than +/- today.  There are more too. 

This.

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54 minutes ago, DON said:

As you put it, whats your point?:B)

 

Weak argument, 100% of rest of players on team are managing to do better, not just a coincidence or a fluky -1. What you are arguing, that the stat doesnt reflect his play?

 

Off top of your head Joe, what other 4 indicators better reflect his play that has him sitting in the pressbox?:popcorn:

See Commandant's post.  In today's NHL,  I find the +/- to be a weak tool to analyse the game.


He could be sitting in the pressbox because he takes extra-long shifts, because Chaput outplays him or because he sucks without the puck, why should I care.

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4 hours ago, JoeLassister said:

See Commandant's post.  In today's NHL,  I find the +/- to be a weak tool to analyse the game.


He could be sitting in the pressbox because he takes extra-long shifts, because Chaput outplays him or because he sucks without the puck, why should I care.

NO wont look at Commandant's post (yet anyways). You said probably are several better indicators, NO he doesnt take long shifts (0:46), Chaput plays a different role, i wouldnt say sucks without puck, but a weakness it seems.

Why should you care? You said it sucks he may be shipped out/waived and when i simply pointed out 1 stat, you got bit excited.

But, cant deny most stats are no silver bullet.

Since Weber came back Price's stats have really improved, but what is #1 reason...more due to Price or more Weber/Byron and Agostino-Chaput getting used to a pretty regular shift?

 

Would be hard to tell and +/- is just another stat, like faceoff% PP%Shooting%yadayadayada, has its limitations BUT on a team with only 3 players - on the roster and one being -8...I say that stat has meaning (as it did for Galchenyuk's -31 last year, he earned it).

But, not a big deal so:surrender:

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