GDT Game 3, Maple Leafs vs Habs, 7 PM

[Chris]

All the big contracts have NMC in them, a MB specialty 

 

The best they can hope for is Kulak or Chairot getting picked up to gain some salary 

 

They'll get some relief with Tatar and Danault leaving as well, 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Habsfan89]

6 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Problem is, the UFA market for D looks fairly thin. If we waive Weber might we be able to land an upgrade in Hamilton at a reasonable rate in a flat-cap world? Or should we be thinking more along the lines of Barrie or even Mike Reilly? Or, will it have to be a trade (always risky)?

Weber isn't going anywhere as long as Bergevin is here and believes in this team and core group he put together. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

7 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Problem is, the UFA market for D looks fairly thin. If we waive Weber might we be able to land an upgrade in Hamilton at a reasonable rate in a flat-cap world? Or should we be thinking more along the lines of Barrie or even Mike Reilly? Or, will it have to be a trade (always risky)?

 

Are you talking about the Mike Reilly who has already played for the Habs and 3 other teams?  I don't think he is solving any of our problems. 

[hab29RETIRED]

2 minutes ago, Chris said:

All the big contracts have NMC in them, a MB specialty 

 

The best they can hope for is Kulak or Chairot getting picked up to gain some salary 

 

They'll get some relief with Tatar and Danault leaving as well, 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think if he is left unprotected Seattle MAY take him. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

1 minute ago, Habsfan89 said:

Weber isn't going anywhere as long as Bergevin is here and believes in this team and core group he put together. 

 

Weber likely isn't going anywhere because no one else wants to take on that cap hit. 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

32 minutes ago, Habsfan89 said:

Weber isn't going anywhere as long as Bergevin is here and believes in this team and core group he put together. 

 

I can see Weber staying because no other GM is dumb enough to take on that contract. But if he stays because Bergevin “believes in this core” then Bergevin should be fired on the spot.

[Habsfan89]

4 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

I can see Weber staying because no other GM is dumb enough to take on that contract. But if he stays because Bergevin “believes in this core” then Bergevin should be fired on the spot.

Bergevin has been on record saying weber was his best trade as habs gm. He's not going to get rid of him.

[dlbalr]

43 minutes ago, Chris said:

All the big contracts have NMC in them, a MB specialty

 

Montreal has three players with a no-move clause - Price, Gallagher, and Petry.  Weber doesn't, Drouin doesn't, and Toffoli doesn't.  Of their six highest-paid players, half have one, not all of them.  (I'm not including Tatar in there since he's on an expiring deal but he doesn't have one either.)  Of those six I referenced, five of the deals were signed by Bergevin so it's not a case of him inheriting a bunch of deals without a NMC either.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Just now, Habsfan89 said:

Bergevin has been on record saying weber was his best trade as habs gm. He's not going to get rid of him.

 

Well - whatever he made of a trade in 2017 or 2018 has ZERO bearing on whether Weber is a desirable asset at that ticket in 2021-22 let alone for the next five years after that. And only a complete ass of a GM would confuse those two issues.

 

This is the kind of “reasoning” I can’t stand: “Weber is ‘my guy’ no matter how much he sucks or how overpaid he is.” No. Weber is your guy until he becomes an obstacle to making your team better. Then you throw him on the trash-pile the first chance you get IF you find another GM stupid enough to take on that contract.

 

[hab29RETIRED]

2 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

 

Montreal has three players with a no-move clause - Price, Gallagher, and Petry.  Weber doesn't, Drouin doesn't, and Toffoli doesn't.  Of their six highest-paid players, half have one, not all of them.  (I'm not including Tatar in there since he's on an expiring deal but he doesn't have one either.)  Of those six I referenced, five of the deals were signed by Bergevin so it's not a case of him inheriting a bunch of deals without a NMC either.

I thought Edmondson and Chiarot also have NTC’s.

[Chris]

So did I 

[Habsfan89]

1 minute ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Well - whatever he made of a trade in 2017 or 2018 has ZERO bearing on whether Weber is a desirable asset at that ticket in 2021-22 let alone for the next five years after that. And only a complete ass of a GM would confuse those two issues.

