Neech Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 For some reason I don't like Jokinen. It might be his face. But he'd still make a great addition to the team, and he fills the position of our most glaring weakness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazy26 Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 You do NOT WANT Antropov. The guy is a stiff 5 out of every 10 games. Why would you want to add a guy who was one of the leaders on a Leaf team that has missed the playoffs four straight years. The guy was a potential guy, if only he could put it all together. Well, he is 29 years old and people are still waiting. PASS Yeh, has everyone forgotten that Antropov has been a running joke for 80% of his career? He's big, but he plays like he's 5'6, and like Wamsley said, he never plays to his potential. Not on my team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexstream Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Yeh, has everyone forgotten that Antropov has been a running joke for 80% of his career? He's big, but he plays like he's 5'6, and like Wamsley said, he never plays to his potential. Not on my team. fits with Kovalev though. I wouldn't...no more europeans!!! I want some true Canadian talent brought into the Habs!!!! If Wayne cant get Olli going...nobody can yes, but Finns play the closest game to NA hockey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Hard to say on Jokenen, he has good skills, good size, realtively young. IS he being brought in to take Koivu's spot? If so do you ask Koivu to move? They need D in the worst way. May want to try Dandy in Brisby's spot tonight. Hamrlik, Brisby, Komi have been really bad of late. If they can't fix the D zone, they may not make the playoffs or get swept right out. Antropov would be a ridicolousd move, how many players can you have on a tema that only show up every now and again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCPetit Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 (edited) Hard to say on Jokenen, he has good skills, good size, realtively young. IS he being brought in to take Koivu's spot? If so do you ask Koivu to move? They need D in the worst way. May want to try Dandy in Brisby's spot tonight. Hamrlik, Brisby, Komi have been really bad of late. If they can't fix the D zone, they may not make the playoffs or get swept right out. Antropov would be a ridicolousd move, how many players can you have on a tema that only show up every now and again. Komisarek is the biggest disappointment, right now. I can't believe how bad he looks when he has the puck deep in the defensive zone. The only play he seems to see is dumping the puck on the board. Needless to say that it's a give away most of the time. Another minus in his case: did you remark that he rarely puts himself in position to keep the puck in the offensive zone? I guess that he plays with an injury, otherwise he is not the shadow of the player he was one year ago. As for Hamrlik and Brisebois: the former doesn't deserve half his salary (5,7 millions $) and the second won't be in the line-up next year. JCPetit Edited February 28, 2009 by JCPetit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 The more I think about it, the more I really think we need to make a serious, determined push for Jokinen. His value is artificially low right now, after a wasted 'I want out' season in Florida and an unsuccessful transplant to Phoenix, coupled with the fact that Phoenix's desire to move him NOT motivated by hockey considerations. Contrary to what's been suggsted, Gretzky is NOT some coaching mastermind and so I wouldn't draw too many conclusions from Jokinen's struggles in that wasteland. He is not the 'saviour' - but then, I don't particularly believe in saviours (remember when everyone was enraged at Bob for failing to sign Briere to that ridiculous contract ?); his contract is tolerable, he's young, big and talented - in short, this could be Bob's Big Chance, one of those rare opportunities where you take a chance and go for the big strike that adds a fundamental ingredient to your core, even if it means taking a risk with the chemistry of our young nucleus. I'll bet Higgins and Gorges, plus some indeterminate mix of other ingredients, could bring Jokinen back. (I'd try to keep Pleks because we'll still need him as a #2 when Koivu goes). That would be risky because of our already-shaking situation at D. And Higgins is only 25 and a natural leader of uncertain potential. But that's what I'm saying. You have to take a real risk; the risk for this particular player probably won't be too high (e.g., Florida wanted Komisarek for Jokinen, and I seriously doubt Phoenix will be as demanding); the potential reward is a fundamental re-jigging of our team profile, such that we suddenly have a #1 C to be reckoned with. Do we really think this team can win now? Or that it can win in the forseeable future with Plekanec as our future #1C? If not, then it's time to make The Big Move. Go, Bob, go!