Jacques Martin new Habs head coach

[Wamsley01]

And Plante revolutionized the position of a goaltender as much as Orr revolutionized the position of defenseman. What's your point? Obviously I'm a Habs fan but that's a fact.

He would fall in my top ten for sure, but best of all time? I'm sorry, but how is that not Gretzky hands-down?

Bobby Orr was just as dominant points wise. 5 defensemen post expansion have posted

100+ points in a season (Leetch (1), Potvin (1), Macinnis (1) and Coffey (5).

Orr did it 6 years in a row during a much lower scoring era. And during those 6 years no defenseman came within 40 pts of him.

The 1980s, when Gretzky did the majority of his damage had 9 of the 10 highest scoring seasons in post expansion history.

The 10 highest are 1981-1990 (the years that just happened to be Gretzky's prime).

8 straight Norris trophies and the only defenseman in history to win the scoring title, 2 Conn Smythe trophies, 3 hart trophies

and over half his career played on one knee, in an era where knee surgery was career ending?

Done at the age of 26 (36 games over the last 3 years of his career hardly count), he would fall in your top ten?

That isn't even mentioning the difference between Gretzky and Orr on the defensive end.

It is hardly hands-down.

And BTW, there is a solid argument to be made that Plante is the greatest goaltender of all-time. He had great stats, longevity,

innovation, influence, awards and the Stanley Cups.

Edited June 6, 2009 by Wamsley01

[Habsy]

Dunno...

How can we really rank/judge coaches is beyond me. We see like what ? 50% of their job ?

I coudn't agree with you more. Nobody really has a clue, from there computer keyboard, who is a good coach or not. I wanted Carbo to be our Lindy Ruff, look how that turned out.

[alexstream]

List of MY top 10 current NHL Coaches: (Base on experience and term)

Mike Babcock (Detroit Red Wings) arguable, ok

Lindy Ruff (Buffalo Sabres) arguable ok

Brent Sutter (New Jersey Devils) totally yes

Ron Wilson (Toronto Maple Leafs) arguable ok

Joel Quenneville (Chicago Blackhawks) arguable ok

Andy Murray (St. Louis Blues) underestimated yes

John Tortorella (New York Rangers) no no no. Short term yes

Pat Quinn (Edmonton Oilers) no no no. Short term yes

Terry Murray (Los Angeles Kings) terry who?

Dave Tippet (Dallas Stars) Mustache Hitchcock legacy? either I give too much credit to hitchcock either I don't give enough to Mustache.

Jacques Martin (Montreal Canadiens) yes, or higher

Claude Julien (Boston Bruins) now yes or higher, but not when he was with the habs... boring, not creative... even now, creativity problems.

Alain Vigneault (Vancouver Canucks) yes.

Ken Hitchcock (Columbus Blue Jackets) higher higher.

Paul Maurice (Carolina Hurricanes) higher higher

Barry Trotz (Nashville Predators) higher higher

John Stevens (Philadelphia Flyers) John who?

Bruce Boudreau (Washinton Capitals) yes, but ... even I with Ovie would make that list.

Randy Carlyle (Anaheim Ducks) hmmm. dunno

Dan Bylsma (Pittsburgh Penguins) higher way higher. just look the difference btw him and dofus therrien.

Todd McLellan (San Jose Sharks) bof

Peter DeBoer (Florida Panthers) i'd believe higher

Cory Clouston (Ottawa Senators)i'd believe higher

Rick Tocchet (Tampa Bay Lighting) next to be fired

Wayne Gretzky (Phoenix Coyotes) next to be fired

John Anderson (Atlanta Thrashers) next to be fired

Scott Gordon (New York Islanders) next to be fired

(This is a quick list, feel free to criticize and give your opinion)

I commented your ranking. feel too lazy to bold it out but it's right after the parenthesis. I wrote some comments.

[BCHabnut]

Gretzky and Mario are the greatest of all time. Look at heir point per game stats. I never watched Orr play, and his footage is impressive, but I believe Gretz and Mario are THE 2 superheros of hockey. Everyone else is out of their league. Orr, Messier, Howe, Lafluer, Coffey, Bossy... are elite players. Gretzky and Mario are superheros.

