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28 minutes ago, Dalhabs said:

4M/year 5 years? Wouldnt be surprised if he wants something like that.

 

I think that's a bit high - I think the Armia/Byron contract (4 x $3.4M) may be more attainable.

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1 hour ago, tomh009 said:

I don't think there is any question that Lehkonen can contribute even after the rebuild. He's only 26, he's outstanding defensively, and he can even score sometimes when teamed up with better linemates (as we saw with Toffoli and Suzuki). And he gives it 100% every night. Kind of like Danault in many ways ...

 

The questions are really based on whether his contract will fit -- only Gorton and Hughes know -- and whether another team might be willing to pay more than he is worth to the Habs.

If someone is willing to give up a 1st move him. Otherwise, May as well keep him until at least the next deadline. If we didn’t already have Armia, Byron being overpaid for multiple years. I’d want to resign him - I like him better than the other two - more consistent effort than Armia, and far less injury prone than Byron.

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54 minutes ago, Dalhabs said:

4M/year 5 years? Wouldnt be surprised if he wants something like that.

No way I’d want to pay anything close to that for Lekhonan, regardless of how much I like him.  We already overpaid players like him. There is no way I’d pay him that much.

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23 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

If someone is willing to give up a 1st move him. Otherwise, May as well keep him until at least the next deadline. If we didn’t already have Armia, Byron being overpaid for multiple years. I’d want to resign him - I like him better than the other two - more consistent effort than Armia, and far less injury prone than Byron.

 

I agree, I would trade him for a 1st, otherwise keep him.  No way I would take a 2nd unless there was something else attached that was attractive. The chances of getting a player as good as Arturri with a late 2nd round pick are pretty low. 

 

Far more consistent than Armia, with Arturri you know what you are getting every night, 

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50 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

What would be a more realistic contract?

 

Id want him locked down for 3m.  Other than that i can find another bottom 6er.  

 

I think if we overpay it has to be legit top line or top pair guys.  Im tired of overpaying depth.

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1 hour ago, Commandant said:

Id want him locked down for 3m.  Other than that i can find another bottom 6er.  

 

I think if we overpay it has to be legit top line or top pair guys.  Im tired of overpaying depth.

Depends on term ... if the rebuild/tool/set goes as hoped he would in a couple of years again be an expensive 4th liner ... just more expensive

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43 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

Depends on term ... if the rebuild/tool/set goes as hoped he would in a couple of years again be an expensive 4th liner ... just more expensive

 

I think Arturri is the perfect 3rd line player, I don't think of him as a 4th line player.  He usually plays against the other team's top players, not usually a role given to 4th liners. 

 

It's a question of what is he worth to the Habs now?  His value is less to a rebuilding team like the Habs right now than a contending team.  Depends on the offer they and/or how much it costs them  to resign him. 

 

I have been following the Rangers fan forums and a lot of their fans have Lehkonen penciled in on their 3rd line. Its interesting to see what they would offer, they know a 2nd alone isn't enough but a 1st is likely too much. They have been offering stuff like a 2nd and Julien Gauthier. At least that's in the ballpark. None of their fans want Chiarot for a 1st.

 

Now the Leaf fans think all their prospects will be superstars and don't want to give anything up.  At least the Ranger fans are realistic. It's fun to read the other forums and see how their fans value their own and other players. In the end that doesn't matter though, the GM makes the call. 

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4 hours ago, Commandant said:

 

Id want him locked down for 3m.  Other than that i can find another bottom 6er.  

 

I think if we overpay it has to be legit top line or top pair guys.  Im tired of overpaying depth.

This was about what I was thinking. 2.5 to 3

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4 hours ago, GHT120 said:

Depends on term ... if the rebuild/tool/set goes as hoped he would in a couple of years again be an expensive 4th liner ... just more expensive

Right. So, if they decide that he's a keeper, they should give him four or maybe even five years. He is still young, has been consistent and not injury-prone so term is not so risky as long as the cap hit is acceptable.

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25 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

Right. So, if they decide that he's a keeper, they should give him four or maybe even five years. He is still young, has been consistent and not injury-prone so term is not so risky as long as the cap hit is acceptable.

Not just for next season but for the role he can reasonably be expected to be filling in years 3/4/5

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2 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

Not just for next season but for the role he can reasonably be expected to be filling in years 3/4/5

That's indeed a question for Gorton and Hughes, what they expect his future value to be.