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ch_nl Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Trading deadline approaching. A lot of speculations about Montreal beeing interested in getting another defenceman. But I don't get it. Canadiens could have keept Streit. Pronger and Bouwmeester? Don't think so, there's no room for any of them. The only intersting players mentioned in this seasons frenzy are Smyth, Jokinen and Lecavalier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted February 28, 2009 Author Share Posted February 28, 2009 A lot of speculations about Montreal beeing interested in getting another defenceman. But I don't get it. Canadiens could have keept Streit. Pronger and Bouwmeester? Don't think so, there's no room for any of them. How often did Streit actually play D, though? While he was with us, he really never showed signs of being a solid defensive player. I don't care how good you are on the point on the powerplay, you're not worth 4 million if that's the only situation you're useful for. For that kind of money, you need a guy to play more significant minutes than Streit ever would have gotten with us. His defensive play with the Islanders suggest he could have handled a more significant role in Montreal, but hindsight is 20/20. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 If they pick up another defender, though, they can flip one of them to Tampa in a package for Vinny. That's what T-Bay insists is in the package: a top-rated defender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexstream Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Trading deadline approaching. A lot of speculations about Montreal beeing interested in getting another defenceman. But I don't get it. Canadiens could have keept Streit. Pronger and Bouwmeester? Don't think so, there's no room for any of them. The only intersting players mentioned in this seasons frenzy are Smyth, Jokinen and Lecavalier. in what world do you live? We could have kept Streit?? two words: FOUR MILLION yeah, we could have kept Ryder too 4M or Souray (he didn't accept our 5.75M, so, what? 6M? 6.5M?) How often did Streit actually play D, though? While he was with us, he really never showed signs of being a solid defensive player. I don't care how good you are on the point on the powerplay, you're not worth 4 million if that's the only situation you're useful for. For that kind of money, you need a guy to play more significant minutes than Streit ever would have gotten with us. His defensive play with the Islanders suggest he could have handled a more significant role in Montreal, but hindsight is 20/20. yeah, i agree. Streit rarely played D, he was only playing the point. So they hoped a guy like Tanguay or one of the Kosts could do the job, or could replace Markov who'd do the job. That was a pretty safe bet. And actually, Schneider is doing a better defensive job than Streit... and is also scoring. Proving that Streit is a tool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wamsley01 Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 The more I think about it, the more I really think we need to make a serious, determined push for Jokinen. His value is artificially low right now, after a wasted 'I want out' season in Florida and an unsuccessful transplant to Phoenix, coupled with the fact that Phoenix's desire to move him NOT motivated by hockey considerations. Contrary to what's been suggsted, Gretzky is NOT some coaching mastermind and so I wouldn't draw too many conclusions from Jokinen's struggles in that wasteland. He is not the 'saviour' - but then, I don't particularly believe in saviours (remember when everyone was enraged at Bob for failing to sign Briere to that ridiculous contract ?); his contract is tolerable, he's young, big and talented - in short, this could be Bob's Big Chance, one of those rare opportunities where you take a chance and go for the big strike that adds a fundamental ingredient to your core, even if it means taking a risk with the chemistry of our young nucleus. I'll bet Higgins and Gorges, plus some indeterminate mix of other ingredients, could bring Jokinen back. (I'd try to keep Pleks because we'll still need him as a #2 when Koivu goes). That would be risky because of our already-shaking situation at D. And Higgins is only 25 and a natural leader of uncertain potential. But that's what I'm saying. You have to take a real risk; the risk for this particular player probably won't be too high (e.g., Florida wanted Komisarek for Jokinen, and I seriously doubt Phoenix will be as demanding); the potential reward is a fundamental re-jigging of our team profile, such that we suddenly have a #1 C to be reckoned with. Do we really think this team can win now? Or that it can win in the forseeable future with Plekanec as our future #1C? If not, then it's time to make The Big Move. Go, Bob, go!!!! I agree 100% Remember last season when you wanted to obtain a 48 pt Marleau for the 82 pt Kovalev and everybody thought you were nuts. It was the perfect buying and selling opportunity. Same with Jokinen right now. People always look at what is right in front of them. Jokinen is undervalued right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MFT77 Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Komisarek is the