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2012-13 Habs Lineup: the Forwards


hankhab
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I remember hearing the Leafs inquired for him (around that same time) and the Avalanche wanted something like Grabovski, Shenn and two firsts. Something ridiculously high like that. So for Montreal equivalent we're talking Plekanec, Emelin and two firsts. No thanks.

Plekanec is miles better than that Belarussian and Yemelin is as well over Schenn, so a bit different, but like i say it would cost for sure, but to secure a yound solid centre upgrade would do wonders i think and is needed till Galchenyuk develops, which will be a couple/few years?

Just maybe need to consult Glen Sather on how to pull wool over another GMs eyes and trade expendables for quality.

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Tomas would still be #30 of 44 centres in playoffs (if extrapolated reg season #s), So you think bottom 1/3 of league consistantly is OK for a centre group and are happy with that, what can i say, but that i disagree and see as a glalring weakness that needs to change.

There is a reason Stastny/Bergeron/Malhotra/Toews etc are on for every important faceoff in a close game.

For the Habs it dosent matter, they all suck (relatively) at it.

It is costly to have to consistantly chase puck down the ice after most offensive PP faceoffs, and for Gorges and Price to stand on head stopping/blocking point shots after most PK faceoffs.

I'm saying that faceoff percentage is OVERRATED. Give me a guy who loses 5% more of his faceoffs but is a better hockey player and I'll take him every day of the week.

A 5% difference in faceoff percentage is the difference of about 1 faceoff per game for a guy like Plekanec.

The difference between being 49% in the circle and 54% in the circle is not worth the teeth gnashing that analysts give us.

If it was a guy at 25% vs a guy at 75% sure, the extra faceoff wins add up. But in this case, they don't.

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Stastny's point totals

79, 57, 53, in the last three years

Plekanec's totals

70, 57, 52

A difference of 10 points over 3 years. And Stastny is no where near as valuable as Plekanec defensively.

Colorado has also been a higher scoring team than Montreal in that time period.

And we want to give Plekanec + Emelin + picks for a guy with a bigger contract?

Why?

Don't get me wrong, I like Stastny, but I probably wouldn't trade Pleks for Stastny 1 for 1.

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I'm saying that faceoff percentage is OVERRATED. Give me a guy who loses 5% more of his faceoffs but is a better hockey player and I'll take him every day of the week.

A 5% difference in faceoff percentage is the difference of about 1 faceoff per game for a guy like Plekanec.

The difference between being 49% in the circle and 54% in the circle is not worth the teeth gnashing that analysts give us.

If it was a guy at 25% vs a guy at 75% sure, the extra faceoff wins add up. But in this case, they don't.

I hear ya and like i say you are happy with sub-average face-offs %, which is fine and kind of understand.

But, i disagree 100% and has zero to do with any anyalysts, for example;

Tomas (whom i hate to pick on but). is even worse on special teams and drops to 47.1%, so too say a Toews (i know totally at other end of spectrum but) at 59% overall and actually ups to 60.0% on special teams, is an irrelevant stat seems a bit odd and dont buy it?

Whom would you pick to take an important faceoff if only had these 2 to pick from?

Because i see some faceoffs, even just 1 sometimes, can be that much more important and can mean diff between a win-loss, and those who win just that 1 extra every game, tend to be the elite leaders.

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Stastny's point totals

79, 57, 53, in the last three years

Plekanec's totals

70, 57, 52

A difference of 10 points over 3 years. And Stastny is no where near as valuable as Plekanec defensively.

Colorado has also been a higher scoring team than Montreal in that time period.

And we want to give Plekanec + Emelin + picks for a guy with a bigger contract?

Why?

Don't get me wrong, I like Stastny, but I probably wouldn't trade Pleks for Stastny 1 for 1.

I said i wouldnt consider that a fair deal, but Tomas for Stastny straight up, in a second!

And again Stastny is more the "typical centre upgrade" example, that i see might be a super fit as #1 centre. If had Stastny at #1 and Plekanec at #2, would be even better, but would likely cost top defensemen + stuff instead.

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Galchenyuk will likely win the second line LW position and by 2013-2014, him and DD will likely swap positions.

Yes. This configuration makes a lot of sense. Even if Galy is NHL-ready, it might be good to ease him in via the less demanding LW position (assuming he can make the adjustment). Indeed, this scenario offers at least some hope that there is some method behind Bergevin's madness in totally refusing to upgrade the top-6 this summer.

