Machine of Loving Grace Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 Cole to Colorado? Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 Cole to Colorado? IF Cole is going to Colorado O'Reilly + a pick needs to be coming back. Thats only if it's only Cole going the other way. Cole is an established 20 goal scorer. O'Reilly hasn't broke 20 in his career. If anything else like Weber or Kaberle goes the other way, we better be picking up another roster player (Erik Johnson). There's no way Cole is going the other way unless we're getting pieces for our future coming back. MB doesn't appear to be a guy to just let players go for nothing. He seems to be the type of GM that likes t win in every trade, something we need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForumGhost Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 So, Habs seem to be mentioned a lot when people discuss where O'Reilly could end up if he's traded. I didn't know too much about him before. His offensive number don't blow me away, but Cullen seems convinced he is a legit top line center. Obviously not a Getzlaf or Crosby, but as a 2 way, totally package guy, more like Bergeron or Plekanecs. Should/can the Habs make a play for him? Dreger says that the talks begin with a top prospect and a roster player. Habs obviously have Tinordi and Beaulieu which may fit that bill, but I would personally not want to touch them unless something a little more than O'Reilly was involved. Or has the emergence of Diaz, Emlyn, Subban and co. make one of the two a little redundant? Perhaps Habs could swing a deal with some combination of Eller, Weber, Leblanc and picks? If O'Reilly is what Cullen makes him out to be, Pleks and O'Reilly down the middle could be one of the best 1-2 offensive/defensive punches down the middle in the NHL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovett's Magnatones Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 I think the team we have is good enough, and if anything, they're asking way too much. O'Reilly isn't going to sign, they shoud be happy to take Eller an a 2nd round pick for him. This is shaping up like the Nash trade, when they wanted the moon and the stars and they got Brandon Dubinsky. Good enough with the prospects we have coming through anyways. I wouldn't trade Eller and Tinordi for him. I would do Desharnais, Beaulieu and a 3rd. Tops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PMAC Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 IF Cole is going to Colorado O'Reilly + a pick needs to be coming back. Thats only if it's only Cole going the other way. Cole is an established 20 goal scorer. O'Reilly hasn't broke 20 in his career. If anything else like Weber or Kaberle goes the other way, we better be picking up another roster player (Erik Johnson). There's no way Cole is going the other way unless we're getting pieces for our future coming back. MB doesn't appear to be a guy to just let players go for nothing. He seems to be the type of GM that likes t win in every trade, something we need. Every GM wants to win every trade...our problem is we have had GM's who thought they were winning--or at least breaking even--when they--obviously to everyone else-- were not. The prob with O' Reilly is not sending Cole. That trade could have tremendous upside for us. The problem is that RoR doesn't, apparently, want to sign a reasonable contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForumGhost Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 I don't think I would even wanna trade Beaulieu, personally. Desharnais is a solid roster player. Him plus Weber and another prospect like Ellis or Kristo should be enough, but I'm sure there will be another GM who would offer more. I could see Toronto going all out for him since they still have no one to play with Kessel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 As I have said before, there is no way that mb could sign him to what he wants after the showdown with PK. He would lose the respect of everyone in the room. O'reilly may be a very good hockey player some day but right now he is average and not worth the cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PMAC Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 So, Habs seem to be mentioned a lot when people discuss where O'Reilly could end up if he's traded. I didn't know too much about him before. His offensive number don't blow me away, but Cullen seems convinced he is a legit top line center. Obviously not a Getzlaf or Crosby, but as a 2 way, totally package guy, more like Bergeron or Plekanecs. Should/can the Habs make a play for him? Dreger says that the talks begin with a top prospect and a roster player. Habs obviously have Tinordi and Beaulieu which may fit that bill, but I would personally not want to touch them unless something a little more than O'Reilly was involved. Or has the emergence of Diaz, Emlyn, Subban and co. make one of the two a little redundant? Perhaps Habs could swing a deal with some combination of Eller, Weber, Leblanc and picks? If O'Reilly is what Cullen makes him out to be, Pleks and O'Reilly down the middle could be one of the best 1-2 offensive/defensive punches down the middle in the NHL. As I just posted in the Permanent Rumour thread, the problem with RoR is not the potential give--which i already trust MB to manage, but his apparent refusal of a bridge contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyhasbeen Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 