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The Official Habs Panic Thread


hab29RETIRED

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I think that the coaching staff really needs to make adjustments to the special teams (which were actually what was the biggest strength at the start of the year).

Biggest problem with the habs is that they have not adjusted while their opposition has. Montreal's powerplay was awesome at the start, but teams adjusted to their game plan. The coaching staff has done nothing to adjust to the oppostions adjustmetns.

Carbo also has done a lousy job on line combos. As i've said before, the koivu line for the past month has looked worse then a Don Cherry suit!!!!

Why Koivu has not been used with samsanov is a bigger mystery then the caramilk secret.

The way Carbo is treating Perozhogin, he is eventually going to get dumped to another team and probably will join the long list of habs castoffs that excels elsewhere. Why are the habs so patient with Ryder and not Perozhogin and Samsonov??? Ryder should have at least 35 goals by know with the chances he's had. But the guy is NOT s sniper (but management seems to think so). I don't remember Brett Hull shooting at the goalie's crest on most of his shots, like Ryder does. Higgens has been struggling, but has worked much harder then Ryder. Why the hell is he not on the first PP unit???

I think up front the habs should try Higgens-Koivu-Sammy (assuming he doesn't get picked up), and Latendresse-Plekcanak-Perozhogin on the second unit.

What about Kovolev???

While Markov is hurt, the habs should try playing Kovolev and Souray on the point on the PP - yes they would both be about as effective as pylons if they gave up the puck, but give the habs two options at the point and the opposition can't key on Souray then. It would also open things up for the play down low. They should put Higgens and Latendresse in front of the net (the way the Canes had their butts in Aebishars face last night.

I really hope that if Sammy is unclaimed, he will get a shot to succeed. It's the coaching staff job, to help players succeed and i don't think they have done a very good job of that. Sammy and Kovy don't look to have any chemistry, so why was every configuration they tried early just revolved around putting someone else between them. Although one intriguing configuration would be Sammy-Koivu-Kovolev, but it probably would not be a good idea to have three playmakers together.

Anyway, I really belive that habs NEED Sammy to do well, more then sammy himself needs to do well (after all, at the end of the day, he is still going to be getting paid). The Habs have a hard time attracting free agents as it is, after they way samsonov has been treated, good luck on getting someone else to play in montreal!!!

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I agree with practically everything you've written here. The coach's ego HAS to take a back seat to developing the players at hand. Otherwise we're back to Mario Tremblay. End of story.

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Don't want to jump all over Carbo. Cuz when we were winning he was a Jack Addams canadate. But The lines need to be fixed. We have our number one center playing with a defenseman and a defensive forward. Why wasn't a Koivu, Kovi, Sammy line even experimented with? It couldn't possibly have hurt to try if only for a few games? Everyone else on the team was given a chance on the top line except for Sammy. I just don't get it.

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I agree with practically everything you've written here. The coach's ego HAS to take a back seat to developing the players at hand. Otherwise we're back to Mario Tremblay. End of story.

also agreed. But I doubt it'll happen. I think we've seen the last of Sammy in mtl...

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Biggest problem with the habs is that they have not adjusted while their opposition has.

I'll agree with that point and disagree with it at the same time. Their biggest problem is that they rely too much on their power play to provide offence, and teams have adjusted to that. The opposition know going into the game that the more 5-on-5 they play, the better their chance to win the game. The Habs have yet to improve their 5-on-5 game, and that's where they're losing games. There's a lot of guys underperforming or not performing at all, and nobody's stepping up on the ice (aside from Plekanec who's been on fire the past few weeks) and doing that little extra to try and create goals. No crashing the net. No fighting through checks. No battles along the boards. They all know what the problem is. They know what will fix the problem. It's just that they're waiting for someone else to take the lead. And lately, it's usually the opposing team.

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I agree with practically everything you've written here. The coach's ego HAS to take a back seat to developing the players at hand. Otherwise we're back to Mario Tremblay. End of story.

I have to take issue with this. I don't think this has anything to do with Carbonneau's ego.

