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Habs acquire Robert Lang and re-sign Brisebois


Peter Puck

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There really isn't as huge a gap as people think between Detroit and the rest of the league. I agree that they're the best team but they're hardly more loaded than some of the post-cap Senators and Sabres teams we've seen recently. On paper, I'd say we have more scoring depth than the Red Wings.

Their D is better than ours but the main thing that makes them better is the winning tradition that they have and the leaders on that team - Lidstrom, Chelios, Draper, Maltby - that are so used to tossing inexperienced teams aside. Really, if Price plays properly we could definitely give them a run for their money, at least as well as the other Western powerhouses could.

Personally I think the main difference between the Wings and the Habs is this: If JP Dumont had wanted to play in Detroit, he would be a Wing right now. :P

Seriously though that is the difference. The Habs better win the Cup soon or they will turn into the next post-cap Senators and Sabres. The Wings are able to be perenial contenders because they have players who want to play there and are willing to take pay cuts so that the Wings can remain competative.

The Ducks only won because Selane was only paid something like 2mil that year. If the Ducks had to pay Selane his real value of around 8 mil then they wouldnt have been able to afford either Pronger or Nedermeyer. It would have been impossible for the Ducks to fit all 3 under the cap with all 3 making their real value.

The gap bewteen Detroit and the rest of the league is bigger than the salary cap generally allows because the Wings have several players who agree to make less that what they are worth on the open market.

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I wonder if Detroit will stagger next year. It's not easy to repeat. They were the last to do it in 1998. But, look at what happened to them in 2007. A puck over the glass against Anaheim led to a devastating goal and Detroit never recovered. There's nothing saying that this can't happen again.

Hopefully MOST of what we need this year for our team goes according to plan. You always need a little luck :hockey:

:hlogo:

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Man the conversation is all over the place. I'll take this moment to comment on all topics quickly. Seems like everyone is coming back for HW training camp, and getting their thread chops going.

1. KOMI will be a stay at home hard hitting MOFO forever. I can't see him becoming a threat offensively. If we plan on being leaders of the pack for a while we need to keep guys with a gift for scoring goals or setting up plays in the PP position. KOMI should do what he does best Hit and Hit some more. If we look up to him for production on the powerplay will mean we are not doing so well.

2. CHIPS? I suppose he could be a BrindAmour as some have suggested and if it happens ...COOL. I see him more as a steady, hard-hitting, Leadership out the wazoo Brian Skrudland type of player. Maybe for some of you that might be a disappointment but I feel it's more realistic. I should also add there is nothing wrong with that. Skrudland had a good, long career which would be great for Chips.

3.Screw Detroit. Montreal will kill them with one hand tied behind their back! Should I start my *Montreal will sweep Detroit* *no jinx* thread early this year. Well maybe I'll wait until April. :blink:

4.Lang? I'm glad with the signing. Sounds like he wants to be here. Good thing! Now, Carbo won't mess with the first line and neither would any of us right now. But hey, if last years first line comes out of the gate slow I wouldn't be surprised to see Lang replacing Pleks in a second. You know, when Pleks plays like a little girl.

Considering Lang and Kovalev had breakfast and talked about the good old days don't be surprised if Gainey goes looking for Straka by December. Where is that guy? in Cleveland or in France.

My point is a lot of things are going to change this year. One thing you can bet on is Koivu will be holding up the CUP this year!!!!!!!

Wooo hoooooo!!!!!!!

oh ya

I hope to GOD Price has a solid year or we are screwed.