Bunch of records i copied and pasted. Holy crap

1.Most goals: 894 in 1,487 games

2.Most goals, including playoffs: 1,016 in 1,487 regular season and 208 playoff games

3.Most goals, one season: 92 in 1981–82, 80-game schedule

4.Most goals, one season, including playoffs: 100 in 1983–84, 87 goals in 74 regular season games and 13 goals in 19 playoff games

5.Most goals, 50 games from start of season: 61 in 1981–82 (October 7, 1981 to January 22, 1982, 80-game schedule) and 1983–84 (October 5, 1983 to January 25, 1984), 80-game schedule

6.Most goals, one period: 4 (Tied with 10 other players) February 18, 1981

7.Most assists: 1,963

8.Most assists, including playoffs: 2,223

9.Most assists, one season: 163 in 1985–86, 80-game schedule

10.Most assists, one season, including playoffs: 174 in 1985–86, 163 assists in 80 regular season games and 11 assists in 10 playoff games

11.Most assists, one game: 7 (tied with Billy "The Kid" Taylor) done three times -- February 15, 1980; December 11, 1985; February 14, 1986

12.Most assists, one road game: 7 (tied with Billy Taylor) December 11, 1985

13.Most points: 2,857 in 1,487 games (894 goals, 1,963 assists)

14.Most points, including playoffs: 3,239 in 1,487 regular season and 208 playoff games. (1016 goals, 2223 assists)

15.Most points, one season: 215 in 1985–86, 80-game schedule (52 goals, 163 assists)

16.Most points, one season, including playoffs: 255 in 1984–85; 208 points in 80 regular season games and 47 points in 18 playoff games

17.Most overtime assists, career: 15

18.Most goals by a centre, career: 894

19.Most goals by a centre, one season: 92 in 1981–82, 80-game schedule

20.Most assists by a centre, career: 1,963

21.Most assists by a centre, one season: 163 in 1985–86, 80-game schedule

22.Most points by a centre, career: 2,857

23.Most points by a centre, one season: 215 in 1985–86, 80-game schedule

24.Most assists in one game by a player in his first season: 7 on February 15, 1980

25.Highest goals-per-game average, one season: 1.18 in 1983–84, 87 goals in 74 games

26.Highest assists-per-game average, career (300 min.): 1.321 -- 1,963 assists in 1,487 games

27.Highest assists-per-game average, one season: 2.04 in 1985–86, 163 assists in 80 games

28.Highest points-per-game average, one season (among players with 50-or-more points): 2.77 in 1983–84, 205 points in 74 games

29.Most 40-or-more goal season: 12 in 20 seasons

30.Most consecutive 40-or-more goal season: 12 from 1979–80 to 1990–91

31.Most 50-or-more goal seasons: 9 (tied with Mike Bossy)

32.Most 60-or-more goal seasons: 5 (tied with Mike Bossy)

33.Most consecutive 60-or-more goals seasons: 4 from 1981–82 to 1984–85

34.Most 100-or-more point seasons: 15

35.Most consecutive 100-or-more point seasons: 13 from 1979–80 to 1991–92

36.Most three-or-more goal games, career: 50 -- 37 three-goal (hat trick) games; nine four-goal games; four five-goal games

37.Most three goal games, one season: 10 (done twice) in 1981–82 and 1983–84

38.Longest consecutive assist scoring streak: 23 games in 1990–91, 48 assists

39.Longest consecutive point-scoring streak: 51 Games in 1983–84 (October 5, 1983 to January 28, 1984, 61 goals, 92 assists for 153 points)

40.Longest consecutive point-scoring streak from start of season: 51 in 1983–84; 61 goals, 92 assists for 153 points (October 5, 1983 to January 28, 1984)

[edit] Playoff records (15)

1.Most playoff goals, career: 122

2.Most playoff assists, career: 260

3.Most assists, one playoff year: 31 in 1988 (19 games)

4.Most assists in one series (other than final): 14 (tied with Rick Middleton) in 1985 Conference Finals (six games vs. Chicago)

5.Most assists in final series: 10 in 1988 (four games, plus suspended game vs. Boston)

6.Most assists, one playoff game: 6 (tied with Mikko Leinonen) on April 9, 1987

7.Most assists, one playoff period: 3 -- Three assists by one player in one period of a playoff game has been recorded on 70 occasions. Gretzky has had three assists in one period five times

8.Most points, career: 382 -- 122 goals and 260 assists

9.Most points, one playoff year: 47 in 1985 (17 goals and 30 assists in 18 games)

10.Most points in final series: 13 in 1988 three goals and 10 assists (four games plus suspended game vs. Boston, three goals)

11.Most points, one playoff period: 4 (tied with nine other players)

12.Most short-handed goals, one playoff year: 3 (tied with five other players) 1983

