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Getting ready for 2012-2013


hab29RETIRED

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Thanks

To add to Chara and Kreijci; Dennis Seidenberg is from Germany, Tomas Kaberle from Czech Republic and Tuukka Rask finland... so you have 5 Euros on that team; and in pretty big roles... #1C, #1 and 2 Dmen, PP QB and a Goalie who played 29 games and is probably the best backup in the NHL.

As bad as Boston's PP was in the playoffs, consider this... Kaberle had as many PP points for them as Chara, Lucic, Seguin, Bergeron, Peverley and Marchand combined. All of whom had between 17 (lowest Marchand) and 73 (highest Chara) minutes of PP time in the playoffs.

Tim Thomas isn't even from this planet, let alone Europe.

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unless PG does something incredibly stupid like trading Subban (wouldn't really surprise me), which should only happen if he can somehow hypnotize Ray Shero or Stan bowman to trade for Malkin or Toews, one of the big moves I think we need is Larry Robinson as an assistant coach.

TOnights game, you could see Ladouceur and Subban jawing at each other after Subban's giveaway that led to a goal. I really think PK needs a guy who was a stud dman (both an explosive offensive star and a defenseive rock) to work with him. Rob Blake, Zitnick raved about how Robinson mentored them, as did Nediermeyer. I think he is the kind of guy that could get through to PK.

We have to get a new coach next year, whoever we get, hiring Larry Robinson should be part of the deal - regardless who we hire. Subban's dad was supposed to be a habs fan, so he would probably also tell subban to listen and listen closey to the big bird. I really think the habs have mismanaged Subban from the start. You look at Letang, Karlson and even a guy like Fowler (who is really a one dimensional dman), they are free to fly and use their offesnsive talent. I think the habs should have let Subban more freedom offensively, at least be confident and keep that part of the game working and work with him to improve his offensive game (i.e don't telegraph the play with his big golf swing and start using the wrister more oftern and practice hitting the FRIGGIN NET), while gradually getting to improve his defensive game. Right now, he seems messed up on both sides of the ice. For a 22/23 (??), he is still playing pretty good, but I really think he could be much further ahead if it didn't seem like he is fighting with the coaching staff.

With all the things I'm pissed off about with Gainey and PG, I think the way the treated Robinson stings the most, becuase I really think we would have a completey different Subban, if he had a better mentor. It's very rare to have a superstar like Robinson who has also proved himself as an elite coach, been a cup winner and has coached or mentored so many great dman (Neidermeyer, Blake, Zhitnik, Stevens, Rafalski). The guy has won as a player and coach and players love him. Yet Gainey strung him along, didn't return his calls, until Robinson finally gave up and went to the devils. It pisses me off to no end that a guy like Lamoriello modeled his team on the Montreal Canadiens and made it a point to hire former Habs greats to turn New jersey to one of the greatest franchises (after Detroit), over the last 15 years. Yet, Gainey, who won all five of his cups with Robinson as a teammate, didn't see the value of having Robinson as an assistant coach with a very young defense.

While Gill, may have been effective in helping keeping subban a bit grounded and may have helped teach him to be more professional, if I was Subban, I'd be tuning Gill out a lot, simply because I know how much better i am then Gill. Tuning out Robinson would have been a totally different story. Muller was one of the few good decsions the habs made (I believe he was Carbo's choice), and the players loved him. Robinson, is another coach, wherever he has coached, the players have loved him. I'd love him as a head coach as well, but he has already said in the past, that he doesn't want the stress that comes with being a head coach and had to quit becasue of the effect the stress had on his health. But he would be the perfect assistant, and I can't help to think how much further ahead Subban could have been right now and how much better Weber could be. Subban still has been a very effective dman (given his age), but weber is a guy i think the habs really Fxcked up with having him swtich from defense to forward - really smart decision by Martin to take a 20 year dman learning the pro-game and shuttling him back and forth as a forward and dman. I had thought Weber could have been (and once we trade him, I think he still will become) a highly effective dman in the mold of Brian Rafalski.

I really hope that that friggin idiot Molson has given very clear instructions to PG, that under no circumstances is Subban, Maxpac or Price to be moved, unless he approves all deals, and I really hope that the guy is smart enough to know that you better not be moving any of these guys unless you are getting a king's ransom.

