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2021 NHL General Discussion


hab29RETIRED

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You can’t have enforcers, because they cause you to lose hockey games.

 

There are only two choices: a league with a disciplinary system that actually gives two sh*ts about enforcing player safety; or a league in which stars are placed at risk of permanent and unnecessary injury. For reasons that escape me, the NHL loves the idea of talented young men suffering permanent brain damage.

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5 minutes ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

So Wilson gets that fine and THIS gets a hearing? Joke of a league 😜

 

 

It's a joke Tom Wilson only got $5,000 but this is also a cheap shot, play was over, puck in the net, player near the boards and not expecting to get hit at all because the play was done. No need for this. 

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10 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

It's a joke Tom Wilson only got $5,000 but this is also a cheap shot, play was over, puck in the net, player near the boards and not expecting to get hit at all because the play was done. No need for this. 

 

I agree, Wilson should be suspended. 

 

I also agree this should be suspended.  This is a similar play as Hunter on Turgeon in the 93 playoffs.  Its not as bad as Hunter so it shouldn't be the same.... but its still cross checking a guy after the play is over and he is in a vulnerable spot. 

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What baffles me in all of this is the department of player safety and kicking beehives have a clear rule.  If the play doesn’t result in an injury, they will not suspend.  Yet the play ended in an injury, and they didn’t suspend.
 

Read something earlier that the play the injured Panarin, Wilson was given 14 minutes in the box, a misconduct and a double minor for roughing.  In those 14 minutes he made something like $21,000 (salary divided by TOI multiplied by 15 minutes he was in the box).  His fine was $5,000.  Tom Wilson injured on of the Ranger’s best players and made $16,000, after his fine, for sitting in the box.

 

Where do I sign up for a gig like that?  I have a few people at my work I wouldn’t mind rag dolling if I knew I was going to get away with it too.

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1 hour ago, Commandant said:

Tom wilson isnt afraid to fight an enforcer.  It does nothing but force a top forward to double shift.

 

EXACTLY ... the majority of the former enforcers lost at least as often as they won ... but getting punched out never stopped them from fighting ... the VAST majority of players who pull the sort the outrageous and dangerous shyte won't stop because they get beaten up ... it will just make the fans feel better because they will feel their team got a pound of flesh ... if teams want toughness find the modern Chris Nolan (i.e., a legit modern NHL 3rd/4th liner who can also fight) ... or better yet, a Tom Wilson with brains/integrity.

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1 hour ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

So Wilson gets that fine and THIS gets a hearing? Joke of a league 😜

 

A random note on that one - Gostisbehere and Friedman had been teammates until earlier this season when Pittsburgh claimed Friedman off waivers in the middle of them having most of their back end injured.

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The other ting this points out is how ridiculous the $5000 maximum fine has become ... and it is all the worse when it aggressor is a Tom Wilson ($5,166,666) instead of Micheal Haley ($700K, only player with more majors than Wilson in the last four seasons) ... Wilson pays less than 0.01% of his salary while Haley pays a tad over 0.07% of his ... more should be done and discipline be more strict and consistent (no more "but he hasn't;t been suspended for doing THAT" crap) ... but at VERY least, the amount be converted to a percentage of salary, and for simplicity round it up to 1%

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10 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

The other ting this points out is how ridiculous the $5000 maximum fine has become ... and it is all the worse when it aggressor is a Tom Wilson ($5,166,666) instead of Micheal Haley ($700K, only player with more majors than Wilson in the last four seasons) ... Wilson pays less than 0.01% of his salary while Haley pays a tad over 0.07% of his ... more should be done and discipline be more strict and consistent (no more "but he hasn't;t been suspended for doing THAT" crap) ... but at VERY least, the amount be converted to a percentage of salary, and for simplicity round it up to 1%

 

A player on 700,000 doesn't get a $5000 fine. 

Its 50% of one day's salary up to a maximum of $10000.00  (15,000 if fined/suspended in the past 18 months for the same offence).

So yes, there will still be differences, but Haley is not paying 0.07% of his salary.   Its not as big a difference as your post says. 

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15 minutes ago, Commandant said:

A player on 700,000 doesn't get a $5000 fine. 

Its 50% of one day's salary up to a maximum of $10000.00  (15,000 if fined/suspended in the past 18 months for the same offence).

So yes, there will still be differences, but Haley is not paying 0.07% of his salary.   Its not as big a difference as your post says. 

One day's salary? Is that one game, or are they also counting days off in that calculation?

 

I would up the maximum to 10 games' salary, no dollar maximum. To be donated to NHLPA retiired players support fund, or NHLPA Goals & Dreams -- basically it doesn't go to the owners, to make this more palatable for the players.

 

But this will likely never happen.

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24 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

A player on 700,000 doesn't get a $5000 fine. 

Its 50% of one day's salary up to a maximum of $10000.00  (15,000 if fined/suspended in the past 18 months for the same offence).

So yes, there will still be differences, but Haley is not paying 0.07% of his salary.   Its not as big a difference as your post says. 

 

Maybe not in absolute dollars ... using 200 day seasons for simplicity of calculations ...

