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Things haven't changed much this year


kaos

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If the Habs had tanked last year and not made the playoffs, there would be scrutiny out the wa-zoo!

The fact that Sundin is still in play as well as decent second, third and fourth options available it makes things easy. Most fans look at the recent signings and shake their heads in disbelief. We are wise not to get involved in the insanity.

If we start next season with our current roster I would be happy. We have made an upgrade on the wing and our young guys are a year more seasoned. However I believe that is when we will start to hear rumblings of discontent from some fans and media.

If Sundin signs there may very well be a riot or perhaps the Quebec government will introduce a new holiday.

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The Komisarek/Higgins deals are top-notch, as are the ones for most of the younger guys. The thing with Olesz is that it's a 6 year deal - paying for potential. I'd imagine would require at least 5-6M for Kostitsyn for a 6 year deal.

Well, I was thinking more along the lines of UFAs such as Roman Hamrlik. Or Mathieu Dandenault, or Steve Begin. Those aren't great value. They're useful players (Dandenault's iffy), but the salary is questionable.

What would you pay Hamrlik? The guy was outstanding last year. Worth every penny. Considering Streit got 4 and we could have given the money to Souray, I'm thrilled with Hammer and what he brings to the club along with what he is paid.

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In the big picture, the addition was Tanguay. The loss was Streit. I could mention Ryder as a loss but we already knew he was leaving anyway.

The Kostitsyn signing was met brilliantly. We still have almost the same team. We have cap room. Things haven't changed that much and there's still time for other options. :)

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The Komisarek/Higgins deals are top-notch, as are the ones for most of the younger guys. The thing with Olesz is that it's a 6 year deal - paying for potential. I'd imagine would require at least 5-6M for Kostitsyn for a 6 year deal.

Well, I was thinking more along the lines of UFAs such as Roman Hamrlik. Or Mathieu Dandenault, or Steve Begin. Those aren't great value. They're useful players (Dandenault's iffy), but the salary is questionable.

I disagree with you totally about the hammer he is worth every penny and had a great year. Remember we could have kept Souray and that would have been more than iffy Edmonton can have him). begin makes what? 850,000 he's well worth it not for much longer cause I think he is getting a little old and injury prone. Dandy is a 2 way player and maybe a little over value at 2.5 but have you seen what they are signing at 4 mill. You are clutching at straws.

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Bob's philosophy with young players who haven't hit their ceiling is that it's fairest to all concerned to sign medium-term deals. That way, the organization doesn't get saddled with a fat contract for players who fail to develop into stars, and players that DO develop into stars aren't trapped with a contract that undervalues them. He has demonstrated with the Koivu and Markov contracts that a player who delivers on their potential will be paid at fair market rate. I fail to see the problem. The assumption that Kosty will automatically "walk" in three years is foolish. Did Markov walk? Did Koivu? No, because those guys were developed within the organization and like it here. So there's no reason for pessimism at all.

Whether we'll be able to keep everyone (Komisarek, Higgins, both kostytsins, Price, Lats, O'Byrne, etc., etc.) in the longer term is certainly questionable - although it helps to recall that Kovy and Koivu, with their hefty contracts, will not be around forever. But here the mistake is in thinking that the rebuild is "done" and now we do nothing but live off the drafts of 2002-07. No, you have to keep drafting good young players who can replace the guys you do have to lose. That's how it works in a cap system, as I'm sure Bob is well aware. I like the Tanguay deal, but he can't keep doing that, and probably won't.

Anyone criticizing Bob for not trapping the team into ludicrous contracts for UFAs needs to lay off the crack. He identified the one UFA who could really solve our glaring long-running problem at C. He did everything he could to get him. With Detroit out of the running, I think we're very close to getting him still. There's no problem here.

I agree with Saskhab.

Coming out of the lockout I was amazed that these guys had not done homework on the effect that long-term

commitments could have on a franchise. The NBA and NFL have all gone through the growing pains that the

NHL is right now in regards to their GM's learning curves. My question, if I learned all the pitfalls of certain contracts

why could high paying executives who do it for a living not take the same time to study their peers?

