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2019-20 NHL Discussion Thread

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54 minutes ago, Commandant said:

Lets be clear on what cherry said.

 

Those who are saying he got fired for "you people" are being disingenious.

 

He said, "You people who come here, you love our milk and honey." 

 

There is no doubt who he meant... and that was immigrants.

 

Lets also not pretend that this is the first time Cherry has shown xenophobic, bigoted, or misogynistic views on the air.  The history is long.  This is the straw that broke the camels back.

 

Cherry was also given the opportunity to apologize.  He refuses to.  He has in fact doubled down saying i know what i said and i stand by it.

The cause Cherry was/is promoting is just as relevant, if not more relevant in a positive manner. When Cherry visits the graves of the fallen soldiers it chokes him up every time. He is passionate about the cause and does not have any select target outside of those who don’t wear poppies. If one happens to be an immigrant and wears a poppy, they shouldn’t be offended because he was not talking to them. Canadians who do not wear poppies now also think of themselves in a specific manner when they realize they didn’t support the cause because they didn’t wear a poppy either.

 

I have to say, if I were a 30 year old immigrant in a foreign South American land and a voice on television was telling me that I should wear a purple and pink pin to remember a great cause and that immigrants like myself were shameful for not doing so, my first thought would be “where can I get one because that’s next on my list” not “fire that man”.

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6 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

The cause Cherry was/is promoting is just as relevant, if not more relevant in a positive manner.

 

He (...) does not have any select target outside of those who don’t wear poppies.

 

He's been consistently xenophobic in the past. In the 80s he was already ranting about European hockey players. And in this latest (final) incident he specifically called out immigrants for (paraphrasing) coming here for milk and honey and not respecting the contributions of the veterans. He could have made a powerful message about the need for everyone to recognize and remember the supreme sacrifice of the war dead, but he chose instead to blame the immigrants.

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15 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

The cause Cherry was/is promoting is just as relevant, if not more relevant in a positive manner. When Cherry visits the graves of the fallen soldiers it chokes him up every time. He is passionate about the cause and does not have any select target outside of those who don’t wear poppies. If one happens to be an immigrant and wears a poppy, they shouldn’t be offended because he was not talking to them. Canadians who do not wear poppies now also think of themselves in a specific manner when they realize they didn’t support the cause because they didn’t wear a poppy either.

 

I have to say, if I were a 30 year old immigrant in a foreign South American land and a voice on television was telling me that I should wear a purple and pink pin to remember a great cause and that immigrants like myself were shameful for not doing so, my first thought would be “where can I get one because that’s next on my list” not “fire that man”.

 

Thats fine.

 

He could easily have said, everyone needs to buy a poppy. 

 

That would have been fine.  he wouldnt' have gotten any flack for that. 

 

It was blaming immigrants as the people who don't buy poppies and don't respect veterans but want the canadian way of life that was the problem. 

 

He got into hateful us against them ideology. 

 

There also is the question, how does he know the people who aren't wearing poppies are people who "come here"... that they are immigrants.... is he checking their passports?  The answer of course is that he doesn't know, he is assuming based on their appearance, accent or color of skin.  There are major problems with those assumptions. 

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2 hours ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

It seems as though anyone who is joyous about the Don Cherry firing already wanted him gone long ago. I haven’t seen a comment on here from those who are actually content which addresses the actual comments he made. 
 

I was fairly indifferent in that I watched Coach’s Corner a lot over the years, but would not go out of my way to watch it any more often than a regular Saturday night second intermission. 
 

With that being said, I don’t think what he said was intended to be overly offensive and even those who say that he could have chosen his words better are mostly saying so in order to not seem politically incorrect.
 

From what I remember as a child, remembrance, or armistice day, was religiously engrained into our system as an important day to celebrate. Those who weren’t born here weren’t raised with that same mentality. While it is one hundred percent true that native Canadians also forgo wearing poppies, it’s only natural that a national celebration wouldn’t be as celebrated by those who weren’t born in the nation. I think Don Cherry was only encouraging those who weren’t brought up with that nature to adopt it and I have real life examples that would seem to confirm that it’s actually true that wearing a poppy wouldn’t even occur to some who weren’t born here. There’s nothing “wrong” with it or anything accusatory, it’s just a reality. I love diversity and constantly defend against racism. This wasn’t that.

I personally think if he said some of you people that come here no one would make a big deal about it. But because he said you people everyone took a disliking to it.

 

Also would like to point out Trudeau gets re elected after painting his face black.

So its ok to paint your face black but not ok to say anything about immigrants. Whats wrong with this picture?

 

Roger's was looking for a excuse to fire Don a long time ago. They never wanted to bring him back. This is why he is gone today.

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39 minutes ago, Habsfan89 said:

I personally think if he said some of you people that come here no one would make a big deal about it. But because he said you people everyone took a disliking to it.

 

Also would like to point out Trudeau gets re elected after we've found out that he painted his face black 20ish years ago.

So its ok to paint your face black but not ok to say anything about immigrants. Whats wrong with this picture?

 

Roger's was looking for a excuse to fire Don a long time ago. They never wanted to bring him back. This is why he is gone today.

fixed that for you.

