ShortHanded Posted April 22, 2007 Share Posted April 22, 2007 I don't think the team wants the hassle of Samsonov being around the organization at training camp. I don't think they want the reputation of putting NHL veterans in the minors. It becomes an issue in attracting vets to the organization. No movement clause requests, makes it difficult for teams to trust management. Even though Sammy may not deserve the respect of the organization providing him a NHL job next year, it doesn't suit our interests to put him in the minors. Plus, Gillett would be paying more money for Samsonov than a buyout does. We made a mistake, Sammy made a mistake, both reputations have been hurt by it, let's just put it behind us, take the cap hit as penalty and move on. so so true. sending him to hamilton would be a short term gain, but would be disastrous to our already difficult likelihood of attracting ufa's. and would do nothing for the trust of vets already in the org (like Kovy) who had bad years, and who we're likely stuck with but need to play better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonus Posted April 22, 2007 Share Posted April 22, 2007 is that correct? if samsonov plays in the minors, does he not count against the cap? I thought vets with one-way deals still counted against the cap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saskhab Posted April 22, 2007 Author Share Posted April 22, 2007 is that correct? if samsonov plays in the minors, does he not count against the cap? I thought vets with one-way deals still counted against the cap. New Jersey has had Dan McGillis in the minors for the past 2 seasons because they had cap issues. If they sign the contract and are under 35 when they did so, they can be waived and assigned to the minors, collect full NHL money but the salary does not count towards the cap. The issues they had to solve were of Alex Mogilny and Vladamir Malakhov, because they were over 35 when they signed their contract with the team. The over 35 rule is to discourage teams from signing aging vets to front end loaded contracts (make $8m for one year, $450k the next, average is $4.25m which would be the cap hit) so players get inflated contracts for their final season and then retire the next year at the low rate. Garth Murray is also on a one way contract and could be assigned to the minors next year without any cap issues. In 2005-06, we had Peter Vandermeer in the minors all year on a one way contract without his salary counting towards the cap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saskhab Posted April 22, 2007 Author Share Posted April 22, 2007 One last thing I'll add. If we re-sign both Markov & Souray, it'll bump Biron's $495k off the cap hit. Gorges will be kept as a spare. So if Markov & Souray sign for $10m total, it'll result in a net increase of $9.55m in the cap. These are little details, but important to remeber. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 so so true. sending him to hamilton would be a short term gain, but would be disastrous to our already difficult likelihood of attracting ufa's. and would do nothing for the trust of vets already in the org (like Kovy) who had bad years, and who we're likely stuck with but need to play better. we cant attract ufa's now that is how we ended up with sammy. Build from within and when we win the cup they will all want to come. I think it might send exactly the right message to a bunch of underachieving vets who have let this team down in a big way. play good stay up play bad ride a bus. they wont do it but in the old days that is how the habs handled problems Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoRvInA Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 Hi guys... long time no say first there is no DOUBT whatsoever we are going to outsource a New top 1 centre... whether this new top centre turns out to be antoher over priced Samsonov remains to be determined. Specially because BG has said that Bonk and Johnson dont figure in our plans... therefore there is PLENTY of material presently signed for a Third and 4th line. Pleks Begin, Murray, Streit (if needed), (Hamilton players Plenty Chips etc...) And EVEN if we get so lucky as getting two or three New Top forwards... Higgins Koivu etc could still be down there. Remember Sabres and Ottawa's line ups So lets just hope We wine and dine the right players and they cope well p.s. Ideally Samsonov will be traded but we all agree their are more chances of him being picked up on waivers (the going up one at the least) we pay less than 2/3 buyout. Because of the waivered option being preferred he still might dress for training camp and who knows.