Max Pac wants to play in Hamilton all season long

[rafikz]

http://www.rds.ca/canadien/chroniques/309224.html

"I want to play in Hamilton all season long. Last year, nothing worked for me. This year, the coach does everything to help me"

"In Montreal, when I made mistakes, I ended up on the fourth line. It affected me. It's the opposite in Hamilton."

More here (in french): http://legrandclub.rds.ca/profils/608456/posts/94286

[lazy26]

Good healthy attitude from Patches. Glad to hear of it.

[sakiqc]

Yeah, great to hear a positive attitude. A strong season in Hamilton will be a real plus in his development. And looks like the Bulldogs coaches are taking his technique/maturity development seriously. He already has the size and tools. I'm sure we'll see him a long time in the NHL.

[Colin]

See the TSN article.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=340010

Now, work your butt off and become that top-6 we need who drives to the net and scores goals.

[saskhab]

http://www.lionsinwinter.ca/2010/11/theres...x-paciorty.html

Good stuff from Topham at LIW here. I think there's some rich kid syndrome coming to the surface. Why should MaxPac get better treatment than other guys? Nearly every player has to learn to play a 3rd or 4th line shift before they're given greater responsibility. Quite frankly, Pacioretty is not that special of a player to skip that stage.

[BCHabnut]

I read a different clip which omitted the naming of Martin and Carbo. I think it's reasonable for him to know what is importanat for his own developement. I hope to see his confidence return. I really don't think he should have mentioned the coaches names or compared them. That is a mistake. Hopefully the kid works hard and earns his top 6 spot. God knows Pouliot won't be renewed at this rate.

[kaos]

I see nothing wrong with Max's comments. Good for him to be mature enough to know that being a top 6 in Hamilton is better for him then being a 4th liner in Montreal. Christ he is only 21 years old. Hes got so much time to develop. I dont blame him for not liking Martin. There are not many of us that do.

[bar]

This is great insight from the players and their regards to the rookie treatment. I have been against this mistake and you sit crap from JM. I watch vets like Hammer and Spaceman make mistake after mistake after mistake with no consequences, when it's the rookies who should be given free reigns to make mistakes and learn from them. I love his desire to be a top 6 forward, and I agree with him, I hate when scorers are put onto grinder designated lines. It's the reason I'm glad Eller is getting his change on the top 6.

The league is adapting, it's getting younger and younger especially with all the entry level deals and the salary cap, youngers players HAVE to a huge part of your success, and coaches will have to adapt their thinking. I hope JM, changes his stance a bit on rookie mistakes.

I read a different clip which omitted the naming of Martin and Carbo. I think it's reasonable for him to know what is importanat for his own developement. I hope to see his confidence return. I really don't think he should have mentioned the coaches names or compared them. That is a mistake. Hopefully the kid works hard and earns his top 6 spot. God knows Pouliot won't be renewed at this rate.

Haha this was obviously posted before Pouliots 3 pt night. This is offtopic, but Pouliot has been great this season, I'm not sure what you're watching. He's been bounced around the entire team and it producing at a high rate compared to most of the top 5.

[BCHabnut]

This is great insight from the players and their regards to the rookie treatment. I have been against this mistake and you sit crap from JM. I watch vets like Hammer and Spaceman make mistake after mistake after mistake with no consequences, when it's the rookies who should be given free reigns to make mistakes and learn from them. I love his desire to be a top 6 forward, and I agree with him, I hate when scorers are put onto grinder designated lines. It's the reason I'm glad Eller is getting his change on the top 6.

The league is adapting, it's getting younger and younger especially with all the entry level deals and the salary cap, youngers players HAVE to a huge part of your success, and coaches will have to adapt their thinking. I hope JM, changes his stance a bit on rookie mistakes.

Haha this was obviously posted before Pouliots 3 pt night. This is offtopic, but Pouliot has been great this season, I'm not sure what you're watching. He's been bounced around the entire team and it producing at a high rate compared to most of the top 5.

I don't disagree that Pouliot has been very good, and yes he did put some points up last night. My question is, can we renew him as a top 6 forward in the 2 to 3 mill category? If he earns it, then I will be very happy. The season is long. It is pretty funny, that I say at this rate, he won't be renewed, then he gets first star and wins a game for us. I love being wrong about that sort of thing.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Martin has an excellent track record of player deveopment - enough to defer to his judgement rather than that of some 20-year-old punk. The fact is, Patches brought NOTHING last season and if he had actually shown something, he might have gotten the ice time. It's this mentality that "I am entitled to be on the top line even though I suck" that is so irritating. You're on the top line if you DELIVER. Yes, Martin gives more rope to his vets. That's because they have proven that they can deliver. This is the NHL, not a baby-sitter service.

