Permanent Trade Proposal Thread

[Machine of Loving Grace]

I think the better move for Winnipeg would be to fire their coach and hold onto Kane to see if the new guy (likely Dale Hawerchuk) can get him motivated and happy. I suspect they'd try that first. Frankly, they should have tried that already.

They are very loyal to a mediocre coach.

[TurdBurglar]

How about Bourque, Diaz, Leblanc + possibly a pick for Kane?

Bourque is Bourque, but Diaz has offensive potential and is coming into his own defensively which is very attractive, plus Leblanc still has potential to be good but doesn't seem to want to put the extra effort in to be an NHL player on Montreal.

This trade will be near even salary wise (5.25m for 4.55m), Winnipeg gets a LW under contract for a couple of years, a solid 3rd pair defenceman that can play on their PP, plus a possible future 2nd/3rd line center. We get a goal scoring RW to put with Chucky and Eller or Patches and DD, with Gally filling out the other line's RW. Give us 2 full scoring lines.

[hab29RETIRED]

If their GM were to make this deal, he'd be fired.

How about Bourque, Diaz, Leblanc + possibly a pick for Kane?

Bourque is Bourque, but Diaz has offensive potential and is coming into his own defensively which is very attractive, plus Leblanc still has potential to be good but doesn't seem to want to put the extra effort in to be an NHL player on Montreal.

This trade will be near even salary wise (5.25m for 4.55m), Winnipeg gets a LW under contract for a couple of years, a solid 3rd pair defenceman that can play on their PP, plus a possible future 2nd/3rd line center. We get a goal scoring RW to put with Chucky and Eller or Patches and DD, with Gally filling out the other line's RW. Give us 2 full scoring lines.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Yeah, you might as well offer Mario Tremblay's old jockstrap for Kane.

[Neech]

Yeah, you might as well offer Mario Tremblay's old jockstrap for Kane.

So you're saying I'll have to up my offers for the jockstrap?

[DON]

Byfuglien would be quite a player to add and $5.2/year seems a good salary (that Eklund mentioned Habs may be a suiter for the big fellow, fantasy BS or not?) but he can be an impact player for sure.

Just not sure what Jets would demand in a deal for him? Diaz, Bourque, Beaulieu, 1st pick, etc ?

Or maybe Eller for him?

A d-core of 79-76, 74-Buff, 26-6-Tinordi would look good to Price I think and may be hard to beat in playoffs.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Byfuglien would be quite a player to add and $5.2/year seems a good salary (that Eklund mentioned Habs may be a suiter for the big fellow, fantasy BS or not?) but he can be an impact player for sure.

Just not sure what Jets would demand in a deal for him? Diaz, Bourque, Beaulieu, 1st pick, etc ?

Or maybe Eller for him?

A d-core of 79-76, 74-Buff, 26-6-Tinordi would look good to Price I think and may be hard to beat in playoffs.

This would be a tremendous acquisition and probably elevate us to being one of the league's very best defence corps, and one with ringing depth to boot. I do think, though, that "Buff" would be most useful to us in his old "FW/D" mould - we could use him more up front than on the back end, in fact. Imagine what we could do with this hulking winger on the PP, for example. His real value to us would thus depend on the extent to which he's happy to be used as a forward should need be. If he's now only a defender, then he still adds considerable value, but it's not necessarily the grand-slam-home-run acquisition he could be.

But of course Beaulieu alone wouldn't prise this important player from the Jets. I think you're right to mention Eller as a possible target...but losing Eller could have serious implications for the rebuild, turning C from a position of relative strength to one of relative weakness. (We'd be relying on an emerging-but-not-fully-mature Galy + an aging Pleks + Desharnais - not exactly inspiring, unless we see Bournival changing the equation). It'd be a bold move, that's for sure.

Also an interesting one, inasmuch we'd almost certainly be giving up key young players (Beaulieu, Eller, Bournival, whatever) in the deal. Given that Buff, who is turning 29, is approaching hockey middle age with maybe another four years of peak performance left, this'd be a signal that we are going all-out for a Cup within the "Markov window," and anything beyond that will have to come from players not yet drafted.

[DON]

I hate to even suggest trading Eller, but to get quality impact player already signed for several more years at OK salary, would never be cheap nor painless;

Some say is better to deal when team isn't in desparate need of a trade.

With Plekanec and DD as top 2 centres anyways, would sill have Galchenyuk, Bournival as 3rd centre option and upgrade on backend (and as winger in crease or on the point on the PP) might be enough to improve team overall?

But the production of Subban, Markov and Byfuglien combined is tantalizing.