13.Most short-handed goals, one playoff game: 2 (tied with eight other players) April 6, 1983

14.Most game winning goals in playoffs, career: 24 (tied with Brett Hull)

15.Most three-or-more goals games (hat trick): 10 (eight three-goal games, two four-goal games)

[edit] All-Star records (6)

1.Most All-Star game goals: 13 (in 18 games played)

2.Most All-Star game goals, one game: 4 (tied with three players) 1983 Campbell Conference

3.Most All-Star game goals, one period: 4 1983 Campbell Conference, third period

4.Most All-Star game assists, career: 12 (tied with four players)

5.Most All-Star game points, career: 25 (13 goals, 12 assists in 18 games)

6.Most All-Star game points, one period: 4 (tied with Mike Gartner and Adam Oates) 1983 Campbell Conference, third period (four goals)

Edited June 6, 2009 by BCHabnut

[Peter Puck]

Gretzky and Mario are the greatest of all time. Look at heir point per game stats. I never watched Orr play, and his footage is impressive, but I believe Gretz and Mario are THE 2 superheros of hockey. Everyone else is out of their league. Orr, Messier, Howe, Lafluer, Coffey, Bossy... are elite players. Gretzky and Mario are superheros.

Bunch of records i copied and pasted. Holy crap

1.Most goals: 894 in 1,487 games

2.Most goals, including playoffs: 1,016 in 1,487 regular season and 208 playoff games

3.Most goals, one season: 92 in 1981–82, 80-game schedule

4.Most goals, one season, including playoffs: 100 in 1983–84, 87 goals in 74 regular season games and 13 goals in 19 playoff games

5.Most goals, 50 games from start of season: 61 in 1981–82 (October 7, 1981 to January 22, 1982, 80-game schedule) and 1983–84 (October 5, 1983 to January 25, 1984), 80-game schedule

6.Most goals, one period: 4 (Tied with 10 other players) February 18, 1981

7.Most assists: 1,963

8.Most assists, including playoffs: 2,223

9.Most assists, one season: 163 in 1985–86, 80-game schedule

10.Most assists, one season, including playoffs: 174 in 1985–86, 163 assists in 80 regular season games and 11 assists in 10 playoff games

11.Most assists, one game: 7 (tied with Billy "The Kid" Taylor) done three times -- February 15, 1980; December 11, 1985; February 14, 1986

12.Most assists, one road game: 7 (tied with Billy Taylor) December 11, 1985

13.Most points: 2,857 in 1,487 games (894 goals, 1,963 assists)

14.Most points, including playoffs: 3,239 in 1,487 regular season and 208 playoff games. (1016 goals, 2223 assists)

15.Most points, one season: 215 in 1985–86, 80-game schedule (52 goals, 163 assists)

16.Most points, one season, including playoffs: 255 in 1984–85; 208 points in 80 regular season games and 47 points in 18 playoff games

17.Most overtime assists, career: 15

18.Most goals by a centre, career: 894

19.Most goals by a centre, one season: 92 in 1981–82, 80-game schedule

20.Most assists by a centre, career: 1,963

21.Most assists by a centre, one season: 163 in 1985–86, 80-game schedule

22.Most points by a centre, career: 2,857

23.Most points by a centre, one season: 215 in 1985–86, 80-game schedule

24.Most assists in one game by a player in his first season: 7 on February 15, 1980

25.Highest goals-per-game average, one season: 1.18 in 1983–84, 87 goals in 74 games

26.Highest assists-per-game average, career (300 min.): 1.321 -- 1,963 assists in 1,487 games

27.Highest assists-per-game average, one season: 2.04 in 1985–86, 163 assists in 80 games

28.Highest points-per-game average, one season (among players with 50-or-more points): 2.77 in 1983–84, 205 points in 74 games

29.Most 40-or-more goal season: 12 in 20 seasons

30.Most consecutive 40-or-more goal season: 12 from 1979–80 to 1990–91

31.Most 50-or-more goal seasons: 9 (tied with Mike Bossy)

32.Most 60-or-more goal seasons: 5 (tied with Mike Bossy)

33.Most consecutive 60-or-more goals seasons: 4 from 1981–82 to 1984–85

34.Most 100-or-more point seasons: 15

35.Most consecutive 100-or-more point seasons: 13 from 1979–80 to 1991–92

36.Most three-or-more goal games, career: 50 -- 37 three-goal (hat trick) games; nine four-goal games; four five-goal games