We had two new arrivals when the season started, who both underperformed. One guy was scratched more often than not, never said a word. The other guy was scratched twice. The first time, he questioned his role on the team, why he was brought in if he didn't have a role on the team. So he played every game after that until recently, when he was scratched again. Then he goes to the GM asks for a trade and gets waived instead. Waivers isn't a coaching decision alone. Maybe Gainey is going to use this as a motivational tool. Nobody wants you know, play out the stretch, pile up some points over the next few weeks and we'll try to trade you at the deadline. If there's no trade then, have a good playoff and we'll see if we can move you during the summer.

There were moves to be made early on concerning line make-up, but it might be too late to do too much of that now. He's played Latendresse all season, and Lapierre is contributing after a mid-season call-up. This isn't about developing Samsonov. He's not a rookie anymore, he's not learning how to play in the league. It's about him learning to play with new teammates, and new teammates adapting to his style of play. It was pretty evident early on that putting he and Kovalev together was an error and a change should have been made much earlier. That was Carbonneau's mistake.

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I have to take issue with this. I don't think this has anything to do with Carbonneau's ego.

We had two new arrivals when the season started, who both underperformed. One guy was scratched more often than not, never said a word. The other guy was scratched twice. The first time, he questioned his role on the team, why he was brought in if he didn't have a role on the team. So he played every game after that until recently, when he was scratched again. Then he goes to the GM asks for a trade and gets waived instead. Waivers isn't a coaching decision alone. Maybe Gainey is going to use this as a motivational tool. Nobody wants you know, play out the stretch, pile up some points over the next few weeks and we'll try to trade you at the deadline. If there's no trade then, have a good playoff and we'll see if we can move you during the summer.

Who's the second guy? If you're talking about Perogie, he's not a newbie, and I bet you that though he hasn't complained publicly he's fed up and doesn't want to be here anymore... Worst than the way Carbo's handled Sammy is the way he's handled Perogie. If he only makes ONE adjustment, I hope Carbo gives Perogie a REGULAR OFFENSIVE SHIFT.

Edited by ShortHanded
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Nice points raised in that which I agree with.

Unfortunately you know it's just frustrating to watch a Canadiens team that just can't take the next step towards becoming a contender - it seems eerily like the teams of the past few years which engaged in dogfights just to get into the playoffs.

Yes, to those who enjoy stating the obvious the Canadiens are 4th right now. But considering that Montreal is only 4 pts out of 9th, they are in a dogfight to make the playoffs. We're just seeing what so many of us were so afraid of seeing before - the special teams and goaltending simply can't win every game.

The team needs more scoring, period. The Canadiens don't have a single consistent scorer unless you count Sheldon Souray, who looks primed for one of the biggest paydays for defenders in recent history.

Not a single one of the supposed top forwards has played well and put the puck in the net consistently. Yes, this includes Kovalev, Ryder, Higgins but also captain Saku Koivu.

Where this will come from remains to be seen. It could come from a rejuvanated Sergei Samsonov fuelled by desire to get out of town (how ironic and how unlikely) Or Gainey's hand may be forced and he will acquire someone...

I don't know about some of you, but I'm tired of hearing how Montreal can't score year in and year out.

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Who's the second guy? If you're talking about Perogie, he's not a newbie, and I bet you that though he hasn't complained publicly he's fed up and doesn't want to be here anymore... Worst than the way Carbo's handled Sammy is the way he's handled Perogie. If he only makes ONE adjustment, I hope Carbo gives Perogie a REGULAR OFFENSIVE SHIFT.

Niinimaa

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i know that to a lot of people, Gainey is beyond reproach. And after the Houle fiasco, Gainey seems like the second coming of sam pollack.

But Samsonov and Ninimma aren't gainey's only mistakes. He does have a history of overpaying for players.

While i've never been a ninnima fan, getting rid of ribeiro is almost worth the salary being paid to ninnima.

but consider the following:

Samsonov signing, while the like's of Sykora were ignored (and i;m not saying this out of hindsight, coz, i was hoping the habs would try and get sykora back when both the Ducks and Rangers were trying to unload him).