[Neech]

Buff's age is key. He's already had conditioning and consistency issues, and soon he'll be on the side of 30 where those rapidly catch up with you (and have a tendency to do so with big-body players like him). Like Cucumber said, that would be a win-now move, and besides the fact that we're not quite ready for that sort of move, it could have the adverse effect of the Vanek win-now move - what we lose would be more than we gain (in the case of Eller).

I'd lock up Eller long term for somewhere between Desharnais and Pacioretty money. How long have we wanted a big centre with offensive skills?

[hab29RETIRED]

Byfuglien would be quite a player to add and $5.2/year seems a good salary (that Eklund mentioned Habs may be a suiter for the big fellow, fantasy BS or not?) but he can be an impact player for sure.

Just not sure what Jets would demand in a deal for him? Diaz, Bourque, Beaulieu, 1st pick, etc ?

Or maybe Eller for him?

A d-core of 79-76, 74-Buff, 26-6-Tinordi would look good to Price I think and may be hard to beat in playoffs.

if we were to trade for Byfuglien, no way we can afford Subban, Markov, Gorges and Emelin. one of our top 3 would be moving. The only way it would make any sense to trade for Byfuglien, if he was going to be a forward like he was in Chicago.

If there is any truth in this rumour, what would worry me is MB, moving Subban for the lower salary (with the exception of +/-, stats wise they are pretty close). No way i'd move Subban for anyone not named Crosby, Malkin or Stamkos.

[hab29RETIRED]

Buff's age is key. He's already had conditioning and consistency issues, and soon he'll be on the side of 30 where those rapidly catch up with you (and have a tendency to do so with big-body players like him). Like Cucumber said, that would be a win-now move, and besides the fact that we're not quite ready for that sort of move, it could have the adverse effect of the Vanek win-now move - what we lose would be more than we gain (in the case of Eller).

I'd lock up Eller long term for somewhere between Desharnais and Pacioretty money. How long have we wanted a big centre with offensive skills?

I agree about Eller. I like a core of Price, Subban, Markov, Emelin, MaxPac, Eller, Galchenyuk, Galleghar and Pleks.

I'm hoping if DD continues to produce he gets move. I can see interest in Gorges from those teams needing leadership (i.e. WPG, EDM).

[hab29RETIRED]

I hate to even suggest trading Eller, but to get quality impact player already signed for several more years at OK salary, would never be cheap nor painless;

Some say is better to deal when team isn't in desparate need of a trade.

With Plekanec and DD as top 2 centres anyways, would sill have Galchenyuk, Bournival as 3rd centre option and upgrade on backend (and as winger in crease or on the point on the PP) might be enough to improve team overall?

But the production of Subban, Markov and Byfuglien combined is tantalizing.

Next year, I'd consider moving Pleks. No way would I want to move Eller. DD, i'd move this year if i could.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Well, nearly any trade proposal involving Subban is out of the question in my book. I'm with habs29 on that - it had better be Crosby, Stamkos, or maybe Malkin coming back. I'd probably settle for that Ovechkin guy too.

Not too keen on the idea of trading Plekanec even next season. I know he hasn't racked up points, but I've absolutely loved his game this year - he seems confident in every situation and just plays such a smart all-around game - it's very important not to underrate his quietly critical contribution as out best all-around player. He's not getting any younger, but I don't see any hint of a drop-off. He's just the type of guy you win with, so I'd be looking to re-sign him myself.

[Commandant]

Byfuglien is a guy I just don't know about.

How does he fit in our team with his salary.

We really don't need the PP help... and his defensive game isn't the greatest.

Not sure he's worth 5.2 million as a winger (though he is worth that to teams where he is the first unit PP guy, on our team he's not).

He's also had issues with his wieight and was reportedly over 300lbs last year.

I don't think he'd be cheap trade wise either.

I don't know its the best move for Montreal even if he's valuable somewhere.

[DON]

I still don't think Habs will make any "big" trades but,

Subban average 49pts/year, Markov 48 and Byfuglien 45.

Sure the big fellow defensively not great and I don't really care if he is 300lbs during the summer (he seems to be producing on a weak team again), he still is a quite mobile player and he is one player even Chara might not be able to push around in front of net and Lucic would not be keen on tackling nor trying to intimidate.

So he instantly, as Murray does on back end, Byfuglien would give a physical presence that Habs are somewhat lacking.

And Bergevin knows him from Chicago, so yes cost would be painful and would involve a top 6 player, but he fits the McCaron/Crisp/Prust in Habs "New-Culture" type of player.

I would be on the fence about trade for the big fellow (or Kane) and I think only Eller or Pacioretty would get it done, which no habsfan wants to see moved, but I don't know if would be an upgrade overall, but interesting or debatable for sure.

[dlbalr]

I still don't think Habs will make any "big" trades but,

Subban average 49pts/year, Markov 48 and Byfuglien 45.

