Commandant Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 I wish he would have been a little more classy and served the Leaf fan without spilling his beer. When will he grow up kidding of course 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted January 9, 2013 Author Share Posted January 9, 2013 First off, anyone care to guess on the deal now that we know the restrictions of the CBA? (35% year-to-year variance, cheapest year can't be worth less than half of the highest dollar value, 7-8 year limit - I'm not sure if there is a minimum year criterion to get an 8 year pact.) Also, talks with Meehan regarding the contract will apparently begin on Thursday. https://twitter.com/RenLavoieRDS/status/288763868258369536 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trizzak Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I'll try a guess that he signs a 2 year, 3.8 mill deal and cashes out big time when Markov and Kaberle's contracts are off the books. Flame away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 2 years 4.26 million per season..... 10,000 more than Kaberle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I'd offer two years, $12M. That immediately makes him the highest paid defenceman on the team. He then has two years to prove he should make $1M more per season on a long term deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I doubt the habs would offer and 8 year deal, but here's the offer I'd make: 8 years - $48M. 4.5M, 5M, 6M, 6.5M, 6.5M, 7M, 6.5M, 6M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I'd offer two years, $12M. That immediately makes him the highest paid defenceman on the team. He then has two years to prove he should make $1M more per season on a long term deal. That seems like the worst of both worlds to me. You're overpaying him based on his actual performance, without locking him up long term! That can't be right. Commandant has the right idea, I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 4 years-$21m to 6 years-$30m, somewhere in that ballpark seems fair for the most important skater on team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helmethead Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 8 yr - $42mil. Split it up any way you need in order to make it work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 That seems like the worst of both worlds to me. You're overpaying him based on his actual performance, without locking him up long term! That can't be right. Commandant has the right idea, I think. Commandant isn't considering the market. It's completely dry for defencemen. Subban has likely already been given offer sheets and Montreal cannot afford to lose him. We assume that the cards are in favour of Montreal after this recent CBA negotiation but truth is, Subban knows his value. That's why he's rumoured to be going after a long term deal now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueKross Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 I have little idea what we are going to do here. My expectations are that the first out of the chute "Subbans contract" that agents and the NHLPA will want a statement made. I think Subban will be under pressure to push the limits from the forementioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Commandant isn't considering the market. It's completely dry for defencemen. Subban has likely already been given offer sheets and Montreal cannot afford to lose him. We assume that the cards are in favour of Montreal after this recent CBA negotiation but truth is, Subban knows his value. That's why he's rumoured to be going after a long term deal now. RFA Defencemen recently signed. (RFA is the key here) Cam Fowler 4.0 million x 5 years John Carlson 3.9667 million per season x 6 years Kyle Quincey 3.775 million per season x 2 years Other RFA defencemen on the market Dmitri Kulikov Michael Del Zotto. Not only did I consider the market.... I gave Subban 300k per year more than John Carlson, and I didn't sign Subban for any of his UFA years, which is what Carlson and Fowler both did with Back Loaded contracts that pay them less up front and more during their UFA years. If Subban averages 6 million per season on this deal, you better be locking him up for a significant chunk of UFA years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 What about Karlsson? Wasn't he an RFA? Granted he is in another class, but subban is better than the other RFA's that have signed and the only other compare able, del zotto is still unsigned. Given the difference between Montreal and the NYR's depth, subban has got a lot more leverage, RFA Defencemen recently signed. (RFA is the key here) Cam Fowler 4.0 million x 5 years John Carlson 3.9667 million per season x 6 years Kyle Quincey 3.775 million per season x 2 years Other RFA defencemen on the market Dmitri Kulikov Michael Del Zotto. Not only did I consider the market.... I gave Subban 300k per year more than John Carlson, and I didn't sign Subban for any of his UFA years, which is what Carlson and Fowler both did with Back Loaded contracts that pay them less up front and more during their UFA years. If Subban averages 6 million per season on this deal, you better be locking him up for a significant chunk of UFA years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted January 10, 2013 Author Share Posted January 10, 2013 I'm going to try to cover this in more detail on the site but the little known tagging rules will play a role in Subban's contract. My prediction? It's going to be very short-term (1 year is what the Habs will probably have to push for). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Look at John Carlson's stats and minutes per game. Subban is better than Fowler and Quincey, but him and Karlsson are near equivalents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhfarber Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Report online that Subban will sign once the CBA is ratified for 22 million over 4 years or an AAV of 5.5 million. Count me in the camp that finds this to be an overpayment. I'm happy to sign him longer term but I would've been more comfortable somewhere in the 4.75-5 million AAV range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Report online that Subban will sign once the CBA is ratified for 22 million over 4 years or an AAV of 5.5 million. Count me in the camp that finds this to be an overpayment. I'm happy to sign him longer term but I would've been more comfortable somewhere in the 4.75-5 million AAV range. I don't care if it's an overpayment. I care if he's on the roster come game time. That's it. That's all. If he under-achieves, you find another place for him. Otherwise, you stop staring at the cap and start focusing on the ice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeLassister Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Report online that Subban will sign once the CBA is ratified for 22 million over 4 years or an AAV of 5.5 million. Count me in the camp that finds this to be an overpayment. I'm happy to sign him longer term but I would've been more comfortable somewhere in the 4.75-5 million AAV range. I'm in the camp of " I'm pretty sure that he will worth it sooner than later". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted January 11, 2013 Author Share Posted January 11, 2013 I'm in the camp that a 4 year deal (and if that's being discussed, the tagging rules are different than what I wrote about) is the dumbest idea possible as that takes him to free agency. It also has been categorically denied by Meehan so I wouldn't read too much into it right now. Subban also said he is unaware of any contract being done. Interestingly enough, the Habs are doing 'voluntary' medicals tomorrow with on-ice sessions beginning Sunday so if this doesn't get done today, he will be in a not-reporting situation. (Although one extra day of negotiations won't cost him a whole lot of time...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobin Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Too much, wrong term. Worse, if he is good, we lose him in 4 years at free agency. I would have preferred the bridge contract option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 I don't like the 4-year idea either, but why is it assumed that we will lose PK to free agency? Is this just more of this delusion that 'nobody wants to play here?' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 4 years at 5.5 doesn't make sense. If you go over 5 million you better buy some of his UFA years... I'd be happier with 6 years at 6 million than 4 at 5.5. Seems everyone is denying the rumor though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobin Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 I don't like the 4-year idea either, but why is it assumed that we will lose PK to free agency? Is this just more of this delusion that 'nobody wants to play here?' Because we will have no more leverage and someone will over pay to get him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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