Edited November 6, 2010 by The Chicoutimi Cucumber

[bar]

I don't understand this view CC, you claim young players should shut up and act like they aren't better than the rest of the team, shouldn't get special treatment, but thats JUST what vets get. They rarely get demoted after a single mistake. The game is changing...you cannot rely on your vets for everything in a cap world, you have to hold all players accountable, and you need to get quality minutes from your young players.

Whats with calling him a punk as well? We as fans bemoan players like Crosby and Gionta who toe the line when it comes to interviews, that when they speak what they feel and how things really are they get treated like your response above. I've been saying this a lot since my time here, that young players are treated like 2nd class citizens in the NHL, and it's not fair.

[saskhab]

This is great insight from the players and their regards to the rookie treatment. I have been against this mistake and you sit crap from JM. I watch vets like Hammer and Spaceman make mistake after mistake after mistake with no consequences, when it's the rookies who should be given free reigns to make mistakes and learn from them. I love his desire to be a top 6 forward, and I agree with him, I hate when scorers are put onto grinder designated lines. It's the reason I'm glad Eller is getting his change on the top 6.

The league is adapting, it's getting younger and younger especially with all the entry level deals and the salary cap, youngers players HAVE to a huge part of your success, and coaches will have to adapt their thinking. I hope JM, changes his stance a bit on rookie mistakes.

I think you're misinterpreting some trends here. Younger players are being utilized a lot around the league is specialized circumstances. Coaches are finding ways to use them to be successful, by finding them situations where their talent can be best used. They are not throwing them out to the wolves... precisely the opposite: they are sheltering them, finding favourable matchups, and having success. The vaunted Anaheim line of Penner-Getzlaf-Perry in the 2007 Cup run was really their 3rd line. The line that helped them win the most was Moen-Pahlsson-Niedermeyer, but the interpretation was how much value the Ducks got out of their talented youngsters on entry level deals, not how much value they got out of their relatively cheap defensive specialists. No doubt, they all helped out, but the value placed on the contributions of each was completely out of whack. Lost in that mix was Kunitz-MacDonald-Selanne, who didn't post huge offensive numbers but drew the hardest matchups, helping the team beat Detroit, the biggest obstacle to victory for the team. Of course, having a defense of Niedermeyer, Pronger and Beauchemin gave them a lot of latitude as well, protecting the kids and allowing them to make their mistakes.

Detroit then won the Cup the next year with very little help from EL players. Pittsburgh had Malkin and Staal as ELs when they won, and Chicago had Kane and Toews... of course that's going to help, just as having Subban helps a lot for us. Subban and Eller are pretty darn good, but they aren't Malkin/Staal or Kane/Toews. Pacioretty or Maxwell or White probably don't help us out that much... they're about as good as Maxim Lapierre or other veteran $700k-$1m players.

And if you haven't noticed, Hamrlik-Spacek are our 3rd pairing. Martin has reigned them in for underperforming. I don't know where you get this idea that they're somehow immune. They don't completely suck like so many think... they aren't our top players, that's for sure, but they aren't terrible. And now they're getting played less than the other 4 D, though a lot of that is special teams division, since Subban gets a lot of PP and Gill gets a lot of PK.

[bar]

I didn't say immune, vets do get demoted, I realize that. Although, one mistake from O'bryne had him nailed to the bench, yet Spacek has made terrible terrible mistakes this year and they kept coming back to him. I'm not even advocating playing Ob.

Your post was very knowledgeable but it doesn't counter my point that JM treats young players harshly, and I believe, just my opinion, this is not a great way to develop players, sure some may work, but in Pax case he said it wasn't great for his development. I have no problem in what he said.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

I didn't say immune, vets do get demoted, I realize that. Although, one mistake from O'bryne had him nailed to the bench, yet Spacek has made terrible terrible mistakes this year and they kept coming back to him. I'm not even advocating playing Ob.

Your post was very knowledgeable but it doesn't counter my point that JM treats young players harshly, and I believe, just my opinion, this is not a great way to develop players, sure some may work, but in Pax case he said it wasn't great for his development. I have no problem in what he said.