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43 minutes ago, Habsfan89 said:

 

Also would like to point out Trudeau gets re elected after painting his face black.

So its ok to paint your face black but not ok to say anything about immigrants. Whats wrong with this picture?

 

 

He apologized, Don didn't.  Is that so hard to understand?

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Just now, Habsfan89 said:

Still doesn't make it right. 

Cultural appropriation was definitely not as big as a concern back in the days than it is nowadays. 
Everyone was doing it for Halloween.  All kind of costumes : Indigenous people, black/brown characters or music/movies stars, Hitler, etc.

Halloween was free for all, nobody cared.

You can't expect the same reaction today when it comes to actions or statements that were made in 2019, in an era where cultural appropriation as been elevated pretty high in terms of disrespect towards individuals or peoples.

 

Finding out  in 2019  that some words were spoken or some actions were made in 1999  is far less controversial than words or actions commited IN 2019.

That's the difference.

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Arpon Basu's take;

 

"I did something I never do Monday morning. Something I have actively avoided over close to 20 years working in the sports media. Something that has always represented a line I was not willing to cross.

I expressed an opinion on Don Cherry.

It is something I never do because I spend far too much energy trying to forget he exists, or at least the persona he has played on his nationally broadcast soapbox for the better part of my entire life. See, Don Cherry makes me uncomfortable. The things he says make me uncomfortable. The fact so many people in my country like him makes me uncomfortable.

The reason for the lack of comfort is that Cherry always reminded me of a reality I lived with every day. Not in a debilitating way – I am no victim – but it is a reality all the same that in a hockey landscape as white as a field of pristine snow in the prairies, I stand out..."

 

I really hope they find someone worth watching and respect, maybe a Luongo, Ferraro or the like.

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If you feel uncomfortable about what other people say, then you have the problem.

 

Life goes on, its ok to have a different opinion, im pretty sure i dont agree with Basu's beliefs and i could care less what his opinions are, im sure being "Woke" gives his life meaning same with trudauex and his apology tour

 

get off your soap box, social media platforms , facebook and stop tweeting 

 

Life is pretty good outside the PC "Woke" social media culture 

 

 

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17 minutes ago, Chris said:

If you feel uncomfortable about what other people say, then you have the problem.

 

Life goes on, its ok to have a different opinion, im pretty sure i dont agree with Basu's beliefs and i could care less what his opinions are, im sure being "Woke" gives his life meaning same with trudauex and his apology tour

 

get off your soap box, social media platforms , facebook and stop tweeting 

 

Life is pretty good outside the PC "Woke" social media culture 

 

 

 

Lol so it's the people uncomfortable with racism and xenophobia who have the problem, not the people who are racist and xenophobic?  Just because you live in a bubble and don't have these sorts of problems to deal with doesn't mean they don't exist for other people.  You just sound like an ignorant old curmudgeon who is annoyed that he had to consider someone else's viewpoint for 15 seconds.

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Yes, because anyone who has has another opinion then what you believe, they are automatically racist, followed by an insult. That's the woke PC culture i was referring to, 

 

i am 30 and everyone has aright to there opinion, i dont make fun of, put down other people's beliefs. I live life outside the social media bubble, perhaps you should practice what you preach 

 

 

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4 hours ago, JoeLassister said:

Cultural appropriation was definitely not as big as a concern back in the days than it is nowadays. 
Everyone was doing it for Halloween.  All kind of costumes : Indigenous people, black/brown characters or music/movies stars, Hitler, etc.

Halloween was free for all, nobody cared.

You can't expect the same reaction today when it comes to actions or statements that were made in 2019, in an era where cultural appropriation as been elevated pretty high in terms of disrespect towards individuals or peoples.

 

Finding out  in 2019  that some words were spoken or some actions were made in 1999  is far less controversial than words or actions commited IN 2019.

That's the difference.

Like I said even though it happened in a time where being politically correct wasn't a big deal, even if it was a Halloween costume.  it still doesn't make it right. Its offensive in any decade. 

 

For years Don has ripped French Canadian people, and European  people. So your telling 

me that because he did it 20 years ago it was ok. No it wasn't just like its not ok now. 

 

The difference today is social media. If social media was around 20 years ago these issues would be just as big then as it is now. 

Edited by Habsfan89

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46 minutes ago, Chris said:

Yes, because anyone who has has another opinion then what you believe, they are automatically racist, followed by an insult. That's the woke PC culture i was referring to, 

 

i am 30 and everyone has aright to there opinion, i dont make fun of, put down other people's beliefs. I live life outside the social media bubble, perhaps you should practice what you preach 

 

 

 

Social media has given an amplified voice to diverse views that wouldn't have been heard in the old media landscape.  Sure, there are strong and weak points to the 'woke' culture you bemoan, just as there are strong and weak points to small town Canadian culture.  Each is a type of 'bubble'.

 

If you truly believe that 'If you feel uncomfortable about what other people say, then you have the problem', then you've never had to deal with racism, or xenophobia, or anyone's bigotry infringing on your own life, and worse still, you sound close-minded towards people who have had different experiences than yours.  That's why I said you sound like an ignorant curmudgeon.  