Before signing Samsonov, he also went after Arnott, who has never played to his potential for any extended period of time.

Overpaid D-Men Ninnema - yes the habs had injuries to contend with, but i would have preferred a more affordable pickup. Frankly I would have been happy if the habs picked up a 3rd or 4th round pick for Ribeiro.

Picking up Traverse when the team already lacks quality d-men.

signing Theodore to the ridicoulas contract (again, this is not hindsight, as even when the habs beat the bruins in the playoffs despite the big kovolev giveaway, I was actually one of the people hoping the habs would trade theadore after that series for a true impact player up front, I was also hoping back when there were rumours of Atlanta being willing to trade their #1 pick that the habs would unload theadore).

Signing bonk to a big contract when they knew that their was a labour shortage coming.

Going back, to his dallas days, he also was responsible for the expensive signings of AUdette (which he unloaded to montreal when he was a bust), Turgeon, Guerin and there were a few others i can't remember off the top of my mind.

Again, I'm not questioning his hockey sense, coz he does manage to get out of his messes much better then Houle could even dream of, and he also did bring in really good role players like Johnson and streit, and this year bonk has been great (just really overpaid), and he also really got lucky with Huet.

I'm just saying that he has a tendancy to overpay for "upper-echlon" and "mid-echlon" player.

Being the consumate proffesional himself, maybe he just naturally expects the same from the players he signs. anyway, just my two cents.

Edited by hab29RETIRED
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Who said Gainey was perfect? Who can be 100% sure what a player will give to his team, if the players will have chemistry together, those who will get injured, etc.?

Gainey brings a lot to this team. Credibilty, stability, he is a true Habs and he brings honor to the team and keeps the spirit of the tradition and history. Who else would have been a better fit than him as a GM? I think he was and is the best candidate, and he's doing great. Fans, media, and I'm sure players, respect him.

You seem to have kept tracks of everything Gainey did. Why not also writing his great decisions, trades, signings?

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Last summer, taking Sammy over Sykora (regardless of money, let's say) was the best move to do according ... 100% of hockey knowledgeable people... Sykora's 2005-2006 season was as distrous as Sammy's current season.

stop using "insight" to bitch management, use perspective too.

Fact is, Sammy was the best UFA left after Shanny, we took him cause we were lacking scoring. Sammy failed... Gainey? Got unlucky IMO. Would he have taken a chance on Sykora instead, (he'd have been bashed summer long for that move) and you'd be saying he's a hero...

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The only GM in the history of the NHL who never made a mistake is the one who never done anything at all.

Go back to the summer. The Habs needed a LW badly. The one guy Gainey went hard after was Shanahan. He even outbidded NYR for Shanny, yet Shanny chose the Big Apple. Nothing Gainey could do about it.

But Gainey had a safety net, which was Samsonov. Was very reasonable for a Plan B. A speedy LW who knew the N-East Division, should fit right in with the Habs.

Theory and practice are two seperate things, and GMs can do little about the latter. Gainey coached an underdog North Stars do the SCF and build a perennial contender and Cup Winner in Dallas. Thats a pretty decent record for a hockey guy I'd say...

But hey, hindsight is always 20/20, right?

Edited by KoZed
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I am pretty sure that Bonk was already signed when the Habs aquired him.

Hindsight is always 20/20 will my the cliche I go with. Samsonov was the right move and could still prove a lot of people wrong if he is given another chance and he can keep a lid on his feelings as well as his agents BIG PIE HOLE.

