Jump to content

Aug. 7 - Game Four - Habs v.s. PITS -4 PM


Recommended Posts

5 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

🤣

 

It's been along time.  How have you been?

 

It was funny I checked some of my last posts and they were from 2011, and 1 of them was a discussion about Webers new contract with Nash, and what Subban would get.  I chuckled about the irony of that now. 

 

Indeed! Pretty good here, you?

 

Haha, the name was so familiar that it took a few minites for it to dawn on me that it wasn't a name I'd seen in a while. So I looked up your posts and the one that stood out to me was the Erik Cole signing thread, haha.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 176
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

And yes id rather have weal, hudon, poehling, than weise.  Heck i'd sit weise and play charlie lindgren at forward if that was the only other option.

Winning the cup is more valuable.  I'll take a 3% chance at the cup over a 12.5% Chance at first overall.    Even if you get first overall it still don't guarantee a cup. 

That's a dangerous typo on a Montreal message board...

Posted Images

1 hour ago, Fanpuck33 said:

Sir_Boagalott, now there's a name out of the past!


Just when you thought 2020 couldn’t get any weirder in come Sir_Boagalott in his Delorean. 
 

Who’s next Walmsley_01???

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, hockeyrealist said:

Go Habs Go!

The icing on the cake of this play-in win is noticing the lack of comments from the negative nellies who believe a high draft pick is the only path to success. The foolish posts that Weber is on the decline, Price is past his prime and this team can’t compete even in a league of extreme parity.

Draft pick primos don’t mean squat in a team sport when games get tight.

McDavid hasn’t won a team achievement even though he’s a stud who lays it all on the line, Eichel is wasting away no matter how hard he tries to do it all and round out his game, and we’re seeing a pattern in TO of talent meaning nothing without buy-in (see Islanders, Columbus) and heart (see Habs). They’re playing like a bunch of Gallagher’s because of the bar set by him, Carey and Weber to do whatever it takes, be humble, carry a big stick.

 

Sorry to disappoint, I was busy... 

 

I still think this is a hollow victory if they just go out in the next round... this team needs a youth movement and to add to that core... this year is a BS hockey season and I would have preferred a top pick... I want several years of being a top four contender in the league. Tired of the cup droughts and hoping for a miracle if we just squeak in.  

 

worse, if the leafs manage to lose they might win the top pick again.., and we will spend the next 5 to 7 years jealous of their talent level. Frankly, we already should be.., they will be contenders for a while. Doesn’t guarantee them a cup by any means but their odds are a lot better then ours.

 

i don’t consider this being negative.., I view this as long term strategic thinking...

Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, Helmethead said:

 

Who’s next Walmsley_01???

 

If only. He was a fantastic contributor!

 

10 minutes ago, brobin said:

Sorry to disappoint, I was busy... 

 

I still think this is a hollow victory if they just go out in the next round... this team needs a youth movement and to add to that core... this year is a BS hockey season and I would have preferred a top pick... I want several years of being a top four contender in the league. Tired of the cup droughts and hoping for a miracle if we just squeak in.  

 

worse, if the leafs manage to lose they might win the top pick again.., and we will spend the next 5 to 7 years jealous of their talent level. Frankly, we already should be.., they will be contenders for a while. Doesn’t guarantee them a cup by any means but their odds are a lot better then ours.

 

i don’t consider this being negative.., I view this as long term strategic thinking...

 

A loss would have meant a 12.5% chance of the #1 overall pick. I don't favour losing a series in exchange for those odds, personally.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

If only. He was a fantastic contributor!

 

 

A loss would have meant a 12.5% chance of the #1 overall pick. I don't favour losing a series in exchange for those odds, personally.

They are now zero... and we still could have gotten a decent pick even if 9th... yes it is a gamble, but I don’t think we have a 12.5% chance of winning the cup this year..

 

oh and don’t expect management changes... we made the playoffs... 😂😂😂😂

Link to post
Share on other sites

Winning the cup is more valuable. 

I'll take a 3% chance at the cup over a 12.5% Chance at first overall.    Even if you get first overall it still don't guarantee a cup. 

  • Upvote 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Commandant said:

Winning the cup is more valuable. 

I'll take a 3% chance at the cup over a 12.5% Chance at first overall.    Even if you get first overall it still don't guarantee a cup. 

I agree... winning the cup is very valuable... we disagree that winning this moves us towards that goal... I want to improve our odds year over year by seriously rebuilding... that includes taking chances on higher round picks to build up the talent...

 

a quick fix is not going to do it.. nothing guarantees a cup, but one can improve the chances... this team was 24th in the league for a reason... it isn’t very good... this win didn’t make them any better..