Sure the big fellow defensively not great and I don't really care if he is 300lbs during the summer (he seems to be producing on a weak team again), he still is a quite mobile player and he is one player even Chara might not be able to push around in front of net and Lucic would not be keen on tackling nor trying to intimidate.

So he instantly, as Murray does on back end, Byfuglien would give a physical presence that Habs are somewhat lacking.

The money on the blueline would be insane though. If you estimate Markov and Subban at $13 M next year, add in Byfuglien (5.2), Emelin (4.1), Gorges (3.9),one of Beaulieu/Tinordi (1 factoring in an allowance for some bonuses), plus Drewiske (.6375), that's $28 million in defence costs. That's way too high to work with.

[Machine of Loving Grace]

For comparison, St. Louis currently spends $27M on their blueline. With Steen, Berglund and Sobotka up in the summer they probably won't be spending as much again next season. Jackman and Leopold will be downgraded.

I currently don't feel we sorely need anything. We have one of the best D-corps in the East when healthy.

[DON]

The money on the blueline would be insane though. If you estimate Markov and Subban at $13 M next year, add in Byfuglien (5.2), Emelin (4.1), Gorges (3.9),one of Beaulieu/Tinordi (1 factoring in an allowance for some bonuses), plus Drewiske (.6375), that's $28 million in defence costs. That's way too high to work with.

Why do you assume Markov is resigned?

He will be old-timer softball age and Byfuglien will be 29 and cheaper than Markov would demand, so $$ wise is better to offload him when he is still worth a ton to a contender.

Just a bit of devil's advocate take, not that i dont love what ol 79 is bringing at present, but he is 1 hit away from retirement and every time he goes into corner and takes a hit, i keep my fingers crossed he dont go down again.

[dlbalr]

Why do you assume Markov is resigned?

He will be old-timer softball age and Byfuglien will be 29 and cheaper than Markov would demand, so $$ wise is better to offload him when he is still worth a ton to a contender.

Just a bit of devil's advocate take, not that i dont love what ol 79 is bringing at present, but he is 1 hit away from retirement and every time he goes into corner and takes a hit, i keep my fingers crossed he dont go down again.

You mentioned the point averages for Subban, Markov, and Byfuglien, so I assumed you were pondering the offensive future of a blueline with all three of those guys.

[hab29RETIRED]

Why do you assume Markov is resigned?

He will be old-timer softball age and Byfuglien will be 29 and cheaper than Markov would demand, so $$ wise is better to offload him when he is still worth a ton to a contender.

Just a bit of devil's advocate take, not that i dont love what ol 79 is bringing at present, but he is 1 hit away from retirement and every time he goes into corner and takes a hit, i keep my fingers crossed he dont go down again.

I'd take the old-timer softball age Markov over a 29 year old Byfugulien next year.

[PMAC]

Why do you assume Markov is resigned?

He will be old-timer softball age and Byfuglien will be 29 and cheaper than Markov would demand, so $$ wise is better to offload him when he is still worth a ton to a contender.

Just a bit of devil's advocate take, not that i dont love what ol 79 is bringing at present, but he is 1 hit away from retirement and every time he goes into corner and takes a hit, i keep my fingers crossed he dont go down again.

Any and every player in the league is one hit--or other incident-- away from retirement every game. See Geffrion,B; Audette, D; McCleary, T etc. We -- and especially they-- are lucky that Patches is not on the retired list, or Parros for that matter

[DON]

Any and every player in the league is one hit--or other incident-- away from retirement every game. See Geffrion,B; Audette, D; McCleary, T etc. We -- and especially they-- are lucky that Patches is not on the retired list, or Parros for that matter

You know not true, older players with surgically repaired knees, achilles would be a bit more risky to insure than a Gallagher/Eller or any younger player with no spare parts in their knee.

Why are we lucky Parros didn't retire? I am happy for him to be healthy, but cringe anytime he is not on the bench or in pressbox.

But this is just a "trade proposal" thread and seems most would never even entertain trading any of top Habs ever, until they slump/are injured and have reduced value, which dosent seem like smart "objective" business practice.

But, I still don't expect any big trades by Bergevin, nor do I think any are necessary, but......

[PMAC]

You know not true, older players with surgically repaired knees, achilles would be a bit more risky to insure than a Gallagher/Eller or any younger player with no spare parts in their knee.

Why are we lucky Parros didn't retire? I am happy for him to be healthy, but cringe anytime he is not on the bench or in pressbox.

But this is just a "trade proposal" thread and seems most would never even entertain trading any of top Habs ever, until they slump/are injured and have reduced value, which dosent seem like smart "objective" business practice.

But, I still don't expect any big trades by Bergevin, nor do I think any are necessary, but......

