GDT Game 3, Maple Leafs vs Habs, 7 PM

[GHT120]

13 hours ago, sbhatt said:

It's the same thing every damn year...a team constructed to lose close low-scoring playoff games.

Heard on TSN690 recently that Scotty Bowman (?) once said that losing a close game by one goal is just one goal away from losing by two ... close just doesn't count for anything except excuses.

[GHT120]

13 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

... The D needs to be fundamentally retooled. That has been obvious most of the season (especially after Petry’s Norris-like play dried up) and it is even more obvious now. Whether Mr Alzner/Chiarot/Edmundson is up for the task is a whole other question.

The Edmunson signing and adding Romanov completed MB's rebuild of the defence ... they are what he wants them to be.

[GHT120]

13 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

Weber likely isn't going anywhere because no one else wants to take on that cap hit. 

The contract runs for five more seasons but how many will he play ... the last three only pay $1M in actual salary ... and year after next is $3M ... so I only expect him to play for a season or two ... a team like Seattle could take him for leadership in the first couple of seasons or even move him on while retaining some cap hit ... Weber being selected by the Kraken (if exposed) is not IMO far fetched ... but I doubt MB would do it unless Shea asked ... neither can I see him ever asking Price to waive his NTC, even if it was guaranteed the habs wouldn't lose him.

[DON]

13 hours ago, BCHabnut said:

I've decided that firing julien was a bad idea. Ducharme and burrows suck

They cant add talented forwards and the roster is what it is...middling at best...with CC & KK or without them. Not saying they are doing wonderful and 99.9% of habfans (and me) likely would have had CC written in pen and rubber stamp him in line-up every game till 2031.

If, had lucky couple bounces they might be sitting 2-1 in series, not sure would hear same complaints if results in just 1 game were different.

And at least folks got off the blaming the refs bandwagon, which was silly (they suck at best of times, we all know that, and owners like it that way, one has to assume).

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

4 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

The contract runs for five more seasons but how many will he play ... the last three only pay $1M in actual salary ... and year after next is $3M ... so I only expect him to play for a season or two ... a team like Seattle could take him for leadership in the first couple of seasons or even move him on while retaining some cap hit ... Weber being selected by the Kraken (if exposed) is not IMO far fetched ... but I doubt MB would do it unless Shea asked ... neither can I see him ever asking Price to waive his NTC, even if it was guaranteed the habs wouldn't lose him.

 

Why are you assuming Shea Weber only plays for the money? Most of these guys love the game and hate to leave. I'm guessing that, as long as he gets a regular roster spot, he will play. And we'll be on the hook for that insane cap hit.

[GHT120]

1 hour ago, johnnyhasbeen said:

I dont know what the complaining is about. Team dominated in the 3rd ...

You mean when the leafs had the lead and were focusing more on not allowing a goal more than scoring another

[GHT120]

6 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Why are you assuming Shea Weber only plays for the money? Most of these guys love the game and hate to leave. I'm guessing that, as long as he gets a regular roster spot, he will play. And we'll be on the hook for that insane cap hit.

 

Not just for the money ... but for the first $1M season he will be 38 ... two Mose seasons of the various injuries he suffers (and often plays through) piling up ... the cost/benefit for the rest of his life has to be a factor in deciding whether to play ... I also think that he expects more of himself than just a "regular roster spot" ... that (IMO) is the very definition of only playing for the money

Edited May 25, 2021 by GHT120
struck through text a brain fart

[DON]

 

1 hour ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

We are shit because we are managed by shit

2-1 loss is not shit, Sabres are shite, Habs & Leafs i would say are both mediocre? They do have some quite talented forwards on the other team and Habs still just down 1 game, 2 to 4 more to play in series, no dead quite yet.

[DON]

36 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

The Edmunson signing and adding Romanov completed MB's rebuild of the defence ... they are what he wants them to be.

Romanov has been better than some expected and as good as most assumed he would be.

And Edmundson has been fine and about as or better than expected also, hasnt he? 

 

So did you have too lofty expectations perhaps? Or you think Bergevin hoped for more from these two this year? 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

12 minutes ago, DON said:

 

2-1 loss is not shit, Sabres are shite, Habs & Leafs i would say are both mediocre? They do have some quite talented forwards on the other team and Habs still just down 1 game, 2 to 4 more to play in series, no dead quite yet.

