JMMR Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 There is pain but this is motrin pain The florida goalie did not play a good game do not kid yourselves this team did not give up the body to score, by that I mean 1. Drive the net all game long 2. Carry the puck to the net 3. Stand in front a take a beating all game long 4. Jab a lose pucks in and around the crease Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habinator33 Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Anyone else see Budaj waving his stick in the air for 15 seconds trying to get Martin's attention? Florida announcers pretty much said it looked like Martin lost track of the time in the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 I still feel like this team is in exactly the same spot they were last december. Absolutely 0 confidence right now. They need one lucky break like Wiz's OT goal last year... and they can't find it right now. No excuses, but those two quick whistles didn't help them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobin Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Anyone remember saying preseason didn't matter... I agree it doesn't matter in terms of results, but it does matter how you use the preseason to get ready for the season. We are still playing like we are figuring out the system, the lines, etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 They did outplay Florida, by and large. This seems to be a game where JM did what we all wanted, gave Cole tons of ice and PP time. Cole was full value, but you had the definite feeling that we were doomed when MaxPac went down. He seems to be the only guy immune to whatever is ailing the Habs. I like what I saw of the PP tonight - Diaz was shooting more, with more authority - but for God's sake, you have to finish. NOBODY on this team seems capable of that. They fan on the puck, they miss the net, they hit the post, they pass when they should shoot, they try to release it too quickly and flub the shot, etc., etc.. And on those rare occasions where they do get a real chance the goalie saves it. This has been happening all season, from the first period against TO onward. Tick, tick, tick...that's the sound of time running out. Either bring a significant new player in here, or toss Martin. Work the phones right now to try to achieve the former. Failing that, if we lose to Philly and Boston, it's guillotine time for JM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Anyone else see Budaj waving his stick in the air for 15 seconds trying to get Martin's attention? Florida announcers pretty much said it looked like Martin lost track of the time in the game. big surprise there - guess Kirk did more then just run the timeouts last year for the penguin They did outplay Florida, by and large. This seems to be a game where JM did what we all wanted, gave Cole tons of ice and PP time. Cole was full value, but you had the definite feeling that we were doomed when MaxPac went down. He seems to be the only guy immune to whatever is ailing the Habs. I like what I saw of the PP tonight - Diaz was shooting more, with more authority - but for God's sake, you have to finish. NOBODY on this team seems capable of that. They fan on the puck, they miss the net, they hit the post, they pass when they should shoot, they try to release it too quickly and flub the shot, etc., etc.. And on those rare occasions where they do get a real chance the goalie saves it. This has been happening all season, from the first period against TO onward. Tick, tick, tick...that's the sound of time running out. Either bring a significant new player in here, or toss Martin. Work the phones right now to try to achieve the former. Failing that, if we lose to Philly and Boston, it's guillotine time for JM. i think its off with his head regardless what happens in the next two games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXx..CK..xXx Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 I am certainly not happy with the results that the habs have been having since the beginning of the season, but I do feel as though the knee-jerk reactions around here are a bit extreme. We have gone through poor stretches throughout the year in past seasons and made the playoffs. I guess it's just been awhile since it has happened right at the beginning of the season. I know I'm only quoting a small sample size but the sentiments on here seem to be that the season is over. Not only that, but that we should even go as far as tanking the season (joking or not). Who here truly believes that the habs will end this season in 15th place simply because of our start? In reality, regardless of what's happened so far the habs will be finishing this season 8th-10th in the east at absolute worst. Have there been any positives to be taken out of the first few games this season? Very few. However we do have a veteran core who is used to winning. This group knows how to win and wont accept the current mediocre standards for much longer. I don't completely buy in to the talk that we are not ready because of the manner in which we chose to use the pre-season either. In my mind if there's anything worth discussing it is the injuries which have happened, and are continuing to happen to our team. This chemistry and "working out the system" that everyone keeps