 

This is the kind of “reasoning” I can’t stand: “Weber is ‘my guy’ no matter how much he sucks or how overpaid he is.” No. Weber is your guy until he becomes an obstacle to making your team better. Then you throw him on the trash-pile the first chance you get IF you find another GM stupid enough to take on that contract.

 

I agree when we did the retool or rebuild I was one who said if we're not planning on wining for awhile we should be trading Weber and even Price as when we're ready to contend they won't be useful. We are seeing that now with weber. But price is still holding his own but that's only because we need to rest him in the regular season. He's no longer that 60plus work horse he was in the past. 

[Neech]

We really needed this one - we held the Leafs to only 2 goals and Price played well.  Unfortunately, Campbell was also good.  We won't win this series if their goalie is as good as ours when they have the advantage everywhere else on the ice.  Plus, I expect the Leafs to light us up once or twice more, so taking the close ones is a must.

 

It was heartening to see Caufield look so dangerous.  We should just leave him out for the full powerplay each time.  Suzuki also had a bounce back game, and he hardly had the game 'on his stick' on that pass from Perry - the puck was in midair.

 

[Prime Minister Koivu]

I blame Ducharme for this loss. 
 

He still doesn’t understand that Weber/Chairot are too slow and not good enough at breakout. 
 

Merrill is useless when paired with a bottom Dman. He sits or pair him with a Weber

 

The constant blender with the lines. How do you develop chemistry?

 

The 1-1-3 system is stupid. We started the season 2-3 system and forechecked the piss out of everything. We caused turnovers and scored. Now we wait for the attack and hope Price stops it. We can’t score and this is why. 
 

Ducharme and Bergevin need to go. This team can’t win cause we can’t score 

[dlbalr]

9 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

I thought Edmondson and Chiarot also have NTC’s.

 

9 hours ago, Chris said:

So did I 

 

NMC was what was claimed, not NTC.  There's a difference. 

 

Yes, Chiarot, Edmundson, and Drouin/Anderson (as of the beginning of free agency this summer) have NTC's.  Chiarot's is 10 teams, Edmundson 10 teams, Anderson 8 teams, and Drouin 3.  None of them are full no-trades.

 

Technically speaking, of the three players with NMC's, two of them also carry partial NTC's (Petry/Gallagher) which means the NMC is a no-waiver provision, not an outright no-trade.

 

They don't have a lot of players with an ability to block a trade; there are quite a few teams with more NTC's on the books than Montreal and of the ones they have, most of them are minimal.

 

Here's a listing of every team's trade provisions for quick reference - https://www.thefourthperiod.com/no-trade-clauses

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

10 hours ago, Habsfan89 said:

I agree when we did the retool or rebuild I was one who said if we're not planning on wining for awhile we should be trading Weber and even Price as when we're ready to contend they won't be useful. We are seeing that now with weber. But price is still holding his own but that's only because we need to rest him in the regular season. He's no longer that 60plus work horse he was in the past. 

 

It’s a worry for another day, but I do fret about how to replace Allen if we lose him to Seattle. He was absolutely critical to getting the team anywhere near the playoffs, and, as you say, Price can no longer be counted on to carry the mail in the regular season - although two stellar playoffs in a row show that he still has it in the crunch.

[DON]

4g in 3gms, last in NHL in g/gm (Aves/Tampa 4 & 5g/gm, not even same league, but should be no surprise)

0ppg's, last in NHL

 

Tied 4th in PK and 10th in goals against/gm. Cant blame goalies so far.

 

Bout as expected as per reg season, no?

 

Oh well, 1 win from making it a best of three, could be worse...could be McDavid.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

7 minutes ago, DON said:

4g in 3gms, last in NHL in g/gm (Aves/Tampa 4 & 5g/gm, not even same league, but should be no surprise)

0ppg's, last in NHL

 

Tied 4th in PK and 10th in goals against/gm. Cant blame goalies so far.

 

Bout as expected as per reg season, no?

.

 

That’s the trouble. This group disappointed in the regular season and the hope has been that we’d see them hit a different plateau in the playoffs. But alas, the “LA Kings 2012” scenario is not coming to pass, at least not so far...

