GHT120 Posted July 19, 2021 Share Posted July 19, 2021 5 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said: I am not sure if goalies would attract new fans like a Mcdavid or Mackinnon would. I don't ever remember getting excited to go to a game because a certain goalie was playing. Tend to agree ... but he is a BIG NAME to have as the face of an expansion team ... still, seems unlikely to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted July 19, 2021 Share Posted July 19, 2021 46 minutes ago, Commandant said: Carey Price and Patrick Roy have both been marketable stars in Montreal. Who in the last 30 years has sold more jerseys with their name on the back? tshirts, etc... etc... Yes, marketable stars in a hockey crazy city like Montreal. Just don't think goalies would generate the same level of excitement in a new market like Seattle. Not to the extent they would pay 10.5M a year and an 11 M bonus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted July 19, 2021 Share Posted July 19, 2021 6 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said: Yes, marketable stars in a hockey crazy city like Montreal. Just don't think goalies would generate the same level of excitement in a new market like Seattle. Not to the extent they would pay 10.5M a year and an 11 M bonus. They aren't paying both 10.5 a year and an 11 million bonus. 10.5 is the cap hit 11 is the bonus due September 1st In total (including the 11 bonus), they pay 44.25 million over 5 years or just under 9 mill per season on average. Price's contract is front loaded, so he got almost 40 million of the 84 total in the first 3 years, leaving 44.25 over the next 5. That said, you also have to consider they are going to have some goalie there. Probably another 3 million dollar guy to go 1a/1b with dreidger at minimum. Is Price's merchandising and ticket sales worth 6 million a year is the question, not 10.5, or 9.... its 6 cause you have to pay the faceless, non-marketable goalie 3. Thats the big question... I don't know the answer, but i know the question is, is he worth 30 million or so over 5 years to an expansion team in real money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 9 minutes ago, Commandant said: They aren't paying both 10.5 a year and an 11 million bonus. 10.5 is the cap hit 11 is the bonus due September 1st In total (including the 11 bonus), they pay 44.25 million over 5 years or just under 9 mill per season on average. Price's contract is front loaded, so he got almost 40 million of the 84 total in the first 3 years, leaving 44.25 over the next 5. That said, you also have to consider they are going to have some goalie there. Probably another 3 million dollar guy to go 1a/1b with dreidger at minimum. Is Price's merchandising and ticket sales worth 6 million a year is the question, not 10.5, or 9.... its 6 cause you have to pay the faceless, non-marketable goalie 3. Thats the big question... I don't know the answer, but i know the question is, is he worth 30 million or so over 5 years to an expansion team in real money. Fair point, I was looking at the cap hit not the actual dollars being paid out. Thanks for shedding a little more light on the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Puck Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 I assume that if Carey goes on LTIR his salary is paid by some insurance the Habs hold. But if Seattle picks him wouldn't the Kraken (rather than some insurance) have to pay the salary even if he is on LTIR? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 20 minutes ago, Peter Puck said: I assume that if Carey goes on LTIR his salary is paid by some insurance the Habs hold. But if Seattle picks him wouldn't the Kraken (rather than some insurance) have to pay the salary even if he is on LTIR? Not every long-term contract is insured so that's not a guarantee. I believe the policy transfers with the player in a trade although I'm not 100% sure about that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 Ok, here goes my Kraken expansion draft. I'll post it this way: best player available (BPA) under contract, UFAs for key positions, best players available RFAs BPA-under-contract NASH Johansen, Ryan OTT Dadonov, Evgeni CBJ Domi, Max WIN Appleton, Mason BUF Eakin, Cody ARZ Pitlick, Tyler VAN Gadjovich, Jonah NYR Gauthier, Julien PHI Gostisbehere, Shayne ANA Fleury, Haydn SJS Meloche, Nicolas MIN Kähkönen, Kaapo WSH Vanecek, Vitek UFAs COL Landeskog, Gabriel BOS Hall, Taylor MTL Danault, Phillip TOR Hyman, Zach CHI Quenneville, John NJD Murray, Ryan EDM Barrie, Tyson FLA Driedger, Chris RFAs NYI Bellows, Kieffer PIT Miletic, Sam DAL Mascherin, Adam STL Dunn, Vince DET Cholowski, Dennis LAK Clague, Kale CAR Bean, Jake TBL Foote, Cal CGY Kylington, Oliver Lineup Landeskog-Johansen-Dadonov Hall-Danault-Hyman Quenneville-Domi-Appleton Bellows-Eakin-Pittlick Murray-Barrie Gotisbehere-Dunn Cholowski-Fleury Kahkonen/Driedge All players must clear waivers, so that means that at the latest at the end of training camp they will have to trade good players for picks and Waive-Exempt prospects My Salary cap is around $75M 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 24 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said: Ok, here goes my Kraken expansion