referring to isn't due to the manner in which they approached the pre-season, it is largely in part due to these injuries. Sure, the Habs have had 8 games to work it out but certain key players, especially when discussing chemistry, have had much less than that. To sum up this post: Captain Obvious is pointing out that things can only get and will only get better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 big surprise there - guess Kirk did more then just run the timeouts last year for the penguin i think its off with his head regardless what happens in the next two games. Well, I'm not so sure about that. If we beat Philly and Boston I think optimism will again reign supreme in Habsland. Interesting to note, though, that we get six days off after the Boston back-to-back. It seems to me that if I were Gauthier and the Habs do go 1-2 or 0-3 over the next trio of games, that'd be the time I'd use to bring a new coach in and give him the chance to run a couple of practices. There's still not a whole lot of rational discussion of coaching options, however. Bob Gainey would be my odds-on favourite since he has stepped in as Fixer twice before, under similar circumstances, and would be happy to be 'Interim Only.' Other bilingual candidates? Rep aside, Marc Crawford seems to have done decent work with Dallas last season and is known for an uptempo style...Bob Hartley is surely obsolete...Patrick Roy is an implosion waiting to happen. Therrien, much as I despise him, at least has a credible resumé. Muller doesn't have the c.v., but if you honestly believe he is head coaching material you may as well reach out. Carbo is also probably older and wiser, but the politics of bringing him back are just gross. And ya know what? There's a guy who tutored under the great Jacques Lemaire all those years and now has the credentials that would justify consideration. Yes, I mean Mario Tremblay! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 I keep thinking this team only needs some confidence... and to find a break. But I think letting JM go and replacing him with a new voice might have the same effect of changing something for the team. I don't think he deserves to be fired, but I wonder if doing so changes things for the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 I keep thinking this team only needs some confidence... and to find a break. But I think letting JM go and replacing him with a new voice might have the same effect of changing something for the team. I don't think he deserves to be fired, but I wonder if doing so changes things for the team. Yeah, that's kinda where I'm coming from too. You really do reach a point where you have to do something to jolt the team and give it renewed reason to believe in itself. It's unfair, but it's reality. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Yeah, that's kinda where I'm coming from too. You really do reach a point where you have to do something to jolt the team and give it renewed reason to believe in itself. It's unfair, but it's reality. Exactly I'm kinda looking at it as "its the first period and we're down three goals.... all were because of breakdowns by defencemen, and the goalie had no chance, but i'm putting in the backup anyway to shock the team." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Well, I'm not so sure about that. If we beat Philly and Boston I think optimism will again reign supreme in Habsland. Interesting to note, though, that we get six days off after the Boston back-to-back. It seems to me that if I were Gauthier and the Habs do go 1-2 or 0-3 over the next trio of games, that'd be the time I'd use to bring a new coach in and give him the chance to run a couple of practices. There's still not a whole lot of rational discussion of coaching options, however. Bob Gainey would be my odds-on favourite since he has stepped in as Fixer twice before, under similar circumstances, and would be happy to be 'Interim Only.' Other bilingual candidates? Rep aside, Marc Crawford seems to have done decent work with Dallas last season and is known for an uptempo style...Bob Hartley is surely obsolete...Patrick Roy is an implosion waiting to happen. Therrien, much as I despise him, at least has a credible resumé. Muller doesn't have the c.v., but if you honestly believe he is head coaching material you may as well reach out. Carbo is also probably older and wiser, but the politics of bringing him back are just gross. And ya know what? There's a guy who tutored under the great Jacques Lemaire all those years and now has the credentials that would justify consideration. Yes, I mean Mario Tremblay! Mario does not deserve a chance to come back. along with the unholy trio of Houle and Corey, Mario took the greatest franchise in sports and tarnished its history and future. Don't care what he accomplished as a player or since his last coaching stint in montreal. He is dead to me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 I hate all the choices. But it is what it is because that stupid rule isn't changing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 habsinsideout1 Dave Stubbs Unconfirmed report has #Habs Pacioretty injury his wrist. Might be fractured. Again, that's unconfirmed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 habsinsideout1 Dave Stubbs Unconfirmed report has #Habs Pacioretty injury his wrist. Might be fractured. Again, that's unconfirmed That's it. We are cursed. It's the Curse of Patrick Roy. Mariano has Lemaire coming in as JM's replacement if the Habs make a coaching change. I find that dubious, but were it possible to get him in here even on an interim basis, I'd be clicking my heels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 I think the interim coach will be Bob Gainey. I'd love to see Lemaire, but I doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Pat Hickey is confirming that the suspicion is broken wrist but they need xrays. CURSED BrianWildeCTV BrianWilde TSN's Bob McKenzie reporting Pacioretty's wrist is the issue. This is going from bad to worse as I am hearing it is serious. HOLY ######ING CURSED. