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Getting ready for 2012-2013


hab29RETIRED

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Wow, fair market value is $4.5 (equivalent to Cole) for a guy who doesn't do half of what Cole does? I'd offer him another couple of years at his current price, might offer a slight raise, but there's no way in the Montreal Forum I offer him Cole money. None.

4.5 million is fair value based on stats... 20-25 goals 45-55 pts for a winger with size who hits.

Its not just cole, its ville leino, brooks laich, and a few others last offseason.

Thats what he'll get July 1st... its the price of that production.

Lets rmember 4.5 million in 2007 for Saku Koivu on a 45 million dollar cap is a lot different than 4.5 million today on a 64 million dollar cap.

I think we sometimes lose sight of the fact that inflation continues to occur in the league.

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I like some of the "thoughts" the Wilily 1 has for the re-shaping of the team. As you can see he was right about Cammy being moved away for a roster player/prospect/pic. Unfortunately I don't agree in the manner the team handled this transaction. I think that with some of the "mis-handlings" by management this year...game day firings/in-game trades....lack of preparation to properly ice a competitive team and pointing the proverbial finger down the line at individuals who were part of the process not part of the solution. Letting Kirk Muller get away from this organization was a momumental error. But it was quickly brushed under the carpet until the results became so bad that an ultramatim caused an exchange of wills battle that resulted in Perry Pearn losing his job 90 mins. before a home game against Philly. Now what Free Agent takes a look at this train wreck called the montreal Canadiens and says..."Oh Yeah....I want to go there" What do you think those Junior Kids are thinking as we step to the podium next June? If its PG walking up those steps with his group of acolytes then they have to be petrified on the thoughts of being selected by the Habs.

Ok...I've vented.....we need to make within the next 4 weeks overtures to AK46 and Moen to see if they are interested in signing extentions now. If they are dead against then by all means they must be packaged up and sent out before the deadline. We can't wait for the deadline to come to us. We are not in the luxury position here. We are going to be paying the piper here. So the faster we do it the better. If we wait...we will morre than likely lose the chance to move one or both and that will leave us with again a free UFA(s) walking away and ZERO return.

I can't say enough on how much this year's managemnt team including Molson is reminding me of how the Leafs were being run for the last 40 odd years prior to Burke getting on board. We lack vision...we use bandaid solutions to get us one day to the next. We're myopic and stubborn to the core How can the richest team in the NHL not have more than 1 PT resource scouting Quebec is beyound me. For a public company to get down on their knees to the French Press is just un-thinkable to me. This is a business/sport....best people, best players are hired to be employed by the team. There is no quota system. The government does not own the team....a public company owns them. GO HABS GO!!!

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Our problems going into next year: it's hard enough to attract UFA's with the tax situation,(you have to overpay by at least 10%) but being a basic laughinstock of the league,the overpayment will be greater. We have to fire Gainey and ALL the Ottawa retreads in this organization and get some fresh,competent people in charge. Might not be possible as Molson is proving he's a buffoon. And the year we get a lottery pick,the top prospects are Russian/Euros ,which we don't need anymore of

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The media has made it clear that anyone who doesnot speak French will be second class citzens. Congratulations, I don't see anyone lining up here unless we pay through the nose.

That also goes for any french players/coaches,unless it's someone desperate for a job.The dark ages of the late 90's/2000's could once again be upon us if something isn't done quick.Thsi management thinks they are smarter than anyone else,though they've never won anything.Except for Gainey in Dallas,and they spent almost $100m to do it and traded away Iginla

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The parallel with the Ballard Leafs is unsettling. We should all be worried.

It's too soon to panic, though. The organization was thrown into an unexpected situation, when a proven team in a position to improve instead took a huge lurch backward. When that sort of cataclysm happens, weird stuff follows - look at 2009 and the whole Carbo circus. There was nothing wrong with Gainey's operation, widely viewed as top-flight. It was just that the operation was thrown into the hopper due to extreme circumstances.

Now, the situation at the top clearly needs to stabilize. If the problem is Gauthier rather than Molson, then that's great news. We can, as Commandant has proposed, begin a comprehensive, rigorous and determined search for a GM - and I hope Jim Nill is the guy standing at the end - and hit 'reset,' with a team that is in vastly better shape than the one Gainey inherited.

But even if we don't unload Gauthier, subsequent years may show this season's chaos to have been a big aberration caused by disastrous results. Remember, his hockey decisions have been in the main sensible, he did lure Cole and Emelin, and he *was* GM through our generally successful season last year. Gauthier has clearly failed to distinguish himself as the coolest, steadiest hand at the rudder in a crisis...but that's true of a lot of general managers.

