Trade Subban traded to Nashville

[johnnyhasbeen]

I just broke the news to my son, 6 and a half years old. Dad had to give him a nice long hug, I've got tears on my shoulder. Darn you, Bergevin!! You made my kid cry!

Mine just called me at sea $15 a minute, MB, my son says you ruined his life. %&!^ off and die!

Looking for a new jersey to wear, Las Vegas I think!

[BCHabnut]

If I don't see a cup in the next 4 years I want mb stoned

[Dalhabs]

If I don't see a cup in the next 4 years I want mb stoned

To late budy, im sure he is already stoned. Why else make this trade if he is not stoned?

[KoRP]

WoW is all I can say, the "cup window" better be in the next year or two.

Done is done, good luck to PK in Nashville, and welcome to Mtl Mr. Weber!

[Chips]

Friends... I have been very quiet for a few years. As I have always felt the discussion on this forum has been bang on in dealing with all the issues our beloved Canadiens have faced in the last few years...

The Subban trade has me, upset, confused, angered, betrayed.

upset because we needed more much more in return for Subban. and dam it look what New Jersey did landing T. HALL. ( this trade is missing a major extra piece )

confused because the habs have once again traded a STUD! player in his prime. ( shades of Roy! )

angered because they could not find a way to make it work with Subban ( don't tell me there were no issues here, clearly there were issues, leadership must take responsibility for this and the only way I will accept anything moving forward from this leadership team is when they come clean about Subban and WHY!!! what went wrong with him in their opinion... )

betrayed because we made a 9 million dollar commitment per season to a player telling him we loved everything about what he brought to the game and the team in Montreal and then management turns around and trades him, one for one for a player about to start planning his retirement makes no sense!

I like Shea but he is not NOT! Subban. a player who can change a game with one rush, one shot and one hit.

History will judge MB and I wish him the best of luck with that ....

today I agree with the veteran voices on this forum, TAR HIM FEATHER HIM put a MATCH to it. MB, Molson, Therien. and any others who felt this trade was fair gets the same treatment!

NO GM in their right mind can and will be able to sleep at night with a trade of this magnitude which is clearly against Les Canadiens.

Short of winning the CUP next season. MB will not survive this decision.

too bad so sad; I was an MB fan.

[xXx..CK..xXx]

I read the whole thread so I've had time to take a breath. In a more recent comparison, I feel the complete opposite way that I felt when we signed Vanek a couple of years ago. That trade really me me feel like we were an instant contender. Today's trade had to be a joke.... Until I saw that the news was coming from the NHL itself.

With that being said, PK is an enigma. He's literally underrated and overrated at the same time in my honest opinion.

It's definitely disappointing; I've always liked PK since I saw him play in the world juniors for the first time. I do think that there are indeed a handful of offensive defenseman who are more dangerous on the rush than PK though, which used to be a strength of his a la Bobby Orr. Perhaps it was the coaching staff or perhaps it was him. I guess now we'll get to actually see.

Without any biased goggles though, there were stretches that I thought Beaulieu was just as good as Subban last season which says a lot more about PK than it does about Beaulieu.

This trade does have the potential to make the team better if we had other moves that depended on it (for whatever reason) but 100% not on its own. That's one of the negatives of this move in my opinion. We didn't even address our biggest needs and I sure hope Bergevin does not think we did.

I know I sound more positive than most but I guess I'm just still hopeful that we land a big offensive player prior to next season. If the season starts and this is our lineup, then I'm just as empty as everyone else.

[bar]

I have lost all faith in this org.

[Link67]

Lets all put aside popularity and player love for a moment, and truly take a good long look at how a SUPREMELY qualified committee of hockey people did NOT chose Subban for team Canada, yet chose Weber on its earliest occasion.

I am not suggesting this trade does not hurt us more in the long run, but if our best window is within the next 3 years, is it crazy to suggest Weber, with his style of play and Leadership help us more in that aspect?

and what about considering that if Weber starts to fall off in 4 or 5 years that Sergachev is not by then, in a position to be a top pairing guy playing big minutes. Does this trade happen like this if we didn't just draft a stud d-man that could provide top tier play in a few years? I doubt it honestly, Sergachev provided MB with a security blanket for the long term risk while providing a different outlook for the next 3 years or so that brought more to the table to facilitate a playoff run of significance. Weber is a monster, Pierre Lebrun reported on TSN a group of Western Conference GMs told him basically "Thank God Weber is out of this conference", that says something, it says a lot actually. They didn;t say "Oh crap Subban is here". Weber is as important in a playoff series grind a big bodied power forward who is dominating, he is intimidating, he is nasty, and he can hurt you individually for taking penalties. Not to set the world on fire, but those are all things Subban can't do.

I'm trying to keep an open mind here, and remain objective, and truthfully if the consensus from the people making millions of dollars to do an NHL job are picking Weber all day over Subban, from top tier coaches to GMs. Then I chose to keep the pitch fork in the closet until further notice, because I simply don't make millions to make those decisions and watch hockey as closely and detailed as they do, and neither does anyone else here.