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbp Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Oh no... Max has been great! We can't lose him! He is the only player playing with any heart! I think Moen will be our leading scorer by seasons end... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l<OV4L3V Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 can you say FML? this team is a mess..can't muster up more than a goal against a Florida Panthers backup goaltender? at the end of the day, why feel sympathy for guys who are making millions of dollars as a result of a career? In a hockey environment like Montreal, it is completely unacceptable to start this bad. We are not in a re-building mode, this is our window to make the playoffs with a potential stanley cup run. It all starts at the top..Gauthier made some really bad decisions. Keeping Markov (who we are so unsure will ever be the same player again) over Wisniewski, signing Erik Cole who did nothing for Edmonton (the Carolina players made him who he was), and a lack of veteran presence on the blueline. Martin needs to go..my fuse has reached the end with him...you can tell in the body language of the players that somethings not right. Bring firewagon hockey back NOW...this system and "emphasis on special teams" is not effective in the new NHL! Even the assistant coaches need to be axed. It doesn't matter if it ends up being a change for the worse, I read on Eklund's blog that teams who finish October with a losing record only make the playoffs 20% of the time. Will we be in that 20%? highly doubt it if this continues..change is GOOD, and change needs to happen NOW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbp Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 can you say FML? this team is a mess..can't muster up more than a goal against a Florida Panthers backup goaltender? at the end of the day, why feel sympathy for guys who are making millions of dollars as a result of a career? In a hockey environment like Montreal, it is completely unacceptable to start this bad. We are not in a re-building mode, this is our window to make the playoffs with a potential stanley cup run. It all starts at the top..Gauthier made some really bad decisions. Keeping Markov (who we are so unsure will ever be the same player again) over Wisniewski, signing Erik Cole who did nothing for Edmonton (the Carolina players made him who he was), and a lack of veteran presence on the blueline. Martin needs to go..my fuse has reached the end with him...you can tell in the body language of the players that somethings not right. Bring firewagon hockey back NOW...this system and "emphasis on special teams" is not effective in the new NHL! Even the assistant coaches need to be axed. It doesn't matter if it ends up being a change for the worse, I read on Eklund's blog that teams who finish October with a losing record only make the playoffs 20% of the time. Will we be in that 20%? highly doubt it if this continues..change is GOOD, and change needs to happen NOW. Okay, enough from people saying Markov over Wiz. Markov hasn't even played yet for us to judge that. Let him play before we trash the signing, Wiz has had more knee injuries then Markov and hasn't shown that he can be a top Defensive force. Markov is by far the better player who could get way more money had he been healthy, it could turn into a huge steal for us. Let him play before we bash him. Cole fit a EXACT need everyone has been complaining about for YEARS. He is a big power forward. Yes he played bad in Edmonton... we must also remember that they were a terrible team. We needed to offer any fa that kind of money and those terms. It isn't even that bad! One year where he will be an over paid player? He hasn't had a great start, but the whole team hasn't played well so we cannot say it is a bust signing, let the team sort something out before we say he is going to be the highest paid 3rd liner and be another Gomez. When the team is playing terribly how can you expect one guy to be good? The whole entire team (except max) has played with no heart. I like that we actually went for someone during fa instead of just sitting around. It shows the right mentality. When it comes to veteran d. Markov has more experience then Wiz and Gill has played over 1000 games now. Spacek is a veteran and Campoli and Georges have been around long enough to not be youngins. Injuries to half our d-line is not something any gm can reasonably plan for. None of those points hold any validity. On the coach. Okay. I