illWill Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 7 minutes ago, Prime Minister Koivu said: Being a super star in Montreal is not easy and I'm sure Tavares has seen how the fans have treated Patches. Not sure why he would want to play under that crap when he can go live somewhere warm, have little pressure and make great $ The only way we get him is if we offer max deal and no other teams do. If his main motivation is winning and he will sign with the team that gives him the best chance, is that really Montreal? If he did sign here I'm sure he would play on Plekanec's wing anyway Being a super star in Montreal is not easy if you're losing, but when you're winning there's nowhere better. Yes, if he wants to play somewhere sunny without the media then I guess we are out of luck. I am assuming that Bergevin will slide a blank check across the table so in terms of money the Habs will be right there with whoever else is bidding. And I think people are underestimating what a player of his calibre added to this team would do. Because barring any changes, the roster is pretty much in tact heading into next season. Because if the Sharks for example were to land him, it would be to replace Joe Thornton, they wouldn't be adding him to what they already have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 10 hours ago, illWill said: So we will just disregard Montreal finishing 1st in their division last season while the Sharks finished 3rd in theirs? This season isn't over yet and San Jose is in a dogfight to make the playoffs. Saying they are a much better team than Montreal who has had injuries to their best two players is a stretch. If I am picking San Jose as a free agent, it's for the weather and the anonymity, not because they are a much better team than Montreal. Great 1 out of 3 seasons. The Sharks are still a better team.... we were 1-6-1 to start the year when both guys were healthy. This isn't like 2015-16 where we were first place end of november when price got hurt and then turned to shit. We've been shit all year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 56 minutes ago, Commandant said: Great 1 out of 3 seasons. The Sharks are still a better team.... we were 1-6-1 to start the year when both guys were healthy. This isn't like 2015-16 where we were first place end of november when price got hurt and then turned to shit. We've been shit all year. Weber was hurt in game #1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 However, this team's biggest issue is goal scoring. Weber really wasn't helping there. For all his PP goals, he doesn't do a lot 5v5, and As stated the powerplay is actually better with Weber not out there as the coaches were forced to be more creative than let Weber one time the puck. Yes they are missing his defence. But this team's fundamental problem remains, even with him in the lienup 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott462 Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 8 minutes ago, Commandant said: However, this team's biggest issue is goal scoring. Weber really wasn't helping there. For all his PP goals, he doesn't do a lot 5v5, and As stated the powerplay is actually better with Weber not out there as the coaches were forced to be more creative than let Weber one time the puck. Yes they are missing his defence. But this team's fundamental problem remains, even with him in the lienup Enter John Tavares who instantly becomes THE guy at forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 3 minutes ago, Scott462 said: Enter John Tavares who instantly becomes THE guy at forward. So if you are tavares, and you want to win... you can either go to a team that can't score without you.... or you go to San Jose, who can score, and you are adding on top of that to move them from good to elite. Again, if winning is the goal... San Jose is a more attractive destination. So is Columbus who is in desperate need of a #1 C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott462 Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 3 minutes ago, Commandant said: So if you are tavares, and you want to win... you can either go to a team that can't score without you.... or you go to San Jose, who can score, and you are adding on top of that to move them from good to elite. Again, if winning is the goal... San Jose is a more attractive destination. So is Columbus who is in desperate need of a #1 C I think Tavares knows he’s the missing piece this team needs. We have had success in the past but just desperately needed that #1 C, add in the fact he’s actually good friends with our two elite players I think it’s definitely something he is considering. Also you have to keep in mind John has his family settled on the east coast which could play a factor. Now I’m not saying San Jose signing him isn’t a big possibility it is, I just don’t think it’s a huge difference of possibility you seem to think it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 He's also good friends with PK.... which isn't going to be a good review in dealing with Bergevin. 