Then as soon as the season ends, I hope he fires PG's ass on the day after the season ends and tries to get Jim Nill out of Detroit and i guess its a foregone conclusion that the habs will hire an idiot like Hartley/crawford/Therrian, even if Bobcock got fired from Detroit, since its more important for the coach to speak french, then it is for him to be a great coach. Anyway, whichever french coach they hire (hopefully TB will fire Boucher, despite him not having a goalie and a worse defesne then the habs to work with), I really hope Molson corrects Gainey's stupidity and brings Larry Robinson back into the fold.

I think Robinson will not only be great with Subban (weber if he is kept - although that is doubtful), with the potential of a lot of good young dman coming up in the system (Beaulieu, Tinordi and others), the big bird would be a great mentor to haver around for 2-3 years.

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unless PG does something incredibly stupid like trading Subban (wouldn't really surprise me), which should only happen if he can somehow hypnotize Ray Shero or Stan bowman to trade for Malkin or Toews, one of the big moves I think we need is Larry Robinson as an assistant coach.

TOnights game, you could see Ladouceur and Subban jawing at each other after Subban's giveaway that led to a goal. I really think PK needs a guy who was a stud dman (both an explosive offensive star and a defenseive rock) to work with him. Rob Blake, Zitnick raved about how Robinson mentored them, as did Nediermeyer. I think he is the kind of guy that could get through to PK.

We have to get a new coach next year, whoever we get, hiring Larry Robinson should be part of the deal - regardless who we hire. Subban's dad was supposed to be a habs fan, so he would probably also tell subban to listen and listen closey to the big bird. I really think the habs have mismanaged Subban from the start. You look at Letang, Karlson and even a guy like Fowler (who is really a one dimensional dman), they are free to fly and use their offesnsive talent. I think the habs should have let Subban more freedom offensively, at least be confident and keep that part of the game working and work with him to improve his offensive game (i.e don't telegraph the play with his big golf swing and start using the wrister more oftern and practice hitting the FRIGGIN NET), while gradually getting to improve his defensive game. Right now, he seems messed up on both sides of the ice. For a 22/23 (??), he is still playing pretty good, but I really think he could be much further ahead if it didn't seem like he is fighting with the coaching staff.

With all the things I'm pissed off about with Gainey and PG, I think the way the treated Robinson stings the most, becuase I really think we would have a completey different Subban, if he had a better mentor. It's very rare to have a superstar like Robinson who has also proved himself as an elite coach, been a cup winner and has coached or mentored so many great dman (Neidermeyer, Blake, Zhitnik, Stevens, Rafalski). The guy has won as a player and coach and players love him. Yet Gainey strung him along, didn't return his calls, until Robinson finally gave up and went to the devils. It pisses me off to no end that a guy like Lamoriello modeled his team on the Montreal Canadiens and made it a point to hire former Habs greats to turn New jersey to one of the greatest franchises (after Detroit), over the last 15 years. Yet, Gainey, who won all five of his cups with Robinson as a teammate, didn't see the value of having Robinson as an assistant coach with a very young defense.

While Gill, may have been effective in helping keeping subban a bit grounded and may have helped teach him to be more professional, if I was Subban, I'd be tuning Gill out a lot, simply because I know how much better i am then Gill. Tuning out Robinson would have been a totally different story. Muller was one of the few good decsions the habs made (I believe he was Carbo's choice), and the players loved him. Robinson, is another coach, wherever he has coached, the players have loved him. I'd love him as a head coach as well, but he has already said in the past, that he doesn't want the stress that comes with being a head coach and had to quit becasue of the effect the stress had on his health. But he would be the perfect assistant, and I can't help to think how much further ahead Subban could have been right now and how much better Weber could be. Subban still has been a very effective dman (given his age), but weber is a guy i think the habs really Fxcked up with having him swtich from defense to forward - really smart decision by Martin to take a 20 year dman learning the pro-game and shuttling him back and forth as a forward and dman. I had thought Weber could have been (and once we trade him, I think he still will become) a highly effective dman in the mold of Brian Rafalski.

I really hope that that friggin idiot Molson has given very clear instructions to PG, that under no circumstances is Subban, Maxpac or Price to be moved, unless he approves all deals, and I really hope that the guy is smart enough to know that you better not be moving any of these guys unless you are getting a king's ransom.

