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2014-15 Scoring Predictions


dlbalr

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Gorges brought unity to the dressing room, he took care of Gallagher and look how well he turned out.

Gorges was a positive player that played his heart out with limited offensive talent, he bruised red, white, and blue every time he played a shift.

Too bad, we had no room for his contract and for his shot blocking abilities but the HABS need to move on.

Good luck to him with his other endeavours.

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Gorges brought unity to the dressing room, he took care of Gallagher and look how well he turned out.

Gorges was a positive player that played his heart out with limited offensive talent, he bruised red, white, and blue every time he played a shift.

Too bad, we had no room for his contract and for his shot blocking abilities but the HABS need to move on.

Good luck to him with his other endeavours.

Yeah, i think I agree with this. Time will tell. I don't understand the Gorges hate from some people... he is one of the top defensive d-men in the league, and his attitude and work ethic are better than anybody. (Also, to repeat Don's statistic - 29 turnovers all year. That's actually extremely low.) However, he didn't bring anything else to the game. Offensively he was a liability. His "advanced stats" (which I don't read much into) were quite poor. Honestly, that's pretty much exactly what we're getting this year with Mike Weaver - only he's not quite as effective at the things he and Gorges both do well, and slightly worse at turnovers and the like. However, the big difference is cost - Gorges was 4 million a year. Weaver is 1.5 million. Building a team is no longer about putting the best player in every role. You can improve a team by replacing (A) with another player who's only 80% of (A), but who frees up 3 million in salary that you use to get another guy who's far better in another position with what we already had. It's a balancing act. In the end, Gorges was replaceable with acceptable losses in capability, while freeing up 2.5 million dollars in salary to improve the team elsewhere.

I don't like it. But right now, I don't think it was a bad move.

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It's difficult to turn over the puck when you never have it. Subban has 83 giveaways. Doughty and Markov have 82. Why? They have the puck a lot.

It'd be like blaming a guy like Pacioretty for missing the net a lot. He takes a lot of shots. Lots are gonna miss. They all can't be scoring chances.

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It's difficult to turn over the puck when you never have it. Subban has 83 giveaways. Doughty and Markov have 82. Why? They have the puck a lot.

It'd be like blaming a guy like Pacioretty for missing the net a lot. He takes a lot of shots. Lots are gonna miss. They all can't be scoring chances.

Very true, to use a baseball tid bit, the home run leader is often the strike out king as well. Cause they swing more and don't look for walks.

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I never understood all of the Gorges' love. He contributed nothing to the offense. Every time he had the puck at the point, he dumped the puck into the same corner. Every damned time!!!

He averaged .18 points per game not nearly enough for a top-4 defensemen. Unlike Emelin, or even Murray, he didn't bring a physical element.

For those who care about fancy stats, he was no prized pig there either. He was a loser, but he was "our loser." That's the extent of the logic behind the Gorges' Craze. He was white bread. To think that some wanted that wet noodle to be the Captain...

right?! I never had any use for jg..I think don was supposed to write that jg had 29 turnovers per month. top defensive defensemen in the league my ass. wet-noodle is perfect!
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Yeah, i think I agree with this. Time will tell. I don't understand the Gorges hate from some people... he is one of the top defensive d-men in the league, and his attitude and work ethic are better than anybody. (Also, to repeat Don's statistic - 29 turnovers all year. That's actually extremely low.) However, he didn't bring anything else to the game. Offensively he was a liability. His "advanced stats" (which I don't read much into) were quite poor. Honestly, that's pretty much exactly what we're getting this year with Mike Weaver - only he's not quite as effective at the things he and Gorges both do well, and slightly worse at turnovers and the like. However, the big difference is cost - Gorges was 4 million a year. Weaver is 1.5 million. Building a team is no longer about putting the best player in every role. You can improve a team by replacing (A) with another player who's only 80% of (A), but who frees up 3 million in salary that you use to get another guy who's far better in another position with what we already had. It's a balancing act. In the end, Gorges was replaceable with acceptable losses in capability, while freeing up 2.5 million dollars in salary to improve the team elsewhere.

I don't like it. But right now, I don't think it was a bad move.

I fear that teams like the HABS are not exactly interested in suiting up their best players on the ice every game, but firstly manage the cap, sign their players as cheaply as possible for the longest period of time.

I fear that Beaulieu will be given garbage ice time to lower his stats so the HABS will sign him on the cheap, I hope that Chucky doesn't get the same treatment.

BTW, I read somewhere that Patrick Sharp could be on the trading block due b/c Chicago is over by 2.5M....hmmm

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After Sharp's lazy play along the boards to help the Kings eliminate the Hawks last playoffs, no way I'd be sending much that even looks like Plekanec to Chicago for Sharp....

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After Sharp's lazy play along the boards to help the Kings eliminate the Hawks last playoffs, no way I'd be sending much that even looks like Plekanec to Chicago for Sharp....