draft. I'll post it this way: best player available (BPA) under contract, UFAs for key positions, best players available RFAs BPA-under-contract NASH Johansen, Ryan OTT Dadonov, Evgeni CBJ Domi, Max WIN Appleton, Mason BUF Eakin, Cody ARZ Pitlick, Tyler VAN Gadjovich, Jonah NYR Gauthier, Julien PHI Gostisbehere, Shayne ANA Fleury, Haydn SJS Meloche, Nicolas MIN Kähkönen, Kaapo WSH Vanecek, Vitek UFAs COL Landeskog, Gabriel BOS Hall, Taylor MTL Danault, Phillip TOR Hyman, Zach CHI Quenneville, John NJD Murray, Ryan EDM Barrie, Tyson FLA Driedger, Chris RFAs NYI Bellows, Kieffer PIT Miletic, Sam DAL Mascherin, Adam STL Dunn, Vince DET Cholowski, Dennis LAK Clague, Kale CAR Bean, Jake TBL Foote, Cal CGY Kylington, Oliver Lineup Landeskog-Johansen-Dadonov Hall-Danault-Hyman Quenneville-Domi-Appleton Bellows-Eakin-Pittlick Murray-Barrie Gotisbehere-Dunn Cholowski-Fleury Kahkonen/Driedge All players must clear waivers, so that means that at the latest at the end of training camp they will have to trade good players for picks and Waive-Exempt prospects My Salary cap is around $75M If Seattle is taking an expensive player from Nashville- which I don’t see them doing unlesss it’s a side deal with retention, it would probably be Duschane, not Johansen. I know Duschane’s got more years, but Johansen has sucked more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 I was not sure which one to chose, went with the younger one. One year less at $8M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 16 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said: I was not sure which one to chose, went with the younger one. One year less at $8M I think Johansen started wearing out his welcome a couple of years ago like he did in Columbus. I also think Francis is more likely to take Price, than one of the high priced Nashville centres, or Tarasenko, from the blues, unless it’s part of a side deal, where the preds, or Blues retain salary. On the other hand the Preds, don’t have as obvious as a puck like Dunn is for that Blues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 24 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said: I think Johansen started wearing out his welcome a couple of years ago like he did in Columbus. I also think Francis is more likely to take Price, than one of the high priced Nashville centres, or Tarasenko, from the blues, unless it’s part of a side deal, where the preds, or Blues retain salary. On the other hand the Preds, don’t have as obvious as a puck like Dunn is for that Blues. Nashville's availabel players is a pathetic. Granlund, Sissons, Haula ares not impact players; Gubradson and Borrowiecko are fringe NHLers at best. The few prospects are not that great. So, it has to be an overpaid center Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said: Nashville's availabel players is a pathetic. Granlund, Sissons, Haula ares not impact players; Gubradson and Borrowiecko are fringe NHLers at best. The few prospects are not that great. So, it has to be an overpaid center Why does it have to be an overpaid centre??? When they had the expansion drafts in the 90’s, I think it was Bob Clarke that tried to pick Lafleur (who was retired) from the Nordiques, because the other choices were garbage - and they had no salary cap than. you don’t take a stupid contract, without some additional incentive from Nashville. You take a forth line grunt/6th dman if you have to, and keep the cap space. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 7 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said: Nashville's availabel players is a pathetic. Granlund, Sissons, Haula ares not impact players; Gubradson and Borrowiecko are fringe NHLers at best. The few prospects are not that great. So, it has to be an overpaid center Tampa is the only team deep enough that they exposed an impact player for reasons other than age/contract. That's how an expansion draft works - everyone protects their 9-11 best players unless they have some reason not to protect all of their best players. Seattle has to take 30 players, so there will be fringe NHLers selected. Nashville is a spot that will come down to their other selections. Like Domi in Columbus. If they have the room, they'll take Johansen and Domi. If they use up space on other players, then they'll take guys like Haula or Stenlund. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 13 minutes ago, Fanpuck33 said: Tampa is the only team deep enough that they exposed an impact player for reasons other than age/contract. That's how an expansion draft works - everyone protects their 9-11 best players unless they have some reason not to protect all of their best players. Seattle has to take 30 players, so there will be fringe NHLers selected. Nashville is a spot that will come down to their other selections. Like Domi in Columbus. If they have the room, they'll take Johansen and Domi. If they use up space on other players, then they'll take guys like Haula or Stenlund. that is why in my list the salary cap is used for UFAs and the grunts are Appleton, Eakin, Pitlick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 10 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said: Ok, here goes my Kraken expansion draft. I'll post it this way: best player