Jump to content

Leafs vs. Habs, Toronto Sports Network Edition


Recommended Posts

We should have hung onto Cammy and tried moving him for a 1st rounder rounder and been willing to pick up an expiring bad contract if we had to. If not at the deadline we should have waited until the draft.

No they should not have kept Cammy.

This team is a rutterless ship. The players are clueless, they don't try. They have no top line, arguably 3 nhl defenseman. They score on most nights 1 goal a game.

So as much as bourque blows, you can say that about every forward not named Cole, pacs or DD.

I actually think Edmonton may catch them.

I'd like to hear it from now until the end of the season. Molson seems like a guy to give into pressure and I want him to feel the pressure to cut ties with both PG and Gainey.

Fair enough. Doing that may be better in the final home game or two of the season though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It wasn't wrong to trade Cammy, but we didn't get good value for him. We also might have been able to make a much bigger trade later with him included.

Bourque looks to be the next "should be better, frustrating to watch, when will he break out" player. In that sense, he replaces AK.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Man I can't wait for this season to be over. I'm such a sad sack that I can't stop watching the habs self destruct.

Can't wait for a fresh start with a new GM and coach to at least start heading in the right direction. it's really "dead men walking" at the moment.

(null)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It wasn't wrong to trade Cammy, but we didn't get good value for him. We also might have been able to make a much bigger trade later with him included.

Bourque looks to be the next "should be better, frustrating to watch, when will he break out" player. In that sense, he replaces AK.

But that's what everybody said when we acquired him. Big guy, not a bad scorer when interested, not interested very often. I agreed with habs29 at the time that we should have tried to package Cammy as part of a bigger deal. That being said, the extra cap room is nice.

This team needs an elite winger. Maybe even more than it needs an elite C, frankly. This summer will tell the tale.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Man I can't wait for this season to be over. I'm such a sad sack that I can't stop watching the habs self destruct.

Can't wait for a fresh start with a new GM and coach to at least start heading in the right direction. it's really "dead men walking" at the moment.

(null)

I'm going to do my best to make tonight's game the last Habs game I watch this season. What's the point of watching these games? The only compelling storyline in play is how many goals MaxPac can get before the season ends...nothing else noteworthy with this bunch.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Man this is a tough loss to swallow. As a guy who wishes nothing but the worst for the Leafs, all I wanted was a Habs victory tonight. Just one measly win, don't care about the rest, just wanted this one. And they couldn't deliver......what a crappy season.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

so what do you think you get for an underproducing scorer(only) who is a dressing room problem and has troubles with the coaches? a first round pick? lets remember there were only 6 or 7 teams on that list of his no trade clause

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We can't really evaluate the Bourque trade until next year. We got a great return for Cammy, remember, he had 19 goals this year for 6 or 7 million and was on pace to produce even less this year. If a guy has a reputation to float, certainly being on the second worst team in the league reinforces that. He can also play the penalty kill, and is part of the habs-smurf makeover. This is probably the worst Canadiens team of all time, including the Rejean Houle years. Lost in all this is the fact that David Desharnais has emerged as a decent number 1 center. Seeing him play so well with two power forwards is why we're building the team up with bigger players. I think we're going to trade Plex and Beaulieu or Gallagher with a 2nd for James Van Riemsdyk. Then down the middle we'll have DD, Eller, Leblanc and White or another 4th line center.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm going to do my best to make tonight's game the last Habs game I watch this season. What's the point of watching these games? The only compelling storyline in play is how many goals MaxPac can get before the season ends...nothing else noteworthy with this bunch.

Amen to that, although I bet I'll end up watching again. Its kind of like when you're throwing up vowing to never drink again, and yet you still do lol

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17:34 for Plekanec tonight. Might be the lowest TOI i've seen him earn in a while. I couldn't believe my eyes when i saw he went 1-13 on the draw.

Disinterested or frustrated?

Probably a combo, this season has been just shit for him.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not a fan of the smurf Gionta personally.  Only smurf on the team I like is DD

Yeah. I mean the guy is a leader, who works his ass off every shift, plaus a two way game, kills penalties, goes to the front of the net despite his size and led our team in goals two years in a row. He also shows up in the playoffs. Certainly a guy worthy of fan hate, just cause he's small. Big guys like Rene Bourque are so much more valuable.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We can't really evaluate the Bourque trade until next year.  We got a great return for Cammy, remember, he had 19 goals this year for 6 or 7 million and was on pace to produce even less this year.  If a guy has a reputation to float, certainly being on the second worst team in the league reinforces that.  He can also play the penalty kill, and is part of the habs-smurf makeover.  This is probably the worst Canadiens team of all time, including the Rejean Houle years.  Lost in all this is the fact that David Desharnais has emerged as a decent number 1 center.  Seeing him play so well with two power forwards is why we're building the team up with bigger players.  I think we're going to trade Plex and Beaulieu or Gallagher with a 2nd for James Van Riemsdyk.  Then down the middle we'll have DD, Eller, Leblanc and White or another 4th line center.

white and leblanc are not centres.  Both are being converted to wing.  If they believed Leblanc was a centre, he wouldn't have played every game for the bulldogs at wing.