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Bob has done a very good job with Les Canadiens. How quickly we forget how bad things had become. We had no hope of winning a cup in this century. Do things sometimes not work out as he has planned OF COURSE! Does he fix them and make them right? Yes!! emphatically YES! I believed that Jose would come back as good as ever he did not. Bob fixed it. As to the Audet fiasco look at his numbers when Bob signed him. It looked like a good signing. When it blew up did he fix it ? Yes! We were the dummy's there. And he fixed that one twice. Bob is a very honorable man who will support his people to the limit (check out why he left Dallas) he is a very smart hockey man (see THE CUPS) he believes in doing what is right without fanfare notice no leaks from the Habs when he makes deals we are taken by surprise. He believes in giving people the opportunity to succeed and he is not chintzy about paying them because he wants them to succeed and stay with the organization. Ask nieuendyk if he thinks dallas was better after Bob left. Would Carbo be here if not for Bob? I for one love the fact that we have some of the best and smartest and talented former Habs coaching and running this team. Tradition is a Habs thing, we are not like the leafs we appreciate and love the former stars who gave us such glory. I have been a fan of this team for 42 years I have seen a lot of good (mostly good ) and some bad (houle tremblay was a mistake) What we have now is a possibilty of a new Habs Dynasty. Quit with the negative stuff all the time a season or a dynasty is not won or lost on 1 player or game. Bob has never been a loser and he never will be. Nor will the Montreal Canadiens. Keep the faith and trust we are really fortunate to have this group leading us.

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The Habs recent fall has left me devoid of strong hockey opinions. I have no idea of how the Habs might get out of this latest slump. One thing that I do know is that Gainey is one of the best minds in hockey and if he can't solve the problem this year, things will turn around next year. Patience!

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I am pretty sure that Bonk was already signed when the Habs aquired him.

Hindsight is always 20/20 will my the cliche I go with. Samsonov was the right move and could still prove a lot of people wrong if he is given another chance and he can keep a lid on his feelings as well as his agents BIG PIE HOLE.

BOnk wasn't signed, the habs signed him to the 2 yr deal a couple of weeks after they traded for him at the draft.

i'm not questioning getting samsonov. I've always liked him (would have liked sykora better), but my main point is that we over paid for him, just as we overpaid for Theodore.

My point isn't so much that gainey made a mistake in getting samsonov, or some of his other pickups, but that gainey has always bought high. He has done a good job unloading his mistakes (like Audatte from his dallas days and theodore last year).

As much as i like koivu (he's one of my favorite habs from the players i've seen (a list that includes Dryden, Lafleur, Robinson, Gainey, Roy), but in a salary cap world, I think we paid a bit too much. Same goes with Kovolev.

On a different note, tHis year, i think we are going to have no choice to have to open the bank for Markov (if we can keep him), coz of the premium the market is paying for defencemen. But I do hope that we don't do somethng stupid and overpay to try and keep SOuray. On the market he can probalbly get $6M, but i don't see him worth more then $3.5M max.

I'm actually hoping we move him. As much as we need his goals, He is probably are most tradeble asset. I don't think we are a serious contender for this year - have the potential of being an upset team of the stars are lined up, but I think moving souray could give us the potential to ice a much stronger team next year. The guy I think the habs should try for is Marleau. It is going to take a hell of a lot more then Souray to get him (especially since he is a UFA), but given that Souray probably wants to sign with a california team, packageing him with the right players might be a way to get Marleau, since SJ does need defensive help to counter anaheim's big 2. If I was in Gainey's shoes i would even be willing to dangle Kovolev and a prospect in a package that could get us Marleau and one of SJ's D-men prospects (Carle).

We do have some good wingers but no bona-fide #1 calibare centre. he is a year away from free agency, so giving up so much could be risky. But i think given his skill and leadership, i think it is worth the gamble, coz with so many young players, having a proven leader, other then koivu, is needed.

Given SJ probably doesn't have the right mix to knock off Anaheim, by giving them more depth, we may be able to get stronger for next year, while still having some upset potential this year.