Then as soon as the season ends, I hope he fires PG's ass on the day after the season ends and tries to get Jim Nill out of Detroit and i guess its a foregone conclusion that the habs will hire an idiot like Hartley/crawford/Therrian, even if Bobcock got fired from Detroit, since its more important for the coach to speak french, then it is for him to be a great coach. Anyway, whichever french coach they hire (hopefully TB will fire Boucher, despite him not having a goalie and a worse defesne then the habs to work with), I really hope Molson corrects Gainey's stupidity and brings Larry Robinson back into the fold.

I think Robinson will not only be great with Subban (weber if he is kept - although that is doubtful), with the potential of a lot of good young dman coming up in the system (Beaulieu, Tinordi and others), the big bird would be a great mentor to haver around for 2-3 years.

I forgot about what they did to Robinson. We would love to see Larry behind our bench in any capacity. I don't know how his style would play in that new cycling culture but quite willing to try it. In Gainey's defense, and I am not a Gainey fan anymore, Robinson and Martin would be like mixing oil and water. Lastly, and I get that you think the goat needs oversight on his incoming trades, you don't want the owner making hockey decisions (approving trades), that is a recipe for disaster.

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unless PG does something incredibly stupid like trading Subban (wouldn't really surprise me), which should only happen if he can somehow hypnotize Ray Shero or Stan bowman to trade for Malkin or Toews, one of the big moves I think we need is Larry Robinson as an assistant coach.

TOnights game, you could see Ladouceur and Subban jawing at each other after Subban's giveaway that led to a goal. I really think PK needs a guy who was a stud dman (both an explosive offensive star and a defenseive rock) to work with him. Rob Blake, Zitnick raved about how Robinson mentored them, as did Nediermeyer. I think he is the kind of guy that could get through to PK.

We have to get a new coach next year, whoever we get, hiring Larry Robinson should be part of the deal - regardless who we hire. Subban's dad was supposed to be a habs fan, so he would probably also tell subban to listen and listen closey to the big bird. I really think the habs have mismanaged Subban from the start. You look at Letang, Karlson and even a guy like Fowler (who is really a one dimensional dman), they are free to fly and use their offesnsive talent. I think the habs should have let Subban more freedom offensively, at least be confident and keep that part of the game working and work with him to improve his offensive game (i.e don't telegraph the play with his big golf swing and start using the wrister more oftern and practice hitting the FRIGGIN NET), while gradually getting to improve his defensive game. Right now, he seems messed up on both sides of the ice. For a 22/23 (??), he is still playing pretty good, but I really think he could be much further ahead if it didn't seem like he is fighting with the coaching staff.

With all the things I'm pissed off about with Gainey and PG, I think the way the treated Robinson stings the most, becuase I really think we would have a completey different Subban, if he had a better mentor. It's very rare to have a superstar like Robinson who has also proved himself as an elite coach, been a cup winner and has coached or mentored so many great dman (Neidermeyer, Blake, Zhitnik, Stevens, Rafalski). The guy has won as a player and coach and players love him. Yet Gainey strung him along, didn't return his calls, until Robinson finally gave up and went to the devils. It pisses me off to no end that a guy like Lamoriello modeled his team on the Montreal Canadiens and made it a point to hire former Habs greats to turn New jersey to one of the greatest franchises (after Detroit), over the last 15 years. Yet, Gainey, who won all five of his cups with Robinson as a teammate, didn't see the value of having Robinson as an assistant coach with a very young defense.

While Gill, may have been effective in helping keeping subban a bit grounded and may have helped teach him to be more professional, if I was Subban, I'd be tuning Gill out a lot, simply because I know how much better i am then Gill. Tuning out Robinson would have been a totally different story. Muller was one of the few good decsions the habs made (I believe he was Carbo's choice), and the players loved him. Robinson, is another coach, wherever he has coached, the players have loved him. I'd love him as a head coach as well, but he has already said in the past, that he doesn't want the stress that comes with being a head coach and had to quit becasue of the effect the stress had on his health. But he would be the perfect assistant, and I can't help to think how much further ahead Subban could have been right now and how much better Weber could be. Subban still has been a very effective dman (given his age), but weber is a guy i think the habs really Fxcked up with having him swtich from defense to forward - really smart decision by Martin to take a 20 year dman learning the pro-game and shuttling him back and forth as a forward and dman. I had thought Weber could have been (and once we trade him, I think he still will become) a highly effective dman in the mold of Brian Rafalski.