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I don't think Chipchura should be sent down, and actually think he should be given the opportunity to be the 4th centre at the beginning of the season; this opportunity should be his to lose, and he should play regularly until he proves he can't play at this level. Both Begin and Kostopoulos should be gone after this season, and I don't think we should play them over Chipchura, especially siu

My lines for the season would like this:

A.Kostsitsyn-Plekanec-Kovalev

Tanguay-Koivu-Latendresse

Higgins-Lang-S.Kostsitsyn

Lapierre-Chipchura-Laraque

Markov-Komisarek

Hamrlik-O'Byrne

Bouillon-Gorges

Unfortunately, even though Mathieu Dandeneault should be the one being sent down as he brings absolutely nothing to the table unlike everyone else, it seems pretty obvious that Chipchura will be sent down as Gainey doesn't have the guts to send a francophone veteran down, especially one he signed to a very expensive 4 year contract. The only possibility for Chipchura to stay would be a trade involving Dandeneault, but then again, I still doubt he would get a regular spot as he would have to play musical chair with Lapierre, Begin, and Kostopoulos.

ps. I don't know how, but I'm still afraid we'll see both Begin and Kostopulos in the lineup for the first game, and possibly even Patrice Brisebois (although I give O'Byrne better odds).

I completely agree with you... however we need to sign him long term before he gets that opportunity ;) It could be the difference between a 4.5M salary and a 6.5M...

That's the nicest line combo I've seen yet. Lang is a great faceoff guy who can score, Sergi is a great setup man, and Higgins is the energizer bunny. He never gives up on plays. This would be our first line in 2001.

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That is, for sure, something to consider. I wonder though, if we haven't seen the best from all three players. Consider that, when challenged and surrounded by excellent players, Kovalev takes his game up a notch. For Koivu, the simple act of not having to carry the team offensively as he did for a number of years relieves a lot of the burden: he's only 33 and his health doesn't seem (fingers crossed) to be as much of an issue as it was. Hamrlik may be the most prone to losing a step, but even there, I wonder if any loss might be compensated with the improved talent level around him.

Hamrlik's already lost a step and he countered it by shifting from a 50 point defenceman to a stay-at-home wall. I think he'll be the same player he is now until the end of his contract.

Is Lidstrom-Rafalski-Kronwall-Stuart better than Pronger-Niedermayer-Schneider-Beauchemin?

Granted, we're not up there yet. We dont have a Norris candidate... yet. Markov-Komisarek-Hamrlik are a great top 3, but we're still missing that solid 4th guy. It's not the candidates that are lacking, but they're all in the AHL or juniors. Unless Carle or Valentenko suddenly grows by leaps this year, we'll have to hope O'Byrne & Gorges stabilizes their respective games and that Bouillon/Brisebois can still play good minutes.

Markov is a potential Norris candidate - he's better than Chara who got a nomination last year.

I respect Lang achievements from 2000 to 2006, while we are now in season 2008-09.

Nobody in Chicago is sad to see him go, everybody knew there he was likely gone and they are expecting

the team to be in the playoffs and the most improved team in the West.

Both Bonk and Smolinski were sold when they came as perennial 20 goals scorer, so being sceptical is not

out of bound here.

That being said low expectations makes every good play more enjoyable. I really wish he can play a solid season.

Bonk and Smolinski were sold as potential 20 goals scorer but they'd done it in the past. Lang hit 20 goals last season on a team with a much worse attack than ours.

That's what I'm trying to get at. If Detroit does win 3 rounds, we're in trouble. But they have to win 3 rounds, which has proven VERY difficult to do for the defending champions. I say it's more likely an upstart team like Edmonton, Columbus or Phoenix knocks them off in Round 1 then us in Round 4. It's just the weird way hockey works.

If someone else from the West is the representative, I'll like our chances, since they won't be overwhelmingly against (I used Dallas as an example). But we still have to worry about getting through the Eastern Conference first, of course. Like the stats I quoted above indicate, we still have areas to improve in.

Columbus? They're more likely to finish 30th overall.

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Sure, he's probably top 10 in the League right now. However he still needs to take that extra step that would put him in the elite top 5. That means 60-70 pts and a huge +/- to prove some dominance at even-strength.

He's in the top 10 in the NHL by most standards, but Markov is not an elite defenseman. I only see four elite defensemen today, and they are Lidstrom, Pronger, Niedermayer, and Dion Phaneuf... Erik Jonhson might reach that level in the near future, but he's not there yet.