Edited by hab29RETIRED
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Bob has done a very good job with Les Canadiens. How quickly we forget how bad things had become. We had no hope of winning a cup in this century. Do things sometimes not work out as he has planned OF COURSE! Does he fix them and make them right? Yes!! emphatically YES! I believed that Jose would come back as good as ever he did not. Bob fixed it. As to the Audet fiasco look at his numbers when Bob signed him. It looked like a good signing. When it blew up did he fix it ? Yes! We were the dummy's there. And he fixed that one twice. Bob is a very honorable man who will support his people to the limit (check out why he left Dallas) he is a very smart hockey man (see THE CUPS) he believes in doing what is right without fanfare notice no leaks from the Habs when he makes deals we are taken by surprise. He believes in giving people the opportunity to succeed and he is not chintzy about paying them because he wants them to succeed and stay with the organization. Ask nieuendyk if he thinks dallas was better after Bob left. Would Carbo be here if not for Bob? I for one love the fact that we have some of the best and smartest and talented former Habs coaching and running this team. Tradition is a Habs thing, we are not like the leafs we appreciate and love the former stars who gave us such glory. I have been a fan of this team for 42 years I have seen a lot of good (mostly good ) and some bad (houle tremblay was a mistake) What we have now is a possibilty of a new Habs Dynasty. Quit with the negative stuff all the time a season or a dynasty is not won or lost on 1 player or game. Bob has never been a loser and he never will be. Nor will the Montreal Canadiens. Keep the faith and trust we are really fortunate to have this group leading us.

I totally agree with you regarding Gainey turning the team around. I was esthatic when he became GM, actually even before he took over from Savard, i was happy he was on board. I also liked the Kovolev pickup. I do think that in today's salarycap system, you have to be a little chintzy. I was shocked at the contract he signed ribeiro for in the summer and was thrilled when we got rid of him before the season started. But i do think, that you can't risk picking up a guy like ninnima for what his contract is worth (i'm just glad it there is only 1 yr left).

ANd it is very DIFFICULT to not be negative when night after night you watch the habs not show up for 2 out of 3 or 3 out of 4 nights. Yes we have a possibility of habs dynasty, but not if we don't let some of our assets like Perozhogin, grabovzsy, Koitysen a prolonged chance to show what the can do. Affennigov did not become the player he is today sitting in the minors, being told to play defence, or toiling on the 4th line.

The habs coaching staff has to give the kids a real chance to play and learn from their mistakes. The habs have a long history in the post pollack days of giving up on guys and watching them excel elsewhere.

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So most people are being a negative nancy (not saying there is reason not to), but maybe we can start a feel good thread on the positives of the greatest team in hockey.

- Gui, gui gui!: I love the way he is playing, the scoring is nice, but when I see the puck being dumped in the corner I know the big hit is coming, and it makes me smile every single time.

- We're still in 4th place, we've slumped for the last 30 or so games and we're still in 4th place, thats not too bad IMO.

Well thats a start...whats your guys (and gals) postitives?

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Bob has done a very good job with Les Canadiens. How quickly we forget how bad things had become. We had no hope of winning a cup in this century. Do things sometimes not work out as he has planned OF COURSE! Does he fix them and make them right? Yes!! emphatically YES! I believed that Jose would come back as good as ever he did not. Bob fixed it. As to the Audet fiasco look at his numbers when Bob signed him. It looked like a good signing. When it blew up did he fix it ? Yes! We were the dummy's there. And he fixed that one twice. Bob is a very honorable man who will support his people to the limit (check out why he left Dallas) he is a very smart hockey man (see THE CUPS) he believes in doing what is right without fanfare notice no leaks from the Habs when he makes deals we are taken by surprise. He believes in giving people the opportunity to succeed and he is not chintzy about paying them because he wants them to succeed and stay with the organization. Ask nieuendyk if he thinks dallas was better after Bob left. Would Carbo be here if not for Bob? I for one love the fact that we have some of the best and smartest and talented former Habs coaching and running this team. Tradition is a Habs thing, we are not like the leafs we appreciate and love the former stars who gave us such glory. I have been a fan of this team for 42 years I have seen a lot of good (mostly good ) and some bad (houle tremblay was a mistake) What we have now is a possibilty of a new Habs Dynasty. Quit with the negative stuff all the time a season or a dynasty is not won or lost on 1 player or game. Bob has never been a loser and he never will be. Nor will the Montreal Canadiens. Keep the faith and trust we are really fortunate to have this group leading us.

YES!!!!!

:clap::clap::clap: :hlogo: :hockey:

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