As for Pleks+ for Stastny, this looks supiciously like a costly lateral move at C. Non merci.

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I wouldn't trade Plekanec for Statsny 1:1.

The 3rd line slot was an option more cause only way Gomez and his 7+ cap hit makes the team is if he's turned around his offensive game enough to play top 6, he doesn't bring anything else to the table to warrant taking away development of Eller or physicality of White and if Galchenyuk is not NHL ready to play centre in the top 6 I'd prefer he go back and dominate junior at that position than play this year on left.

Ideally Galy makes the team, Pleks is top line centre and new bottom 6 guys like Prust/Colby and a healthy White/Moen take some of the PK and shut down time to free Tomas up to concentrate on his offensive game and work on faceoffs. Then DD on Pleks wing and Galy in the 2 hole, Eller 3rd.

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I wouldn't trade Plekanec for Statsny 1:1.

The 3rd line slot was an option more cause only way Gomez and his 7+ cap hit makes the team is if he's turned around his offensive game enough to play top 6, he doesn't bring anything else to the table to warrant taking away development of Eller or physicality of White and if Galchenyuk is not NHL ready to play centre in the top 6 I'd prefer he go back and dominate junior at that position than play this year on left.

Ideally Galy makes the team, Pleks is top line centre and new bottom 6 guys like Prust/Colby and a healthy White/Moen take some of the PK and shut down time to free Tomas up to concentrate on his offensive game and work on faceoffs. Then DD on Pleks wing and Galy in the 2 hole, Eller 3rd.

As Dudley says, Plan on Galchenyuk playing junior this year.

Sseeing as he hasnt really played since last fall, has only 1 year in OHL, the Habs already have 13-14 forwards and are the defending 28th place team, there dosent seem much reason to rush him up to play 3rd line and 10 minutes/game.

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As Dudley says, Plan on Galchenyuk playing junior this year.

That's of course the plan but if Galchenyuk is ready, he's ready. And as everyone said before he was drafted, he has a one of a kind work ethic. I expect him to be ready. If not, I'll enjoy watching him in Sarnia.

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3rd line is closer to 15 minutes per game than it is 10. Also 15 in the NHL is more valuable than 20 in junior... see Tyler Seguin

Segain played 2 full years in OHL; but, however you cut it, Sarnia shouldnt be too worried.

Has there ever even been a north american player to only play 1 year junior jump to NHL?

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Segain played 2 full years in OHL; but, however you cut it, Sarnia shouldnt be too worried.

Has there ever even been a north american player to only play 1 year junior jump to NHL?

Patrice Bergeron.

But at the same time, There haven't been many players get drafted as high as Galchenyuk with only one year of Junior either.

Its a total misnomer cause the only guy who is comparable to this situation... ie being this talented and missing almost a full year of junior due to injury is Brett Connolly. Thats it.

Sure he didn't make it... but its a small sample size of top 10 picks with only one season of junior, so I don't think there is much to base this on in terms of history.

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What do you guys think about Eric Fehr? 1st rd pick (18th overall)

Is definitely a big body and had bad luck with injuries. Currently UFA and could probably be had cheaply. According to TSN plays both RW and LW.

(null)

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What do you guys think about Eric Fehr? 1st rd pick (18th overall)

Is definitely a big body and had bad luck with injuries. Currently UFA and could probably be had cheaply. According to TSN plays both RW and LW.

(null)

Yeah looked at him a few days ago, not sure if we want to bring in another project with the number we have already

Cheechoo also caught my eye - traditional RW though - but coming off a decent year in the AHL, hard to believe someone can crash & burn that bad but he wouldn't be the first to be carried by an all star centre

maybe an invite to camp if they're still sitting but think the only really serious upgrade is via trade at this point or one of the kids lighting it up

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I hear ya and like i say you are happy with sub-average face-offs %, which is fine and kind of understand.

But, i disagree 100% and has zero to do with any anyalysts, for example;

Tomas (whom i hate to pick on but). is even worse on special teams and drops to 47.1%, so too say a Toews (i know totally at other end of spectrum but) at 59% overall and actually ups to 60.0% on special teams, is an irrelevant stat seems a bit odd and dont buy it?