Don't think the hawks are in the market for a Center anyway with the Richards signing

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I fear that teams like the HABS are not exactly interested in suiting up their best players on the ice every game, but firstly manage the cap, sign their players as cheaply as possible for the longest period of time.

I fear that Beaulieu will be given garbage ice time to lower his stats so the HABS will sign him on the cheap, I hope that Chucky doesn't get the same treatment.

This theory is just plain wrong in my opinion. Sorry but coaches do whatever they can to get wins. No way a coach risks losing to keep contracts down.
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"This theory is just plain wrong in my opinion. Sorry but coaches do whatever they can to get wins. No way a coach risks losing to keep contracts down."

Correct you are. Coaches know they are going to get fired, they just don't like to hurry the process along. The genius does these things cause he thinks he is right, not because of what the player is making. He could care less about that.

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I must say I'm a bit surprised with the optimistic projections for Weise. I can't see him getting more than spot time off the fourth line, it's extremely rare for primarily fourth liners to be pushing 25+ points. We don't even have a FF piece planned for him, he's going to get lumped in with the rest of the depth guys.

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I must say I'm a bit surprised with the optimistic projections for Weise. I can't see him getting more than spot time off the fourth line, it's extremely rare for primarily fourth liners to be pushing 25+ points. We don't even have a FF piece planned for him, he's going to get lumped in with the rest of the depth guys.

100% agree. His playoff should not predict his season. I think he will give it all and be exactly what we've wanted from a forth liner, but he's just that. A forth liner. 10 goals 7 assists.

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This theory is just plain wrong in my opinion. Sorry but coaches do whatever they can to get wins. No way a coach risks losing to keep contracts down.

Can you explain why Bouillon and Murray were geting ice time....Sorry, but Beaulieu didn't just become talented by the playoffs, how come Tinordi who played well the year before wasn't played.....

How about Gionta on the PP, too funny. There were more deserving players than him that could have increased their stats (but wpuld have cost more to sign later)...

Chucky too is being "brought up" slowly....the kid is a gamer, watch how everything slows down when he's on the ice yet didn't get PP time...

Anyways just saying,

I agree that coaches have to keep their jobs by winning, making it into the playoffs assures that, job done.

Would you not do the same in order to keep players long term, I would?

Risk losing...or win moderately with your "trusted" signed players...

Edited by bigbigbear
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I must say I'm a bit surprised with the optimistic projections for Weise. I can't see him getting more than spot time off the fourth line, it's extremely rare for primarily fourth liners to be pushing 25+ points. We don't even have a FF piece planned for him, he's going to get lumped in with the rest of the depth guys.

I think I agree with the conclusion, but I'm not sure I agree with the premise. On most other teams, I think Weise would make a decent third liner, in a traditional sense -- a main offensive line, a secondary offensive line, a third line with defensive, physical players, and a fourth line of spares/goons.

The Habs don't roll that way. We run 3 solid but not spectacular offensively capable lines, and one defensive-only checking line.

On the Habs, Weise fits into that fourth defensive-only line. He'd be wasted as a spare 4th liner on another team (the way Torts was misusing him in Vancouver.) Weise is defensively responsible, physically imposing, but most importantly, he's blazingly fast on his skates. He doesn't have a great shot, or soft hands, or even much passing precision, but he can be effective offensively because his speed is so incredible. He was the fastest skating forward in Vancouver by a longshot, and he might be in Montreal as well (we'll have to wait until the skills competitions to find out), and we can convert that into occasional offense, but I don't see him hitting much more than 20 points. I'd say Meller93's 10 goal prediction is reachable, if generous, but it's Weise's speed that will get him there, if he does. The kid (yeah, he's the same age as Subban and Pacioretty) also works like a dog, and is genuinely elated to be playing in Montreal. He's probably my favorite "fourth-liner" in the league, but he's not an offensive force.

His offensive numbers will also be crippled by his likely use on the penalty kill, although I wouldn't be surprised to see a shorthanded goal or two out of him this year - speed on your defenders makes that a constant threat.

Can you explain why Bouillon and Murray were geting ice time....Sorry, but Beaulieu didn't just become talented by the playoffs, how come Tinordi who played well the year before wasn't played.....

Beaulieu wasn't talented in the playoffs, either. He's a nightmare waiting to happen every time he's on the ice. If winning were my only goal, I'd put Bouillon on the ice before Beaulieu right now, any shift. Beaulieu obviously has more potential, but he's going to have to grow a brain cell or two before that happens.

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I must say I'm a bit surprised with the optimistic projections for Weise. I can't see him getting more than spot time off the fourth line, it's extremely rare for primarily fourth liners to be pushing 25+ points. We don't even have a FF piece planned for him, he's going to get lumped in with the rest of the depth guys.

If you combine his totals from the playoffs/Vancouver/Montreal he had 9/14/23 in 77 games.

