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Life on the bubble, after that November


tomh009

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November was pretty much an unmitigated disaster for the Habs, with injuries to Drouin, Byron and Mete, and subpar performances throughout resulting in an eight-game losing streak. Prior to the streak, we were in second place in the division, and the playoffs looked reachable. And then the wheels came off ...

 

Shockingly, we did not lose all that much ground as many of our direct competitors struggled as well. Look where we are:

 

Atlantic:

  • 2nd: Florida (has 1 game on hand): 1 point ahead of the Habs (5-5-0 in the last 10)
  • 3rd: Buffalo (0 GoH): 1 point ahead (4-4-2)
  • 5th: Toronto (2 games more played): tied with the Habs (4-6-0)
  • 6th: Tampa Bay (3 GoH): 1 point behind the Habs (5-4-1)

 

Metropolitan wild-card:

  • 4th: Pittsburgh (0 GoH): 4 points ahead (5-3-2)
  • 5th: Carolina (0 GoH): 3 points ahead (6-4-0)
  • 6th: Rangers (2 GoH): 1 point behind (5-4-1)

 

Our record is 2-5-3 in the last 10, but we actually lost no more than five points of ground to anyone (Pittsburgh and Carolina), four points to TB and three to Florida and Buffalo.

 

I'd say the season is not lost yet, in spite of the atrocious losing streak. It's certainly more difficult than it was before, but it's likely no more difficult than it was on the first day of the season. The question is whether the last game was a real turning point (rather than a false spring), and whether the team can move forward from here. And how well we can deal with the ongoing injuries ...

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48 minutes ago, Habsfan89 said:

Yeah both trips will be big that's 4 coming up Against the Canadian team's and then  4 against the California teams and  Colorado. So that's going to be 16 big points  Up for grabs. 

if they get 8 points out of 16, I will be happy

 

And before I am judge for being contempt with mediocrity: I am just being a realist given the number of injuries an the lack of D depth 

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10 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

if they get 8 points out of 16, I will be happy

 

And before I am judge for being contempt with mediocrity: I am just being a realist given the number of injuries an the lack of D depth 

Yeah I know what you mean, I think being realist is a no no here.

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My contention is that good teams do not lose 8 games in a row.

 

We have a lot of work to do here and I wonder if Bergy - longest tenured GM in the east - is on the hot seat.
 

I’m not sure that it’s the move I would make but one has to wonder.

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18 minutes ago, zumpano21 said:

My contention is that good teams do not lose 8 games in a row.

 

We have a lot of work to do here and I wonder if Bergy - longest tenured GM in the east - is on the hot seat.
 

I’m not sure that it’s the move I would make but one has to wonder.

I’m all on board for the Habs still making the playoffs and there certainly is plenty of time to do so. With that being said, good teams don’t have only 9 regulation or overtime wins after 29 games played. 

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2 hours ago, zumpano21 said:

My contention is that good teams do not lose 8 games in a row.

 

We have a lot of work to do here and I wonder if Bergy - longest tenured GM in the east - is on the hot seat.
 

I’m not sure that it’s the move I would make but one has to wonder.

 

My view is that if the team misses the playoffs again, MB should be fired.

 

That said, the team hasn't missed the playoffs yet, and replacing GMs in mid-season is not always a good idea (c.f. Houle).

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42 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

My view is that if the team misses the playoffs again, MB should be fired.

Come on!

If Habs make playoffs, but lose in the finals, you would still call for him to be fired.

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19 hours ago, DON said:

Come on!

If Habs make playoffs, but lose in the finals, you would still call for him to be fired.


And if the Habs go nowhere for the next 10 years you would still be praising his glorious work. ‘Just wait...we’ll be contenders any year now...’

 

19 hours ago, Chris said:

Missing the playoffs 5 out of 8 years should get any GM fired. 

 

 

 

This is what normal people would think, yes.

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44 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:


And if the Habs go nowhere for the next 10 years you would still be praising his glorious work. ‘Just wait...we’ll be contenders any year now...’

 

 

This is what normal people would think, yes.

since the 2012-2013 season teh CH has been in the palyoffs 4 times, sames as: CBJ, LAK, NYI, TOR, DET

 

More than: 

3xWPG

3xDAL

3xPHI

3xCGY

3xOTT

1xFLA

3xCOL

2xVAN

1xCAR

1xNJD

0xARZ

1xEDM

0xBUF

 

Your point? :spamafote:

 

in the last 4 years like other teams rebuilding:

4xPIT

4xWSH

3xANA

3xBOS

3xSTL

2xCHI

3xTBL

4xSJS

            1xMTL

4xNSH

3xMIN

2xNYR

3xCBJ

2xLAK

2xNYI

2xWPG

2xDAL

2xPHI

3xTOR

2xCGY

           1xDET

            1xOTT

            1xFLA

2xCOL

            0xVAN

            1xCAR

            1xNJD

            0xARZ

            1xEDM

            0xBUF

2xVGK

 

Edited by alfredoh2009
added last 4 years
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46 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:


Then we should trade Weber and Price, right?