What absolutely cannot continue is the strong sense, felt by everyone from fans to players, that management is not in full command of events (as with the confused messaging around Cunneyworth) and that they are just reacting, reacting, without a plan. PG needs to make up his mind about what to do now that the original plan, which was to compete, is in the toilet, and proceed decisively, smoothly and competently in the new direction. That will settle everyone down and is his best chance of not being fired - unless Molson has already made up his mind, or is an idiot.

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Our problems going into next year: it's hard enough to attract UFA's with the tax situation,(you have to overpay by at least 10%) but being a basic laughinstock of the league,the overpayment will be greater. We have to fire Gainey and ALL the Ottawa retreads in this organization and get some fresh,competent people in charge. Might not be possible as Molson is proving he's a buffoon. And the year we get a lottery pick,the top prospects are Russian/Euros ,which we don't need anymore of

WOAH

Thats xenophobic right there.

If the best players are from Mars those would be the players I draft.

Who cares if its a Euro or a Canadian

I don't know if you noticed, but Canadians like Patrick Marleau, Dany Heatley, Roberto Luongo, Eric Lindros, and others can be playoff chokers with no heart too.

Meanwhile I think the Red Wings are pretty pleased with their Russians and Euros over the years... guys who won like a Pavel Datsyuk, Johan Franzen, Henrik Zetterberg, Sergei Fedorov, Nic Lidstrom etc....

Hell 4 of the last 8 Conn Smythe winners are non-Canadians.

The game has changed, we aren't the exclusive owners of heart and playoff ability.... just look at how tough the battles in the World Juniors have become.

That also goes for any french players/coaches,unless it's someone desperate for a job.The dark ages of the late 90's/2000's could once again be upon us if something isn't done quick.Thsi management thinks they are smarter than anyone else,though they've never won anything.Except for Gainey in Dallas,and they spent almost $100m to do it and traded away Iginla

Of oourse you have no problem criticizing the French media for how they treat non frnch players and coaches.

You are the pot who is calling the kettle black here.

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The problem is too many focus on enigmatic Russians or Europeans who have burned them in the past .

People never think about the countless headcase North American players because they are not so easy to categorize.

Both Yakupov and Grigs are playing in North America for the purpose of playing in the NHL. Neither seems to be a headcase player. If Montreal does finish bottom two (which I can't see it happening), we're getting a very good HOCKEY player. Which is all that matters.

EDIT: Funny Commandant, you forgot to mention Joe Thornton in your list of chokers ;)

Edited by Machine of Loving Grace
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Isn't it odd how we went from small to big in just a few games:

Bourque, Eller, Moen, Kostitsyn, Pacioretty, Cole, Darche, Blunden are 8 of the 11 forwards who dressed.

Some additonal minopr tweaking and a new look at D and this team looks like it can be re-tolled fairly easily.

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Even with adding guys like Bourque and Blunden, Montreal is now just an average sized team. The most important thing is Montreal is adding size that can skate. It'd be hard for me to cheer a slow Canadiens team. It just wouldn't feel like Montreal.

I don't expect a one season turnaround. I hope Montreal considers trying some youngsters in a top scoring winger role now that Cammalleri is gone. Experiment with Leblanc, Palushaj and Gallagher in the top line role, see what sticks. Moen and Kostitsyn should be traded for draft picks and prospects, same to Gill, Campoli and Weber. Expect a Bottom 10 finish and use the season as experience. 13-14 will be Gionta, Markov and Kaberle's last years with the club. That's the season you make a playoff run but don't give up too much because 14-15 is when the team should be ready to be a contender again. The top prospects should be ready to play and free agents should be considering Montreal as a great destination to win a Cup again.

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Even with adding guys like Bourque and Blunden, Montreal is now just an average sized team. The most important thing is Montreal is adding size that can skate. It'd be hard for me to cheer a slow Canadiens team. It just wouldn't feel like Montreal.

I don't expect a one season turnaround. I hope Montreal considers trying some youngsters in a top scoring winger role now that Cammalleri is gone. Experiment with Leblanc, Palushaj and Gallagher in the top line role, see what sticks. Moen and Kostitsyn should be traded for draft picks and prospects, same to Gill, Campoli and Weber. Expect a Bottom 10 finish and use the season as experience. 13-14 will be Gionta, Markov and Kaberle's last years with the club. That's the season you make a playoff run but don't give up too much because 14-15 is when the team should be ready to be a contender again. The top prospects should be ready to play and free agents should be considering Montreal as a great destination to win a Cup again.

