Chaotic Scene As Shots Fired At Montreal College Cbc

[Jean]

From CBC

Hundreds of officers surrounded the building in downtown Montreal, cordoning off a park facing the school, as well as the Alexis Nihon Plaza, a nearby shopping centre.

Shit! I was in Alexis Nihon less than one hour before the event.

[JLP]

Yeah for those outside Montréal this is pretty well the old (English) downtown area, the old Forum is as few hundred meters from the campus. Dawson is the biggest English-language CEGEP in Quebec has both pre-university and vocational streams, most students are 17 to 20 years old.

Terrible thing to happen, fu*king guns...

[Jean]

I really wonder what's the motive of the guy that did this. For now tough all we can do is speculate.

[markierung]

sad stuff,

it could have been my skool

this is one of those ######s with no girlfriend, job or friends and blame the rest of society for their problems

[Jean]

Man who loved guns, hated people

Web diary on Goths website, photos show insight

Sep. 14, 2006. 02:43 AM

PHINJO GOMBU

STAFF REPORTER

The last online posting by Kimveer Gill on a website that is a popular gathering place for Goths is eerily time-stamped 10:41 a.m. yesterday — about two hours before Gill was shot dead by Montreal police officers at Dawson College.

In it, Gill describes little of how the events of the day are going to unfold — instead focusing on how whiskey tastes so good in the morning. There's a throwaway footnote that when he calls people "niggahs" in my journals ... it doesn't have to do anything with their skin colour.

"I call white people niggahs too, it's just fun," he writes.

But in a detailed user profile, asked how he wants to die, he wrote in prescient foreshadowing of yesterday's bloody events in Montreal: "Like Romeo and Juliet — or in a hail of gunfire."

The website http://www.vampirefreaks.com, which the Star found last night, reveals Gill as a lonely, conflicted, self-described 25-year-old Goth freak from Montreal who hated authority figures like police, principals and teachers and singled out "jocks" for high school bullying.

On the website's welcoming home page is a picture of the Laval resident, his eyes, shaded by his hands, staring intently into the camera.

Other pictures on another website show him wearing a black trench coat, holding a semi-automatic rifle with the caption "Ready for action," beneath it.

Other online postings showed that Gill, who described Natural Born Killers, as his favourite movie, was a fan of the Tec-9 semi-automatic handgun, lamenting that it was not legal in Canada.

Writing in the third person, Gill described himself to fellow Goths as someone "you will come to know as Trench," a chilling reference that was cited again and again by witnesses who described the man that shot at them yesterday.

"He is male. He is 25 years of age. He lives in Quebec. He finds that it is an okay place to live. He is not a people person. He has met a handful of people in his life who are decent.

But he finds the vast majority to be worthless, no good, conniving, betraying, lieing (sic), deceptive, mother-------.

"Work sucks ... school sucks ... life sucks ... what else can I say?

"Metal and Goth kick ass. Life is a video game, you've got to die sometime.''

A cached version of the webpage shows a tombstone with the name "Kimveer'' on it.

Below his name is the epitaph that goes: "Lived fast died young. Left a mangled corpse.''

In a detailed user profile that usually accompanies the web pages of various members, Gill revealed that he was born on July 9, 1981 in Montreal of Indian heritage with a weakness for laziness and a fear of nothing.

His goal for this year was to stay alive with a self-deprecating dig at his most overused phrase on instant messenger being "Heavy Metal Rulez."

He said he goes to bed whenever he's tired and his first thought upon waking is that he's tired, although he doesn't care much for coffee.

He wrote that he misses being young, hadn't gone out for a date in a month, wore combat boots that day and loved being covered in black clothing.

Gill's web handle, or the name by which he was known to other users of the website, is Fatality666.

A quick perusal of Gill's online diary shows that just hours before he posted his final entry, he was revealing very little of what he was going to be doing within the next hours to come.

At 3.33 a.m., he writes: "As you can tell, I got nothing of importrance (sic) to write about today. Poor me."

And then he goes on to describe his mundane pleasures such as eating freezies and flirting with girls — asking them if they are feeling down and want to play with him.

He expresses frustration at having to wait for his contact lenses to dry.

On Tuesday, a day earlier, at 5 a.m. Gill launched a tirade against authority figures.

"It's not only the bullies fault, but the principal's fault for turning a blind eye ... it's the police's fault for not doing anything when people complain (ooooops) my mistake, the cops are corrupt sons of whores, so it's not like they can do anything about it. F--- the police.

Gill then added that he was disgusted at society, which allowed people to behave like "assholes" to each other.

"Society disgusts me," he wrote.

Clearly Gill wasn't getting much sleep because only four hours earlier at 12.56 a.m., he posted the stark message: "F--- people, F--- Life."