I like this quote:

<<The most difficult thing is the decision to act, the rest is merely tenacity. The fears are paper tigers. You can do anything you decide to do. You can act to change and control your life; and the procedure, the process is its own reward.>> Amelia Earhart

 

The CH made a decision to do a reset instead of a rebuild. You and I cannot exchange Weber and Price because that is not what our favourite team has decided.

 

Now, as a fan, we either show tenacity in staying a fan during this stretch; or we decide not to be contempt with it.

 

I chose to be a fan. That is what I do for fun.

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Well, that seems to be an honest difference. We could decide to cheerlead for the organization no matter what it does, or we could conclude that being a fan does not involve surrendering our critical faculties. Obviously I subscribe to the second model, but hey, fill yer boots.

 

And note that all I said above was that if the team missed the playoffs for the fourth time in five years, the GM should be canned. Given that the primary reason for missing the dance would be his comical inability over three seasons to add a quality LD - this after years of analogous floundering in adding a C - I think that’s quite reasonable. The (apparent) argument that it’s more ‘fun’ to support the GM irrespective of results would mean being happy even if Reggie Houle were still GM of this team. Non merci.

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11 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

And note that all I said above was that if the team missed the playoffs for the fourth time in five years, the GM should be canned. Given that the primary reason for missing the dance would be his comical inability over three seasons to add a quality LD - this after years of analogous floundering in adding a C - I think that’s quite reasonable. The (apparent) argument that it’s more ‘fun’ to support the GM irrespective of results would mean being happy even if Reggie Houle were still GM of this team. Non merci.

That is one way to evaluate if the GM merits to be fired, but not what I will go with.

 

I will look at how the prospects develop during this year, how he manages assets at the trade deadline and if the team performs to a reasonable level given the roster.

 

I do not care much for making the playoff and losing in the first round if it keeps us in this "groundhog day" cycle of just getting in but hitting a wall

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FYI, I shared my spreadsheet on the NHL thread (didn't know where to put it) so that you can see what I use as a rough estimate of progress. Not a perfect thing, but one good enough to help me have a good grip of how the team has fared since MB came on board.

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47 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

That is one way to evaluate if the GM merits to be fired, but not what I will go with.

 

I will look at how the prospects develop during this year, how he manages assets at the trade deadline and if the team performs to a reasonable level given the roster.

 

I do not care much for making the playoff and losing in the first round if it keeps us in this "groundhog day" cycle of just getting in but hitting a wall

If this was year 4 on the job and he came in with a barren prospect pool and was committed to a true rebuild, sure.  But when you make non-sensical moves that don’t address your biggest holes and call it a reset, you’d have to be ready to be committed to an asylum to continue to support management - unless you agree that it’s fine to strive for mediocrity.

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I wonder if a reset over a rebuild was the right move in Montreal? A reset can quickly  be shored up with free agents, and you're back in business.  Montreal can not attract free agents. It seems that only trading and drafting are options. Imagine the wrath of the fans if MB traded Brooke or Poehling to address a need, and then they turn out to be elite. The fans would eat him alive. If this reset lasts another season after this one, it will have taken the same time that a rebuild would have. Only price and weber will be lower in value. 

 

Cant attract free agents

 

Get your ass chewed out by media and fans for every trade you lose.

 

Drafting is the best option. Rebuild is the best way to get through that. 

 

So now you've drafted all of the stars, you are bound to go down one of two roads...

Trash team with no leaders and a couple of superstars EDMONTON. 

High talent team where all of your superstar talent will destroy your cap early because kids get paid earlier TORONTO.  + quebec tax

 

All hope is lost.

 

 

 

 

 

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22 minutes ago, BCHabnut said:

I wonder if a reset over a rebuild was the right move in Montreal? A reset can quickly  be shored up with free agents, and you're back in business.  Montreal can not attract free agents. It seems that only trading and drafting are options. Imagine the wrath of the fans if MB traded Brooke or Poehling to address a need, and then they turn out to be elite. The fans would eat him alive. If this reset lasts another season after this one, it will have taken the same time that a rebuild would have. Only price and weber will be lower in value. 

 

Cant attract free agents

 

Get your ass chewed out by media and fans for every trade you lose.

 

Drafting is the best option. Rebuild is the best way to get through that. 

 

So now you've drafted all of the stars, you are bound to go down one of two roads...

Trash team with no leaders and a couple of superstars EDMONTON. 

High talent team where all of your superstar talent will destroy your cap early because kids get paid earlier TORONTO.  + quebec tax

 

All hope is lost.

 

 

 

 

 

You trade the over 30 players and keep Gallagher as your leader.

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Judas Priest! It’s either Panglossian cheerleaders or C-3P0-style Doom and Gloom around here...

 

This team has a lot of good elements, right now. In particular it has good FW depth, two legit top pairing D-men and a goalie with heavy pedigree. If our Andy Capp of a GM would get off the couch and fill the abyssal hole at LD, I honestly think that would be enough to get us over the playoff bar. And that should be the goal this season: getting over the bar.

 

Remember, even if we’re retooling with youth, those youth will need playoff experience. It is consistent with - indeed, desirable to - a youth movement to ice a team that makes the dance.  I do not subscribe to this narrative of endlessly deferred gratification in the name of some continually-shifting three-year vanishing point when we will miraculously contend. MB’s job was to make this team better than last year’s. As usual, that turned out to be too ‘tough.’

 

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