biggest disappointment, right now. I can't believe how bad he looks when he has the puck deep in the defensive zone. The only play he seems to see is dumping the puck on the board. Needless to say that it's a give away most of the time. Another minus in his case: did you remark that he rarely puts himself in position to keep the puck in the offensive zone? I guess that he plays with an injury, otherwise he is not the shadow of the player he was one year ago. As for Hamrlik and Brisebois: the former doesn't deserve half his salary (5,7 millions $) and the second won't be in the line-up next year. JCPetit I have to agree that Komi's play is really poor lately. Maybe he is still injured, that would explain alot, cause his play is terrible and i hate the thought of him getting a huge contract. Nothing over $4 million per. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Puck Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 (edited) The more I think about it, the more I really think we need to make a serious, determined push for Jokinen. His value is artificially low right now, after a wasted 'I want out' season in Florida and an unsuccessful transplant to Phoenix, coupled with the fact that Phoenix's desire to move him NOT motivated by hockey considerations. Contrary to what's been suggsted, Gretzky is NOT some coaching mastermind and so I wouldn't draw too many conclusions from Jokinen's struggles in that wasteland. He is not the 'saviour' - but then, I don't particularly believe in saviours (remember when everyone was enraged at Bob for failing to sign Briere to that ridiculous contract ?); his contract is tolerable, he's young, big and talented - in short, this could be Bob's Big Chance, one of those rare opportunities where you take a chance and go for the big strike that adds a fundamental ingredient to your core, even if it means taking a risk with the chemistry of our young nucleus. I'll bet Higgins and Gorges, plus some indeterminate mix of other ingredients, could bring Jokinen back. (I'd try to keep Pleks because we'll still need him as a #2 when Koivu goes). That would be risky because of our already-shaking situation at D. And Higgins is only 25 and a natural leader of uncertain potential. But that's what I'm saying. You have to take a real risk; the risk for this particular player probably won't be too high (e.g., Florida wanted Komisarek for Jokinen, and I seriously doubt Phoenix will be as demanding); the potential reward is a fundamental re-jigging of our team profile, such that we suddenly have a #1 C to be reckoned with. Do we really think this team can win now? Or that it can win in the forseeable future with Plekanec as our future #1C? If not, then it's time to make The Big Move. Go, Bob, go!!!! I really agree with this analysis. Jokinen is the perfect target. He's signed for 1 more year so he isn't a rental and we won't be stuck with him long term if he doesn't work out. I'd really like to keep Higgins though. I think its hard for us to work out a trade for Jokinen since we have to send some salary back because Phoenix is close to the floor. I think a more likely deal is something like O'bryne + Dandenault for Morris (who just announced he wont play until traded) Edited February 28, 2009 by Peter Puck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 (edited) I agree 100% Remember last season when you wanted to obtain a 48 pt Marleau for the 82 pt Kovalev and everybody thought you were nuts. It was the perfect buying and selling opportunity. Same with Jokinen right now. People always look at what is right in front of them. Jokinen is undervalued right now. I also agree with his post as well but trading an 82 point Kovalev for a 48 point Marleau is nuts, if only because a winning team shouldn't be trading it's best player at any cost unless it has to. Besides, do you really think Marleau would be having his Big Turnaround season in Montreal without Joe Thornton (and Setoguchi) on his wing? Not a chance. But now that I think about it - I think The Chicoutimi Cucumber wanted to trade Koivu for Marleau, not Kovalev. A bit less nuts. EDIT: @Peter Puck: We have definitely been negotiating with Phoenix over Morris but now that we have Schneiderman, I'm not sure we're going to be willing to give up a decent young defenseman for him. We'd also have a problem finding the capspace to do it. Gainey's first priority is probably bringing in a centre like Reinprecht but maybe that's over now that he's brought in Metropolit. Edited February 28, 2009 by BTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 I think a more likely deal is something like O'bryne + Dandenault for Morris (who just announced he wont play until traded) It's rare you hear of a player telling the team he won't play until he's traded at this time of year. Should also note that the proposed deal would not work under the cap - Habs are taking too much money back (O'Byrne's in Hamilton so his salary doesn't count right now). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbhatt Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 But now that I think about it - I think The Chicoutimi Cucumber wanted to trade Koivu for Marleau If only that had happened.