Permanent Rumour Thread

[hab29RETIRED]

3 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

I just think it's better to use some draft picks and have Columbus retain for a couple years than pay the whole shot of 8.7M for 2 years. If it was just for 1 year I might think differently. After next year Slafs new contact will kick in so they may not have a whole lot of extra money to throw around. Not sure Ott has relevance here. I don't think he cost the Habs much. I guess you don't want to miss an opportunity to take a shot at a former GM.

The point was in reference to having your comment in having flexibility to use cap space in other areas. In the past we reacted and to make trades at the deadline (the year we traded for Ott and three other garbage players, when we needed scoring), or wasted cap space on bums like Alzner - because we had the space.  If all goes according to plan after next year we should be competing for a playoff spot, I'd rather get a guy like Laine right now - full contract at low cost, or use picks to reduce cap the cap hit - don't really care. But the point is pick up a guy now, see if he can be part of the future. If he works sign him to a an extension at hopefully less than what it will cost to bring a UFA in. I'd rather take on Laine's remaining two year deal than the 8 year deal that Philly just handed out.

 

I think we have an opportunity to add the type of player we may want long term for fewer assets and see if he will be a potential fit, rather than pay for a UFA, or pay through the nose at the trade deadline, to pick up scoring help I. 2-3 years when we are hopefully starting to contend.
 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

35 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

The point was in reference to having your comment in having flexibility to use cap space in other areas. In the past we reacted and to make trades at the deadline (the year we traded for Ott and three other garbage players, when we needed scoring), or wasted cap space on bums like Alzner - because we had the space.  If all goes according to plan after next year we should be competing for a playoff spot, I'd rather get a guy like Laine right now - full contract at low cost, or use picks to reduce cap the cap hit - don't really care. But the point is pick up a guy now, see if he can be part of the future. If he works sign him to a an extension at hopefully less than what it will cost to bring a UFA in. I'd rather take on Laine's remaining two year deal than the 8 year deal that Philly just handed out.

 

I think we have an opportunity to add the type of player we may want long term for fewer assets and see if he will be a potential fit, rather than pay for a UFA, or pay through the nose at the trade deadline, to pick up scoring help I. 2-3 years when we are hopefully starting to contend.
 

 

I think everyone on this forum would agree that the Habs need another top 6 forward so the pursuit of Laine makes perfect sense. The question is what mix of assets/cap space are you willing to give up to get him?

 

The Habs have 9 picks in the 1st four rounds next year plus an excess of prospects at LD. To me it makes more sense to use some of that draft capital and less cap space to acquire Laine. How many draft picks do we need? It's time to narrow the focus to get what we need while giving up what we have excess of. A year from now Hughes might need the cap space to target some UFA he has his eye on. It would be good if he had the cap space flexibility to give him options. 

 

In a perfect world we get Laine without giving up a ton, he stays healthy and has a couple good years (ie. 30-40 goals). He will then be 28, a UFA and have all the leverage in negotiations. It would be nice to think he would sign in Montreal at a discount if he enjoys his time here but in reality he would probably go to the highest bidder. 

 

I have little doubt Hughes is pursuing Laine. In an article a few days ago it said Columbus wants picks and/or prospects in return. They aren't getting that without eating some salary. There is part of me that thinks Waddell doesn't want to do Montreal any favours because of previous crap but maybe I am dead wrong on that and he has a decent relationship with Hughes.  I hope Hughes can pull off a good deal here. 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

I think you try to get CBJ to retain salary - obviously. But if they absolutely refuse, or if their bottom-line price for doing so is more than I want to pay, I’d still take him. That’s just me. I can see the other side. But a rejuvenated Laine would be great to see in the CH.

[BCHabnut]

1 hour ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

The Habs have 9 picks in the 1st four rounds next year plus an excess of prospects at LD. To me it makes more sense to use some of that draft capital and less cap space to acquire Laine. How many draft picks do we need? It's time to narrow the focus to get what we need while giving up what we have excess of. A year from now Hughes might need the cap space to target some UFA he has his eye on. It would be good if he had the cap space flexibility to give him options. 

 

This is a solid point. At some point, all these guys need to get paid. Adding Laine to that equation could make cap management messy, prematurely.  The thing is, if he can resurrect his still young career, maybe the team takes a step toward being a bubble team as early as next season. Maybe one or two of those draft picks becomes an impact player, and you suddenly have the low cost rookie depth to compete in the playoffs. A year or two earlier than you had hoped.  