37.Most three goal games, one season: 10 (done twice) in 1981–82 and 1983–84

38.Longest consecutive assist scoring streak: 23 games in 1990–91, 48 assists

39.Longest consecutive point-scoring streak: 51 Games in 1983–84 (October 5, 1983 to January 28, 1984, 61 goals, 92 assists for 153 points)

40.Longest consecutive point-scoring streak from start of season: 51 in 1983–84; 61 goals, 92 assists for 153 points (October 5, 1983 to January 28, 1984)

[edit] Playoff records (15)

1.Most playoff goals, career: 122

2.Most playoff assists, career: 260

3.Most assists, one playoff year: 31 in 1988 (19 games)

4.Most assists in one series (other than final): 14 (tied with Rick Middleton) in 1985 Conference Finals (six games vs. Chicago)

5.Most assists in final series: 10 in 1988 (four games, plus suspended game vs. Boston)

6.Most assists, one playoff game: 6 (tied with Mikko Leinonen) on April 9, 1987

7.Most assists, one playoff period: 3 -- Three assists by one player in one period of a playoff game has been recorded on 70 occasions. Gretzky has had three assists in one period five times

8.Most points, career: 382 -- 122 goals and 260 assists

9.Most points, one playoff year: 47 in 1985 (17 goals and 30 assists in 18 games)

10.Most points in final series: 13 in 1988 three goals and 10 assists (four games plus suspended game vs. Boston, three goals)

11.Most points, one playoff period: 4 (tied with nine other players)

12.Most short-handed goals, one playoff year: 3 (tied with five other players) 1983

13.Most short-handed goals, one playoff game: 2 (tied with eight other players) April 6, 1983

14.Most game winning goals in playoffs, career: 24 (tied with Brett Hull)

15.Most three-or-more goals games (hat trick): 10 (eight three-goal games, two four-goal games)

[edit] All-Star records (6)

1.Most All-Star game goals: 13 (in 18 games played)

2.Most All-Star game goals, one game: 4 (tied with three players) 1983 Campbell Conference

3.Most All-Star game goals, one period: 4 1983 Campbell Conference, third period

4.Most All-Star game assists, career: 12 (tied with four players)

5.Most All-Star game points, career: 25 (13 goals, 12 assists in 18 games)

6.Most All-Star game points, one period: 4 (tied with Mike Gartner and Adam Oates) 1983 Campbell Conference, third period (four goals)

Yes this is a very impressive list. But these records only show 1 thing: Mario and Wayne were the most prolific goal (and assist) scorers ever. It doesn't address the fact that they played in an era of high scoring and it doesn't say anything about comparing them to a Dman (like Orr) or a goaltender.

[BCHabnut]

Yes this is a very impressive list. But these records only show 1 thing: Mario and Wayne were the most prolific goal (and assist) scorers ever. It doesn't address the fact that they played in an era of high scoring and it doesn't say anything about comparing them to a Dman (like Orr) or a goaltender.

Meh,

Last time I checked, the team that scores more goals, wins. The times had something to do with it, but it's all retoric. Gretz is bar none the greatest player to lace up the skates.

[habs rule]

How the hell did we get so far off topic? What has "who's the best player" have to do with the hiring of Jacques?

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Bobby Orr was just as dominant points wise. 5 defensemen post expansion have posted

100+ points in a season (Leetch (1), Potvin (1), Macinnis (1) and Coffey (5).

Orr did it 6 years in a row during a much lower scoring era. And during those 6 years no defenseman came within 40 pts of him.

The 1980s, when Gretzky did the majority of his damage had 9 of the 10 highest scoring seasons in post expansion history.

The 10 highest are 1981-1990 (the years that just happened to be Gretzky's prime).

8 straight Norris trophies and the only defenseman in history to win the scoring title, 2 Conn Smythe trophies, 3 hart trophies

and over half his career played on one knee, in an era where knee surgery was career ending?

Done at the age of 26 (36 games over the last 3 years of his career hardly count), he would fall in your top ten?

That isn't even mentioning the difference between Gretzky and Orr on the defensive end.

It is hardly hands-down.

And BTW, there is a solid argument to be made that Plante is the greatest goaltender of all-time. He had great stats, longevity,

innovation, influence, awards and the Stanley Cups.

Killer post! Looking at that list of achievements, your really begin to recognize how prodigious Bobby Orr was. What a tragedy his career was cut so painfulyl short.