Like I said earlier, JM has a good track record in developing young talent. While this shouldn't absolve him in specific cases where he may mishandle a guy, all things being equal it should relieve him of blanket criticism of this type. Ottawa fans said he was treating Spezza harshly. It turns out that he was exactly right - that Spezza needed to learn to compete harder and become a responsible player. On most accounts, he still does.

A coach isn't only trying to develop young players. He is also trying to win hockey games. This means he has to factor in the player's actual overall performance as well as his potential. Look at Subban. He makes gaffes but he still gets the ice, because Martin recognizes the many positives he brings as well as his formidable potential. O'Bryne, in contrast, is clearly not a player that Martin believes will ever become more than a depth player in the league; nor is he a great asset in any particular facet of the game; and he is treated accordingly. Sometimes people confuse 'not developing' a player with that player simply being mediocre.

In the case of Patches, I'd have to go back and look at the games in question, but offhand I cannot recall him doing a whole lot with the opportunities he was given. It is the player's job to make the case that he deserves more ice, that he should be used in situation X or Y. On an uncharitable reading of his comments, Pacioretty seems to feel that because he has a top 6 'profile' (in his own mind - as far as I'm concerned he is more likely to end up as yet another third liner) he is entitled to extended use on the top-6 at the NHL level. It doesn't work like that, especially on good teams; and it would not surprise me at all of this attitude was part of the package that let to Martin concluding he wasn't ready.

Veterans are held to a somewhat different standard because they have proven that they can help teams day in and day out. Remember, the coach is also trying to win. Martin allowed Spacek a good chunk of time to work out his problems and then started to lower the boom. That's as it should be. If Wayne Gretzky hits a slump for five games, you don't bench him in favour of Max Pacioretty. Why not? Because one has a track record, the other is a nobody who has yet to show you anything notable. The examples are extreme but the principle is sound.

Bar, you say we need 'quality minutes from young players.' I agree. But the key is to get quality minutes. We are getting these, at present, from Pouliot, Lapierre, and Subban and maybe a couple of others. We did NOT get them from Pacioretty. The reason most likely lies with Pacioretty, not Martin. The sooner he figures that out, the rosier his prospects will become.

[hab29RETIRED]

Like I said earlier, JM has a good track record in developing young talent. While this shouldn't absolve him in specific cases where he may mishandle a guy, all things being equal it should relieve him of blanket criticism of this type. Ottawa fans said he was treating Spezza harshly. It turns out that he was exactly right - that Spezza needed to learn to compete harder and become a responsible player. On most accounts, he still does.

A coach isn't only trying to develop young players. He is also trying to win hockey games. This means he has to factor in the player's actual overall performance as well as his potential. Look at Subban. He makes gaffes but he still gets the ice, because Martin recognizes the many positives he brings as well as his formidable potential. O'Bryne, in contrast, is clearly not a player that Martin believes will ever become more than a depth player in the league; nor is he a great asset in any particular facet of the game; and he is treated accordingly. Sometimes people confuse 'not developing' a player with that player simply being mediocre.

In the case of Patches, I'd have to go back and look at the games in question, but offhand I cannot recall him doing a whole lot with the opportunities he was given. It is the player's job to make the case that he deserves more ice, that he should be used in situation X or Y. On an uncharitable reading of his comments, Pacioretty seems to feel that because he has a top 6 'profile' (in his own mind - as far as I'm concerned he is more likely to end up as yet another third liner) he is entitled to extended use on the top-6 at the NHL level. It doesn't work like that, especially on good teams; and it would not surprise me at all of this attitude was part of the package that let to Martin concluding he wasn't ready.

Veterans are held to a somewhat different standard because they have proven that they can help teams day in and day out. Remember, the coach is also trying to win. Martin allowed Spacek a good chunk of time to work out his problems and then started to lower the boom. That's as it should be. If Wayne Gretzky hits a slump for five games, you don't bench him in favour of Max Pacioretty. Why not? Because one has a track record, the other is a nobody who has yet to show you anything notable. The examples are extreme but the principle is sound.

Bar, you say we need 'quality minutes from young players.' I agree. But the key is to get quality minutes. We are getting these, at present, from Pouliot, Lapierre, and Subban and maybe a couple of others. We did NOT get them from Pacioretty. The reason most likely lies with Pacioretty, not Martin. The sooner he figures that out, the rosier his prospects will become.