available (BPA) under contract, UFAs for key positions, best players available RFAs BPA-under-contract NASH Johansen, Ryan OTT Dadonov, Evgeni CBJ Domi, Max WIN Appleton, Mason BUF Eakin, Cody ARZ Pitlick, Tyler VAN Gadjovich, Jonah NYR Gauthier, Julien PHI Gostisbehere, Shayne ANA Fleury, Haydn SJS Meloche, Nicolas MIN Kähkönen, Kaapo WSH Vanecek, Vitek UFAs COL Landeskog, Gabriel BOS Hall, Taylor MTL Danault, Phillip TOR Hyman, Zach CHI Quenneville, John NJD Murray, Ryan EDM Barrie, Tyson FLA Driedger, Chris RFAs NYI Bellows, Kieffer PIT Miletic, Sam DAL Mascherin, Adam STL Dunn, Vince DET Cholowski, Dennis LAK Clague, Kale CAR Bean, Jake TBL Foote, Cal CGY Kylington, Oliver Lineup Landeskog-Johansen-Dadonov Hall-Danault-Hyman Quenneville-Domi-Appleton Bellows-Eakin-Pittlick Murray-Barrie Gotisbehere-Dunn Cholowski-Fleury Kahkonen/Driedge All players must clear waivers, so that means that at the latest at the end of training camp they will have to trade good players for picks and Waive-Exempt prospects My Salary cap is around $75M There must be 20 players on existing contracts selected (you only have 13) so your scenario isn't allowable by the expansion rules. (You also need at least 3 goalies.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 9 minutes ago, dlbalr said: There must be 20 players on existing contracts selected (you only have 13) so your scenario isn't allowable by the expansion rules. (You also need at least 3 goalies.) Speed dating to sign all the UFAs, RFAs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 2 hours ago, Fanpuck33 said: Seattle has to take 30 players, so there will be fringe NHLers selected. Like Kulak, or Fleury most likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 10 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said: Nashville's availabel players is a pathetic. Granlund, Sissons, Haula ares not impact players; Gubradson and Borrowiecko are fringe NHLers at best. The few prospects are not that great. So, it has to be an overpaid center So, you take someone like Haula. He can contribute and is not overpaid (as I recall). You have to make 31 picks and most of them will NOT be impact players. EDIT: Haula is UFA, so that doesn't help much. Ah well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 The Athletic has made available an expansion list (Eric Duhatschek, Ryan S. Clark) : https://theathletic.com/2715340/2021/07/20/seattle-kraken-mock-expansion-draft/?redirected=1 I have their three goalie selections in my list... and 5 out of 15 in my defensemen list (I took a lot of Ds), then my list crashes and burns with only one forward in both lists (Landeskog) We'll find out tomorrow how close I am Has anyone else tried creating a list? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 3 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said: Speed dating to sign all the UFAs, RFAs... Still doesn't matter. It has to be 20 contracts already signed prior to the protection lists being released. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 4 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said: Has anyone else tried creating a list? I've done one - https://www.prohockeyrumors.com/2021/07/phr-mock-expansion-draft-seattle-kraken.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 33 minutes ago, dlbalr said: Still doesn't matter. It has to be 20 contracts already signed prior to the protection lists being released. Then why The Athletic and other commentators and analysts have UFAs and RFAs in their lists ? I am utterly confused Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 12 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said: Then why The Athletic and other commentators and analysts have UFAs and RFAs in their lists ? I am utterly confused They are taking 30 players... a maximum of 10 of those players can be UFAs/RFAs.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted July 20, 2021 Share Posted July 20, 2021 23 minutes ago, Commandant said: They are taking 30 players... a maximum of 10 of those players can be UFAs/RFAs.... 10! darn it! I’ll have to re-do my list now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Ok, here is my updated and fixed list. A $80M/cap after signing the UFA/RFs with too many defensemen and just Kahko that can be waived, which will allow for some trades for picks and prospects. UNDER CONTRACT NASH Johansen, Ryan OTT Dadonov, Evgeni PHI Voracek, Jakub TBL Gourde, Yanni NYI Bailey, Josh WIN Appleton, Mason ARZ Pitlick, Tyler LAK Lemieux, Brendan BUF Girgensons, Zemgus NYR Gauthier, Julien VAN Gadjovich, Jonah CGY Giordano, Mark BOS Clifton, Connor CBJ Kukan, Dean ANA Fleury, Haydn MTL Kulak, Brett DET Stecher, Troy TOR Dermott, Travis SJS Meloche, Nicolas MIN Kähkönen, Kaapo WSH Vanecek, Vitek RFAs (team control) PIT Miletic, Sam DAL Mascherin, Adam STL Dunn, Vince CAR Bean, Jake UFAs (show me the money) COL Landeskog, Gabriel CHI Quenneville, John NJD Murray, Ryan EDM Barrie, Tyson FLA Driedger, Chris LINEUP Landeskog-Johansen-Dadonov Voracek-Gourde-Bailey Quenneville-Appleton-Pitlick Lemieux-Girgenson-Gauthier Murray-Barrie Giordano-Dunn Cliffton-Kukan Kulak-Fleury Driedge/Vaneck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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