[alfredoh2009]

I don't want Laine, I've had enough of damaged goods.

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

2 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I don't want Laine, I've had enough of damaged goods.

 

Like any trade it depends on what you have to give up. Sure there is risk but I think a risk worth taking if you can make the right deal. 

 

A healthy Dach, Laine turns it around, throw Newhook on the left wing with them and all of a sudden you have a #2 line that can do some damage. 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

1 hour ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

Like any trade it depends on what you have to give up. Sure there is risk but I think a risk worth taking if you can make the right deal. 

 

A healthy Dach, Laine turns it around, throw Newhook on the left wing with them and all of a sudden you have a #2 line that can do some damage. 

 

Yeah…the reason he’s available is that he’s “damaged goods.” But the guy is a productive, PPG player capable of scoring 35 goals. In fact he has been pretty productive by normal standards even through his dark years. I see us as being in a position where acquiring him could only help; even if he falls off the wagon at some point, we’re not committed longer term. 

 

Anyhow, if we don’t get him, I won’t rend my garment about it. But I think he would help push us toward the playoff bar next season, as you say, and he would be exciting from a “fan” POV. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

59 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Yeah…the reason he’s available is that he’s “damaged goods.” But the guy is a productive, PPG player capable of scoring 35 goals. In fact he has been pretty productive by normal standards even through his dark years. I see us as being in a position where acquiring him could only help; even if he falls off the wagon at some point, we’re not committed longer term. 

 

Anyhow, if we don’t get him, I won’t rend my garment about it. But I think he would help push us toward the playoff bar next season, as you say, and he would be exciting from a “fan” POV. 

 

Agreed. Over his career he has averaged .81 pts/game, he is still only 26. Like you say he is "damaged goods" so you are likely getting him at some sort of discount.  I am sure Hughes is working hard at it but I won't rend my garment either if it doesn't work out. 

[tomh009]

3 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I don't want Laine, I've had enough of damaged goods.

So far, St-Louis has been able to turn around Newhook and (I think) Dach. Laine would be a similar reclamation projection: acquire someone with the potential to improve or turn things around for a lower cost, and rely on your development staff to help them reach their potential.

 

Have Newhook and Dach been an issue for some reason?

[Commandant]

6 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

So far, St-Louis has been able to turn around Newhook and (I think) Dach. Laine would be a similar reclamation projection: acquire someone with the potential to improve or turn things around for a lower cost, and rely on your development staff to help them reach their potential.

 

Have Newhook and Dach been an issue for some reason?

 

We know the issue.  They were acquired by the current management group.  Any argument to discredit them.

[DON]

8 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

So far, St-Louis has been able to turn around Newhook and (I think) Dach. Laine would be a similar reclamation projection: acquire someone with the potential to improve or turn things around for a lower cost, and rely on your development staff to help them reach their potential.

 

Have Newhook and Dach been an issue for some reason?

Newhook missed 17 games last season and Dach 102 games in 2 seasons as a Hab, only issue as been health.

[alfredoh2009]

Dach and Newhook have not played all games, they’ve had injuries 

 

I do not want a line of injury-prone cross-your-fingers high-hope 2nd-liners.

 

les Glorieux deserve so much better

[Commandant]

I want HuGo to use their crystal ball and make sure no one they acquire will ever have injuries, cause Les Glorieux deserve it. 

 

What is this argument even?

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

3 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Dach and Newhook have not played all games, they’ve had injuries 

 

I do not want a line of injury-prone cross-your-fingers high-hope 2nd-liners.

 

les Glorieux deserve so much better

 

Newhook played all 82 games the year before and 81 (NHL + AHL) the year before that so I don't see any sort of injury prone history there, last year was likely a one of.  No concerns there. 

 

Dach on the other hand, I am hoping and praying he can stay healthy. 

 

 

[tomh009]

40 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I do not want a line of injury-prone cross-your-fingers high-hope 2nd-liners.

An ankle sprain from a collision with the net means you are injury-prone?

 

And I do think Dach still has a first-line ceiling.

[DON]

1 hour ago, tomh009 said:

And I do think Dach still has a first-line ceiling.