MaxPac had no business being in the NHL. I said that during his first year and was saying it all last year that he belonged in Hamilton. The Habs did him a diservice (as they did with Lats), by bringing these guys up to quickly, without giving them a chance for seasoning in the AHL. When you have a guy like MaxPac at that age up, you need to play them lots for them to learn.

What kind of message do you send to kids who make one mistake and they get benched for two weeks and OB benched since practically last year, when you have bums like the spaceman and regular season/non-PK Gill cough up the puck 5 times a game with impunity??? Eller gets one chance centering the the top two lines and then gets benched. Gomez has sucked lemons for most of the year and he is out there during the last minute of the game tonight while Pleks is on the bench??? I know that no coach is going to treat a vet the same way as a rookie, but given how horrible the spaceman, non-PK Gill, Gomez, Laps have been this year, you would think that OB, Eller whould have been given a better oppertunity.

The habs haven't figured out how to work within the cap world, by screwing up on player development and paying 55-60 point guys $7.3M. You really need to give your kids a chance to succeed. If you aren't going to play SKILLED/TOP 6 potential guys at least 15 minutes a night, live with their mistakes while still giving them the message on where they need to improve, then you may as well have those guys playing 20+ minutes in the minors.

[bar]

CC you make great points, I'm just frustrated as a fan to see rookies get the boom lowered on them for one mistake, and yet we had a walking blooper film in MAB last year get chance after chance.

[v-hab]

This is a issue I can’t agree with many on this board , finally someone from within that is ‘brutally honest’ with respect to Jacques Martin.. I have a new-found respect for MaxPac. The Martin hiring will go down as Gainey’s biggest mistake, Martin is a dinosaur filled with a history of breaking the spirit and confidence of young players, just ask some of the players in Ottawa and Florida if ‘they would play for him today ?’remember I said, ‘ if they would play for him today’. Spezza is only the first that comes to mind, and the list is long.

Yet there are many that find it necessary to highlight that Martin falls into the NHL’s top 10 winningest coaches making him out ‘as he must have more creditability making the MaxPac statement untrue or that of a crybaby. However, Martin was never picked as part of a ‘Team Canada’ coaching team, perhaps it has something to do with his dinosaur coaching philosophy. Being a winning coach depends on the strength of the team you have. Considering the roster’s he had in Ottawa anyone could have won most of those games.

Remember, he copied his ex good friend Mike ( Iron mike) Keenan one of the most hated coaches, so how long will it take the Molson’s to wake up and see that it’s not the players that need to be changed it’s the coach. Being bilingual does not make you the right coach for young assets. Charbonneau who played in the NHL had his coaching faults but patience with developing our young assets was not one of those faults. Martin never played, Junior, AHL or NHL and the result is the mirror image of learning the game from Keenan. Slowly these dinosaur coach’s are falling by the wayside in the new NHL and the new CBA.

His track record here in Montreal only confirms he is not, and has never been, a teaching coach, do we wait for names like Eller, Lapierre, Pouliot to be lost and are part of the list of; Chipchura, Latendresse, Stewart, Matt D'Agostini and waiting to dump O’Byrne. What other coach can you remember going on record with the press having said “ I don’t have any confidence in this player” (O’Byrne last season). Well, lets be clear on this issue, I don’t have any confidence in Martin as a coach.

If a coach’s only ‘claim to fame’ is to break the spirit of potential players with talent by sitting them out or dressing them to play 2-4 minutes rather than encouraging and developing the talent then your talent as a coach has to comes into question. The Martin coaching plan, Eller LH center, Martin plays him LW/RW, Lapierre RH center, now has to play RW, Pouliot LH center, now has to play LW/RW, the list goes on and on, the real kick in the azz is, Martin then criticizes their effort at the changed position as their fault. It has taken Pouliot many years too convert to a winger and he is still learning.

GOOD ON YOU MAXPAC

[hab29RETIRED]

This is a issue I can’t agree with many on this board , finally someone from within that is ‘brutally honest’ with respect to Jacques Martin.. I have a new-found respect for MaxPac. The Martin hiring will go down as Gainey’s biggest mistake, Martin is a dinosaur filled with a history of breaking the spirit and confidence of young players, just ask some of the players in Ottawa and Florida if ‘they would play for him today ?’remember I said, ‘ if they would play for him today’. Spezza is only the first that comes to mind, and the list is long.