[IN THE HEARTS OF MEN]

We act like Bergevin is scared to fix his own mistakes. I dont genuinely believe he's scared to pull the trigger on anything including trading Weber...

 

My concern is him getting involved in the coaching. Like the goal challenge or forcing the coach to dress certain players etc 

 

 

Also I can't see how Caufield gets taken out of this line up moving forward. I think both he and KK are in to stay.

 

Next is Romanov for that plug Merril. Hopefully game 4 hes in... we look at leafs playing Sandin at same age and it drives me nuts!

 

Game 3 could of gone either way. We had some real quality chances in the 1st and 3rd, sandwiched between a horrible 2nd period.  The PP is such a momentum killer... both in favour of leafs. 

 

How's lehks? How soon till Evans is back?

 

 

 

 

 

[johnnyhasbeen]

I dont know what the complaining is about. Team dominated in the 3rd. We need to play 60 minutes like that tonight and go back to Toronto needing 2 of 3 games. 

Want to see Suzuki between Toffoli and Caulfield and Danault Tatar Gally againg Matthews line. 

[Prime Minister Koivu]

4 minutes ago, IN THE HEARTS OF MEN said:

We act like Bergevin is scared to fix his own mistakes. I dont genuinely believe he's scared to pull the trigger on anything including trading Weber...

 

My concern is him getting involved in the coaching. Like the goal challenge or forcing the coach to dress certain players etc 

 

 

Also I can't see how Caufield gets taken out of this line up moving forward. I think both he and KK are in to stay.

 

Next is Romanov for that plug Merril. Hopefully game 4 hes in... we look at leafs playing Sandin at same age and it drives me nuts!

 

Game 3 could of gone either way. We had some real quality chances in the 1st and 3rd, sandwiched between a horrible 2nd period.  The PP is such a momentum killer... both in favour of leafs. 

 

How's lehks? How soon till Evans is back?

 

 

 

 

 

I disagree 

 

We played with intensity for 10 minutes. 
 

We sit back and wait for the leafs to come. We have no drive and no swagger at all. Our hope is for Price to make a save then we get a chance to score off the rush. 
 

We are a team built for in your face Sutter hockey but we play a sad sack turtle style. 
 

We managed 4 goals in three games which is pathetic. Price is doing his job and Ducharme is squandering it. Our plan is genuinely to win 1-0 or 2-1. 
 

We are shit because we are managed by shit

[Habsfan89]

1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

It’s a worry for another day, but I do fret about how to replace Allen if we lose him to Seattle. He was absolutely critical to getting the team anywhere near the playoffs, and, as you say, Price can no longer be counted on to carry the mail in the regular season - although two stellar playoffs in a row show that he still has it in the crunch.

Yes Price has looked great 2 years in a row in the playoffs with time off in the regular season.  We need  to time management him in the regular season from here on in and I agree we need to keep Allan. If we lose him could be a long year going back to old division. 

[DON]

13 hours ago, brobin said:

I am not sure why people are surprised.  The leafs are a much much better team then the Habs… they have far more talent and the point totals show it…

 

yes, the habs can upset, bUt that would be the surprise.. the habs need more young talent to build around.

Or need (sorry to repeat myself for 1,000th time) at least 1 legit all-star forward. Oil got swept, but 2 stars still had 9pts, whereas Habs whole team has 11pts.

I think you could add a Robinson, Savard or Chelios clone on back end and still would get outscored in a series.

 

But, still playing and if all the stars align, they can win a couple games vs the Leafs for sure. Lucky bounce or two and win special teams battle could be all that is needed to get 3g for Price to have a shot at winning today.

[GHT120]

14 hours ago, Commandant said:

Of course we get an extra penalty on the scrum

 

 

TVA has a former ref available for commentary and he said unless things go crazy it is usually penalties for whoever initiated the fracas and one other from each side

[DON]

13 hours ago, sbhatt said:

 

This team is missing multiple key pieces, while it has a GM who either doesn't see it or doesn't know how to address it.

You just spoke to about 20+ teams current GMs and a whole string of past Hab GMs, not just this one. So, you aint saying anything new or earth shattering, thats for sure.