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20 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

Not just for next season but for the role he can reasonably be expected to be filling in years 3/4/5

 

I think in 3/4/5 years he will be filling exactly the same role he is filling now, a shut down winger but hopefully on a much better team then. As I mentioned on another thread the fact he is -3 on a bad team is pretty impressive.  

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14 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

I think in 3/4/5 years he will be filling exactly the same role he is filling now, a shut down winger but hopefully on a much better team then. As I mentioned on another thread the fact he is -3 on a bad team is pretty impressive.  

https://www.habseyesontheprize.com/2022/2/27/22952101/artturi-lehkonen-trade-rumours-montreal-canadiens-ottawa-senators-goals-highlights

 

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He’ll be 27 this July. Let’s assume that our rebuild takes 3-4 years. He’ll be 30-31 by the time we really need his moxy, defensive play, and leadership for playoff purposes. I can see him still being effective at that age, but I can also see him starting to wane around that point. Makes more sense to trade him now, with his value likely as high as it is ever going to be. Meanwhile, we can bring up some of that supposedly strong depth from the farm and let one of them grow into the player that Lehks currently is by the time we’re ready to get serious.

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I sure hope that we'll be a playoff team already in the spring of 2025 (when he will be 29). If he were signed to a reasonable four-year deal, he'd be 31 at the 2027 trade deadline, and still have trade value at that point. His value might be less than it is today, but then we would have got four years' worth of value from him playing for the Habs.

 

Anyway, it really comes down to what HuGo's rebuild plan looks like, whether Lehkonen fits into that picture, and whether other teams are offering more than his value would be to the Habs. Alas, we don't know the answers to any of those, so we are left with just each of our opinions, and no facts. 🙂

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I agree that his value now is pretty close to it's peak. I also think Arturri is one of those guys who will age well because he is tremendously fit, skates smoothly, plays intelligently and doesn't need to grind like a Gallagher to be effective. 

 

I think most are on the same page here, anything less than a 1st round pick or a top notch young prospect and I wouldn't even consider it. I think Hughes-Gorton know his value and will make a good decision. 

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I hear that it is necessary to trade Leks due to the salary cap. https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/canadiens-lehkonen-boosts-trade-value-in-playoff-style-win-over-senators/

 

I think if the return is outstanding, trade him. If not, why not give Arizona a pick to take Byron? And keep him. Even better, sucker some GM enamoured of the puck possession, grinding beast that Armia was last playoffs into taking him off your hands. If the Leafs can dump Ritchie at an affordable price there is no reason why Hugh/Gort should allow the salary cap to be the defining guide of their actions and I don’t think that they will.

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22 minutes ago, PMAC said:

I hear that it is necessary to trade Leks due to the salary cap. https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/canadiens-lehkonen-boosts-trade-value-in-playoff-style-win-over-senators/

 

I think if the return is outstanding, trade him. If not, why not give Arizona a pick to take Byron? And keep him. Even better, sucker some GM enamoured of the puck possession, grinding beast that Armia was last playoffs into taking him off your hands. If the Leafs can dump Ritchie at an affordable price there is no reason why Hugh/Gort should allow the salary cap to be the defining guide of their actions and I don’t think that they will.

 

Ritchie has one year left.  Armia has three.  If it cost Toronto a second-rounder to dump Ritchie, it will cost considerably more than that to move Armia who makes more and somehow has produced less.  That's why they won't go that route.  Maybe they look to flip him for another underachieving depth guy but in terms of clearing him off the books outright, the cost would be way more than they should be willing to pay.

 

Byron with one year left is palatable but if they value his off-ice contributions (and it seems like they do), that could make him one of the veterans they choose to keep around.  I also don't think his presence is leading to them likely moving Lehkonen because his deal is nearly up anyway.

 

I don't see Lehkonen signing long-term for $3 million or less.  Frankly, he has no reason to being a year away from hitting the open market where he'll get more than that.  We know they need to move money out simply to get compliant for next season (let alone wanting to make a splash in free agency which is being suggested).  But if you have to trade more than what you'd get in a trade for Lehkonen to get out of Armia's deal and you're in a spot where the win/loss record may not matter for a year or two, is it worth paying the premium to effectively keep Lehkonen?  Probably not.