Yet there are many that find it necessary to highlight that Martin falls into the NHL’s top 10 winningest coaches making him out ‘as he must have more creditability making the MaxPac statement untrue or that of a crybaby. However, Martin was never picked as part of a ‘Team Canada’ coaching team, perhaps it has something to do with his dinosaur coaching philosophy. Being a winning coach depends on the strength of the team you have. Considering the roster’s he had in Ottawa anyone could have won most of those games.

Remember, he copied his ex good friend Mike ( Iron mike) Keenan one of the most hated coaches, so how long will it take the Molson’s to wake up and see that it’s not the players that need to be changed it’s the coach. Being bilingual does not make you the right coach for young assets. Charbonneau who played in the NHL had his coaching faults but patience with developing our young assets was not one of those faults. Martin never played, Junior, AHL or NHL and the result is the mirror image of learning the game from Keenan. Slowly these dinosaur coach’s are falling by the wayside in the new NHL and the new CBA.

His track record here in Montreal only confirms he is not, and has never been, a teaching coach, do we wait for names like Eller, Lapierre, Pouliot to be lost and are part of the list of; Chipchura, Latendresse, Stewart, Matt D'Agostini and waiting to dump O’Byrne. What other coach can you remember going on record with the press having said “ I don’t have any confidence in this player” (O’Byrne last season). Well, lets be clear on this issue, I don’t have any confidence in Martin as a coach.

If a coach’s only ‘claim to fame’ is to break the spirit of potential players with talent by sitting them out or dressing them to play 2-4 minutes rather than encouraging and developing the talent then your talent as a coach has to comes into question. The Martin coaching plan, Eller LH center, Martin plays him LW/RW, Lapierre RH center, now has to play RW, Pouliot LH center, now has to play LW/RW, the list goes on and on, the real kick in the azz is, Martin then criticizes their effort at the changed position as their fault. It has taken Pouliot many years too convert to a winger and he is still learning.

GOOD ON YOU MAXPAC

I find the all time top 10 winningest coach arguement as crap. What has the guy actually won - ZILCH!!! there is a big difference in continuosly being recycled from one losing team to another - with the exception of what - 3-5 years in Ottawa, a team that had stocked up on #1 draft picks and the stupidity of Milbury to stockpile a bumch of young talent.

There is a difference between a coach that is been around for 10 years and has been a winner everywhere he has gone and a guy who has been coaching for 15 years over the last 25 years and has missed the playoffs 4 times and made the playoffs, despite his team having a sub .500 record 3 times. From his 3 years as coach in florida his teams missed the playoffs three straight years and the team finished with exactly the same number of points in the his last year as coach as they did in his first year. But the biggest indictment, the guy has made it to the 3rd round of the playoffs exactly twice. Big friggin deal.

The whole top ten winningest coach record is simply a matter is how NHL coaches are recycled until they decide to quit and go into broadcasting, but can you actually see the Penguin as a color commentator on tv??? He would be even worse as a broadcaster then he is as a coach!!!

[dlbalr]

Personally, I have no issue with Pacioretty stating he'd like to stay in the AHL for the year because he feels it's best for his development. What I did have a bit of a problem with were the thinly veiled shots at the coaching staff (that's not going to help his case, especially if Martin is around next season) and saying he'd only like to be called up if he'll be on the top-2 lines. It's one thing to make a suggestion ("I'd like to stay in Hamilton as I feel it's best for my development") but to come out and basically say only call me up if you're going to play me in the role and ice time that I want to play? That's not right.

That said, kudos for recognizing that he needs more time in Hamilton and is willing to (enthusiastically at that) put in the time to succeed - even if it costs him a couple of brief callups along the way. Short-term pain for long-term gain, and that's fine with me.

[v-hab]

Personally, I have no issue with Pacioretty stating he'd like to stay in the AHL for the year because he feels it's best for his development. What I did have a bit of a problem with were the thinly veiled shots at the coaching staff (that's not going to help his case, especially if Martin is around next season) and saying he'd only like to be called up if he'll be on the top-2 lines. It's one thing to make a suggestion ("I'd like to stay in Hamilton as I feel it's best for my development") but to come out and basically say only call me up if you're going to play me in the role and ice time that I want to play? That's not right.