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wamsley01 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 (edited) I also agree with his post as well but trading an 82 point Kovalev for a 48 point Marleau is nuts, if only because a winning team shouldn't be trading it's best player at any cost unless it has to. Besides, do you really think Marleau would be having his Big Turnaround season in Montreal without Joe Thornton (and Setoguchi) on his wing? Not a chance. But now that I think about it - I think The Chicoutimi Cucumber wanted to trade Koivu for Marleau, not Kovalev. A bit less nuts. EDIT: @Peter Puck: We have definitely been negotiating with Phoenix over Morris but now that we have Schneiderman, I'm not sure we're going to be willing to give up a decent young defenseman for him. We'd also have a problem finding the capspace to do it. Gainey's first priority is probably bringing in a centre like Reinprecht but maybe that's over now that he's brought in Metropolit. Maybe it was Koivu, but I can't remember. The Habs were not going to win the Cup last year, so dealing Kovalev would not have bothered me in the least. They overachieved, if Gainey decided to run at the Cup seriously last season he would not have dealt Huet. They had a year where everything went right, Gainey was assessing talent. And he will continue to do so, when he believes they are a true contender he will pull the trigger. But the point is, the majority of people ignore the past when they assess a player. Which is why it was ridiculous that people could not see Kovalev's 2009 faceplant. And funny that you credit Thornton and SETOGUCHI! Marleau has two PPG seasons in his career. Thornton being credited is understandable, but Setoguchi has proven nothing. Edited March 1, 2009 by Wamsley01 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexstream Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=269203&...os=topStory_nhl at least that's what this article suggests. Guerin was pulled out of the lineup just after pregame warmup. He has a NMC. Therefore it's suggested that he's been moved pending his approval. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Because you're looking at stats and thinking that his numbers are based on great linemates and a great team. But watch him play, he's a first line talent and possibly as good a linemate for Marleau as anyone on the Habs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted March 1, 2009 Author Share Posted March 1, 2009 Derek Morris is refusing to play until he is traded. http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=269167&...s=headlines_nhl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 I'm flattered people actually remember my fussin' For the record, I wanted trade Koivu for Marleau. But Wamsley is also right - I was an advocate of trading Kovalev at the end of last season, and this year too, for the very reasons he identifies. And I still think both moves would have been justified, although the Koivu thing is higher-risk than the Kovalev idea, because I, unlike many around here, suspect Koivu really is a key leader on this team. Anyway, water under the bridge - now Bob, get us Jokinen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoZed Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Derek Morris is refusing to play until he is traded. http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=269167&...s=headlines_nhl I always liked him. I'd welcome him arms opened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoRvInA Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 I have a bad feeling...... were ending up with Bill Guerin tomorrow morning! he fits the Gainey grabbing cheap rentals... with wide range performance ability could end up being useless pick up or the chance Guerin was waiting for to shine. (much like Kovy 5 years ago) anywho hope we trade nothing more than the rights to Perezhogen for him ( or realistically Metropolit, or Chips or O'brian ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexstream Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 I have a bad feeling...... were ending up with Bill Guerin tomorrow morning! he fits the Gainey grabbing cheap rentals... with wide range performance ability could end up being useless pick up or the chance Guerin was waiting for to shine. (much like Kovy 5 years ago) anywho hope we trade nothing more than the rights to Perezhogen for him ( or realistically Metropolit, or Chips or O'brian ... Guerin = 4.5M it means : either Dandenault + Metropolit + Bouillon or Kovalev or Koivu or Markov or Hamrlik or Higgins + Plekanec + Komisarek or .... none of the above Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoRvInA Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 none of the above I'm more for that! but i think the math is different than what u suggest... our cap space is at what 500k? which is roughly half of what's left of guerin's contract... and that would reduce the amount of salary having to be moved...I believe so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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