Link to post
Share on other sites
38 minutes ago, brobin said:

I agree... winning the cup is very valuable... we disagree that winning this moves us towards that goal... I want to improve our odds year over year by seriously rebuilding... that includes taking chances on higher round picks to build up the talent...

 

a quick fix is not going to do it.. nothing guarantees a cup, but one can improve the chances... this team was 24th in the league for a reason... it isn’t very good... this win didn’t make them any better..

Totally agree that this win does not make us any better and I really wanted that number 1 pick who will be a player whose name starts with “Laf”.

having said that, I have a lot more comfort in seeing we any have a two good young centres that are 1a/1b potential and the fact that it was with quality ice time in key roles and. It just as but players.  They aren’t the truly cant miss generational players you usually get at in the top 3, but they look like guys who can control games.  Having said that, it was a short series in weird year and there were no expectation on the team. So we’ll have to wait until next year to figure what we have.

id like to think that we can go on a 1985 or 2010 type run, but i don’t think we have the D for that - especially if we have to play Tampa. I do have more hope though that If Romanov and Canfield also pan out we may have the makings of a pretty good future.  I would have been more confident had we still had Sergechev, rather than Drouin, but I digress.

 

anyway, I do think we still need to substantially improve the talent pool and I think there as a chance to do that given our cap space if we take on another bad contract in return.  
 

what I don’t want is another blip of one or two half decent showings and than going back to bubble status - which is essentially what we have been through the Houle-Savard-Gainey-Ghost-MB years. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, brobin said:

Sorry to disappoint, I was busy... 

 

I still think this is a hollow victory if they just go out in the next round... this team needs a youth movement and to add to that core... this year is a BS hockey season and I would have preferred a top pick... I want several years of being a top four contender in the league. Tired of the cup droughts and hoping for a miracle if we just squeak in.  

 

worse, if the leafs manage to lose they might win the top pick again.., and we will spend the next 5 to 7 years jealous of their talent level. Frankly, we already should be.., they will be contenders for a while. Doesn’t guarantee them a cup by any means but their odds are a lot better then ours.

 

i don’t consider this being negative.., I view this as long term strategic thinking...

Everyone points to Edmonton and says top picks don't mean success. Meanwhile I'm looking at Minnesota and thinking we're the next team to pick between 13 and 20 OA for a decade.

 

But hey, I get to watch at least 4 more Habs games this summer so that's pretty nice. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, brobin said:

Sorry to disappoint, I was busy... 

 

I still think this is a hollow victory if they just go out in the next round... this team needs a youth movement and to add to that core... this year is a BS hockey season and I would have preferred a top pick... I want several years of being a top four contender in the league. Tired of the cup droughts and hoping for a miracle if we just squeak in.  

 

worse, if the leafs manage to lose they might win the top pick again.., and we will spend the next 5 to 7 years jealous of their talent level. Frankly, we already should be.., they will be contenders for a while. Doesn’t guarantee them a cup by any means but their odds are a lot better then ours.

 

i don’t consider this being negative.., I view this as long term strategic thinking...

I counted 3 “ifs” 

 

“This year is a BS hockey season” is also a roll your eyes comment. It’s possible that the teams who got into the playoffs are a little skewed, but once they have the playoff teams decided, a very deserving team will come out on top as the cup champ.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Haha, I cannot believe all these shallow fans who can’t even truly support a team that is laying it on the line, playing good playoff style hockey, yet continue to visit/post on a Habs fan site.

I pity these fools.

It’s hilarious reading these posters who think they know how to build a winning hockey team from their lazy boys just by securing Lafreniere ( he’s gonna be good but he’s not a Gretzky or even McDavid, and even if he is: a bird (or playoff birth) in the hand is worth two in the bush).

 

Aside from Taking too many penalties, this team is playing structurally solid hockey that wins playoff games when checking is tight.  I’ll take offense by committee in playoff hockey more than 1-2 key players who can be neutralized, these new line configurations are possibly the most balanced forward group in the league and our top three d are among the best in the league, and oh yeah Carey Freaking Price rises to the occasion as we’ve seen throughout his career going back to junior hockey.

 

A lot easier to be a hater than a supporter, but this is a fan site and as far as I know no poster here has qualifications or experience to manage an NHL team yet they still insist that the percentage chance at a top 9 pick is worth more that even an outside shot at a cup? Pfffft, this series experience alone just made KK and Suzuki ten times more valuable and a proven asset, draft picks are speculative and I’d rather roll the dice with my known assets than be happy to watch a rebuild that posters throw around like its the be all, end all solution.

i can only imagine the crap posts these same posters would be making over the next few seasons about how terrible the team is as we struggle through the development of a potential stud who could turn out to be Yakupov 2.0.