That said, kudos for recognizing that he needs more time in Hamilton and is willing to (enthusiastically at that) put in the time to succeed - even if it costs him a couple of brief callups along the way. Short-term pain for long-term gain, and that's fine with me.

Hab29Retired, Very valid points and obviously I agree. Like the tie-in to ‘The Penguin’ however are you not doing a disservice to penguins in general?.

Brian, I think I understand you’re position and totally agree for the most part that maxpac will improve faster in Hamilton as well as, it is not his place to only assign a ‘top6’ destination as his place in the NHL.

My diatribe was with the issue of Martin as a coach and his coaching philosophy, and comparing Martin to Charbonneau I have no problem with what maxpac said, history will prove maxpac was right, frustratingly so. Look how Charbonneau handled OB when he scored in his own net, very classy for a rookie coach not in the top 10.

The line juggling last night and sitting out Eller made no sense whatsoever and supports maxpac’s statement, and supports my thinking as well.

[BTH]

Personally, I have no issue with Pacioretty stating he'd like to stay in the AHL for the year because he feels it's best for his development. What I did have a bit of a problem with were the thinly veiled shots at the coaching staff (that's not going to help his case, especially if Martin is around next season) and saying he'd only like to be called up if he'll be on the top-2 lines. It's one thing to make a suggestion ("I'd like to stay in Hamilton as I feel it's best for my development") but to come out and basically say only call me up if you're going to play me in the role and ice time that I want to play? That's not right.

That said, kudos for recognizing that he needs more time in Hamilton and is willing to (enthusiastically at that) put in the time to succeed - even if it costs him a couple of brief callups along the way. Short-term pain for long-term gain, and that's fine with me.

This. If he refuses to play for Montreal unless he's guaranteed a spot in our top 6, he's never going to make the NHL.

[nikohab]

I couldn't agree more with Max's remark. It's so stupid that when player's make mistakes and are demoted to the 3rd or 4th line. Remember what Wayne Gretzky always said about the game of hockey that it must be fun and played naturaly. I'm beginning to think that Jacque Martin is starting to loose his team. My choice would be to make Kirk Muller our next coach because he knows what fun is all about. Hang in there Max there will changes soon.

[ForumGhost]

This. If he refuses to play for Montreal unless he's guaranteed a spot in our top 6, he's never going to make the NHL.

That's not what he said at all. He said he sees himself as a top 6 player.

[hab29RETIRED]

That's not what he said at all. He said he sees himself as a top 6 player.

exactly. And he isn't going to become one playing 5-7 minutes a game with Pyatt, Darche, Boyd or Moen. He is much better served playing in Hamilton - where he should have been 2 years ago. Unless a guy is a can't miss prospect, i'd rather have a guy gain confidence dominating in the AHL before bringing him up.

I do think that he would be happy playing on the 3rd line until he shows himself as top six worthy, if he didn't feel he was going to be benched or sit in the pressbox after every mistake.

We have a lot of young kids that can have a solid impact in the future, but Martin is clearly not the coach to proceed with.

How this team can have a PP that has sucked since the Philly series last year and the dynamic duo of Martin and Pearn are unable to do anything is beyond belief. On the other hand, Muller has kept the PK pretty solid.

[Toronthab]

Martin has an excellent track record of player deveopment - enough to defer to his judgement rather than that of some 20-year-old punk. The fact is, Patches brought NOTHING last season and if he had actually shown something, he might have gotten the ice time. It's this mentality that "I am entitled to be on the top line even though I suck" that is so irritating. You're on the top line if you DELIVER. Yes, Martin gives more rope to his vets. That's because they have proven that they can deliver. This is the NHL, not a baby-sitter service.

I agree. I think Patches should first apply for the job of general manager and hire a few professional coaches before he gainsays Bob Gainey's best judgment.

I think JM uses a number of criteria to decide what risks and upsides; what attitudes and abilities plus work ethics, along with information we will never know will show up on the ice. It may be that a Spacek playing his heart out when tired and making a mistake or two is a different category than a lazy hooking penalty from a rookie. It is to me.

Nice that Pacman wants to play in the NHL and is willing to learn. Hope it works for all of us. But I wouldn't be shocked to learn that JM had a pretty good approach to coaching decisions that's well understood and geared to mazimize the whole team. Maybe Pac can become a player JM would want in his lineup. Hamilton seems to have got his attention.