 

I would say the Leafs are better than mediocre.  As much as I hate to admit it, the Leafs are simply a better team so my expectations weren't high going into this series.  I am still hopeful that they come back but if they are going to lose, I would rather see them lose with guys like KK, Caulfield and Romanov playing a role and gaining valuable experience. 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

15 minutes ago, DON said:

 

2-1 loss is not shit, Sabres are shite, Habs & Leafs i would say are both mediocre? They do have some quite talented forwards on the other team and Habs still just down 1 game, 2 to 4 more to play in series, no dead quite yet.

 

I don't believe the Leafs are mediocre; au contraire, I think they are elite, and readier than they have ever been to go all the way.

 

Not dead yet, but if the elderly Habs' D manages to not crumble before the Leafs' youthful speed without a day's rest, I will be surprised.

[DON]

Just now, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

I would say the Leafs are better than mediocre.  As much as I hate to admit it, the Leafs are simply a better team so my expectations weren't high going into this series.  

Compared to Aves or Tampa or Carolina or Vegas...Leafs or any Canadian team will be swept.

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

1 minute ago, DON said:

Compared to Aves or Tampa or Carolina or Vegas...Leafs or any Canadian team will be swept.

 

I think you badly underestimate the Leafs and/or Winnipeg. I would put Winnipeg's forward group up against any other forward group. Nobody is sweeping either team. 

[DON]

1 minute ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

Not dead yet, but if the elderly Habs' D manages to not crumble before the Leafs' youthful speed without a day's rest, I will be surprised.

I still say, will be the forward group actually scoring enough (no they shouldnt need the defense gift-wrapping break aways for them), who make difference in winning or losing.

 

Old d? How many odd man rushs or breakaways have Leafs had? Not more than normal, so d-speed has been non issue, seems to me anyways (would a Morgan Reilly help, for sure.).

[BCHabnut]

3 minutes ago, DON said:

Romanov has been better than some expected and as good as most assumed he would be.

And Edmundson has been fine and about as or better than expected also, hasnt he? 

 

So did you have too lofty expectations perhaps? Or you think Bergevin hoped for more from these two this year? 

I think that Weber, Chiarot, Edmondson, Romanov are all good defenseman. The issue for me is that there are too many players of similar style, and nobody with hands. I like all 4 of them , but they are all stay at home players. And that's where they play. At home in their own zone, unable to make an outlet play, or a stretch pass, or hold the offensive zone, or make an unpredictable play in the o zone. They are all good players individually, but combined, the team is badly unbalanced on the backend. For a team, that only scores off the rush, it's critical to have a defenseman who can create that rush from his own zone. 

[DON]

2 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

I think you badly underestimate the Leafs and/or Winnipeg. I would put Winnipeg's forward group up against any other forward group. Nobody is sweeping either team. 

We shall see in couple weeks.

[hab29RETIRED]

1 hour ago, johnnyhasbeen said:

I dont know what the complaining is about. Team dominated in the 3rd. We need to play 60 minutes like that tonight and go back to Toronto needing 2 of 3 games. 

Want to see Suzuki between Toffoli and Caulfield and Danault Tatar Gally againg Matthews line. 

What the complaining is about??? We lost. We scored one goal AGAIN. Could have been 5 scored on us before the third period that we dominated.🙄

[dlbalr]

2 hours ago, IN THE HEARTS OF MEN said:

Next is Romanov for that plug Merril. Hopefully game 4 hes in... we look at leafs playing Sandin at same age and it drives me nuts!

 

How's lehks? How soon till Evans is back?

 

Romanov was doing extra skating after practice which would suggest he's unlikely to play.  I'm okay with Merrill staying in, to be honest (I think he has been quiet but they're not getting hammered in their own end for too long when he's out there) but I'd give serious consideration to sitting Chiarot.  I know they won't do that but I think he has been the weakest link so far.  

 

They're waiting for test results on Lehkonen and he isn't ruled out yet for tonight.  Evans and Staal appear to be gametime decisions as well.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

31 minutes ago, BCHabnut said:

I think that Weber, Chiarot, Edmondson, Romanov are all good defenseman. The issue for me is that there are too many players of similar style, and nobody with hands. I like all 4 of them , but they are all stay at home players. And that's where they play. At home in their own zone, unable to make an outlet play, or a stretch pass, or hold the offensive zone, or make an unpredictable play in the o zone. They are all good players individually, but combined, the team is badly unbalanced on the backend. For a team, that only scores off the rush, it's critical to have a defenseman who can create that rush from his own zone. 