I really hope that that friggin idiot Molson has given very clear instructions to PG, that under no circumstances is Subban, Maxpac or Price to be moved, unless he approves all deals, and I really hope that the guy is smart enough to know that you better not be moving any of these guys unless you are getting a king's ransom.

Then as soon as the season ends, I hope he fires PG's ass on the day after the season ends and tries to get Jim Nill out of Detroit and i guess its a foregone conclusion that the habs will hire an idiot like Hartley/crawford/Therrian, even if Bobcock got fired from Detroit, since its more important for the coach to speak french, then it is for him to be a great coach. Anyway, whichever french coach they hire (hopefully TB will fire Boucher, despite him not having a goalie and a worse defesne then the habs to work with), I really hope Molson corrects Gainey's stupidity and brings Larry Robinson back into the fold.

I think Robinson will not only be great with Subban (weber if he is kept - although that is doubtful), with the potential of a lot of good young dman coming up in the system (Beaulieu, Tinordi and others), the big bird would be a great mentor to haver around for 2-3 years.

Subban needs a mentor. Seems like all the players bad-mouthing him were right. It WASN'T RACISM like some freaks were suggesting. He's turned into a slew-footing,trash-talking,coach-arguing turtle.Top 5 talent,but bottom 5 brain

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God forbid a player and coach talk on the bench in the middle of the game about a bad play.....

THIS NEVER HAPPENS IN THE NHL

Give me a break.

Mountain out of a mole hill.... again.

And you thought that slewfoot was a good,tough hockey play? he's turning into a punk and needs to be straightened out asap. he's too good to be like that,and is the #1 player talent in this organization (Sorry Carey fans)

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God forbid a player and coach talk on the bench in the middle of the game about a bad play.....

THIS NEVER HAPPENS IN THE NHL

Give me a break.

Mountain out of a mole hill.... again.

I so agree this is what i want to to see on either a great or bad play. Communication is key and one of the few things most didn't like about J.m. I would rather him talk to him then sit him for the rest of the game which we all seen before on this team as in a young guy screws up and nailed to the bench and a vet can do no wrong.
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It's not south the arguing on the bench - its the same type of mistakes being made over and over again on both sides of the ice. That shows the message isn't getting through.

God forbid a player and coach talk on the bench in the middle of the game about a bad play.....

THIS NEVER HAPPENS IN THE NHL

Give me a break.

Mountain out of a mole hill.... again.

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There's an emerging current of thought that says PK is uncoachable. Which is interesting, because he certainly seemed coachable last season under the twin auspices of Martin and Gill.

If you ask me, Subban needs a firm coaching hand that relays a consistent message and is prepared to bench him if that message is not heeded. Sadly, this Markov-less team has no choice but to dress PK no matter what he does. Furthermore, instability in the coaching ranks (3 coaches within 6 months, once Cunny is gone and the new guy hired) is exactly the WRONG prescription for his development.

The worst thing we could do is trade him under these circumstances and if we do trade him we will regret it for the next 15 years. Fire Gauthier, replace Cunneyworth, and reboot - starting with a firm hand with PK.

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Perspective, from Melnick

"

“Subban is in his second NHL season. What’s Drew Doughty doing in LA? Ok, I’ll tell you. In 43 games Doughty is 3-17-20 pts +1. Subban, in 46 games, is 3-16-19 pts -1. Calder Trophy winner Tyler Myers has 8 points in 27 games this season, has been a healthy scratch, and is -8. In his 2nd NHL season Jack Johnson had 11 points and was -18. Second year defenseman Cam Fowler has played 45 games this season. He’s 3-15-18 pts -13. And to save us both a lot of time I’ll just jump ahead to Zdeno Chara who, in his second full season, played 65 games and was 2-9-11 pts -27. Chara had a similar third full season before his imbecile of a GM lost his patience and dealt him to Ottawa.”