Whom would you pick to take an important faceoff if only had these 2 to pick from?

Because i see some faceoffs, even just 1 sometimes, can be that much more important and can mean diff between a win-loss, and those who win just that 1 extra every game, tend to be the elite leaders.

Faceoff percentage has as much to do with the center as it does his teammates. May be off base here but one of my major complaints when it came to Martin was that on faceoffs we rarely saw our forwards attack the faceoff circle but rather sit back and wait for a clear win. Some of the best faceoff men do have the ability for clear wins but also win a fair share because of their wingers attacking the faceoff circle and battling for the puck.

If Plekanec had some biggers wingers then he can play for the tie up and then watch his line mates go and retrieve the puck.

I think that with Therrien's more offensive/aggressive system you are going to see a better faceoff record and more puck possession.

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What do you guys think about Eric Fehr? 1st rd pick (18th overall)

Is definitely a big body and had bad luck with injuries. Currently UFA and could probably be had cheaply. According to TSN plays both RW and LW.

(null)

He's a decent big body for the bottom 6, but we have a lot of those already.

He doesn't really fill the spot we need.

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He's a decent big body for the bottom 6, but we have a lot of those already.

He doesn't really fill the spot we need.

Exactly.....I mean is there much of a difference between Fehr and Blunden?

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Faceoff percentage has as much to do with the center as it does his teammates. May be off base here but one of my major complaints when it came to Martin was that on faceoffs we rarely saw our forwards attack the faceoff circle but rather sit back and wait for a clear win. Some of the best faceoff men do have the ability for clear wins but also win a fair share because of their wingers attacking the faceoff circle and battling for the puck.

If Plekanec had some biggers wingers then he can play for the tie up and then watch his line mates go and retrieve the puck.

I think that with Therrien's more offensive/aggressive system you are going to see a better faceoff record and more puck possession.

Likely valid that wingers can help for sure, but DD has a couple big ones and his numbers are also not the best (but i think he was improving towards end of year?)

I think being a lot more aggressive around face-offs is what all the 3 centres maybe need to be? But just a guess.

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Likely valid that wingers can help for sure, but DD has a couple big ones and his numbers are also not the best (but i think he was improving towards end of year?)

I think being a lot more aggressive around face-offs is what all the 3 centres maybe need to be? But just a guess.

I find us just way too passive. Good faceoff teams have 2 guys rushing for the puck. We always seem to have one guy play b ehind the center looking for a one timer for some reason. Go for posession already.

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Someone will obviously correct me if i'm wrong but MT system is way more aggressive style then JM, Carbo and even Julien.

So i expect to see a more aggressive, harder forechecking team.

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Someone will obviously correct me if i'm wrong but MT system is way more aggressive style then JM, Carbo and even Julien.

So i expect to see a more aggressive, harder forechecking team.

Carbo's system was pretty up tempo but Therrien seems to like an aggressive game plan. In the past this would have hurt us because of our lack of size but now we have guys like Bourque, Eller, Armstrong, Pacioretty, Cole, White, Prust, Moen, Blunden, Nokelainen who have good size and capable of laying on the body

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Carbo's 'system' appeared to be to open the bench door and cross his fingers. To this day I remain puzzled that one of the all-time defensive forwards seemed to instil so little structure as coach. (I'll admit, though, this what-the-hell approach worked out great in 2008).

The retooled bottom six and eviscerated top six does make for a somewhat different team, so it'll be very interesting to see what Therrien has in mind for this bunch.

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Yeah looked at him a few days ago, not sure if we want to bring in another project with the number we have already

Cheechoo also caught my eye - traditional RW though - but coming off a decent year in the AHL, hard to believe someone can crash & burn that bad but he wouldn't be the first to be carried by an all star centre

maybe an invite to camp if they're still sitting but think the only really serious upgrade is via trade at this point or one of the kids lighting it up

Cheechoo would be good for Hamilton.

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Yeah looked at him a few days ago, not sure if we want to bring in another project with the number we have already

Cheechoo also caught my eye - traditional RW though - but coming off a decent year in the AHL, hard to believe someone can crash & burn that bad but he wouldn't be the first to be carried by an all star centre

maybe an invite to camp if they're still sitting but think the only really serious upgrade is via trade at this point or one of the kids lighting it up

More like he wouldn't be the first to have a career ended because his knee...

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