Well the average last night was 6'1 and 206lbs. Actually bigger than the Rangers. This with Weber and Diaz both in the line-up. I think if we can get rid of Weber and add a good tough stay at home D-man in the 6'3-6'4 range then we'll take another step forward.

On a side note I've heard rumours from within Washington that Wednesday is going to be a very rough game. Bourque is going to be the target of many because of his shot to Backstrom.

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Well the average last night was 6'1 and 206lbs. Actually bigger than the Rangers. This with Weber and Diaz both in the line-up. I think if we can get rid of Weber and add a good tough stay at home D-man in the 6'3-6'4 range then we'll take another step forward.

The big blueliner in Montreal's future is Jarred Tinordi. Unless we can find someone to take a one to two year deal with size, best to use a smart D-man like Diaz until Tinordi is ready for the NHL.

What Brendan Gallagher lacks in size he backs up with intensity and aggression. His height won't be a mark against his ability even in the NHL. Danny Kristo seems to play with an edge as well if his recent suspension has anything to say about it.

Steve Quailer is really coming into his own as of late and I could see him on Montreal's bottom six. Michael Bournival is destined to make our bottom six as well. That's size, strength and intensity built through our draft. Extremely important and valuable.

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<p>

Isn't it odd how we went from small to big in just a few games:

Bourque, Eller, Moen, Kostitsyn, Pacioretty, Cole, Darche, Blunden are 8 of the 11 forwards who dressed.

Some additonal minopr tweaking and a new look at D and this team looks like it can be re-tolled fairly easily.

Bourque made it 8 of 11 but I've been pointing to 7 of 11 for a while. The size of the forwards has been a bit of a mmythh for a while now at least at forward. Its on D where we need another nasty guy with aize to shut down the cycle.

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<p>

Bourque made it 8 of 11 but I've been pointing to 7 of 11 for a while. The size of the forwards has been a bit of a mmythh for a while now at least at forward. Its on D where we need another nasty guy with aize to shut down the cycle.

Can't wait to have White back. I am not sure if he'll ever be a center in the NHL but he'd look good on that 4th line right now.

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Can't wait to have White back. I am not sure if he'll ever be a center in the NHL but he'd look good on that 4th line right now.

He would be a great fourth liner right now!

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WOAH

Thats xenophobic right there.

If the best players are from Mars those would be the players I draft.

Who cares if its a Euro or a Canadian

I don't know if you noticed, but Canadians like Patrick Marleau, Dany Heatley, Roberto Luongo, Eric Lindros, and others can be playoff chokers with no heart too.

Meanwhile I think the Red Wings are pretty pleased with their Russians and Euros over the years... guys who won like a Pavel Datsyuk, Johan Franzen, Henrik Zetterberg, Sergei Fedorov, Nic Lidstrom etc....

Hell 4 of the last 8 Conn Smythe winners are non-Canadians.

The game has changed, we aren't the exclusive owners of heart and playoff ability.... just look at how tough the battles in the World Juniors have become.

Of oourse you have no problem criticizing the French media for how they treat non frnch players and coaches.

You are the pot who is calling the kettle black here.

I'm into a winning hockey team. You can be politically correct.Good for you,I hope it makes you feel good.You can point out particular cases. Point is Bost,Chic and Pitt,last 3 cup winners have very few Euros and we consistently dress double that. RedWings are an anomaly to that,but their Euros are bigger and tougher and better than anyone elses.Plus their cup winning days seem to be in the rearview mirror. BTW I am a Euro myself,born and lived there for 15 years.Other than specific cases,they can't match North Americans grit,toughness and heart. Fact.

I think the whole Montreal media French or English are as soft as our team ever was. A bunch of buttkissers. It took a young female reporter to call out JM about using Darsche instead of Cole on the PP.

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Pittsburgh's leading scorer in the regular season and Playoffs was a Russian..... he also won the Conn Smythe Trophy. Their leading scorer among defencemen in the playoffs was also a defenceman.

Euros on the cup winning team.... Malkin, Gonchar, Sykora, Fedotenko, Satan, (i count 5 there).

Chicago's Cup team.... Hossa, Kopecky, Hjarlmarson, Niemi, Huet, (again another 5 guys there)

As for grit, toughness and heart its a myth..... a myth propogated by xenophobes like Don Cherry.... the reality is Canada has more hockey players than these countries and thus produces more good players on average. Its all proportional. In those proportions are gritty players and soft players. There are gritty Euros and soft Euros, there are gritty Canadians and Soft Canadians... there are just more Canadians overall. Over half the league is still Canadian.