Looking through Lafreniere history I see no championships except for when playing on all-star variety national teams, has he propelled a mediocre team to excellence, carried a team on his back to championship? 35 goals in final junior year doesn’t scream stud to me. Is he going to be a great player? Probably, but can he single handedly turn a franchise into a champion? I doubt it, so are we needing a few years of top picks and losing to assemble enough star power to dominate? And at what point does all that losing impact player development? 
 

Nope, not for me. Ride this run because this league is a game of inches, Full of battles of attrition and I’ll take this tight knit group of plugs over some percentage chance of drafting a star any day of the week. They’re playing for each other because there is no 1 guy and if you’re gonna have that one star the goalie is best case scenario as it’s such a unique, individual position that can impact a game greater than any other position.
 

crosby, Malkin, McDavid, Draisitl are all studs who are done for the season and half of them have yet to win a damn thing that matters: the cup.

Crosby and Malkin got into the league before parity was so prominent as well and we are seeing how that has caught up to them also.

no one pick is worth sacrificing a chance to dance.

 

no fan regrets their team winning, making the playoffs (especially in these days).

 

16 wins ain’t no thang.  I’ll never be happy about a loss.

 

Go Habs Go.

 

 

 

Edited by hockeyrealist
Link to post
Share on other sites

“Long term strategic thinking” from lazy boy managers is the most idiotic excuse I’ve heard to backtrack from being a half-assed fan I’ve even seen.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Totally agree that this win does not make us any better and I really wanted that number 1 pick who will be a player whose name starts with “Laf”.

having said that, I have a lot more comfort in seeing we any have a two good young centres that are 1a/1b potential and the fact that it was with quality ice time in key roles and. It just as but players.  They aren’t the truly cant miss generational players you usually get at in the top 3, but they look like guys who can control games.  Having said that, it was a short series in weird year and there were no expectation on the team. So we’ll have to wait until next year to figure what we have.

id like to think that we can go on a 1985 or 2010 type run, but i don’t think we have the D for that - especially if we have to play Tampa. I do have more hope though that If Romanov and Canfield also pan out we may have the makings of a pretty good future.  I would have been more confident had we still had Sergechev, rather than Drouin, but I digress.

 

anyway, I do think we still need to substantially improve the talent pool and I think there as a chance to do that given our cap space if we take on another bad contract in return.  
 

what I don’t want is another blip of one or two half decent showings and than going back to bubble status - which is essentially what we have been through the Houle-Savard-Gainey-Ghost-MB years. 

 

I agree with a lot of your points. Excited to see how KK and Suzuki are developing, it bodes well for the future, this kind of experience will do wonders for their development. I don't think their defence is deep enough yet, their top 3 is going to log a lot of minutes and will likely get worn down in a grueling 7 game series. However the positives vastly outweigh the negatives right now. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

If we had a 100% chance of getting Lafreniere, maybe I’d think the best long term plan is to fail vs Pittsburgh. But the minute Lafreniere isn’t guaranteed, what just happened is the best thing for the Habs and their development. 
 

This is good for KK, for Suzuki any young player. To feel like a winner. This has to encourage Price. Even CJ ends up getting a boost since he clearly out coached Sullivan. I’d even add that the players that didn’t play like Romanov, Fleury and Primeau gain through all this. Maybe not Poehling who might not see where he fits. Possibly not helping Domi any (tho - remember, as a 4th loner, his line mates may be Swiss Leaguers (hello Weise), but he also should be getting the softer opposition avoiding the Pens top lines. 
 

As the regular season wound down, I was fine with getting a top 10 pick. When the first round of draft order was set, I was thrilled with the shot at Lafreniere. But I’m convinced that the best case long term scenario has just played out. I’ll take the success over Crosby, Malkin et al over a winger that will only hit prime after Price and Weber are backups. 

  • Upvote 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

For my part, I separate whatever playoff success we have - which I savour and enjoy to the hilt - from the longer term 'strategic' question of building a powerhouse. Yes, we could have gotten an excellent player at 9th. You can also get Max Pacioretty at 18th, David Pasternak at 23rd or whatever it was, and PK Subban in Round Two. And your celebrated 'tank' pick can turn into Galchenyuk. So I'm not crying over the pick.I'm not a tankist. I believe in the Boston model of superior drafting and development.