2 years ago Stamkos was a pipe dream. Before that it was brad richards there was the lecavalier saga. there was danny briere (when he was actually good) there was patrick elias. there were more.... Tavares feels much the same, I hope I'm wrong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 2 hours ago, Commandant said: Great 1 out of 3 seasons. The Sharks are still a better team.... we were 1-6-1 to start the year when both guys were healthy. This isn't like 2015-16 where we were first place end of november when price got hurt and then turned to shit. We've been shit all year. 3 seasons? I went back 6 but apparently Tavares doesn't care about that. Okay let's talk about how last season Montreal was slightly the better team but this year they've been garbage. They started 1-6-1 with a broken footed Weber, a chronically fatigued Price and a whole lot of cap space. Do you think that Montreal would be higher in the standings if those things didn't happen? Or if they signed Radulov or Markov? Because San Jose hasn't dealt with those things are they are still in very real danger of missing the playoffs. San Jose also has Couture and Pavelski as UFA after next season and Jumbo Joe after this season, Habs just have Pacioretty due after next. It wouldn't be the same team whereas Montreal can slide Johnnie T right into the current lineup. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 There are 4 players on the team now, who were on the team from 4 years ago. Why the hell would he care about that is the question you never answered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 12 minutes ago, illWill said: 3 seasons? I went back 6 but apparently Tavares doesn't care about that. Okay let's talk about how last season Montreal was slightly the better team but this year they've been garbage. They started 1-6-1 with a broken footed Weber, a chronically fatigued Price and a whole lot of cap space. Do you think that Montreal would be higher in the standings if those things didn't happen? Or if they signed Radulov or Markov? Because San Jose hasn't dealt with those things are they are still in very real danger of missing the playoffs. San Jose also has Couture and Pavelski as UFA after next season and Jumbo Joe after this season, Habs just have Pacioretty due after next. It wouldn't be the same team whereas Montreal can slide Johnnie T right into the current lineup. Everything is awesome, we are winning the cup next year. We are so awesome we don't even need JT. This is the best team in the league, just not playing well cause injuries and fatigue and blah... blah... blah.... is that better? God forbid we take a realistic look at a team that has been shit all season long. We didn't end up where we are in the standings cause of luck. there is no puck movers on defence. We have 1 top 4 Defenceman... and when Weber is healthy we have two. Tavares doesn't solve that problem. Even with Tavares we have 1 top 6 centre. There is no secondary centre. He doesn't solve that problem. This team needs more than Tavares. In San jose they have a much better supporting cast. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 3 hours ago, illWill said: And if we are talking about Tavares signing with the Habs, wouldn't it be an incentive to play in the weaker division? So now we are bashing Carey Price and Shea Weber? And tell me again how Montreal struggles for top free agents.... It would be an incentive if he wasn't playing for one of the weakest teams in the division. I don't see how it's bashing to point out that Carey Price is an often injured goaltender entering his 30s and Shea Weber just suffered a tendon injury which is hard to come back from. Montreal's two longest signed players both have injury issues. His agent would be quick to point out that Tavares could have a career year in Montreal only to miss the playoffs because Price and Weber are not 100%. Montreal doesn't struggle for B level free agents. If the guy has question marks or isn't as good as he's asking for, Montreal can probably get him. If he's a true superstar, Montreal isn't even in the mix. As Commandant said, this is the Stamkos story all over again. One which people thought we had a shot in when Stamkos was publicly complaining about getting stalked around Montreal. Montreal is the best place to win in and the worst to lose in? Then why sign when the team sucks? If Montreal was actually good I could see it, but this isn't a good team. It's about to miss the playoffs 2/3 years. Why come here? The money? Anyone can offer it. The term? Anyone can offer it. The wingers? We're not elite in that category. Our best players? Not playing their best and not in their best shape. Our youngsters? Plenty of teams have better players under 25 than Montreal. Our defence? One of, if not the worst in the league. Our coaching? Dan Lacroix says hi then falls down a flight of stairs. Our GM? Has made maybe two good trades (Deslauriers and Danault) in three years despite making the most trades out of any GM in the league. The only reason I could ever see Tavares signing in Montreal is because he always wanted to play here. If that's the case then nothing else matters. Otherwise, everything matters and nothing says Montreal should be even Top 10 for his services. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 7 minutes ago, Commandant said: Everything is awesome, we are winning the cup next year. We are so awesome we don't even need JT. This is the best team in the league, just not playing well cause injuries and fatigue and blah... blah... blah.... is that better? God forbid we take a realistic look at a team that has been shit all season long. We didn't end up where we are in the standings cause of luck. there is no puck movers on defence. We have 1 top 4 Defenceman... and when Weber is healthy we have two. Tavares doesn't solve that problem. Even with Tavares we have 1 top 6 centre. There is no secondary centre. He doesn't solve that problem. This team needs more than Tavares. In San jose they have a much better supporting cast. You are the one that bet $100 that the Habs would make the playoffs, you are the one that defended the team for the first half of the season based on analytics and an unrealistic shooting percentage, or "luck". This team has a good core and a good group of young forwards. Slot JT in the #1C and all of the sudden players start to play where they should in the lineup. Danault is easily a 2/3C, or maybe Drouin improves as the #2 away from tougher match ups. There aren't any perfect teams in the NHL, everybody has holes. I can pick apart the weaknesses on any team just like you did for the Habs. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 I can admit I was wrong about the team. Everything I'm seeing now shows me we are more than one piece away. This defence is a shambles. Its not near the level it needs to be at. At least 2 top 4 defencemen are needed. The 2nd line centre... our coach and GM won't allow Galchenyuk to be a centre, so we need that too. I thought their stubborness would wear off, it hasn't. We are at least 3 pieces away even with Tavares. 4 without him.... and they are huge pieces, both top 2 centres... two top 4 D 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 Everyone to me be like: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 55 minutes ago, Commandant said: I can admit I was wrong about the team. Everything I'm seeing now shows me we are more than one piece away. This defence is a shambles. Its not near the level it needs to be at. At least 2 top 4 defencemen are needed. The 2nd line centre... our coach and GM won't allow Galchenyuk to be a centre, so we need that too. I thought their stubborness would wear off, it hasn't. We are at least 3 pieces away even with Tavares. 4 without him.... and they are huge pieces, both top 2 centres... two top 4 D Before the season I made a large bet with a friend that the Habs would make the playoffs and the Leafs wouldn't....I'm not sure what's worse, paying him the money or listening to him trash talk me all year. They do need some pieces to be a serious contender but the good news is that they have a lot of youth that could step up or be used in a hockey trade to fill holes. And who knows what the draft will bring. Personally I've been liking the idea of trading Patches for a top 4 LD, the lineup would be much more balanced and improved: Galchenyuk - Tavares - Gallagher Lehkonen - Drouin - Scherbak Byron - Danault - Shaw Deslauriers - De La Rose - Hudon Muzzin? - Weber Alzner - Petry Mete - Schlemko/Benn/Juulsen It's not perfect but it's pretty good 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXx..CK..xXx Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 20 minutes ago, illWill said: Everyone to me be like: You actually got a natural upvote from me before I even saw this one. No offense to anyone but your first two lines had me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 32 minutes ago, illWill said: Everyone to me be like: Yeah, i have no idea what that is like.... I downvote you one time.... the second time you posted the 6 seasons thing, cause you didn't understand my point that its irrelevant to look at a team that has merely than 4 players on the current team. You've downvoted me 4 times for that, at least. Holy ####ing hypocrite batman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habopotamus Posted March 2, 2018 Author Share Posted March 2, 2018 13 minutes ago, illWill said: Before the season I made a large bet with a friend that the Habs would make the playoffs and the Leafs wouldn't....I'm not sure what's worse, paying him the money or listening to him trash talk me all year. They do need some pieces to be a serious contender but the good news is that they have a lot of youth that could step up or be used in a hockey trade to fill holes. And who knows what the draft will bring. Personally I've been liking the idea of trading Patches for a top 4 LD, the lineup would be much more balanced and improved: Galchenyuk - Tavares - Gallagher Lehkonen - Drouin - Scherbak Byron - Danault - Shaw Deslauriers - De La Rose - Hudon Muzzin? - Weber Alzner - Petry Mete - Schlemko/Benn/Juulsen It's not perfect but it's pretty good So we are a top pair d-man and one of best players in the game away from accomplishing anything.... Sounds easy enough. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXx..CK..xXx Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 2 minutes ago, Habopotamus said: So we are a top pair d-man and one of best players in the game away from accomplishing anything.... Sounds easy enough. I’d say it’s a little better than the alternative of assuming it would be absolutely impossible. We may have more of a plan than the actual organization but there’s nothing wrong with that type of thinking being plan A. There are some options out there, even if not Tavares. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 21 minutes ago, illWill said: Before the season I made a large bet with a friend that the Habs would make the playoffs and the Leafs wouldn't....I'm not sure what's worse, paying him the money or listening to him trash talk me all year. They do need some pieces to be a serious contender but the good news is that they have a lot of youth that could step up or be used in a hockey trade to fill holes. And who knows what the draft will bring. Personally I've been liking the idea of trading Patches for a top 4 LD, the lineup would be much more balanced and improved: Galchenyuk - Tavares - Gallagher Lehkonen - Drouin - Scherbak Byron - Danault - Shaw Deslauriers - De La Rose - Hudon Muzzin? - Weber Alzner - Petry Mete - Schlemko/Benn/Juulsen It's not perfect but it's pretty good I also would be ok with keeping Patches and trading Petry and one of Byron/Lehkonen instead: Pacioretty - Tavares - Gallagher Galchenyuk - Drouin - Scherbak Byron/Lehkonen - Danault - Hudon Deslauriers - De La Rose - A.Shaw Mete/Riley - Weber Alzner - Juulsen Riley/Mete - Benn Schlemko Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 1 minute ago, alfredoh2009 said: I also would be ok with keeping Patches and trading Petry and one of Byron/Lehkonen instead: Pacioretty - Tavares - Gallagher Galchenyuk - Drouin - Scherbak Byron/Lehkonen - Danault - Hudon Deslauriers - De La Rose - A.Shaw Mete/Riley - Weber Alzner - Juulsen Riley/Mete - Benn Schlemko That defense has 1 top four defenceman. its not winning a damn thing. If the idea is to win now... you have to keep Petry and even add another top defenceman. If the idea is to tear it all down and rebuild around 25 and under guys... fine.... keep those signed long term to act as leaders for the youth, and trade anything that isn't nailed down like Patch, Byron, Petry. No need to be half way. I'd also keep Lehkonen, as he's the best defensive forward on the team and I still think his scoring is more like last year than this year. He's also quite young. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCHabnut Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Commandant said: I can admit I was wrong about the team. Everything I'm seeing now shows me we are more than one piece away. This defence is a shambles. Its not near the level it needs to be at. At least 2 top 4 defencemen are needed. The 2nd line centre... our coach and GM won't allow Galchenyuk to be a centre, so we need that too. I thought their stubborness would wear off, it hasn't. We are at least 3 pieces away even with Tavares. 4 without him.... and they are huge pieces, both top 2 centres... two top 4 D This is a good assessment. And as you say, very difficult to fill the holes. #1 centre and #2 defenseman and the team can compete. Holy crap talk about hard to do without drafting and developing at least 2 of the 4 four holes. I'm still hoping there is a deal for pacioretty this summer. To me this is the only way to do it quickly. Tavares signing in Montreal is not even in my mind. Don't see it happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 Either we get a 1C or a top 4 D this summer. I do not think we can do both. My take is tonimprive scoring while Weber ca still play 30 min/game and Price is not hurt; and go for top Ds when the right player becomes available Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 48 minutes ago, Commandant said: Yeah, i have no idea what that is like.... I downvote you one time.... the second time you posted the 6 seasons thing, cause you didn't understand my point that its irrelevant to look at a team that has merely than 4 players on the current team. You've downvoted me 4 times for that, at least. Holy ####ing hypocrite batman. I wasn't talking about you in particular, just in general. And I didn't down vote anything in this thread and I very rarely do at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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