The softest player I've ever, ever seen in my life is Pierre Turgeon; here's a guy who when 21 of his teammates were fighting on the ice in Piestany refused to get involved. Who stood by and watched as two Russians assaulted Stephane Roy and injured him severely. He's gutless. Yet here he is a "good Canadian boy" by birth.

I think you evaluate these two players on who they are, and not where they were born. Everything I've seen from Grigorenko and Yakupov suggests that neither is soft. Not in the QMJHL and OHL respectively... Yakupov is a big hitter despite being 5'11. Grigorenko uses his size very effectively as well. Also in the WJC we saw Grigorenko play the final two games on one leg with a severly injured ankle, suggesting a ton of heart and courage. I really don't think that they are soft.

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I'm into a winning hockey team. You can be politically correct.Good for you,I hope it makes you feel good.You can point out particular cases. Point is Bost,Chic and Pitt,last 3 cup winners have very few Euros and we consistently dress double that. RedWings are an anomaly to that,but their Euros are bigger and tougher and better than anyone elses.Plus their cup winning days seem to be in the rearview mirror. BTW I am a Euro myself,born and lived there for 15 years.Other than specific cases,they can't match North Americans grit,toughness and heart. Fact.

I think the whole Montreal media French or English are as soft as our team ever was. A bunch of buttkissers. It took a young female reporter to call out JM about using Darsche instead of Cole on the PP.

Oooo! If we want to roll with stereotypes, I have a great one which could get me pilloried: Francophone players don't know where their own zone is, which is why Montreal doesn't like them and why other teams have to insulate them with OHL and WHL grads in order not to be constantly scored upon. They attack well, but their defence is hopeless.

For the record, I don't believe that. What I believe is that the Q has traditionally been a more offensive league which leads to higher scoring and better goalies, but which can delay a player's defensive capabilities for a year or two thus ensuring they need more time in the AHL, and don't hit their stride in the NHL until slightly later in their careers. This is also why they're drafted, on average, slightly lower than other leagues. (Unverified, as it's just subjective feeling for the moment.)

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I'm into a winning hockey team. You can be politically correct.Good for you,I hope it makes you feel good.You can point out particular cases. Point is Bost,Chic and Pitt,last 3 cup winners have very few Euros and we consistently dress double that. RedWings are an anomaly to that,but their Euros are bigger and tougher and better than anyone elses.Plus their cup winning days seem to be in the rearview mirror. BTW I am a Euro myself,born and lived there for 15 years.Other than specific cases,they can't match North Americans grit,toughness and heart. Fact.

I think the whole Montreal media French or English are as soft as our team ever was. A bunch of buttkissers. It took a young female reporter to call out JM about using Darsche instead of Cole on the PP.

These mindsets are why there are people who believe the Montreal Canadiens haven't won a Stanley Cup since 1993 because there are not as many Quebecois on the team.

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lafrous? You're entitled to your opinion. We all have them, and that's what makes websites like these interesting. But kindly refrain from using the word fact, will ya? Especially when discussing someone's heart. Because you have no clue what you're talking about. Again, these are opinions. The current temperature is -11C outside my door, that's a fact. Getting inside the head of a player from Europe is impossible. But keep posting, I agree with your take on Campoli.

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Euros on the cup winning team.... Malkin, Gonchar, Sykora, Fedotenko, Satan, (i count 5 there).

Chicago's Cup team.... Hossa, Kopecky, Hjarlmarson, Niemi, Huet, (again another 5 guys there)

Let's not forget who Boston's captain is... It sure looked like he had just a little bit of heart in him when he lifted the cup last year. Their leading scorer during their cup run? David Krejci. Not exactly the most Canadian name you'll ever find.

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Let's not forget who Boston's captain is... It sure looked like he had just a little bit of heart in him when he lifted the cup last year. Their leading scorer during their cup run? David Krejci. Not exactly the most Canadian name you'll ever find.

Thanks

To add to Chara and Kreijci; Dennis Seidenberg is from Germany, Tomas Kaberle from Czech Republic and Tuukka Rask finland... so you have 5 Euros on that team; and in pretty big roles... #1C, #1 and 2 Dmen, PP QB and a Goalie who played 29 games and is probably the best backup in the NHL.

As bad as Boston's PP was in the playoffs, consider this... Kaberle had as many PP points for them as Chara, Lucic, Seguin, Bergeron, Peverley and Marchand combined. All of whom had between 17 (lowest Marchand) and 73 (highest Chara) minutes of PP time in the playoffs.

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