His blog also reveals that Gill was a fan of the video game series Postal, a controversial and violent program in which the goal is to endure slights and insults without going beserk.

The killer

He look a bit too happy for someone who's going to die..

[Pierre the Great]

He played Columbine type video games:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14818183/

[jetsniper]

Oh geez, now Jack Thompson has more fuel for his anti-video games crusade.

Dammit.

[KoZed]

This saddens me as much as it angers me. Hard not to turn it into something political, but everything social is also political. You can't deny that.

The NRA or any guns-advocating person can kiss my ass. Guns are mass-murdering machines.

How about a ######ing pens-advocating group? You're a ######ed up teen? Pick up a ######ing pen and write, draw, do something ######ing creative.

I,m so ######ing stirred by all this right now...

[Pierre the Great]

Exactly Kozed, I think Duceppe said it best yesterday about the gun registry for example. He said I forget the exact quote but it was like "We register everyones car, we can't imagine what it would be like if we didn't do that. Guns are the same no matter what the cost registering guns make sense."

He said something like that I completely agree with him. We register everything else in the world why is there a push not to have guns registered?

And then these guns this creep liked were illegal. When are the politicians of Canada going to start to crack down on illegal gun trade?

Hasn't Canada seen enough blood shed on her streets to see that illegal guns from the US are a problem?

I think politicians are finally getting the message. I thought they'd get it after the boxing day shooting but now if they don't do anything they will seem distant and not caring for the people that elected them.

End of speech.

Hope the 5 remaining 'very critical' make it through.

Edited September 14, 2006 by Pierre the Great

[Psycing]

sad stuff,

it could have been my skool

this is one of those ######s with no girlfriend, job or friends and blame the rest of society for their problems

Yet it is society and words/views/thoughts such as these very words that provide the fuel for the fire that burns inside these troubled people's minds.

I am not defending him though, but there is a lesson to be learned here. We can learn from this and try to make the world a more welcoming place for people, people who have been pushed aside and shown no compassion.

Is it wrong to feel angry, sad, and very upset over yesterday’s occurrences? No. But is it right to jump-start the cycle again and start labeling people as "one of those _____________"? [fill in the blank as you see fit.] Definitely not.

Things have to be done, as horrific as each one of these events are, they can also be considered somewhat of a wake-up call. Something has to be done. Is it realistic to think that we can reach out to everyone and help them? Not really. However, we can try, and we can do our best. That alone can reduce the chances of a sequel.

It comes down to one of those "How many more times before we do something about it" statements. People, our society in general, has grown and developed a ignorance habit, a "let someone else deal with it" philosophy really. Too many people are too busy worrying about their own agendas to turn and help someone maybe mere feet away from them.

In my opinion, this is not just a case of one of those people looking to get revenge, but one of a much larger magnitude. A case that involves each and every one of us. Every single person has to look into themselves and decide what it is they can do to make sure something like this never happens again.

Some people truthfully can't be helped, but you cannot just assume it and move on. You have to try. I'm not saying go out and attempt to help every individual you come across that you'd consider "troubled". Just simply do all in your power to treat everyone around you with the respect they deserve.

Anyway, I'm done ranting for now.

[Pierre the Great]

I can relate to this guy. I was bullied throughout my years in school. I'd fight back every once in a while because I couldn't take it anymore from them.

But I decided early on to find a passion and keep to it so one day I could show them that PTG is all grown up so to speak. That passion was politics.

Then instead of being angry at the world and wanting to kill people I decided I'd get my revenge by trying to change it. Been fighting ever since.

Troubled minds should not have access to guns. Its like an alcoholic with alcohol. Bad things happen.

Parents, teachers, students and everyone need to be taught how to see the warning signs so that you can tell the difference in someones personality between experimenting in life vs. a calling for help.

[jetsniper]

Exactly Kozed, I think Duceppe said it best yesterday about the gun registry for example. He said I forget the exact quote but it was like "We register everyones car, we can't imagine what it would be like if we didn't do that. Guns are the same no matter what the cost registering guns make sense."

He said something like that I completely agree with him. We register everything else in the world why is there a push not to have guns registered?

And then these guns this creep liked were illegal. When are the politicians of Canada going to start to crack down on illegal gun trade?

Hasn't Canada seen enough blood shed on her streets to see that illegal guns from the US are a problem?

I think politicians are finally getting the message. I thought they'd get it after the boxing day shooting but now if they don't do anything they will seem distant and not caring for the people that elected them.

End of speech.

Hope the 5 remaining 'very critical' make it through.