If he ain't worth 5mill to the Avs why is he worth that to us? Let him sit out the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 Every GM wants to win every trade...our problem is we have had GM's who thought they were winning--or at least breaking even--when they--obviously to everyone else-- were not. The prob with O' Reilly is not sending Cole. That trade could have tremendous upside for us. The problem is that RoR doesn't, apparently, want to sign a reasonable contract. Your mistaken what winning a trade means. In the general term winning a trade is getting the best value in a deal. Cole for a 1st rounder, we win that trade, Cole for O'Reilly, Avs win that trade. An accomplished player for an unaccomplished one. Just had to clairify that. The thing about trading someone like Cole of O'Reilly is that it frees up $4.5m to use on the O'Reilly contract. O'Reilly and his agent will know all the negotiating he did with Colorado will mean nothing once he is traded. He played hardball with the Avs and if he gets traded, he lost the staring contest. He'll have to start over and may very well sign for less than what the Avs were offering, it's something him and his agent will have to accept. If he gets traded to anybody, I wouldn't expect him to get the $5m per he was looking for, unless the team needs to burn money (Islanders). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsfan Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 as mentionned by habs rule and PMAC, O'Reilly wants a long term deal worth approx 5 million per year. How in the world can Bergevin show his face in the locker room (after having gone to war with P.K.) if he were to give O'Reilly a long term deal?? I seriously doubt the Habs will get this kid. The only way it'll happen is if O'reilly is willing to take a bridge contract (2-3 years) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 I think the team we have is good enough, and if anything, they're asking way too much. O'Reilly isn't going to sign, they shoud be happy to take Eller an a 2nd round pick for him. This is shaping up like the Nash trade, when they wanted the moon and the stars and they got Brandon Dubinsky. Good enough with the prospects we have coming through anyways. I wouldn't trade Eller and Tinordi for him. I would do Desharnais, Beaulieu and a 3rd. Tops. Eller and a second, maybe, but the DD, Beaulieu and a 3rd is way too much. Even take the 3rd out and it's still too much. DD has better numbers than O'Reilly. Id DD is in that trade with anythign else, there better be more than O'Reilly coming back. as mentionned by habs rule and PMAC, O'Reilly wants a long term deal worth approx 5 million per year. How in the world can Bergevin show his face in the locker room (after having gone to war with P.K.) if he were to give O'Reilly a long term deal?? I seriously doubt the Habs will get this kid. The only way it'll happen is if O'reilly is willing to take a bridge contract (2-3 years) You have to believe that after this failed hold out with the Avs, O'Reilly and his agent have to be reconsidering what he's worth. They held out for the long term $5m per deal and lost, he'll probably settle for a smaller contract now. They have to realize that if he does get traded and not signed he'll have to go to arbitration and there's no way in hell he's getting $5m per for 5 years from arbitration, especially since the recent trend for signings are pointing at bridge contracts. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't arbitration contracts 1 year only? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sakiqc Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 If we're going to overspend on a guy, I'd rather wait for a real one and not redo the mistake we made the year when we went signing/trading for Gomez, Gionta and Cammy. I'd overspend for a Getzlaf or Perry, but O'Reilly at 5M? Come on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't arbitration contracts 1 year only? 1 or 2 years only for arbitration deals. Players who are only 1 year from UFA can only get 1 year deals but others can get 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 I'm not sure if the Avs would win a cole for o'reilly trade. Everything I read about him suggests future 1st or 2nd rounder. On the other side, while Cole had a career year last year, his play and some if his comments at the start of the year validate my complaint about the habs including an extra, year on top of the higher salary for him. Your mistaken what winning a trade means. In the general term winning a trade is getting the best value in a deal. Cole for a 1st rounder, we win that trade, Cole for O'Reilly, Avs win that trade. An accomplished player for an unaccomplished one. Just had to clairify that. The thing about trading someone like Cole of O'Reilly is that it frees up $4.5m to use on the O'Reilly contract. O'Reilly and his agent will know all the negotiating he did with Colorado will mean nothing once he is traded. He played hardball with the Avs and if he gets traded, he lost the staring contest. He'll have to start over and may very well sign for less than what the Avs were offering, it's something him and his agent will have to accept. If he gets traded to anybody, I wouldn't expect him to get the $5m per he was looking for, unless the team needs to burn money (Islanders). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trizzak Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 So, Habs seem to be mentioned a lot when people discuss where O'Reilly could end up if he's traded. I didn't know too much about him before. His offensive number don't blow me away, but Cullen seems convinced he is a legit top line center. Obviously not a Getzlaf or Crosby, but as a 2 way, totally package guy, more like Bergeron or Plekanecs. Should/can the Habs make a play for him? Dreger says that the talks begin with a top prospect and a roster player. Habs obviously have Tinordi and Beaulieu which may fit that bill, but I would personally not want to touch them unless something a little more than O'Reilly was involved. Or has the emergence of Diaz, Emlyn, Subban and co. make one of the two a little redundant? Perhaps Habs could swing a deal with some combination of Eller, Weber, Leblanc and picks? If O'Reilly is what Cullen makes him out to be, Pleks and O'Reilly down the middle could be one of the best 1-2 offensive/defensive punches down the middle in the NHL. Mind you, the Habs are mentioned in pretty much any trade rumour... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 He's not coming. Stop talking about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 I'm not sure if the Avs would win a cole for o'reilly trade. Everything I read about him suggests future 1st or 2nd rounder. On the other side, while Cole had a career year last year, his play and some if his comments at the start of the year validate my complaint about the habs including an extra, year on top of the higher salary for him. Cole's last 3 seasons: 204GP - 72G - 57A - 129P - 0.63PPG O'Reilly's last 3 seasons: 236GP - 39G - 68 A - 107P - 0.45PPG Cole has a ring, O'Reilly doesn't. Value wise, you can't sell the farm when O'Reilly may never have another 50 pts year. I'm guessing if Colorado thought he was going to be a 50+ point player every year he would of gotten the deal he was looking for. In a Cole for O'Reilly trade, I firmly believe Colorado would win. Cole has at least another year of production and 3+ years of leadership left in him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 He's not coming. Stop talking about it. Exactly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PMAC Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Your mistaken what winning a trade means. In the general term winning a trade is getting the best value in a deal. Cole for a 1st rounder, we win that trade, Cole for O'Reilly, Avs win that trade. An accomplished player for an unaccomplished one. Just had to clairify that. The thing about trading someone like Cole of O'Reilly is that it frees up $4.5m to use on the O'Reilly contract. O'Reilly and his agent will know all the negotiating he did with Colorado will mean nothing once he is traded. He played hardball with the Avs and if he gets traded, he lost the staring contest. He'll have to start over and may very well sign for less than what the Avs were offering, it's something him and his agent will have to accept. If he gets traded to anybody, I wouldn't expect him to get the $5m per he was looking for, unless the team needs to burn money (Islanders). Actually, I am not mistaken. In my definition, winning a trade means that the team wins for the long term not the short term. And, while Cole might outperform RoR for the short term, over the next 2-5 seasons that is highly unlikely. Also, given Cole's play this season--his unwillingness/inability to drive the net every game-- could indicate his traditional slow start or it could indicate the start of his decline. Potential for a declining assest. Just had to clarify that. Who won the Ignila for Joe Niewendik trade.. Short term obviously Dallas-- Long term Calgary. Also, to be clear, I was not advocating for this trade--nor comparing RoR to Iginla. I was saying that given his work so far I trust MB to do his job and I do not believe that RoR will be in MTL unless they could get him to agree to a contract similar in structure to PK's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Cole for Oreilly would be one the biggest steals ever for the Habs. Orielly will be a perneial 60+ point man and hes a kid. Colorado sucks and arent making a cup run this year or next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 O'Reilly is not coming to Montreal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PMAC Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 O'Reilly is not coming to Montreal. I agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbp Posted February 24, 2013 Share Posted February 24, 2013 Not worth Tinordi or Bealieau, would be an terrible terrible trade as both are top defensive prospects/who alone would be worth more or as much when in NHL. Also, how would he fit in our lineup? We have Pleks and Chuckie in the middle for the foreseeable future and Eller has been doing well. I would be really surprised if they traded for him and incredibly disappointed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted February 24, 2013 Share Posted February 24, 2013 Yes, just to echo bbp, do we really need help at C anyway? Eller has been showing signs of life; Pleks is back to top form; Desharnais had a rocky start but is rounding into form; and Galy has slick moves up the wazoo. If we develop Eller and Galy properly, we will be just fine down the middle going forward. Words I never thought I'd write (maybe it's the booze talking)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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