am tired of him. He is making a lot of mistakes from what I can see and even if not, I would like to see a more exciting game of hockey... but as has been pointed out... there are not many coaches available who fit Montreal's requirements. Should these requirements be changed... I say yes, but that is another issue. Gauthier has made some really smart moves, Campoli signing was great, the attempt for Betts was great, I agree with the Phoenix trade and I like the Cole signing and Markov signing, I have nothing bad to say about him. He is stuck at the moment because of injuries and flukes that make his moves look pointless, but I really like what he has done. No hate should be thrown at Gauthier. It does not make sense. The hate towards JM is a little more rational, mainly because a lot of people complain about him when we are winning anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 habsinsideout1 Dave Stubbs Unconfirmed report has #Habs Pacioretty injury his wrist. Might be fractured. Again, that's unconfirmed Crap. Trading Trotter who was really our only offensive guy in Hamilton is looking even worse now - different type of players I know, but who else is there that we can call up?? This will even look worse if Trotter lights it up in Phoenix! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Okay, enough from people saying Markov over Wiz. Markov hasn't even played yet for us to judge that. Let him play before we trash the signing, Wiz has had more knee injuries then Markov and hasn't shown that he can be a top Defensive force. Markov is by far the better player who could get way more money had he been healthy, it could turn into a huge steal for us. Let him play before we bash him. Cole fit a EXACT need everyone has been complaining about for YEARS. He is a big power forward. Yes he played bad in Edmonton... we must also remember that they were a terrible team. We needed to offer any fa that kind of money and those terms. It isn't even that bad! One year where he will be an over paid player? He hasn't had a great start, but the whole team hasn't played well so we cannot say it is a bust signing, let the team sort something out before we say he is going to be the highest paid 3rd liner and be another Gomez. When the team is playing terribly how can you expect one guy to be good? The whole entire team (except max) has played with no heart. I like that we actually went for someone during fa instead of just sitting around. It shows the right mentality. When it comes to veteran d. Markov has more experience then Wiz and Gill has played over 1000 games now. Spacek is a veteran and Campoli and Georges have been around long enough to not be youngins. Injuries to half our d-line is not something any gm can reasonably plan for. None of those points hold any validity. On the coach. Okay. I am tired of him. He is making a lot of mistakes from what I can see and even if not, I would like to see a more exciting game of hockey... but as has been pointed out... there are not many coaches available who fit Montreal's requirements. Should these requirements be changed... I say yes, but that is another issue. Gauthier has made some really smart moves, Campoli signing was great, the attempt for Betts was great, I agree with the Phoenix trade and I like the Cole signing and Markov signing, I have nothing bad to say about him. He is stuck at the moment because of injuries and flukes that make his moves look pointless, but I really like what he has done. No hate should be thrown at Gauthier. It does not make sense. The hate towards JM is a little more rational, mainly because a lot of people complain about him when we are winning anyways. I agree with you about the Markov signing. I would have resigned him, what i didn't like was that he signed for the same dollars, despite getting a 3 year deal. Given the habs were signing him to a longer term deal after serious injuries, I would have liked lower dollars. I think the issue I do have with the goat is like Gainey, he doesn't negotiate during the year and didn't immiadiatley try and resign Wiz when he started to have an impact in Montreal. I'm sure a guy who's moved around a lot and has an injury history like Wiz, probably would have signed for a lot less if he was offered a long term deal in the $4.5M range, despite his upcoming free agency. I also hated not signing AK46 longer term - I would have preferred that over signing Cole. I said it at the time, Cole hasn't looked good outside of the Canes. I also didn't like the term/$ we signed him for. The main issue with the Cole signing is how he is being used by the Penguin. The other major issue I had with the goat is the Halak trade. While in hindsight - Halak's suckage in St. Louis and the fact that Eller is looking good now - the trade is looking good now, the return of Eller and Schultz was terrible considering the playoff's that Halak had. Any other GM in the league would have tried to create a bidding war if he was going to make that deal, in fact there were GM's who said they would have been interested if they had known Halak was available. But the PR concscious Habs have to do everything in the shroud of secrecy which impacted the return for Halak. The fact that the caps got a 1st and 2nd rounder (which were expected to include a lottery pick), for a guy who wasn't