[John B]

I've been preparing myself for this since the rumors first began so I'm not in complete shock. I wish they had been able to get a bit more given the term on Weber's deal and his age, but it is what it is. Even with Subban, I didn't see the Habs as a contender and with the moves they have made in last few years leading up to today I didn't see a contender being built. Just a whole lot more mediocrity. This organization has had several opportunities to add impact players, but has failed. Instead they rely on reclamation projects and declining veterans to fill major holes on the roster while paying average players above average money. I don't see this team winning a Stanley Cup anytime soon or even in their "window". I'm hoping that after yet another few failed attempts (which will likely see Pacioretty and/or Price move on as UFAs) this team will begin a rebuild. A true rebuild not a retooling before guys like Galchenyuk get too old and were stuck with another 2 or 3 year window to win before they move on.

[Machine of Loving Grace]

Weber was absolutely terrible against the Sharks and everyone except old school hockey people saw it. He couldn't get the puck out of his zone to Mike Komisarek proportions. He had to be constantly bailed out by Josi.

In the seven games he had one goal and one assist and was a minus-4. According to War on Ice, he was a minus-4.6 CF% Rel when his team was 5-on-5.

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/watch-everything-that-went-wrong-for-shea-weber-in-game-7/

All of that said, the Preds will likely win this deal. The worst part about this trade from a emotional standpoint, other than losing a benevolent and kind person in the community, is that the last game Shea Weber played for Nashville was his worst. In fact, the entire series against San Jose was rough on Shea. And with a team built the way San Jose plays, Weber's weaknesses shown through. He's not the best at keeping the puck, and he defers too often to Roman Josi in order to exit the zone. At times he appeared to be one-dimensional, and as fatigue set in he was caught out of position several times.

Link: http://www.ontheforecheck.com/2016/6/29/12062084/instant-reaction-weber-traded-for-subban

[Habiman]

Ok other than McDonough and Higgins to Rangers for Gomez, this is the worse hockey deal of all time...At least they won the cup when they traded Chelios for Savard....This defies logic on every plane. We got older, slower for longer with the same money....

Honestly, until now, I respected MB patience on the market. What is this? It is horrible.

[Link67]

Weber was absolutely terrible against the Sharks and everyone except old school hockey people saw it. He couldn't get the puck out of his zone to Mike Komisarek proportions. He had to be constantly bailed out by Josi.

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/watch-everything-that-went-wrong-for-shea-weber-in-game-7/

In all honesty I can hash up a giant post of quotes from game threads this season where people wanted Subban benched blamed him for a loss and were straight up questioning his character in the dressing room after his "i'm not paid to score" outburst, do we really want to open that can of worms? Anyone can be quoted in a negative light if you look for the right things

[Machine of Loving Grace]

In all honesty I can hash up a giant post of quotes from game threads this season where people wanted Subban benched blamed him for a loss and were straight up questioning his character in the dressing room after his "i'm not paid to score" outburst, do we really want to open that can of worms? Anyone can be quoted in a negative light if you look for the right things

Sure, because people flip out over not making "the safe play" and making a mistake. Weber makes "the safe play" and still makes countless mistakes. Open the can of worms if you want. I have close to every single stat aside from powerplay goals, height, weight, and "giveaways" to point out just how much Weber has regressed over the past season, how bad he was in the playoffs, and how it all likely shows that Montreal just traded for a declining asset with a huge cap hit.

[TurdBurglar]

I was one of the few that were ok with this trade. While PK is younger, faster and more offensive skill, we need to be better defensively. Everyone forgot last season already? Yeah, we couldn't score, neither could PK. At the same time PK couldn't help keep the puck out of his own net either. Yeah he racked up points, in meaningless games, but didn't help much during those tight games. Everyone forgot why PK isn't ever on any team Canada starting roster? He can't be trusted defensively.

in the long run, this trade is going to hurt us, unless Weber has something build into his contract where we are free of the cap when he retires because it was signed before the new CBA. Short term, we gain cap space, got better defensively and apparently got a dressing room cancer gone.

If we can land Fowler and drop Markov to the 2nd pair I think we will be fine. With cap relief I think we could pull some top-6 guys in, move Emelin and DD and we will be fine. You guys forget we are 1 year removed from a 110 point season. Subban didn't single-handedly make that season, it was Price, and we need to support our best player, make his job easier.

Relax, it'll be fine, and if it's not we have to live with this. At least it wasn't Subban for Larsson......

[Guest Stogey24]

P.K couldn't help keep the puck out of our net? Are you serious? How about the AHL Goaltending we had in place? No, couldn't be that.

[TurdBurglar]

Forgetting when Price was playing how many stellar saves he had to make or goals let in because of a PK blunder?

Just looked it up and if Weber retires before his contract is over, the Predators get the cap recapture penalties, not the Canadiens.

[Davehab]

I still don't know what to say.....just stunned

[Link67]

Sure, because people flip out over not making "the safe play" and making a mistake. Weber makes "the safe play" and still makes countless mistakes. Open the can of worms if you want. I have close to every single stat aside from powerplay goals, height, weight, and "giveaways" to point out just how much Weber has regressed over the past season, how bad he was in the playoffs, and how it all likely shows that Montreal just traded for a declining asset with a huge cap hit.