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Again you have to go to insults. 

 

the left will be proud of you. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Chris said:

Again you have to go to insults. 

 

the left will be proud of you. 

 

 

 

Lol, avoiding the actual points I made and playing the victim.  The right would be proud of your aversion to substance.

 

If you don't want to be called an ignorant curmudgeon, don't act like one.

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Yes, what points? 

 

I'll listen to any of my friends or colleagues about whatever, doesnt mean i have to agree with them or i have to change their mind. 

 

If Don Cherry makes people so upset, dont watch him. Its called the power of choice

 

 

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1 minute ago, Chris said:

Yes, what points? 

 

 

 

 

 

If you truly believe that 'If you feel uncomfortable about what other people say, then you have the problem', then you've never had to deal with racism, or xenophobia, or anyone's bigotry infringing on your own life, and worse still, you sound close-minded towards people who have had different experiences than yours.

 

2 minutes ago, Chris said:

 

I'll listen to any of my friends or colleagues about whatever, doesnt mean i have to agree with them or i have to change their mind. 

 

If Don Cherry makes people so upset, dont watch him. Its called the power of choice

 

 

 

Sure, and Sportsnet can fire him if they feel he's negatively affecting their brand.  

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I said that in my first post, actions have consequences. 

 

Don Cherry will be fine without the apology and will get a big platform to speak his mind. 

 

Trudeax simply apologized to stay in power. if that video never surfaced, he wouldnt have said a word about about it

 

At least Don Cherry is true to whop he is and what he believes 

 

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2 minutes ago, Chris said:

I said that in my first post, actions have consequences. 

 

Don Cherry will be fine without the apology and will get a big platform to speak his mind. 

 

Trudeax simply apologized to stay in power. if that video never surfaced, he wouldnt have said a word about about it

 

At least Don Cherry is true to whop he is and what he believes 

 

 

Again, you're skating by the point I made about you being close-minded about people with different experiences than you.  That is privilege.  Some people have to deal with a lot of the sh*t the world has to offer, and others have the privilege of avoiding it.  The least you can do with privilege is be aware of it.

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Right, why is having my own opinion close minded or makes me privileged? , i stated i listen to all my friends and colleagues opinions, i dont agree with some of them i dont argue the point, i dont insult them. They can think what ever they want, it doesnt bother me at all. My opinions dont my my friends and colleagues either, 

 

Its ok to have your own mind and live your life the way you want to. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Chris said:

Right, why is having my own opinion close minded or makes me privileged? , i stated i listen to all my friends and colleagues opinions, i dont agree with some of them i dont argue the point, i dont insult them. They can think what ever they want, it doesnt bother me at all. My opinions dont my my friends and colleagues either, 

 

Its ok to have your own mind and live your life the way you want to. 

 

 

 

No, your refusal to consider others' viewpoints is a symptom of your privilege.  You've never had to and there's no reason for you to start now.  On the other hand, some people have no choice but to deal with racism and xenophobia in their day to day lives.  

 

So hypothetically, there is nothing that a TV personality could ever say that would offend you or make you think they should be de-platformed?  What Cherry said wasn't offensive to you, but it was to many others.     

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1 hour ago, Chris said:

If you feel uncomfortable about what other people say, then you have the problem.

 

Life goes on, its ok to have a different opinion, im pretty sure i dont agree with Basu's beliefs and i could care less what his opinions are, im sure being "Woke" gives his life meaning same with trudauex and his apology tour

 

get off your soap box, social media platforms , facebook and stop tweeting 

 

Life is pretty good outside the PC "Woke" social media culture 

 

1 hour ago, Chris said:

Yes, because anyone who has has another opinion then what you believe, they are automatically racist, followed by an insult. That's the woke PC culture i was referring to, 

 

i am 30 and everyone has aright to there opinion, i dont make fun of, put down other people's beliefs. I live life outside the social media bubble, perhaps you should practice what you preach 

 

8 minutes ago, Chris said:

Yes, what points? 

 

I'll listen to any of my friends or colleagues about whatever, doesnt mean i have to agree with them or i have to change their mind. 

 

If Don Cherry makes people so upset, dont watch him. Its called the power of choice

 

"I believe others can treat you improperly without any repercussions, and if you voice your displeasure you're problematic."

 

"I don't need to actually consider a side of the story that challenges my preconceived notions."

 

"Life is good when I don't need compassion for other people's strife."

 

"I judge groups that challenge me by their worst persons because it's easy and makes me feel better for not growing."

 

"Taking in information from many sources is a "bubble," ignoring others is what makes you truly free."

 

"Don't shine a light on ignorance and hate, and don't fight for what you believe in. Just ignore it and hope it will eventually go away while they get the spotlight."

 

and finally:

 

15 minutes ago, Chris said:

Again you have to go to insults. 

 

the left will be proud of you. 

 

"You being fed up with my uncaring attitude is the only thing I'll latch on to from this experience so I can continue to dismiss anyone who dares to question my world view."

 

- a dramatic reenactment by We, the Privileged Many

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I dont watch much tv or do much of any social media. I do watch the habs when i get time

 

i just live my life

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