looking very good and was rumoured to go back to russia, shows how lousy of the return the goat worked out. Habs have had bad luck with the Markov, Campoli and now the MaxPac injuries, but we are still not in the Pittsburgh situation, so I really think injuries are not the reason, our issues is having a coach who the game has passed by and too conservative of a GM. But given the inability or actually not attempting to sign Wiz early, is the issue I have with the goat, but can't fault him for signing Markov, given how successful most ACL surgeries are these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 The only way to break this curse is to bring Roy back into the organization. Maybe as an assistant coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Crap. Trading Trotter who was really our only offensive guy in Hamilton is looking even worse now - different type of players I know, but who else is there that we can call up?? This will even look worse if Trotter lights it up in Phoenix! Trotter cleared waivers twice.... give me a break. Why not try the guy who outperformed him in camp and was already with this team in Palushaj? Give him a spot on an offensive line instead of 5:00 per game beside Engqvist and you might see a different result. Brock Trotter was nothing special, its like lamenting the loss of Corey Locke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 I agree with you about the Markov signing. I would have resigned him, what i didn't like was that he signed for the same dollars, despite getting a 3 year deal. Given the habs were signing him to a longer term deal after serious injuries, I would have liked lower dollars. Given that the cap has risen over 15 million dollars between the two contracts.... signing for the same money is actually a discount. He takes up a lower % of the cap. When everyone else's contract is rising and his stays the same, its basically a discount. I think the issue I do have with the goat is like Gainey, he doesn't negotiate during the year and didn't immiadiatley try and resign Wiz when he started to have an impact in Montreal. I'm sure a guy who's moved around a lot and has an injury history like Wiz, probably would have signed for a lot less if he was offered a long term deal in the $4.5M range, despite his upcoming free agency. Thats nothing more than speculation. Wiz got a lot more than that. Everyone (including the agents) knew the cap was gonna have a 4-5 million dollar raise last year, and the fact that prices went sky high in the summer was easily predictable. So why would he have loyalty and give a home town discount to a team he played for 20 games for? I also hated not signing AK46 longer term - I would have preferred that over signing Cole. I said it at the time, Cole hasn't looked good outside of the Canes. I also didn't like the term/$ we signed him for. The main issue with the Cole signing is how he is being used by the Penguin. Cole played 1/2 a season outside of Carolina on a horrid Oiler team that has Shawn Horcoff as a number 1 centre. Lets give him some time to settle in. Also signing AK and not bringing in a UFA does nothing to add depth to the lineup... it would be icing the same lineup as last season, where at least in this way, we add another winger.... something that might be valuable in the coming weeks if maxpac is out a while. The other major issue I had with the goat is the Halak trade. While in hindsight - Halak's suckage in St. Louis and the fact that Eller is looking good now - the trade is looking good now, the return of Eller and Schultz was terrible considering the playoff's that Halak had. Any other GM in the league would have tried to create a bidding war if he was going to make that deal, in fact there were GM's who said they would have been interested if they had known Halak was available. But the PR concscious Habs have to do everything in the shroud of secrecy which impacted the return for Halak. The fact that the caps got a 1st and 2nd rounder (which were expected to include a lottery pick), for a guy who wasn't looking very good and was rumoured to go back to russia, shows how lousy of the return the goat worked out. Are you just parroting Pierre McGuire here? Eller = recent 13th overall pick (top half of the first round)..... Schultz = recent high 3rd rounder. Return for Varlamov = 1st + 2nd. There is very little difference between the return on the two deals. But Pierre when he goes on the radio conveniently ignores those facts because the guy has a personal grudge with Gauthier going back to being fired by him in Florida, and including not being considered for the Montreal job. Habs have had bad luck with the Markov, Campoli and now the MaxPac injuries, but we are still not in the Pittsburgh situation, so I really think injuries are not the reason, our issues is having a coach who the game has passed by and too conservative of a GM. But given the inability or actually not attempting to sign Wiz early, is the issue I have with the goat, but can't fault him for signing Markov, given how successful most ACL surgeries are these days. Pittsburgh when healthy is a better team than we are... they have more ability to withstand the injuries, that shouldn't be a surprise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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