 

Haley: 700000/200 = $3500 ... half = $1750 ... which is 0.25% of this salary


Wilson: 5,166,666/200 = $25833 ... half = 12916 ... or 0.25% ... but capped at $5000 means Wilson loses 0.097% of his salary (about 1/3 the impact for Haley)

 

My point was less about the actual dollars but more about the relative impact on the offenders ... let alone how ridiculous the $5000 cap is a deterrent to future behaviour

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12 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

One day's salary? Is that one game, or are they also counting days off in that calculation?

 

I would up the maximum to 10 games' salary, no dollar maximum. To be donated to NHLPA retiired players support fund, or NHLPA Goals & Dreams -- basically it doesn't go to the owners, to make this more palatable for the players.

 

But this will likely never happen.

 

It already goes to the NHL Player Assistance fund.

 

And its one day, based on the number of days (not games) per season.

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I *** DO NOT *** advocate this approach ... but given Tom Wilson's status as one of the best fighters in the NHL it has a certain disgusting and disturbing logic ... beating up Wilson will not cause him to no longer be a danger to opponents ... so make his team and teammates pressure him to change.
 

 

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2 hours ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

So Wilson gets that fine and THIS gets a hearing? Joke of a league 😜

 

 

Wilson should absolutely have not only got an hearing, but received an immediate suspension, while they decided on the length of the suspension.

I do think that this does merit a suspension as well. Dale Hunter laid a similar cheap shots on Pierre Turgeon in the playoffs after Turgeon scored a goal. That hit ended Turgeon’s playoffs (which benefited in the 93 cup win). Incidentally - Hunter was also a Cap.

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55 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

I *** DO NOT *** advocate this approach ... but given Tom Wilson's status as one of the best fighters in the NHL it has a certain disgusting and disturbing logic ... beating up Wilson will not cause him to no longer be a danger to opponents ... so make his team and teammates pressure him to change.
 

 

That’s about what I’d expect from a scum bag like Avery. Sadly, something like this is more likely than the NHL getting their shit together.

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4 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

That’s about what I’d expect from a scum bag like Avery. Sadly, something like this is more likely than the NHL getting their shit together.

 

Never been a fan of Avery but he is not totally wrong. If a guy like Wilson takes out one of your best players then you take out one of their best players. Wilson and the Capitals will get the message. 

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1 hour ago, Commandant said:

It already goes to the NHL Player Assistance fund.

 

And its one day, based on the number of days (not games) per season.

That's really feeble, then. One day, and a meaningless dollar maximum. Presumably NHLPA didn't want any higher fines.

 

Really, it then leaves suspensions as the only option with teeth.

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1 hour ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

Never been a fan of Avery but he is not totally wrong. If a guy like Wilson takes out one of your best players then you take out one of their best players. Wilson and the Capitals will get the message. 

I would lie if I said I didnt want us to go after someone like Krejci after the Chara-Pacioretty incident or going after Lundqvist after Kreiders glidetackle on Price.

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1 hour ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

Never been a fan of Avery but he is not totally wrong. If a guy like Wilson takes out one of your best players then you take out one of their best players. Wilson and the Capitals will get the message. 

 

This is the issue with the DOPS not doing their job.  There are no real good deterrents to a guy like Wilson if the league isn't effective at bringing deterrance.  It makes teams take things into their own hands.  And then we get an eye for an eye justice that never ends.   The Rangers go after Backstrom tonight, The Capitals then go after Zibanejad, the Rangers go after Ovechkin, etc... etc....

 

No one wins and the league is worse off as more stars get hurt. 

 

Its so short sighted by the NHL to handle discipline this way. 

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Sorry, got little empathy for any of them.

Players union goes along with it, owners are businessmen and $$ drives alot, union has a member on committee from what very little i know, so is up to both parties to agree on how is dealt with.

Are lots of more hazardous jobs than being part of the entertainment industry for all of 5-10years for most NHLers. 

 

 

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22 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

This is the issue with the DOPS not doing their job.  There are no real good deterrents to a guy like Wilson if the league isn't effective at bringing deterrance.  It makes teams take things into their own hands.  And then we get an eye for an eye justice that never ends.   The Rangers go after Backstrom tonight, The Capitals then go after Zibanejad, the Rangers go after Ovechkin, etc... etc....

 

No one wins and the league is worse off as more stars get hurt. 

 

Its so short sighted by the NHL to handle discipline this way. 

 

Agree, thought it was always sort of an unwritten rule\code that tough guys didn't go after  star players. Once the code is broken then either the team takes matters into their own hands or the league better do something. The league did nothing here and totally dropped the ball so if the Rangers do nothing then they will look like a bunch of pushovers. 

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Rangers fire President John Davidson and GM Jeff Gorton.  Chris Drury named Pres and GM

Apparently, according to Freidmann and Seravelli, owner James Dolan wrote yesterday's statement from the team and JD and Gorton disagreed with it.  That was enough to fire them.  They were already on thin ice from missing the playoffs (even though I personally think they've done a good job on that rebuild).

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