 

If KK and Suzuki are for real, that changes the organization's complexion considerably. And the experience they're gaining right now will make them more ready on the next go, when they actually might have a shot to go deep.

 

Still, I agree with those who worry that MB will leverage this success to smugly sit back rather than address critical and long-standing needs, such as a backup goalie who can play 30-35 quality games, and upgrades throughout the lineup. Our D, which was so key against PITT, is old and out of sync with the KK/Suzuki arc. There are structural issues. But I refuse to surrender the joys of playoff fandom just because we don't trust Bergevin not to be an ass.

Link to post
Share on other sites

All the talk about what if draft picks... seriously??

 

-Our #13 overall pick Suzuki just trumped Crosby and has emerged as our #1C. We should all be elated with this development. It's exactly what WE have been clamoring for the last 20 years!!!

-Our #3rd overall KK after an injury riddled sophomore season just put on 20lbs and looked amazing as a huge 2 way C who isnt being pushed around anymore. All the while still one of the 10 youngest players in the entire league i believe and still needs to add another 15/20lbs to that frame... amazing!

-Nobody is talking about LDB Lehks Danault and byron emerging as a super checking line then can produce. Crazy!

-Kulak had quite the series... can he continue with that type of play to complete an all of a sudden threatening top 4 D

-How much can be said of Chairot? What a player, what a pick up

-There really is no need to speak to Weber and Petry as they are playing to expectation. 

- Carey Fukn Price is back.... finally! I've been all over him for his inconsistent play over the last 3 seasons. THANK THE HEAVENS ABOVE HE HAS RE-EMERGED!!

 

Now if we can stay out of the box vs TB/philly  and ALL the above continues for sure we have a chance. How could we not?? 

 

-The special teams are a whole other matter.

Regardless if we even win the cup. The special teams coach no matter WHO must be fired!I mean why on earth would the 1st unit have Weber on the top of the umbrella with Droui  on the left and Suzuki on the right? That's only 1 trigger. I'd have Drouin on the right Weber on the left and Suzuki a top the umbrella but who am I...

 

As for drafting... the best line over the last few years has been Bostons

Pasternak #24th

Bergeron 2nd RD

Marchand #71st

 

I get it. I would love Lafreniere as he would really boost this line up especially with the money we have yet to spend and if he would be able to contribute immediately with an entry level contract and with kids being paid minimally MB could really leverage to load up for a 2/3 year run before having to pony up significantly for the kids. But, the question is do you want our current kids to fail or would you like to see Suzuki outplay Point next and KK continue to blossom b4 our very eyes... that's the real question. A question now already answered by the players themselves.

 

My only disappointment so far is the reluctance to insert Poehling and Evans and really give the oppurtunity  to our future rather then plugs like Weise. Let them play. Let them get experience for tomorrow.

I want to see

Domi Poehling Evans (inj)

Weal

Belzilie

Hudon

A 6th defenceman

b4 Weise plays again

-Domi's future on this team is wing as I've been saying since day 1.

 

Ouelett played well and Mete played great in game 4 to. But I think ideally Mete should move to the left and Fleury should get some experience as well. My thoughts only!

What a shame Romanov cant be inserted. I've been drooling over him since the WJC of 2 years past.

 

The one thing we can say about MB is that hes in fact stuck with his new plan of not trading picks for immediate help and has stock piled draft picks and let kids develop 

 

This team is significantly different then the team that started the season and it seems all our/my "hopes and dreams b4 the start of the season are coming to fruition if not for one series.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

For my part, I separate whatever playoff success we have - which I savour and enjoy to the hilt - from the longer term 'strategic' question of building a powerhouse. Yes, we could have gotten an excellent player at 9th. You can also get Max Pacioretty at 18th, David Pasternak at 23rd or whatever it was, and PK Subban in Round Two. And your celebrated 'tank' pick can turn into Galchenyuk. So I'm not crying over the pick.I'm not a tankist. I believe in the Boston model of superior drafting and development.

 

If KK and Suzuki are for real, that changes the organization's complexion considerably. And the experience they're gaining right now will make them more ready on the next go, when they actually might have a shot to go deep.