He's the type of player we should be giving every opportunity to, he's fast, he hits and he fights. I'd like to see what he can do with Bourque and Eller. That line needs someone to go to the net and in the corners.

His stats in the Dutch league weren't too shabby either!

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If you combine his totals from the playoffs/Vancouver/Montreal he had 9/14/23 in 77 games.

He's the type of player we should be giving every opportunity to, he's fast, he hits and he fights. I'd like to see what he can do with Bourque and Eller. That line needs someone to go to the net and in the corners.

His stats in the Dutch league weren't too shabby either!

He was a freaking legend in the Dutch league hahah

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I probably would have boycotted the Habs had Gorges been C. Dude knew he was one dimensional and tried tooooo hard to sound like a leader when answering Q?s. I thought sometimes he might collapse from a brain aneurism for forcing too hard to sound savy. Hal Gill was 200% the leader Gorges was and said 250% less jargon. I found him fake and slightly unbearable. 29 turnovers? Too bad they don't count dumping the puck from zone to zone without an icing as a turnover which essentially it is. More just a straight give away. Dude was the dump king. No looking, no second thought options. Change of possession master. Nobody will miss him. And Bergy's 2nd rd pick in return was a STEAL imo. I'd have rather had Cody Franson, though.

Weise will bounce from 3rd & 4th lines. Calling him a pure 4th liner is like saying Bork will dress 82 games.

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Weise will bounce from 3rd & 4th lines. Calling him a pure 4th liner is like saying Bork will dress 82 games.

Fair enough, although I feel much better with him in our 4th line than 3rd line. I agree that he's capable if some third line minutes, but it gives me a sense that the team has good depth when he is a forth liner.

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Weise still has a chip on his shoulder from how his career was held back by Torts. He looked a lot better for us than people expected because he was free from the guy who twice coached him into healthy scratch territory. He's not a bad choice to predict for inflated bottom six numbers.

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"This theory is just plain wrong in my opinion. Sorry but coaches do whatever they can to get wins. No way a coach risks losing to keep contracts down."

Correct you are. Coaches know they are going to get fired, they just don't like to hurry the process along. The genius does these things cause he thinks he is right, not because of what the player is making. He could care less about that.

Come on, NHL coaches know the players they're going to have for a few years, you mean to tell me Subban signed for 8 years won't be on the PK once in while...I'd say more than last year that's for sure, and for the next 4-5 years.

The "defensive liabilty" argument could have been brought up and put into question.during the contract negotiations.

As for Therrien, he's "has to care more about" developing his players long term in order to keep coaching hockey...If he put his "best" players on all the time, how does he get rid of the ones that he does not see providing him with the tools to win games in the future if the team cannot trade them for fair or greater value or improve and nurture the younger ones to provide the coach with more options.

Did you see Chucky on the PP, Eller? Nope, but we saw Gionta,

If the coach wants to be effective and have a long career with the same team in 2014, he should be coaching and acting like a GM.

I'd rather be the "Bill Bellichick" of hockey than the "Mario Tremblay" of hockey.

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Fair enough, although I feel much better with him in our 4th line than 3rd line. I agree that he's capable if some third line minutes, but it gives me a sense that the team has good depth when he is a forth liner.

Completely agree.

Weise still has a chip on his shoulder from how his career was held back by Torts. He looked a lot better for us than people expected because he was free from the guy who twice coached him into healthy scratch territory. He's not a bad choice to predict for inflated bottom six numbers.

Torts didn't just scratch him.. he rode him and humiliated him like a rotten step father. Im happy for Weise, and he's on his fav team. Karma.

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I think of Russ Courtnall when I think of Weise. Couldn't score if his life depended on it, but frequently terrorized defenders by streaking past and going on goalies alone. If nothing else he kept the defenseman honest and when he did score it was huge. That is how I invision Weise.

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Did you see Chucky on the PP, Eller? Nope, but we saw Gionta,

PP TOI per game last year:

Galchenyuk: 2:02 (fourth highest among full-season Montreal forwards)

Eller: 1:06

Gionta: 1:25

Gionta getting 19 seconds per game more than Eller isn't that bad, especially when you consider that Eller had two goals in the final four months of the season and really should have been seeing even less time on the PP.

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I think of Russ Courtnall when I think of Weise. Couldn't score if his life depended on it, but frequently terrorized defenders by streaking past and going on goalies alone. If nothing else he kept the defenseman honest and when he did score it was huge. That is how I invision Weise.

I don't think you and I remember the same Russ Courtnall.

1986 - 22 goals

1987 - 29 goals

1988 - 23 goals

1989 - 23 goals

1990 - 27 goals

1991 - 26 goals

1993 - 36 goals

1994 - 23 goals

1996 - 26 goals

At only 5'11", 175 lbs, and a career 65 points, 20+ goals per season guy, Courtnall and Weise have very little in common.

Don't get me wrong, I love Weise, but apart from being ridiculously fast, they don't have much in common.

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