I was optimistic that Gainey would figure it out, and I agree with you. He has played it like a fiddle. As a Leaf hater

I watched every landmine in front of JFJ and prayed he would step on them. He never missed ONE. Long term contracts

with no trade clauses, rewarding players coming off career seasons etc etc.

The blueprint was there in New England and Ken Holland is now setting one in Detroit. 3-4 years from now people

will look at the work Bob Gainey has done and try to duplicate it as well.

He has done a great job, and when I hear people bashing him for trading Huet, not re-signing Souray, overpaying Markov

(which I was one :) ), I ignore it and know that he knows what he is doing. In Gainey I trust.

Edited by Wamsley01
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I highly dispute that comment. Bob signing A Kostitsyn to a 3 year deal is the exact opposite of "smart". Am I the only 1 who realizes Bob just signed lil A.K. till he is UFA eligible? :huh:

How smart will you think Bob is when lil A.K. walks in 3 years? :?-

What's to say Bob doesn't sign him to a contract extension halfway through the season after next? I'd be surprised if Bob didn't start negotiating his next contract early if he is looking like he'll be a consistent 30+ goal scorer.

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What's to say Bob doesn't sign him to a contract extension halfway through the season after next? I'd be surprised if Bob didn't start negotiating his next contract early if he is looking like he'll be a consistent 30+ goal scorer.

can only sign extensions in the last year of a contract

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I just thought I'd take time to mention how intelligent the discussion in this thread has been. Some really excellent well thought out posts. I'd single out Saskhabs and habsrule but really I think every post in the thread (up till this one) has been really good.

This is the sort of thing that makes HW the best Habs site. Keep up th good work.

Now we return you to your previously scheduled programming ...

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I highly dispute that comment. Bob signing A Kostitsyn to a 3 year deal is the exact opposite of "smart". Am I the only 1 who realizes Bob just signed lil A.K. till he is UFA eligible? :huh:

You are the only one who realizes it because it isn't true. In order to become an unrestricted free agent, a player must either be 27 years old or have played in 7 NHL seasons. When Andrei's contract expires in 2011, Andrei will be 26 years old and will have completed 6 NHL seasons. Thus, he is not eligible for unrestricted free agency at the end of this contract.

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can only sign extensions in the last year of a contract

yeah. I wouldn't be surprised to see Kostitsyn (if he keeps his game up like that and improve) receive a long extension just like Malkin received yesterday. 5-6 years would put him at 32-33 years old, the exact time we can see if a player will keep going or start to fall.

Keep going if he stays in good shape and avoid major injuries, if the coaching staff doesn't pull a Roy-Tremblay-Brashear, if his brother stays around and if they get along great.

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I disagree with you totally about the hammer he is worth every penny and had a great year. Remember we could have kept Souray and that would have been more than iffy Edmonton can have him).

Can you imagine the amount of crap Bob would have taken had he signed Souray to a 4 year 20 million$ deal. The Same Souray who only played 30 games last year!!?!?!? Hamrlik has strengthened our defense and that is way more important that having a d-man who scores 25 goals!

Edited by Habsfan
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Can you imagine the amount of crap Bob would have taken had he signed Souray to a 4 year 20 million$ deal. The Same Souray who only played 30 games last year!!?!?!? Hamrlik has strengthened our defense and that is way more important that having a d-man who scores 25 goals!

And it's not like those were typical Sheldon Souray numbers either, this was by far his best season statistically, and he's not likely to ever repeat that. He was really just a big shot from the blueline who happened to play on the best powerplay in the NHL.

Having one fluke season doesn't make Souray a genuine scoring machine in the NHL.

The same could be said for Mark Streit. Is anyone one here ready to bet 5000$ that he will get another 60+ point season next year, or even once during the rest of his career? I'm not...