1st liner, if all the stars align.

But, a fragile 3rd line forward seems more likely than a 80 point centre.

Going only by his track record to date.

[hab29RETIRED]

3 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Dach and Newhook have not played all games, they’ve had injuries 

 

I do not want a line of injury-prone cross-your-fingers high-hope 2nd-liners.

 

les Glorieux deserve so much better

So much better acquiring guys like Alzner to play in Laval, or the injury prone and useless Dvorak, or paying $11m to Anderson and Gallagher to 3rd/4th liners, or trading for Drouin - signing him to a dumb contract when he had proven squat by giving up a stud dman for that privilege. Even better is constantly trading for wingers to convert them into centres - because you know, you can't trade for centres.

[hab29RETIRED]

1 hour ago, DON said:

1st liner, if all the stars align.

But, a fragile 3rd line forward seems more likely than a 80 point centre.

Going only by his track record to date.

I think he can be more productive than Suzuki. It would be a great problem to have if a year from now our top three lines are:

Slafkovsky-Suzuki-Caufield

Demidov-Dach-Laine

Roy-Beck-Newhook

 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

5 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

So much better acquiring guys like Alzner to play in Laval, or the injury prone and useless Dvorak, or paying $11m to Anderson and Gallagher to 3rd/4th liners, or trading for Drouin - signing him to a dumb contract when he had proven squat by giving up a stud dman for that privilege. Even better is constantly trading for wingers to convert them into centres - because you know, you can't trade for centres.

I am starting to sense that maybe you didn't like the previous management team. I could be dead wrong but the evidence is mounting. Please correct me if I am wrong. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

7 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

I think he can be more productive than Suzuki. It would be a great problem to have if a year from now our top three lines are:

Slafkovsky-Suzuki-Caufield

Demidov-Dach-Laine

Roy-Beck-Newhook

 

That is a pretty good looking top nine. If there is one thing I really hope for this year is a healthy Dach. We need to find out what kind of player he will be.

[Prime Minister Koivu]

2 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

I think he can be more productive than Suzuki. It would be a great problem to have if a year from now our top three lines are:

Slafkovsky-Suzuki-Caufield

Demidov-Dach-Laine

Roy-Beck-Newhook

 

 

2 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

That is a pretty good looking top nine. If there is one thing I really hope for this year is a healthy Dach. We need to find out what kind of player he will be.

That top 9 is spectacular if all players reach expectations. 
 

 

[Commandant]

1 hour ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

 

That top 9 is spectacular if all players reach expectations. 
 

 

In fairness most teams can have a spectacular top 9 if you 

 

Have 3 prospects in there who "reach expectations".

Include 1 player by trade who hasnt been traded for yet..  and assume he stays healthy and reaches expectations to be back to a PPG player.

 

Have 1 injury prone player stay healthy and reaches expectations.

 

Oh and the other 4 keep progressing to their expectations.

 

 

What im saying is its unlikely we will have all 9 and that all 9 will reach expectations.

[hab29RETIRED]

4 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

I am starting to sense that maybe you didn't like the previous management team. I could be dead wrong but the evidence is mounting. Please correct me if I am wrong. 

Really? Is it that obvious 😁

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

14 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Really? Is it that obvious 😁

 

Yes, to be honest, you are not hiding your disfavour with previous Habs management well at all. I know you have tried to be subtle about it but it is starting to become obvious. I think the cat is out of the bag now. 

[hab29RETIRED]

6 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

Yes, to be honest, you are not hiding your disfavour with previous Habs management well at all. I know you have tried to be subtle about it but it is starting to become obvious. I think the cat is out of the bag now. 

Actually, I don't think I've ever tried to be subtle about my dislike of the previous regime. I had a strong dislike of MB after the first three significant decisions he made:

1) hiring Therrien - Jones hose selfish bench minors (plural) cost us a playoff series during his first stint.

2) not hiring Robinson as an assistant, when it was obvious he wanted the job.

3) not signing Subban to a longterm contract after his entry level deal and than having to pay though the nose after he won a Norris.

All of these decisions were made before a single game was played, and aside from a few good moves like the Vanek and Petry trades, did not like his moves, drafting, lack of player development, keeping his bum buddies he grow up with on the job like Lefebve and Daigneult way too long.