It is more likely that someone who has previous injuries might have a career ending injury, but my point is that it COULD happen to anyone. Also, did you not see Parros having a chat with Colton Orr on Sat., when Orr was going after Subban? That BS didn't happen again, so yes I am happy Parros is back on the team. He has a limited, but useful role.

Also, I would entertain the trading of almost any Hab if the return was right. However, when you have a dominant d pair, contenders don't usually trade one unless they are getting outstanding value back. Also, a trade is rather unlikely while we are in the middle of great streak and generally playing really good hockey.

[Machine of Loving Grace]

You know not true, older players with surgically repaired knees, achilles would be a bit more risky to insure than a Gallagher/Eller or any younger player with no spare parts in their knee.

Why are we lucky Parros didn't retire? I am happy for him to be healthy, but cringe anytime he is not on the bench or in pressbox.

But this is just a "trade proposal" thread and seems most would never even entertain trading any of top Habs ever, until they slump/are injured and have reduced value, which dosent seem like smart "objective" business practice.

But, I still don't expect any big trades by Bergevin, nor do I think any are necessary, but......

Who is going to replace Markov? We've been asking this question for years now. The answer has always been nobody. Now that Subban has established himself as the team's best defenceman, we're still not sure who Markov's replacement is because now his role has changed. He's now the veteran blueliner who can score and play great D. We don't have a two way player like him ready. We don't know if Beaulieu will become it. And even if he did replace his production, he wouldn't replace his leadership and experience.

So sure, we might get a first round pick, maybe another pick, a decent prospect from a contending team for him, but what's the use? We're losing value that we can't replace. And hey, let's say we even get a guy similar to Markov to replace him like Kronwall. Who is to say he's gonna gel with the team like Markov does? Nothing.

Your viewpoint in this is a lot like when someone barks, "Hey anyone is tradeable, look at Gretzky!" ignoring that trading Gretzky was a terrible mistake for Edmonton. We're currently riding the second best (or maybe the best) defence in the East. You lose Markov? We're no longer playing with a great defence. All for the gamble of hopefully drafting or acquiring a blueliner who could one day grow to be Markov, or be Markov, or better than Markov. All gambles equivalent of burning your money.

If the right deal came around, there's a lot of Habs I'd trade. For all of the Evander Kane talk, I'd be up to offering Lars Eller to get it done. But Markov? It immediately handicaps the team to lose him. Why would you do that?

[hab29RETIRED]

Who is going to replace Markov? We've been asking this question for years now. The answer has always been nobody. Now that Subban has established himself as the team's best defenceman, we're still not sure who Markov's replacement is because now his role has changed. He's now the veteran blueliner who can score and play great D. We don't have a two way player like him ready. We don't know if Beaulieu will become it. And even if he did replace his production, he wouldn't replace his leadership and experience.

So sure, we might get a first round pick, maybe another pick, a decent prospect from a contending team for him, but what's the use? We're losing value that we can't replace. And hey, let's say we even get a guy similar to Markov to replace him like Kronwall. Who is to say he's gonna gel with the team like Markov does? Nothing.

Your viewpoint in this is a lot like when someone barks, "Hey anyone is tradeable, look at Gretzky!" ignoring that trading Gretzky was a terrible mistake for Edmonton. We're currently riding the second best (or maybe the best) defence in the East. You lose Markov? We're no longer playing with a great defence. All for the gamble of hopefully drafting or acquiring a blueliner who could one day grow to be Markov, or be Markov, or better than Markov. All gambles equivalent of burning your money.

If the right deal came around, there's a lot of Habs I'd trade. For all of the Evander Kane talk, I'd be up to offering Lars Eller to get it done. But Markov? It immediately handicaps the team to lose him. Why would you do that?

Trading Markov would be as stupid as what Serve Savard did in the late 80's/early 90's. We had Kurvers, Chelios, Schneider and Svobodar, so he let Robinson walk (rather than make him Captain), dumped Ludwig and Green. Than he also dumped Chelios. You can't expect young players develop without strong veteran mentors and aside from the hockey sense and skill Markov brings to the table, he is a leader and example on the ice and there is no replacement for that. You can get a leader like a Gorges (kind of like a Keane or Skrudland), but its not the same as having your BEST player or a an elite player being a role model - those guys are rare. With Subban, Tinordi and Bealieau all being young dmen, Markov is invaluable to the habs.

This is why I've been pissed when over the last few years, the habs have passed on Jagr. After reading about the impact that Chelios training regimen had on the Red Wings young players, I really think having a guy like Jagr as a role model for Galchenyuk, Gallegher, MacPac, Eller and now Bournival would be invaluable. I'd much rather spend the money on Jagr than a pussy like Briere, whose lack of effort was the primary reason for a goal in the last couple of games.