Anyone who doubts Plante's greatness is out of their minds. Sawchuck seems to have nudged him aside in the official narrative of the 1950s, but that likely has more to do with Toronto-centricity than analysis. While I was born after his era, I always rate Plante as #1 just because he combined phenomenal on-ice achievement with revolutions to the way his position was played. If you add the latter consideration into the mix, Plante and Roy are probably #1 and 2 all-time.

[Koivu11]

Alexstream Quote:

QUOTE (Koivu11 @ Jun 5 2009, 06:12 PM)

List of MY top 10 current NHL Coaches: (Base on experience and term)

Mike Babcock (Detroit Red Wings) arguable, ok

Lindy Ruff (Buffalo Sabres) arguable ok

Brent Sutter (New Jersey Devils) totally yes

Ron Wilson (Toronto Maple Leafs) arguable ok

Joel Quenneville (Chicago Blackhawks) arguable ok

Andy Murray (St. Louis Blues) underestimated yes

John Tortorella (New York Rangers) no no no. Short term yes

Pat Quinn (Edmonton Oilers) no no no. Short term yes

Terry Murray (Los Angeles Kings) terry who?

Dave Tippet (Dallas Stars) Mustache Hitchcock legacy? either I give too much credit to hitchcock either I don't give enough to Mustache.

Jacques Martin (Montreal Canadiens) yes, or higher

Claude Julien (Boston Bruins) now yes or higher, but not when he was with the habs... boring, not creative... even now, creativity problems.

Alain Vigneault (Vancouver Canucks) yes.

Ken Hitchcock (Columbus Blue Jackets) higher higher.

Paul Maurice (Carolina Hurricanes) higher higher

Barry Trotz (Nashville Predators) higher higher

John Stevens (Philadelphia Flyers) John who?

Bruce Boudreau (Washinton Capitals) yes, but ... even I with Ovie would make that list.

Randy Carlyle (Anaheim Ducks) hmmm. dunno

Dan Bylsma (Pittsburgh Penguins) higher way higher. just look the difference btw him and dofus therrien.

Todd McLellan (San Jose Sharks) bof

Peter DeBoer (Florida Panthers) i'd believe higher

Cory Clouston (Ottawa Senators)i'd believe higher

Rick Tocchet (Tampa Bay Lighting) next to be fired

Wayne Gretzky (Phoenix Coyotes) next to be fired

John Anderson (Atlanta Thrashers) next to be fired

Scott Gordon (New York Islanders) next to be fired

(This is a quick list, feel free to criticize and give your opinion)

The reason I put those coaches at the bottom Alexstream was because they have a small about of games coached (and Gretzky just sucks) and Terry Murray led the Washington Capitals in 1989-90 season, to the conference finals and led the Philadelphia Flyers to the Stanley Cup Final in 1996-97. He played in the NHL and coached in the AHL before becoming coach and he hias over 800 games under his belt. Just because he is with LA doesn't mean he sucks lol.

Pat Quinn did lead Canada to Gold medals so hes in that place because of experience not because of Toronto.

Tortorella is an effective coach, he has a cup after all.

Edited June 6, 2009 by Koivu11

[BCHabnut]

Killer post! Looking at that list of achievements, your really begin to recognize how prodigious Bobby Orr was. What a tragedy his career was cut so painfulyl short.

Anyone who doubts Plante's greatness is out of their minds. Sawchuck seems to have nudged him aside in the official narrative of the 1950s, but that likely has more to do with Toronto-centricity than analysis. While I was born after his era, I always rate Plante as #1 just because he combined phenomenal on-ice achievement with revolutions to the way his position was played. If you add the latter consideration into the mix, Plante and Roy are probably #1 and 2 all-time.

Please refer to the individual record list on the previous page.

[ForumGhost]

The fact is is that you can't compare goalie and d-men and forwards. I still say The Great One though.

[Peter Puck]

Meh,

Last time I checked, the team that scores more goals, wins. The times had something to do with it, but it's all retoric. Gretz is bar none the greatest player to lace up the skates.

So this means that all that matters is scoring, does it? If all that matters is who scores the most, then every save or blocked shot is just as good as a goal. I guarantee that Allan Bester had more saves per game then either Gretzky or Lemieux had goals. I don't think that means he was better but it does mean that he did more for the goals for vs goals against then either of them.

I do agree that Gretzky was probably the best ever. But the idea that this is settled by the fact that he has more goal scoring records than anyone else just isn't true.

[JoeLassister]

Pierre Dagenais FTW !!!!