What about these stats

- Called out after multiple games by his coach for a game losing turnover

- Called out by Canadiens Allumni for his off ice antics

- Flopping around looking for a Penalty call while a goal is scored moments later

- Being fined for Diving

- Playing as 8th d-man for Canada at the Olympics

- Not even playing for Canada at the World Cup

- Grand Total 2 votes for 2016 Norris Trophy

Weber has none of those dreadful stats on his resume, are their any analytics for that? I know PK is beloved, he is a fan favorite, but this is the stuff i'm talking about. It was far from all roses with the guy, and we need to stop acting like we just traded Niklas Lidstrom for Patrice Brisbois.

[dlbalr]

in the long run, this trade is going to hurt us, unless Weber has something build into his contract where we are free of the cap when he retires because it was signed before the new CBA. Short term, we gain cap space, got better defensively and apparently got a dressing room cancer gone.

I put a post in the CBA/Cap thread about this. Unless Weber shocks everyone and retires in the next few years, the Habs will be off the hook for recapture. (Nashville could be in a world of trouble though.)

[Commandant]

Lets all put aside popularity and player love for a moment, and truly take a good long look at how a SUPREMELY qualified committee of hockey people did NOT chose Subban for team Canada, yet chose Weber on its earliest occasion.

I am not suggesting this trade does not hurt us more in the long run, but if our best window is within the next 3 years, is it crazy to suggest Weber, with his style of play and Leadership help us more in that aspect?

and what about considering that if Weber starts to fall off in 4 or 5 years that Sergachev is not by then, in a position to be a top pairing guy playing big minutes. Does this trade happen like this if we didn't just draft a stud d-man that could provide top tier play in a few years? I doubt it honestly, Sergachev provided MB with a security blanket for the long term risk while providing a different outlook for the next 3 years or so that brought more to the table to facilitate a playoff run of significance. Weber is a monster, Pierre Lebrun reported on TSN a group of Western Conference GMs told him basically "Thank God Weber is out of this conference", that says something, it says a lot actually. They didn;t say "Oh crap Subban is here". Weber is as important in a playoff series grind a big bodied power forward who is dominating, he is intimidating, he is nasty, and he can hurt you individually for taking penalties. Not to set the world on fire, but those are all things Subban can't do.

I'm trying to keep an open mind here, and remain objective, and truthfully if the consensus from the people making millions of dollars to do an NHL job are picking Weber all day over Subban, from top tier coaches to GMs. Then I chose to keep the pitch fork in the closet until further notice, because I simply don't make millions to make those decisions and watch hockey as closely and detailed as they do, and neither does anyone else here.

Weber has already fallen off. He is slow and has real troubles defensively. Just look at his shot suppression numbers.

[DON]

To all those that constantly said, that the Mt-Subban issuea weren't a big deal and at the end is th day subban would b here long after that SOB My was gone - I told you this e going to end badly. The Edmonton rumour was much better than this bs.

For this of you who supported and defended this crappy Management team, what do you think now?????

Good deal for the team for next several years and supposedly got rid of a player who rubbed more than one teammate the wrong way. 14 PP goals for Weber last year...nice! Weber won NHL leadership award and we all know his other teams he helped win. Not many GMs would pick Subban over Weber in any ranking is there?

So who got the best all-round player for 2016-17 season? Y'all keep going on about the "Window" and grit/leadership were lacking and Weber-Shaw should help with that, especially once Emelin is traded.

[bar]

Good deal for the team for next several years and supposedly got rid of a player who rubbed more than one teammate the wrong way. 14 PP goals for Weber last year...nice! Weber won NHL leadership award and we all know his other teams he helped win. Not many GMs would pick Subban over Weber in any ranking is there?

So who got the best all-round player for 2016-17 season? Y'all keep going on about the "Window" and grit/leadership were lacking and Weber-Shaw should help with that, especially once Emelin is traded.

This team got worse, that's how I know this trade is bad.

[DON]

Subban must have been terrible in the dressing room

So now what happens with the millions he just donated?

He is paying it over length of contract isn't he, he hasn't donated one big chunk.

and he said he would be back to Montreal to support hospital.

[Link67]

Commandant you an I seldom disagree on hockey points

but I can't base this all on analytics, is there a chart out there someone can show me that shows % towards commanding respect from your team? Keeping players honest in front of Price? Fear of blocking shots? Forcing teams to play disciplined hockey against you for fear of a PP? How much you intimidate your opposition? This is the kind of chart Weber would dominate Subban in.

I already knew the analytics people were going to crush this trade, Jamie Mclennan made that clear to me the moment the trade broke, but as he Suggested and I also believe, hockey is more than just stats or observation, but a solid blend of both.

And before anyone starts thinking i'm trying to blindly defend management or even suggest that Subban is not that good, I absolutely am not. With that said let me be clear, this isn't about trying to Say Subban isn't very good, because he is very good. It is more about me saying Shea Weber is also very good.

[nihilz]

Subban-Hall would have been best for all concerned.