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShortHanded Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 we cant attract ufa's now that is how we ended up with sammy. Build from within and when we win the cup they will all want to come. I think it might send exactly the right message to a bunch of underachieving vets who have let this team down in a big way. play good stay up play bad ride a bus. they wont do it but in the old days that is how the habs handled problems except we don't have enough depth from within to win that cup without some outside help. It's either ufa or trades to round us out. And just because we haven't been able to attract them in the past, I wouldn't want Gainey to just NOT even try to go after the big fish. Did you hear Koivu's frustration about the rebuilding? we need to be serious, whatever that's gonna take. So try to sign the big fish, if not, try to trade for some immediate help, but DON'T leave poor koivu without any support for another year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saskhab Posted May 9, 2007 Author Share Posted May 9, 2007 Thought I'd just let you know I made a minor tweak with news of Perezhogin's signing. I've taken his QO off the total and called up Grabovski as a replacement. It is a cap saving move of a paltry $39 700. I have done this under the assumption that Grabovski is further ahead on the depth chart than anyone else that was not on the team at the end of the season. So the cap number is now: $30 197 973.65 Based on a lineup of... Higgins - Koivu - Ryder Latendresse - Plekanec - Kovalev Begin - Lapierre - Kostitsyn Samsonov - Grabovski - Murray Streit - Komisarek Bouillon - Dandenault Gorges - Biron Huet Halak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chips Posted May 10, 2007 Share Posted May 10, 2007 all these number and options are hurting my head... glad you pros are able to crunch the options. thanks for the interesting details. when all is said and done I don't want to be in Gainey's shoes this off season. its going to be a challenge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saskhab Posted May 16, 2007 Author Share Posted May 16, 2007 Wasn't sure where to put this exactly, but it's worth a consideration. The cap could hit $52m next year if the NHLPA asks for the max. Saskin definitely negotiated compromise caps the past 2 years, it could change with him gone. I don't know why the PA would want a lower cap, it really doesn't make much sense. http://www.nypost.com/seven/05132007/sport...ooks.htm?page=0 If that happened, a lot could change. In theory, Buffalo could re-sign both Drury and Briere, if they're willing to spend to the cap limit (which would be a huge leap for them). Also, New Jersey should be able to re-up Gomez and Rafalski. It also means that contracts could get really pricey this off-season with all the extra cash available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeLassister Posted May 22, 2007 Share Posted May 22, 2007 :hlogo: should sign Souray, Markov and Hannan Markov-Komi Hannan-Souray Streit - Bouillon Gorges/Dandy hope we could trade Dandenault Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habsfan88 Posted May 22, 2007 Share Posted May 22, 2007 first off i just want to say that this is a great thread, good call saskhab...your posts are very interesting and informative. all i can say is that i expect a very fast and youthful lineup this season, and i also expect that bob will spend the cash to improve this team...we have have too many years of "rebuilding" and we haven't gotten past the second round in the playoffs, and we even missed the playoffs this year. We have some sweet prospects, but we also need to blend them in with some well-spent money in the offseason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saskhab Posted May 31, 2007 Author Share Posted May 31, 2007 I was on vacation for a while there, and when I came back Markov had re-upped. Here's how his $5.75m/year price tag works in... May 9 update + Markov - Biron = Cap Total so... $30 197 973.65 + $5 750 000 - $495 000 = $35 452 973.65 Based on a lineup of: Higgins - Koivu - Ryder Latendresse - Plekanec - Kovalev Begin - Lapierre - Kostitsyn Samsonov - Grabovski - Murray Markov - Komisarek Streit - Dandenault Bouillon - Gorges Huet Halak Again, this lineup includes the QO values of Higgins, Ryder, Plekanec, Komisarek, Gorges and Kostitsyn (who may not be a RFA). This lineup also contains no reserve players, just the minimum 20 man roster. I'll add spares as the roster becomes more finalized. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saskhab Posted June 15, 2007 Author Share Posted June 15, 2007 A new number comes with the Komisarek/Higgins signings. At $1.7m cap hit each and based on what I remember their old cap numbers to be... Just some quick math... 1.7-.95+1.7-.63 = $1.82m or so to add to my number, which means we're at about $37.7m for next year. Based on the same lineup as the post above. Until I know what Lahti's contract is worth I won't include him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habitforming Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 A new number comes with the Komisarek/Higgins signings. At $1.7m cap hit each and based on what I remember their old cap numbers to be... Just some quick math... 1.7-.95+1.7-.63 = $1.82m or so to add to my number, which means we're at about $37.7m for next year. Based on the same lineup as the post above. Until I know what Lahti's contract is worth I won't include him. With the cap being at $48M to $50M we are getting there already. BTW the