[rafikz]

Pierre Groulx rumored to be the next goalie coach

http://www.rds.ca/canadien/chroniques/276196.html

[BCHabnut]

Pierre Groulx rumored to be the next goalie coach

http://www.rds.ca/canadien/chroniques/276196.html

Doesn`t look too impressive. Belfour and Vokoun.

Edited June 9, 2009 by BCHabnut

[alexstream]

Pierre Groulx rumored to be the next goalie coach

http://www.rds.ca/canadien/chroniques/276196.html

and that's how you start rumours

no, he's just avaiable and interested, will try to catch Jacques Martin to discuss with him.

[BCHabnut]

and that's how you start rumours

no, he's just avaiable and interested, will try to catch Jacques Martin to discuss with him.

Awesome. I'm a western canadian with grade 11 french, so I can comprehend most of what I read, but am too lazy to figure it out word for word. That IS how rumours are started.

[alexstream]

Awesome. I'm a western canadian with grade 11 french, so I can comprehend most of what I read, but am too lazy to figure it out word for word. That IS how rumours are started.

Yeah, then, next thing you know, Eklown cites us, Michel Villeneuve from CKAC cites Eklown (well doesn't name him, but says he's got a source) and BOUM...

next think you know, you're sure it's a done deal.

(slight exaggerations)

[CoRvInA]

So when do you think Bob Gainey will resign from GM? prior or after the Draft? Its sad but I think thats what the man is planning!

[BCHabnut]

Francois Allaire is in TO, so we won't have his services.

[MAK]

So when do you think Bob Gainey will resign from GM? prior or after the Draft? Its sad but I think thats what the man is planning!

I think he would do everybody a great favor by quiting. he got 5-6 years to put his team back on track and so far he has nothing to show up for except for a number of prospects that may play in montreal one day.

[habs rule]

I think he would do everybody a great favor by quiting. he got 5-6 years to put his team back on track and so far he has nothing to show up for except for a number of prospects that may play in montreal one day.

as always i will rise to Bobs defence, What the hell did we have 5 years ago that you are so proud of. We had nothing and no hope of anything, give your head a shake.

[alexstream]

as always i will rise to Bobs defence, What the hell did we have 5 years ago that you are so proud of. We had nothing and no hope of anything, give your head a shake.

[MAK]

as always i will rise to Bobs defence, What the hell did we have 5 years ago that you are so proud of. We had nothing and no hope of anything, give your head a shake.

What has he done in the last 5 years to get all the praises ??

we're on the verge of losing our captain and his assistants with nothing but pacioretty to show up for. so he can shove his 5 year plan...I dont think it'll take Burke five years to bring TO back on track.

I know you like bob to a point of ordering people who dont share your opinion to shut up(heck, just like religion, politics...)

but I believe your man crush for Gainey relies more on his reputation(as a player) than actual facts( as a gm of course)

oh yeah he won a cup..10 years ago !!

whats frustrating me about gainey is his lack of action and creativity.

failed to attract UFAs

refusal to trade key players at trade deadline for picks or prospects

seems to be the one that got screwed on every trade he made not involving kovy and rivet

Lost beauchemin due to lack of knowledge of the rules

his team haven't pass the second round.

the only reason we made the playoffs this year is we got more wins against florida. 5 year plan = being equal to Florida ???

Edited June 11, 2009 by marky_and_komi

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Gainey's record is mixed. No question.

Some pros: acquired Tanguay, Lang, Huet via trade; locked up Markov at reasonable rates; acquired Kovalev for a song; succesfully unloaded Theodore; excellent track record of drafting NHL-calibre players.

Some cons: idiotically threw away PPG C Mike Ribeiro despite a total lack of C in the organization, leaving a fundamental hole; hired and then re-signed Carbo; failed to re-sign Streit; failed to trade Souray at the deadline; lost Beauchemin and Hainsey for nothing; traded Huet at the deadline; failed to draft bona-fide all-star talent (Price aside).

As for this five-year plan business...the team had a catastrophic second-half collapse, compounded by lamentable injury problems. Maybe I'm the only one, but I just don't think you can assess a long-range building plan based on a bizarre three-month stretch in which key players got hurt, the team rebelled against the coach, the goalie suffered an injury and never recovered his game, most key players ridiculously under-performed, and basically everything that could go wrong, did go wrong. I keep coming back to the same old saw - you're never as good as you look when you're winning (2008) and never as bad as you look when you're losing (2009). Firing him would be an over-reaction to a wacko short-term spate of craziness IMHO.

Edited June 11, 2009 by The Chicoutimi Cucumber