I see Markov in the next best category, along with guys like Zubov, Redden (despite his troubles recently), Chara, Kaberle, Timonen, and maybe a couple more depending on how loose your standards are. These are great complete players who could challenge for the Norris on any given great year, but they don't dominate the game like the first group does.

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That's the nicest line combo I've seen yet. Lang is a great faceoff guy who can score, Sergi is a great setup man, and Higgins is the energizer bunny. He never gives up on plays. This would be our first line in 2001.

And the forth line of Chipchura with Lapierre and Laraque could physically intimidate any other line in the NHL while still being capable of playing good hockey; I could even see them becoming a good shutdown line. These guys are all big and physical, relatively skilled, and gritty.

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And the forth line of Chipchura with Lapierre and Laraque could physically intimidate any other line in the NHL while still being capable of playing good hockey; I could even see them becoming a good shutdown line. These guys are all big and physical, relatively skilled, and gritty.

I actually like this 4th line a lot, but the question is, what happens to Kostopo and Beige? I know you can rotate people in and out, but are they both "out" most of the time? do you get rid of one of them?

I really like both Beige and Kosto, but I feel like the ice time is better given to our younger kids (Lappy, Chipper) who still have a lot of potential to get so much better...

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Begin will be in most nights, don't fool yourselves. Whether you guys like Begin or not he brings toughness, speed, Pk, blocks shots and is generally a pest. He was part of the habs best line in the playoffs. Guys ike him aren't easy to find. He With the current depth, he does get injured alot and the team can afford to rest him him when they play back to back.

Chipchura and Lapierre won't play together on the same line.

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He's in the top 10 in the NHL by most standards, but Markov is not an elite defenseman. I only see four elite defensemen today, and they are Lidstrom, Pronger, Niedermayer, and Dion Phaneuf... Erik Jonhson might reach that level in the near future, but he's not there yet.

I see Markov in the next best category, along with guys like Zubov, Redden (despite his troubles recently), Chara, Kaberle, Timonen, and maybe a couple more depending on how loose your standards are. These are great complete players who could challenge for the Norris on any given great year, but they don't dominate the game like the first group does.

And out of all those guys, Zubov is the only one I could consider on a level with Markov and that would make Markov 5th or 6th best in the NHL. Then take into account that Niedermayer, Lidstrom and Zubov are very close to retirement and then Pronger a couple of years afte them. In two or three years, Markov may very well be in a class of the top 3 defencemen in the league.

I didn't say Columbus was the most likely to finish last, simply that they were more likely to finish last than to make the playoffs.

Not just to make the playoffs but he also claims they have a chance at taking out Detroit in Round 1.

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Begin will be in most nights, don't fool yourselves. Whether you guys like Begin or not he brings toughness, speed, Pk, blocks shots and is generally a pest. He was part of the habs best line in the playoffs. Guys ike him aren't easy to find. He With the current depth, he does get injured alot and the team can afford to rest him him when they play back to back.

Chipchura and Lapierre won't play together on the same line.

That's the forth line I would like to see, and the one I feel that benefits the Canadiens both today and even more on the longer run, however I agree with you that Begin will unfortunately play regularly, and I have a feeling that both he and Kostopoulos (perhaps also Brisebois) will be in the lineup for the first game.

Edited by CerebusClone
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Begin will be, i don't know about Brisby. You also have to remember they start the season 3 in 4 nights if i'm not mistaken. You'll see some subs right off the bat. There is nothing wrong with having depth and good solid players. It gives players a chance to rest and give there best every night they play.

There will be games where they don't need Laraque and can give him a rest also.

Competition is what has brought the team to a better level the last 2 years, if you can't cut it, your spot isn't safe anymore. I like that alot.

So as long as Begin, Kostopolous play the way they did last year, i have no problem with them getting ice time.

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Begin will be, i don't know about Brisby. You also have to remember they start the season 3 in 4 nights if i'm not mistaken. You'll see some subs right off the bat. There is nothing wrong with having depth and good solid players. It gives players a chance to rest and give there best every night they play.

There will be games where they don't need Laraque and can give him a rest also.