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Perspective, from Melnick

"

“Subban is in his second NHL season. What’s Drew Doughty doing in LA? Ok, I’ll tell you. In 43 games Doughty is 3-17-20 pts +1. Subban, in 46 games, is 3-16-19 pts -1. Calder Trophy winner Tyler Myers has 8 points in 27 games this season, has been a healthy scratch, and is -8. In his 2nd NHL season Jack Johnson had 11 points and was -18. Second year defenseman Cam Fowler has played 45 games this season. He’s 3-15-18 pts -13. And to save us both a lot of time I’ll just jump ahead to Zdeno Chara who, in his second full season, played 65 games and was 2-9-11 pts -27. Chara had a similar third full season before his imbecile of a GM lost his patience and dealt him to Ottawa.”

Thank you.

PK will continue to struggle at times, but it's all part of his development. No player is truly untouchable, but PK should be kept at almost any cost, or I am confident we will rue the day we squandered such an asset.

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And you thought that slewfoot was a good,tough hockey play? he's turning into a punk and needs to be straightened out asap. he's too good to be like that,and is the #1 player talent in this organization (Sorry Carey fans)

Subban is a cheap shot artist just like other Canadien greats like Chelios, Corson and Lemieux. I have no problem with that. I want people to hate playing the Canadiens, even if it means people disrespecting us.

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Subban is a cheap shot artist just like other Canadien greats like Chelios, Corson and Lemieux. I have no problem with that. I want people to hate playing the Canadiens, even if it means people disrespecting us.

That's greasy,slewfooting. it's not a facewash or punch in the head. Als Those 3 players fought many times,and with success. other than lemieux,they didn't dive and corson and Cheloios NEVER turtled. bad comparisons

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That's greasy,slewfooting. it's not a facewash or punch in the head. Als Those 3 players fought many times,and with success. other than lemieux,they didn't dive and corson and Cheloios NEVER turtled. bad comparisons

Subban turtled because he had five Bruins coming at him and he was on the ice. Sorry, I'm turtled too when I could get a skate to the face.

People have rose coloured glasses on if they don't remember the kind of things those three would pull with CH uniforms. And also, doesn't matter if you fight. What matters is whether you help your team win or not. You have a very Cherryisian viewpoint on hockey players.

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Subban turtled because he had five Bruins coming at him and he was on the ice. Sorry, I'm turtled too when I could get a skate to the face.

People have rose coloured glasses on if they don't remember the kind of things those three would pull with CH uniforms. And also, doesn't matter if you fight. What matters is whether you help your team win or not. You have a very Cherryisian viewpoint on hockey players.

He turtled against Florida too. I've played competetively. Slewfooting is chickensh*t. Dirty like Corson,Chelios,Nilan,Tremblay,or Neely, Tocchet,Ryan even Lucic is one thing,PK is falling into the Lemieux,Marchand,Linesman,Samuelsson category which is puke hockey. he has the ability to be a perrenial Norris trophy and even MVP candidate if he follows the right path. Yapping,diving and slewfooting isn't it. If you're gonna pull that crap then you should be ready to fight

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I'm just sick of the whole don cherry mentality of wanting our guys to fight or the need for them to have to fight. Against Washington, to start the game Rene Bourque dropped the gloves won the fight. Where was the supposed big momentum swing???? Washington scored 3 minutes later and we got shutout.

Last night Maxpac fought and you could see him sitting in the box rubbing his hands and wrists. He went off later in the game holding his wrist (did return). I don't want our guys risking an injury by getting into a fight. I grow up enjoying the Habs-Nords bloodbaths of the early to mid-eighties as much as anyone else. But honestly, fighting is something that needs to be taken out of the game. even the former GM of the bruins Harry sinden felt that way. Kerry Fraser has also wrote the same thing in one of his blogs, or it might have been only in the kamloops paper i read. But seriously, I don't want Subban, MaxPac, Cole, Ak46, Emelin, or any of our bigger important players fighting.

All this talk about hockey being necessary to cut down on the stick work or rats is bullshit. Get tougher on disciplining stick infractions, un-sportsman like conduct like other major professional sport. Hell, the NHL gave Avery a long suspension of calling Phaneuf's girlfriend a sloppy second. You're telling me they can't start giving guys 5 to 10 game suspensions for FIRST TIME OFFENDERS meaningful suspensions (rather then bullshit 1 gamers and then 2-3 gamers, then 4-5 gamers, then 7 games), that tougher suspensions wouldn't take the cheap shots out of the game????? Suspend repeate offenders for 10 to 15 then 20 to 30 games. On top of that start having more infractions become majors. Players WILL learn to adjust and the game WILL be cleaned up.