cap ceiling will be set and announced next week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saskhab Posted June 16, 2007 Author Share Posted June 16, 2007 Good to know about the cap ceiling announcement. After some adjusting of old figures from different sources, a slightly more accurate figure has been reached. We have a cap hit of.... $37 321 266.32, based on the following 20 player lineup: Higgins-Koivu-Ryder Latendresse-Plekanec-Kovalev Bégin-Lapierre-Kostitsyn Samsonov-Grabovski-Murray Markov-Komisarek Bouillon-Streit Gorges-Dandenault Huet Halak Grabovski's total now includes his rookie bonus, while Halak's was lowered since he had a smaller salary in his first season of his contract than last year's and this year's. Ryder, Plekanec, and Gorges are the only 3 on the list who we are using their QO towards the cap hit, and again.... Samsonov is counted for the whole contract as if he makes the team next year. No spares have been used, and Lahti's salary is still unknown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saskhab Posted June 16, 2007 Author Share Posted June 16, 2007 A great salary source... http://walzy.hd-graphics.de Most eye-popping cap number? Carey Price, if he achieves all his bonuses, has a $2.2m cap hit. Suddenly that Huet-Price tandem looks less likely ($5m in cap space to goaltenders). Also, Mathieu Carle makes $850 000 (same as Latendresse, rookie salary max, no bonuses), while Sergei Kostitsyn gets $816 667. Again, no Lahti figures available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saskhab Posted June 16, 2007 Author Share Posted June 16, 2007 Samsonov for Cullimore and Salmalienen, with Cullimore bought out: Last total - Samsonov + Cullimore buyout + Salmalienen = new figure $37 321 266.32 - $3 525 000 + 633 333.33 + 700 000 = $35 129 599.65 Cap savings of $2 191 666.67 New lineup: Higgins-Koivu-Ryder Latendresse-Plekanec-Kovalev Bégin-Lapierre-A Kostitsyn Murray-Grabovski-Salmalienen Markov-Komisarek Bouillon-Streit Gorges-Dandenault Huet Halak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athlétique.Canadien Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 After the Komisarek and Higgins contracts, the cap bubble became $14,632,667.00. Samsonov's contract saved minus the Cullimore buyout and adding in Salmelainen's for $700,000 is a savings that can be added equalling $2,191,667.00 Our bubble is now $16,824,334.00 but that doesn't include Andrei Kostitsyn nor does it include Lapierre or Halak I believe. All that remains is working on signing: Plekanec Ryder Souray - if he or we decide to. Gorges Emelin Also, this calculation is based on a 48 cap. If it's 51 million, our bubble will be around $19,824,334.00 I know this is rough. Please feel free to help me out here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 http://forums.habsworld.net/index.php?showtopic=11008 The current exact cap hit for players under contract who played significantly in the NHL last season (so not including Grabovski) is 31,175,667 for 9 forwards, 5 defencemen, 2 goalies, and a buyout. Thus, if the cap is 48 million, the Habs now have 16,824,333 to work with. I figure Ryder to go for 2.5-3 million, Plekanec for about 1.5 million, and Gorges for half a million. Then we'd be looking at between 35,675,667 and 36,175,667. Under a 48 million cap, the Habs would have around 12 million to spend on UFAs, with 11 forwards, 6 defencemen, and 2 goalies under contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dark_faerie87 Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 The current exact cap hit for players under contract who played significantly in the NHL last season (so not including Grabovsky) is 31,175,667 for 9 forwards, 5 defencemen, 2 goalies, and a buyout. Thus, if the cap is 48 million, the Habs now have 16,824,333 to work with. I figure Ryder to go for 2.5-3 million, Plekanec for about 1.5 million, and Gorges for half a million. Then we'd be looking at between 35,675,667 and 36,175,667. Then there's also Lahti, although as far as I know, still no disclosed money figures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 Then there's also Lahti, although as far as I know, still no disclosed money figures. Is Lahti going to be on the NHL roster? I kinda figured he'd be in Hamilton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 Is Lahti going to be on the NHL roster? I kinda figured he'd be in Hamilton. I doubt he would come to NA not to play in the NHL I think he will play but my guess would be 750-900k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 I doubt he would come to NA not to play in the NHL I think he will play but my guess would be 750-900k As for salary, I expect 600,000. It's what Streit signed for, I don't see why Lahti would garner any more money than Streit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 As for salary, I expect 600,000. It's what Streit signed for, I don't see why Lahti would garner any more money than Streit. I guess you are right but I thought there was some competition for Lahti. I am sure we will know soon enough, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.