Competition is what has brought the team to a better level the last 2 years, if you can't cut it, your spot isn't safe anymore. I like that alot.

So as long as Begin, Kostopolous play the way they did last year, i have no problem with them getting ice time.

At the same time, you want to make sure that Lapierre and Chipchura get every chance to improve, and fulfill their potential. After all, these are the guys who will still be here after this season, not to mention that a Kyle Chipchura playing like he can brings you so much more, especially come playoffs time, than a Steve Bégin could ever dream to.

I still think that a confident Chipchura with a full season under his belt could have made a small difference against a team like the Flyers, doing the dirty work, winning battles for puck possesion, and getting his nose dirty in front of Biron's net, whom no one even bottered during the entire series.

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Not just to make the playoffs but he also claims they have a chance at taking out Detroit in Round 1.

Geez, I just gave a list of "young up and coming teams" and gave theoretical examples. There was nothing concrete in that statement.

For the record, I don't think Columbus or Edmonton will make the playoffs. Columbus has some kind of weird curse against them and Edmonton were only close last year due to a late season surge when the pressure was off, fueled by a ridiculous shootout record that won't be repeated. Phoenix I think could make it, however, but they have a tough division to get points in.

I didn't respond to this until now because it was completely irrelevant to the point I was making. An upstart team in the early rounds is more likely to take down Detroit than us in the Final, because Detroit will have tons of confidence in their game if they have already won 3 rounds.

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The 3rd centre merry-go-round continues. Juneau, Bonk, Smolinksi, now Lang. Granted, with the current edition of the Habs, there isn't a ton of delineation between 2nd and 3rd lines. Whereas in the past, the Habs had a top line, then 3 third/fourth lines. To be honest, I'd prefer to see Lang as a 2a centre, and Koivu as 2b (2a slated as more offensively minded line, 2b as a defensive minded line with offensive potential). Primarily because the other efforts the Habs have made recently to take bigger centers (in size, not playing style) that were formerly offensive minded, and slot them as our 3rd line "shut down" centre hasn't worked well. Simply put, even with the addition of Lang, the Habs don't have a true shut down centre. The Habs do have better offensive depth capabilities if they have injuries, though.

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The 3rd centre merry-go-round continues. Juneau, Bonk, Smolinksi, now Lang. Granted, with the current edition of the Habs, there isn't a ton of delineation between 2nd and 3rd lines. Whereas in the past, the Habs had a top line, then 3 third/fourth lines. To be honest, I'd prefer to see Lang as a 2a centre, and Koivu as 2b (2a slated as more offensively minded line, 2b as a defensive minded line with offensive potential). Primarily because the other efforts the Habs have made recently to take bigger centers (in size, not playing style) that were formerly offensive minded, and slot them as our 3rd line "shut down" centre hasn't worked well. Simply put, even with the addition of Lang, the Habs don't have a true shut down centre. The Habs do have better offensive depth capabilities if they have injuries, though.

Funny how Carbo and Gainey, of all people, have put together a team without any shutdown players... Dontcha think?

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Smoke wasn't exactly a strong shutdown centre last season, so at least this year the Habs are fielding a third line with at least something of an identity.

Funny how Carbo and Gainey, of all people, have put together a team without any shutdown players... Dontcha think?

If I were to play the fan for a second, I'd say that it is evidence of their willingness and ability to modify their approach to the game as the times change.

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If I were to play the fan for a second, I'd say that it is evidence of their willingness and ability to modify their approach to the game as the times change.

I'd say they're trying to compensate for a career spent shutting down opponents and want to finally play all out of offense by proxy. :P

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I'd say they're trying to compensate for a career spent shutting down opponents and want to finally play all out of offense by proxy. :P

IIRC, in The Game, Gainey is reported as saying that his favourite moments are scoring a goal or creating a situation that directly lead to a goal. If I can paraphrase, he basically said that he loved scoring more than anything, but his love of scoring was less than his hated of being scored against.

Now someone who has read the book more recently than I can tell me how wrong I am.

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