 

Agree completely.

31 minutes ago, DON said:

I still say, will be the forward group actually scoring enough (no they shouldnt need the defense gift-wrapping break aways for them), who make difference in winning or losing.

 

Old d? How many odd man rushs or breakaways have Leafs had? Not more than normal, so d-speed has been non issue, seems to me anyways (would a Morgan Reilly help, for sure.).

 

I think you grossly underestimate the importance of effective offensive defencemen to a team's overall offensive game (especially, but not exclusively, on the PP). As for the old D-men, did you see the second period last night? Complete domination from the Leafs for 20 minutes, salvaged only by Price's superhuman efforts. My point is not that we're going to see 60 minutes of that tonight, but rather that this game is likely to be significantly harder for the Webers and the Petrys of the world than it will be for the comparatively youthful Leafs. If the Habs are going to win, they're going to have to really gut it out.

[GHT120]

47 minutes ago, DON said:

Romanov has been better than some expected and as good as most assumed he would be.

And Edmundson has been fine and about as or better than expected also, hasnt he? 

 

So did you have too lofty expectations perhaps? Or you think Bergevin hoped for more from these two this year? 

Edmundson has been fine ... basically as advertised, but is essentially in the same general mold as Chiarot ... Romanov looks promising but not YET a top 4 defenceman (which I think is the expectation) and not YET showing any real offence. 

 

But my post was in response to another saying the D needed to be re-tooled ... I was saying that Bergevin has already completed his re-build of the defence ... not criticizing Edmundson and Romanov.

 

The current blueline has one leftover from MB's 3rd season (Petry) ... another from his 5th season (Weber) ... another from his 7th season (Kulak) ... Chiarot from last season and then Romanov and Edmundson to start this season ... it is now what MB sees as the D that is needed for the playoffs ... mostly big, slow and defensively focused, with support for the offence not a priority.

IMO it reflects the long-standing  "make the playoffs and see what happens (i.e., how far Price can "Carey" them)  philosophy ... certainly not the "do damage" objective set before the season

 

[Prime Minister Koivu]

1 hour ago, DON said:

 

2-1 loss is not shit, Sabres are shite, Habs & Leafs i would say are both mediocre? They do have some quite talented forwards on the other team and Habs still just down 1 game, 2 to 4 more to play in series, no dead quite yet.

 

 

Don that is indeed shit. 
 

Our coach does not understand the relationship between the defence and offence. 
 

We are managed by idiots

[hab29RETIRED]

3 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

That’s the trouble. This group disappointed in the regular season and the hope has been that we’d see them hit a different plateau in the playoffs. But alas, the “LA Kings 2012” scenario is not coming to pass, at least not so far...

The kings had more skill. Kopitar, Carter, Brown, and Richards, and depth in Williams and Penner. On D they had a legit #1 in Doughty. In goal, Quick was as good as Price had ever been in the playoffs. We’ve got some hood wingers and Price.  We got the extra size on D like the kings did, but now QB on the blueline. No dominant centre, or elite playmaker.

[hab29RETIRED]

2 hours ago, DON said:

Or need (sorry to repeat myself for 1,000th time) at least 1 legit all-star forward. Oil got swept, but 2 stars still had 9pts, whereas Habs whole team has 11pts.

I think you could add a Robinson, Savard or Chelios clone on back end and still would get outscored in a series.

 

But, still playing and if all the stars align, they can win a couple games vs the Leafs for sure. Lucky bounce or two and win special teams battle could be all that is needed to get 3g for Price to have a shot at winning today.

I disagree. I think if we had Robinson, Lapointe and Savard, they themselves would have had at least 4 goals and setup another 4 or 5. We definitely have a legit PP with them.

[hab29RETIRED]

2 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Why are you assuming Shea Weber only plays for the money? Most of these guys love the game and hate to leave. I'm guessing that, as long as he gets a regular roster spot, he will play. And we'll be on the hook for that insane cap hit.

Agree. May want to play until he wins. Thornton and Spezza are playing for pocket change (to them - a fortune for me).

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

4 hours ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

 

 

Don that is indeed shit. 
 

Our coach does not understand the relationship between the defence and offence. 
 

We are managed by idiots

 

That may be true, but the fact remains that Romanov had 6 points on the entire season. It is far from clear that he represents an offensive upgrade in any meaningful way on any of those other guys. Sadly.