Something has to be coming because even without this tragedy, the crime rates are up. Just last week, Edmonton had three homicides within 24 hours. Calgary is starting to becoming gang central. A man was shot in a local eatery last week just because he was in an opposing gang. I think it was 2 weeks ago, a body is dumped from a moving car into a busy street at 10:30 in the morning downtown.

And I had people in Grade 11 bragging to me about how he could get all these illegal guns downtown if he wanted to. Is that something a 16/17 year old should be bragging about? Not at all. There has to be some kind of movement in general from way up top to stop the rising crime in Canada and to prevent these kinds of tragedies.

I'm all for gun-registry, it only makes sense.

[KoZed]

Completely agree with you Maca. Without defending what he did, you've got to aknowledge that some people get pushed so far and often, once they decide to push back it is radical.

Of course, some people might be lost causes. In which case, we've at least have to make it impossible for them to unleash. Guns shouldnt be available for anyone but policemen and military, its as simple as that. No country can called itself civilized when innocent citizens can be shot down by fellow citizens. End of the story.

I can relate to this guy. I was bullied throughout my years in school. I'd fight back every once in a while because I couldn't take it anymore from them.

Finding passions is the solution to almost everything destructive. Eros is the solution to Thanatos. As simple as that.

Teach, no, FORCE the kids to express themselves in something creative, whatever it might be.

[Fanpuck33]

I'm all for registering guns and everything, but don't kid yourself that it will solve all gun problems. If crazy people and criminals want guns, they will find a way to get them. Underground sellers. The black market. Gun registry is great, but 99% of the people who register their guns are not using them for illegal activities.

[Pierre the Great]

Another way to go is to put in the gun control a provision that bans anyone with any type of criminal past from owning a gun or operating one.

Believe it or not down here we have an example of a criminal owning guns after getting out and committing crimes. "The Capitol Hill Massacre" in Seattle was just that. The guy was from Montana who had a checkered past with guns and crime. But since Montana has more looser gun policies he was allowed to get his guns back.

They have a three strikes law for drunk driving where you could end up in life prison and loose the right to ever drive again, why not do that for guns

[Psycing]

Completely agree with you Maca. Without defending what he did, you've got to aknowledge that some people get pushed so far and often, once they decide to push back it is radical.

Of course, some people might be lost causes. In which case, we've at least have to make it impossible for them to unleash. Guns shouldnt be available for anyone but policemen and military, its as simple as that. No country can called itself civilized when innocent citizens can be shot down by fellow citizens. End of the story.

Yea, can't disagree there either, was sort of in my mind but not expressed by my post. I'm in Psychology and such, and I understand that there are actually people out there that are impossible to help, which makes things difficult. As a whole though, we must work together to make sure that they are either being watched in some form, or the means for devastation are not available.

[sakiqc]

Yet it is society and words/views/thoughts such as these very words that provide the fuel for the fire that burns inside these troubled people's minds.

I am not defending him though, but there is a lesson to be learned here. We can learn from this and try to make the world a more welcoming place for people, people who have been pushed aside and shown no compassion.

Is it wrong to feel angry, sad, and very upset over yesterday’s occurrences? No. But is it right to jump-start the cycle again and start labeling people as "one of those _____________"? [fill in the blank as you see fit.] Definitely not.

Things have to be done, as horrific as each one of these events are, they can also be considered somewhat of a wake-up call. Something has to be done. Is it realistic to think that we can reach out to everyone and help them? Not really. However, we can try, and we can do our best. That alone can reduce the chances of a sequel.

It comes down to one of those "How many more times before we do something about it" statements. People, our society in general, has grown and developed a ignorance habit, a "let someone else deal with it" philosophy really. Too many people are too busy worrying about their own agendas to turn and help someone maybe mere feet away from them.

In my opinion, this is not just a case of one of those people looking to get revenge, but one of a much larger magnitude. A case that involves each and every one of us. Every single person has to look into themselves and decide what it is they can do to make sure something like this never happens again.

Some people truthfully can't be helped, but you cannot just assume it and move on. You have to try. I'm not saying go out and attempt to help every individual you come across that you'd consider "troubled". Just simply do all in your power to treat everyone around you with the respect they deserve.

Anyway, I'm done ranting for now.

Excellent post

[Pierre the Great]

I'm all for registering guns and everything, but don't kid yourself that it will solve all gun problems. If crazy people and criminals want guns, they will find a way to get them. Underground sellers. The black market. Gun registry is great, but 99% of the people who register their guns are not using them for illegal activities.

Yes fanpuck. Canada's problem is illegal gun trade from the US. The politicians haven't wanted to really crack down on that trade or do the steps necessary.

Bottom line we need to be vigilant about these problems. The problem I see is that some politicians aren't listening. How many people are going to have to die before some in Ottawa and Washington get there heads out of the clouds.