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And it's not like those were typical Sheldon Souray numbers either, this was by far his best season statistically, and he's not likely to ever repeat that. He was really just a big shot from the blueline who happened to play on the best powerplay in the NHL.

Having one fluke season doesn't make Souray a genuine scoring machine in the NHL.

The same could be said for Mark Streit. Is anyone one here ready to bet 5000$ that he will get another 60+ point season next year, or even once during the rest of his career? I'm not...

The funny thing about the situation with Souray was the EXACT same situation had played out in Toronto the season before.

They made the choice to give McCabe big $ and they are trying to dump the contract after 2 seasons.

I wonder if Gainey used that scenario in his decision, or was he just lucky that Souray decided 5M was not enough

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I wonder if Gainey used that scenario in his decision, or was he just lucky that Souray decided 5M was not enough

I think it was a little bit of both. Bob got lucky that Souray got gready!

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I like Hamrlik and all, not suggesting Souray was a better option, but tying up 5.5M/yr for him just seems a bit much, especially when guys like Rafalski signed for 6.5M, or Markov took 5.75M. But it was a circumstance where he needed to get a defender signed to replace Souray at literally any cost. In my original post, I mentioned that Gainey overpays players. I still think he does. But that's not necessarily a bad thing, because you have to overpay to get players on the market.

It's just something I've noticed over the years. Even in Dallas, Gainey didn't hesitate to sign guys like Audette, Turgeon and Boucher to big money deals.

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I will gladly admit without a doubt though, this year's spending makes Gainey look practically miserly in dishing out the dough. Even Dandenault might end up with a higher salary on the market.

Edited by smon
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I will gladly admit without a doubt though, this year's spending makes Gainey look practically miserly in dishing out the dough. Even Dandenault might end up with a higher salary on the market.

\

I think he's doing what he should do get the best player for the best price and contrary to your belief that he overpays, I think he always has a backup plan to dump someone if he has to. As a hockey player he was very intelligent as a gm he's just a lot smarter than the other guys. :clap: :hlogo:

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Simple, they were too soft in the playoffs and everyone has said including habs players they were pushed around and taken advantage of. Your tough guys can't be Gorges and SK. Therefore he had to sign Laraque, great move.

Tanguay gives them a legitimate second line. Again great move, if one line is off, the other line can step up.

So signing 2 players i don't really consider that changing the team too much. Both players are well respected on and off the ice.

BG didn't resign 3 vets. Those spots needed to be filled. He gets an A- from me so far. If Sundin comes aboard he gets an A+

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Simple, they were too soft in the playoffs and everyone has said including habs players they were pushed around and taken advantage of. Your tough guys can't be Gorges and SK. Therefore he had to sign Laraque, great move.

Tanguay gives them a legitimate second line. Again great move, if one line is off, the other line can step up.

So signing 2 players i don't really consider that changing the team too much. Both players are well respected on and off the ice.

BG didn't resign 3 vets. Those spots needed to be filled. He gets an A- from me so far. If Sundin comes aboard he gets an A+

Totally agree except for the 3 spots to be filled. I think we have enough prospects to find a few solid ones that can replace the vets.

Im was most scared about Price being shaky in the playoffs but in case he has a poor start I think Denis or Halak can take over for a while.

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Totally agree except for the 3 spots to be filled. I think we have enough prospects to find a few solid ones that can replace the vets.

Im was most scared about Price being shaky in the playoffs but in case he has a poor start I think Denis or Halak can take over for a while.

Yeah, Ryder, Smolinski, Streit, Grabovski and Brisebois left. Ryder was replaced by Tanguay, Smolinski by Laraque, Grabovski was a reserve for us and can be replaced by Chipchura and Brisebois will probably be re-signed. That leaves us only without a Streit replacement and I think we mostly all agreed that O'Byrne will be the one taking his spot on Hamrlik's flank.

So every single one of those open spots was filled with a player with NHL experience - and if we sign Sundin then the least experienced (Chipchura) gets bumped off and we look even more "safe."

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