If you get tough on cheap cross checks to head, boarding, stick infractions, spearing, cheap elbows to the head (like Bourque on Backstrom, Ference on Halpern, or Steckel on Crosby), or guys like Lucic running over goalies, and there is an actual MEANINGFUL CONSEQUENCE to an action, these infractions will be phased out.

Having vigilante justice as the means of eliminating cheap shots doesn't work. Hell, we are in a situation now, where even when a guy lays a completely CLEAN hit on someone, he gets challenged to fight. The whole arguement that tougher discipline takes hitting out of the game is bullshit. The best hockey I saw in the last 5 years was the last olympics. how much fighting was there???? It was fast, skilled, high tempo hockey, with lots of solid CLEAN hits.

To me its absurd that the NHL wants to take out headshots to cut risks of concussions, yet, its fine to have bare knuckle punches to the head.

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I 100% agree and support what habs29retired said. The idea that fighting is somehow necessary is bullshit.

I also want to point out that PK has fought 5 times in 1.5 years in the league. How many times do you want to see the player with the most icetime on the team sitting in the box?

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PK is being over taxed..He is simply playing too many minutes and we can thank Gauthier for that..He decided to re sign Markov and PK is the closest thing we have to a top pairing defence man..Gorges is solid, but more of a shut down top 4 kinda guy that can eat minutes in the top 2 from time to time..

IMO, he is wearing down because he is so young..Mental fatigue tends to sink in if you are worn down which, in turn causes your mental sharpness to become a little dull..

As soon as we find another top pairing/top 2 defense man to help PK, he will be making the same mistakes out there..We can't be having a 22 year old logging close to 30 minutes a game and expect him not to make mistakes..Give the kid some help..He needs it..

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I 100% agree and support what habs29retired said. The idea that fighting is somehow necessary is bullshit.

I also want to point out that PK has fought 5 times in 1.5 years in the league. How many times do you want to see the player with the most icetime on the team sitting in the box?

Last I checked,fighting was a part of the game,the teams with the most fight are atop the East.And 95% of players polled want to keep it in the game.That huge.If it's allowed/even encouraged then you might as well be good at it. I didn't see any complaints when White beat Boychuk or Bourque won his fight. Why else are people so enamored about White coming back? Of course you're going to want fighting abolished if your team gets their asses handed to themall the time. Habs need to adapt to the NHL not vice versa.

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You're both right. Look at what's become of some of the tough guys when career ends.

Julien, Vigneault,Holmgen,Burke,Gainey,Robinson,Milbury,Cherry off the top of my head were really tough guys and seem to be doing ok. You can pick specific cases to support both sides of any argument

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If you don't think that the concussions suffered by fighters have a dramatic effect on their quality of life after their careers are over.... there is really no use responding to any more of your posts. This bury your head in the sand mentality is sickening.

Look everyone knows someone who smoked a pack a day and lived to be 95-100 years old; however we don't hear people arguing that there aren't dangers to being a smoker.

You can pick out all the fighters you want who are doing well today, doesn't change the fact that CTE is real, and changes people's lives, and is being found at an astonishing rate in the brains of NHL enforcers.

Its utter lunacy to say that just because 100% of fighters don't suffer from it, it means that Fighters don't face an increased risk.

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Julien, Vigneault,Holmgen,Burke,Gainey,Robinson,Milbury,Cherry off the top of my head were really tough guys and seem to be doing ok. You can pick specific cases to support both sides of any argument

Are you listing guys that are actual players or just coaches/gm's?? If your trying to give examples of Players the only elite players you'v listed are Robinson and Gainey. Burke never played in the NHL and I believe Julien, Vigneuault were career minor leaguers along with the CBC cross-dressing clown Cherry. Milbury isn't even worth mentioning.

One of the longest serving (if not the longest) serving GM of the big bad bruins was campaigning to get rid of fighting in the 90's, based on his perspective of guys like Henderson in the 72 summit series.

In any even, anyone who cites Milbury as an example to support his arguement isn't even worth responding to.

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Last I checked,fighting was a part of the game,the teams with the most fight are atop the East.

And the team that has the fewest fights in the entire league leads the NHL in points (Detroit). Just goes to show that one mentality isn't necessarily more right than the other...

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