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8 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

 

Ritchie has one year left.  Armia has three.  If it cost Toronto a second-rounder to dump Ritchie, it will cost considerably more than that to move Armia who makes more and somehow has produced less.  That's why they won't go that route.  Maybe they look to flip him for another underachieving depth guy but in terms of clearing him off the books outright, the cost would be way more than they should be willing to pay.

 

Byron with one year left is palatable but if they value his off-ice contributions (and it seems like they do), that could make him one of the veterans they choose to keep around.  I also don't think his presence is leading to them likely moving Lehkonen because his deal is nearly up anyway.

 

I don't see Lehkonen signing long-term for $3 million or less.  Frankly, he has no reason to being a year away from hitting the open market where he'll get more than that.  We know they need to move money out simply to get compliant for next season (let alone wanting to make a splash in free agency which is being suggested).  But if you have to trade more than what you'd get in a trade for Lehkonen to get out of Armia's deal and you're in a spot where the win/loss record may not matter for a year or two, is it worth paying the premium to effectively keep Lehkonen?  Probably not.

I take your point, but I used the word “sucker” in regards to Armia as I am hoping that they somehow trade him without giving up too many assets. Also, Lekhonen’s price point for re-signing has not been brought up in the media as a factor in the decision to trade him and it should be. 

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4 minutes ago, PMAC said:

I take your point, but I used the word “sucker” in regards to Armia as I am hoping that they somehow trade him without giving up too many assets. Also, Lekhonen’s price point for re-signing has not been brought up in the media as a factor in the decision to trade him and it should be. 

 

Recent playoff performance matters but Armia has been so truly awful this season that even the dumbest of GMs know that adding his contract would be a big risk.  I'd love to see it happen where someone takes on the contract without throwing another anchor Montreal's way but I don't see that being feasible.

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1 hour ago, dlbalr said:

 

Ritchie has one year left.  Armia has three.  If it cost Toronto a second-rounder to dump Ritchie, it will cost considerably more than that to move Armia who makes more and somehow has produced less.  That's why they won't go that route.  Maybe they look to flip him for another underachieving depth guy but in terms of clearing him off the books outright, the cost would be way more than they should be willing to pay.

 

Byron with one year left is palatable but if they value his off-ice contributions (and it seems like they do), that could make him one of the veterans they choose to keep around.  I also don't think his presence is leading to them likely moving Lehkonen because his deal is nearly up anyway.

 

I don't see Lehkonen signing long-term for $3 million or less.  Frankly, he has no reason to being a year away from hitting the open market where he'll get more than that.  We know they need to move money out simply to get compliant for next season (let alone wanting to make a splash in free agency which is being suggested).  But if you have to trade more than what you'd get in a trade for Lehkonen to get out of Armia's deal and you're in a spot where the win/loss record may not matter for a year or two, is it worth paying the premium to effectively keep Lehkonen?  Probably not.

 

The Leafs got a defenceman back in the deal for Ritchie... (as well as Dzingel, who immediately was lost on waivers, so )

 

Even assuming Dzingel's value was nil (he also cost nothing to dump)

 

For a second rounder (3 years from now) OR a third rounder now....  they got Lybushkin and dumped ritchie's contract.

 

I'm not sure how much of that value to assign to Ritchie and how much to assign to Lybushkin, but certainly there is some value in Lybushkin too.  Then there is the time of the picks. 

 

Is it 4th now if there is no Lybushkin and no waiting 3 years, to just get rid of 1.5 years of ritchie? is it a 5th? I don't know... but this isn't the Fleury trade, or the Marleau trade (to Carolina) or other trades where it's contract and pick for future considerations.

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4 hours ago, PMAC said:

That assumes that they don't trade away more players, such as Hoffman, Gallagher, Petry, Savard or Allen. How much space they have for next season really depends on how many of the high-paid players are traded for futures. We'll get some idea at the traded deadline and more so in the summer.

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8 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

That assumes that they don't trade away more players, such as Hoffman, Gallagher, Petry, Savard or Allen. How much space they have for next season really depends on how many of the high-paid players are traded for futures. We'll get some idea at the traded deadline and more so in the summer.

Yes, but to be clear, that is Engles opinion not mine. 

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