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Andrei Markov Retires #79

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Was Markov a better defenseman  than Subban ?

 

Just asking,

not trolling 

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47 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Was Markov a better defenseman  than Subban ?

 

Just asking,

not trolling 

Good question.

I think Markov was better passer, skating equal, but offensively Subban could just do much more on his own. If factor in off-ice, or as a teammate is no comparison (not sure if Markov ever had 1 scrap at practice ever...with smallest teammates he could find...poor lil DD and Pleky).

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3 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Was Markov a better defenseman  than Subban ?

 

Just asking,

not trolling 

Hard to say, honestly. Subban probably peaked higher but for a lesser length of time. Markov was consistently great, and his style of play was more about subtly making teammates into stars instead of being the obvious star.

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4 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Was Markov a better defenseman  than Subban ?

 

Just asking,

not trolling 

Subban had better years (norris win and multi time finalist), but have to see how he does over next 5 years, or so.  Markov was consistent despite some horrific knee injuries and came back strong.  Have to see how Subban’s back holds up.

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Thanks for the replies, I liked Markov but it seems to me that we are romanticizing his legacy. He was not a great one, same as Saku: he was the "least worst" we had at the time. Almost elite but not dominant.

 

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Just too bad they way he parted ways?

Not sure who is more to blame; Bergevin (with zero plan B & take it or leave it message) or Markov (acting as own agent, asking for too much $ & or term)?

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20 minutes ago, DON said:

Just too bad they way he parted ways?

Not sure who is more to blame; Bergevin (with zero plan B & take it or leave it message) or Markov (acting as own agent, asking for too much $ & or term)?

I didn’t like the way Markov or Koivu parted ways. Would have like to see both finish their careers in Montreal. Markov should have gotten the extra year. Would that have been worse of a mistake then the bum MB signed in Alzner??

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23 hours ago, Trizzak said:

Hard to say, honestly. Subban probably peaked higher but for a lesser length of time. Markov was consistently great, and his style of play was more about subtly making teammates into stars instead of being the obvious star.

 

If we're talking about just their time on the Habs, then I'd give the nod to Subban, but it's a very, very thin margin. I agree with the basic contrast in styles you point to here. PK was more spectacular, more explosive. Markov was more cerebral. Worth noting that Subban himself cited Markov as the superior defenceman after the Habs let Markov walk (which he couldn't believe).

 

23 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Subban had better years (norris win and multi time finalist), but have to see how he does over next 5 years, or so.  Markov was consistent despite some horrific knee injuries and came back strong.  Have to see how Subban’s back holds up.

 

Subban was atrocious last season. I think injuries prematurely shortened his career as an elite player. (They hurt Markov's career too, but the drop-off was not as precipitous). His first step was always awkward and that may also be a contributor - once he lost even a fraction of his first-step speed it really set him back. But injuries may be the cause of that loss of quickness. That said, maybe NJ was a factor, last year was an outlier and he will find his game again; sometimes that can happen.

 

I always remember the 2014 playoffs. In Game One or Two an amped-up Subban practically challenged the entire Bruins' bench to a fight; Markov came over and told him to calm down. You could see PK absorbing the message. Subban was dominant in that series, but I also remember Markov stepping up any time Subban faltered in that playoff. They really were a fabulous 1-2 punch, in whichever order.

 

20 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

I didn’t like the way Markov or Koivu parted ways. Would have like to see both finish their careers in Montreal. Markov should have gotten the extra year. Would that have been worse of a mistake then the bum MB signed in Alzner??

 

Great point. This is how MB rolls - it's about his own ego as much as anything else. So, Markov plays a little bit hardball, and instead of making the rational move and biting on the extra year, MB says "screw you!" and "teaches him who's boss" by wasting millions on that POS Alzner. When push comes to shove, personal ego is prioritized over team success. It's no way to run a railroad.

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Loved Subban. Liked the Weber trade.

 

The question was: Was Markov a better defenseman than Subban?

 

I had to think for about 45 seconds, but I honestly think he was. If Markov were traded to pretty much any team in the league at Subban’s age, he would have been a #1 or at worst #1B.
 

Subban’s tenure in Nashville, (more so his usage, not that he played bad) despite their stacked defense changed my perception of him slightly just because of his usage. His numbers this year were worse than could be expected as well.

 

My last memory of Subban on the team, was a horribly boring season where the team performed terribly and he was the most relied upon player. 
 

All that being said and tied in with the last point, the Habs record with or without Markov is really the reason I’ve answered the way I have. He had an enormous impact for me the success of our team. 

 

While my opinion may seem harsh, it’s a comparison between Markov and Subban and Markov was great For the Habs. It’s so over used but it’s similar to Lidstrom. Subban may be flashier, but you’d probably want Lidstrom on your NHL team. Yes, Markov wasn’t quite Lidstrom, though on Detroit he would have been. 
 

In the end, it’s certainly possible that Subban was more talented, and Markov had a larger positive impact on his team but my answer goes to Markov.

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

Yes, Markov wasn’t quite Lidstrom, though on Detroit he would have been.

Was a Markov fan' but, take off those rose-coloured glasses sir, you are talking two vastly different d-men, not even same ballpark.

I would say that is like comparing Ovi to Lecavalier.

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3 hours ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

Loved Subban. Liked the Weber trade.

 

The question was: Was Markov a better defenseman than Subban?

 

 

Subban was the more dynamic blueliner and could take over a game in a way that Markov couldn't.  But in terms of overall play, Markov was the more valuable of the two.  He's someone that would be out there in all situations and made a lot of players that much better.  Subban never really elevated the play of his partners the way Markov could.

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