As for the smurf team being the worst team ever, I'd take the 2009 team which was much smaller than this years team as being way better than this team.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

so what do you think you get for an underproducing scorer(only) who is a dressing room problem and has troubles with the coaches? a first round pick? lets remember there were only 6 or 7 teams on that list of his no trade clause

People got stupid at the deadline, a guy with proven playoff history might have been worth more than what we got in January.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We can't really evaluate the Bourque trade until next year. We got a great return for Cammy, remember, he had 19 goals this year for 6 or 7 million and was on pace to produce even less this year. If a guy has a reputation to float, certainly being on the second worst team in the league reinforces that. He can also play the penalty kill, and is part of the habs-smurf makeover. This is probably the worst Canadiens team of all time, including the Rejean Houle years. Lost in all this is the fact that David Desharnais has emerged as a decent number 1 center. Seeing him play so well with two power forwards is why we're building the team up with bigger players. I think we're going to trade Plex and Beaulieu or Gallagher with a 2nd for James Van Riemsdyk. Then down the middle we'll have DD, Eller, Leblanc and White or another 4th line center.

That is anawful bunch down the middle. Don't hold your breath for Eller to emerge as anything other than a 3rd liner. White is a very good 4th liner. And we should be drafting a center with our top 3 pick. Pleks stays

Disinterested or frustrated?

Probably a combo, this season has been just shit for him.

Just look at his wingers. i'm glad Cunny is interim

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Gionta coming back helps the wings a lot, but we could use another wing too.

I still say I hated that Cammy trade, he may have needed to go, but we needed to get more back than Bourque.

Are you forgetting Holland? This is the guy they targetted,not Bourque. Bourque is just something to cover off the loss of Cammy in the present on a team that is going no where, somebody producing at a similar rate to Cammy. Holland is a Geoffrion type of return, only a few years behind.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Are you forgetting Holland? This is the guy they targetted,not Bourque. Bourque is just something to cover off the loss of Cammy in the present on a team that is going no where, somebody producing at a similar rate to Cammy. Holland is a Geoffrion type of return, only a few years behind.

I like Holland, and I've talked about him a little on the prospects board. His stats are fantastic, but he's also playing on a line with two overagers who are destroying the WHL. His two linemates have better stats than he does. It remains to be seen if his potential is more than a 3rd line guy. As CC has pointed out, we lack a first line winger. The big reason is that what Cammy was to bring has not been replaced. Bourque might take the place of Kostitsyn on the third line long term, but trading a first line wing for a third line wing plus a third line prospect isn't really the best move in my move. The very fact that move felt so rushed after the infamous We Play Like Losers interview makes me question it, and maybe we should have taken a step back before making this move.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

DD is not a number 1 center in this league. He is playing with too big, scoring wingers. Even Gomez might be doing decently between those two. DD is having a great year, but I don't think he is the key to that line. If you drop him with Bourque and Gionta, he will drop off considerably.

We need a true number one center. Then we can decide who between DD, Eller, and Pleks we should keep. One probably has to go. I might be tempted to trade DD for a scoring winger as I think his trade value is very high right now and I am not convinced he repeats this years performance (especially without Cole and Pacs). The other thing to keep in mind is that small guys like him tend to be very hot, then get broken down with the years faster then the bigger guys.

Now if we get a big number one center, then I could see DD and Pleks being our other centers, but this means Pleks is our 3rd line shutdown guy (which is would be fantastic at). I am not sure Pleks would settle for that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You can be a shutdown guy and play on the second line.  I think this is Pleks role going forward.  A ton of teams in the league are doing this now... just look at Patrice Bergeron, Ryan Kesler, Jordan Staal, Mike Richards, Mikko Koivu, Ryan O'Reilly, and a number of others.  DD can also be moved to wing, which would mean we'd still keep all three of DD, Plek, Eller.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

DD is not a number 1 center in this league. He is playing with too big, scoring wingers. Even Gomez might be doing decently between those two. DD is having a great year, but I don't think he is the key to that line. If you drop him with Bourque and Gionta, he will drop off considerably.

We need a true number one center. Then we can decide who between DD, Eller, and Pleks we should keep. One probably has to go. I might be tempted to trade DD for a scoring winger as I think his trade value is very high right now and I am not convinced he repeats this years performance (especially without Cole and Pacs). The other thing to keep in mind is that small guys like him tend to be very hot, then get broken down with the years faster then the bigger guys.