[simonus]

I'm all for registering guns and everything, but don't kid yourself that it will solve all gun problems. If crazy people and criminals want guns, they will find a way to get them. Underground sellers. The black market. Gun registry is great, but 99% of the people who register their guns are not using them for illegal activities.

i think much of the idea of the registry is that many of the guns that are on the black market started in the conventional market (and then was stolen or sold to those who could otherwise not buy their own). If you have a better idea where the gun started, you can track it more easily. You can find gun dealers and more easily prosecute those who have guns registered in other names, etc...

Of course it's not perfect... but it is a rare and usually trivial law whose efficacy is 100%...

[Pierre the Great]

Exactly Simonus, gun registry is mainly a tracking device. Its like registering a vehicle. You register it and it gets stolen. An hour later the person that stole gets pulled over and arrested for driving a car that is not in there name or was reported stolen.

[sakiqc]

I'm all for registering guns and everything, but don't kid yourself that it will solve all gun problems. If crazy people and criminals want guns, they will find a way to get them. Underground sellers. The black market. Gun registry is great, but 99% of the people who register their guns are not using them for illegal activities.

I'm thinking the same. The gun registry is a GREAT thing, but this massacre doesn't have anything to do with the presence of a registry or not. You CAN'T register this gun. It's illegal to have a gun like this in your possession, registry or not! Those guns shouldn't exist outside the military camps! To use yesterday's shooting as a tool to promote the gun registry would be not looking at the real problem. We have some serious problems here in Quebec. Yesterday was another suicide case. Quebec has one of the highest suicide-rate in the world. And yet we do little about it. Now what if those suicide candidates decide to leave this world and take people with them like yesterday? Would we look more at the problem?

[Fanpuck33]

I see your guys' point, but a lot of the times, crimes are committed with the stolen guns before they can be tracked down. In that sort of case, the gun registry didn't really help anything.

I'm not saying gun registry is a bad thing or that it doesn't help anything. I'm just saying it wouldn't solve everything.

I'm thinking the same. The gun registry is a GREAT thing, but this massacre doesn't have anything to do with the presence of a registry or not. You CAN'T register this gun. It's illegal to have a gun like this in your possession, registry or not! Those guns shouldn't exist outside the military camps! To use yesterday's shooting as a tool to promote the gun registry would be not looking at the real problem. We have some serious problems here in Quebec. Yesterday was another suicide case. Quebec has one of the highest suicide-rate in the world. And yet we do little about it. Now what if those suicide candidates decide to leave this world and take people with them like yesterday? Would we look more at the problem?

Well put. You said almost exactly what I was trying to say, you did a much better job of it than I did.

He played Columbine type video games:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14818183/

Holy crap! What kind of sick person makes a Columbine video game?

[Pierre the Great]

Remember Gun Registry is only the first step. Crack down on illegal guns is the bigger elephant in the room that no one seems to want to take on.

Holy crap! What kind of sick person makes a Columbine video game?

A person who's mentally disturbed.

We have some serious problems here in Quebec. Yesterday was another suicide case. Quebec has one of the highest suicide-rate in the world. And yet we do little about it. Now what if those suicide candidates decide to leave this world and take people with them like yesterday? Would we look more at the problem?

We won't look at the problem until we as a society realize what we are doing wrong. You can only help people who want to help themselves. In this case these incidents will continue to happen until society realizes that the society as a whole has a problem. Think of any situation in life. You don't fix the problem until you combat the issue but first tell yourself "I have a problem" then you'll seek help.

I've been drilled before and probly again for my beliefs on these issues. I'm more preventive instead of authoritarian when it comes to these issues. But in reality we have to do both. The conservative view is that jail will fix everything. The liberal view is that these people are just lost. But the real solution is a mix of both.

There's a bible verse somewhere that explains what I'm talking about. Can't think of it but I hope people get what I'm saying.

[huzer]

All I can say about the whole thing is one big sigh. I'll even just explicitly tackle the issue of assault rifles. They have absolutely, positively no place in non military/police operations and should not be available to the public. But what's a good example? My old roommate. Religiously went to gun shows. Owns several AK-47s (complete with the drums that hold however many 100 rounds), other assault rifles, WWII rifles, sniper guns, etc. When you went to the gun show, they'd run a cursory background check, and sell you the weapon(s) of your choice. No registration needed. So here they are, assault rifles, being sold legally at those traveling gun shows, and you can just plop down your money and walk away with it. Sweet.

Anyway, I hope for the best for everyone back east. Tis a sad, sad day.

[CoRvInA]

Keep safe guys and Gals! Love ya all!