 

Still, I agree with those who worry that MB will leverage this success to smugly sit back rather than address critical and long-standing needs, such as a backup goalie who can play 30-35 quality games, and upgrades throughout the lineup. Our D, which was so key against PITT, is old and out of sync with the KK/Suzuki arc. There are structural issues. But I refuse to surrender the joys of playoff fandom just because we don't trust Bergevin not to be an ass.

keep in mind that neither the of our years with #3 picks were actually tank jobs.  We were just bad teams that just sucked.  But it wasn't by design. Neither teams were like the Leafs trading away everyone and keeping players in the minors and icing an AHL team for Matthews, or Buffalo doing the same for McDavid (having to settle for Eichal).  We were genuinely had faith in, but were really bubble teams that additional adversity with injuries or lousy coaching, or the Montreal unique coaching language issues.  Those were bubble teams that just imploded.  very similar to the bubble teams that played above their head.  but at no time was there a conscious effort by management to try and be bad to get a high draft pick - they just got the picks by incompetence, injury and players having crappy years..  They weren't the Rangers sending out a letter that they ware rebuilding. Hell, after the galchenyuk pick we had a pretty good reason, with most of the key players from the previous regime. The team this year wasn't much worse/better than the team that drafted KK.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

keep in mind that neither the of our years with #3 picks were actually tank jobs.  We were just bad teams that just sucked.  But it wasn't by design. Neither teams were like the Leafs trading away everyone and keeping players in the minors and icing an AHL team for Matthews, or Buffalo doing the same for McDavid (having to settle for Eichal).  We were genuinely had faith in, but were really bubble teams that additional adversity with injuries or lousy coaching, or the Montreal unique coaching language issues.  Those were bubble teams that just imploded.  very similar to the bubble teams that played above their head.  but at no time was there a conscious effort by management to try and be bad to get a high draft pick - they just got the picks by incompetence, injury and players having crappy years..  They weren't the Rangers sending out a letter that they ware rebuilding. Hell, after the galchenyuk pick we had a pretty good reason, with most of the key players from the previous regime. The team this year wasn't much worse/better than the team that drafted KK.  

Yes and the point is that had the Habs actually attempted to tank and been successful at doing so during that year, they would have done all that tanking work for Nail Yakupov. It’ll never make sense to me.

Link to post
Share on other sites

What's the difference between getting the #3 pick because you suck, versus getting it because you've engineered it? Either way, the result is the same. The Habs have had two picks under MB which were the equivalent of 'tanking.' Team Tank tends to forget that.

Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

What's the difference between getting the #3 pick because you suck, versus getting it because you've engineered it? Either way, the result is the same. The Habs have had two picks under MB which were the equivalent of 'tanking.' Team Tank tends to forget that.

To be honest. I am more concerned of getting late second round picks than the late first round pick. Usually, that is where TT has been successful

 

that being said, I am really happy with making the playoffs and having hope of a solid D crew next season 

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, hockeyrealist said:

... I pity these fools ...

 

And rational discussion is precluded when it falls to third grade name calling

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, GHT120 said:

 

And rational discussion is precluded when it falls to third grade name calling

Those would be pretty fancy third graders using that language, not the ones I’ve seen around here 🙃

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

What's the difference between getting the #3 pick because you suck, versus getting it because you've engineered it? Either way, the result is the same. The Habs have had two picks under MB which were the equivalent of 'tanking.' Team Tank tends to forget that.

 

Team Tank as you call it doesn't want to tank every season, it wants strategic planning to tank in seasons with 2-3 elite players available ... like 2016 (Matthews, Laine, Dubois), 2015 (McDavid, Eichel, Marner), 2010 (Hall, Seguin), 2009 (Tavares, Hedman) ... no reason to suck if the reward is Yakupov/Murray/Galchenyuk ... this season is reputed to be another "good" draft ... as is the 2021 draft.

 

Sure, there is no guarantee that you get the top players, but it isn't like the last 26 seasons been a rousing success with the "hope to make the playoffs and see" approach ... with an occasional glimpse at a chance for the Cup Finals (twice) ... I was good with that for a long time but finally lost faith ... even with a decent collection of prospects for the first time in many, many years I don't see the Habs becoming any more than "a playoff favourite and see" team ... I can advocate for a rebuild while cheering for the players/team if management is happy with the hamster wheel they are on.

  • Upvote 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

To be honest. I am more concerned of getting late second round picks than the late first round pick. Usually, that is where TT has been successful

 

that being said, I am really happy with making the playoffs and having hope of a solid D crew next season 

 

I'll agree to disagree about the relative merits of sacrificing the shot at #1 (guaranteed #9) for "making the 2020 playoffs" (despite MB's carefully constructed team having an abysmal season) ... I'll be cheering unabashedly now, because it is now what is best for the team ... and that is what both sides of the "tank" issue really want ... 

 

But totally agree with optimism for the future of defence corps ... eager to see Romanov, Juulsen and Fleury next season ... with Norlinder, Harris, Stuble in 21/22 and beyond ... even Fairbrother is somewhat intriguing

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




×
×
  • Create New...