Now if we get a big number one center, then I could see DD and Pleks being our other centers, but this means Pleks is our 3rd line shutdown guy (which is would be fantastic at). I am not sure Pleks would settle for that.

I wouldn't agree completely with this. I honestly think DD is the catalyst on that line. MaxPac stated he was the best center (or player?) he's ever played with. Cole was almost up for a career year in points. Had he not had a slow start, he could of passed the 60 mark. I think a lot of it has to do with DD being able to find these guys just about anywhere. He's extremely quick in making decisions with the puck. Plekanec is an equally good distributor of the puck, but i think DD has better game vision.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Are you forgetting Holland? This is the guy they targetted,not Bourque. Bourque is just something to cover off the loss of Cammy in the present on a team that is going no where, somebody producing at a similar rate to Cammy. Holland is a Geoffrion type of return, only a few years behind.

Holland is just another 3rd line type according to the experts,,which we have had so many over the years.

DD is not a number 1 center in this league. He is playing with too big, scoring wingers. Even Gomez might be doing decently between those two. DD is having a great year, but I don't think he is the key to that line. If you drop him with Bourque and Gionta, he will drop off considerably.

We need a true number one center. Then we can decide who between DD, Eller, and Pleks we should keep. One probably has to go. I might be tempted to trade DD for a scoring winger as I think his trade value is very high right now and I am not convinced he repeats this years performance (especially without Cole and Pacs). The other thing to keep in mind is that small guys like him tend to be very hot, then get broken down with the years faster then the bigger guys.

Now if we get a big number one center, then I could see DD and Pleks being our other centers, but this means Pleks is our 3rd line shutdown guy (which is would be fantastic at). I am not sure Pleks would settle for that.

DD is playing at a level that Gomez was suppose to be,salary or not. Eller,imo doesn't really have much trade value and his max value is a 3rd liner

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Commandant's analysis of DD's deficiencies defensively in another thread was excellent. But in terms of being an offensive catalyst, I'm inclined to think the evidence is pretty persuasively in Desharnais's favour, and I think it's a disservice to him to say he's a 'product' of his wingers for just the reasons mineral states. I'll go out on a limb and say he is a legitimate #2 C in the NHL, notwithstanding his defensive limitations. In effect he replaces what Grabovski should have been to this team if we hadn't stupidly thrown him away (along with Ribeiro, Lapierre, and Sergei Kostitsyn).

As I've said elsewhere, despite conventional wisdom there's a case to be made that a stud winger might add more value to this team than a stud centreman. Right now, we have MaxPac and Cole on the wing and that's it; Gionta will be a useful addition but he's not getting any younger and his injuries are a bit worrisome. Give Pleks an elite winger and suddenly the situation at C looks, not great, but serviceable. Bring an elite C in here and that's still not gonna make Bourque, Geoffrion, Leblanc, or whoever else legitimate top-line wingers. In short, it's at W where we really need big-time help, with nothing on the big club and nothing close to being ready in the system.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think Eller has confidence issues....too much pressure and not enough encouragement from Cunningworth ( read...at this point in the season he needs to find a groove not sit on the bench all game) he should be alloted 2nd line center duties next season and given some rope (read quality linemates) to see what he can do for 20 games or so. He has size and skill, he just needs to build some chemestry with consistent wingers (not Kostitsyn) and i think we will be surprised with his output. Put him between Cole and Gio and we instantly have a 2nd line that works hard is defensively responsible and can score. i dont think its that unreasonable to expect 20-25 goals from every guy on that line including Eller.

especially if we actually have a Number 1 center to take the tough assignments (2nd overall draft pick this year, i know it is much to ask for from a kid but others recently have done it, RNH).... and a third line center to take most of the defensive assignments (Plekanecs).

the way i see it is that Pleks plays best when he is the best skilled player on the line.

if you are still with me I am thinking this:

Patches (1st rounder or DD) (FA winger) -- with Gomez gone we are going to have money to spend this offseason on a 1st line winger

Gionta Eller Cole ---if after 20 games this doesn't work swap Pleks for Eller

Bourque Plekanec Leblanc/Moen (kind of an expensive 3rd worth it to have Pleks in on all important faceoffs/penalty kills/hardchecking)

Boom Boom Jr White staubitz type (crash, bang and fight) a llittle weak in FW's but that can be fixed (hire a face off coach-- no panic Yanik)

this will give us three very close lines in terms of skill each will have a designated role. plus if we can get a true sniper for the firstline Winger position (Parise?) we would really be dangerous. and the best part is i think we have the money to pull this off if PG doesnt ###### it up. With the plethora of picks we have in the next two drafts all we have to do is plugin players as they become NHL ready and there is space (ie. Gionta's contract expires, Coles contract expires). Pleks and Bourque are here for a while and everyone else will be re-uped in the next season or two.

Vola insta-dinasty (feel free to cut up my ideas at your convienience)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...