Habs Off Season 2021

[GHT120]

53 minutes ago, IN THE HEARTS OF MEN said:

You'd think LTIR would be the option here on drouin if he's not back from whatever ails him. Could he had been the difference in these playoffs? Highly unlikely.Its amazing when you think 2 of our highest paid forwards largely played zero role in this run  (10M for Tatar and Drouin.)
 

You'd have to believe if they expose Weber the Krak likely take Allen and if they protect Weber they likely take one of Edmundson or Chiarot...Or maybe they sign a UFa and were in the clear.

 

Caufield has already replaced Tatar in the top 6

How far away is norlinder from being the puck mover we crave?

Is Evans the heir apparant to Danault?

Is Poehling centering Perry and Armia

on the 4th line? Cause I want Perry back!

Surely weve seen the last of the scratching of KK and Romanov

• LTIR is only useful if Drouin is unfit to play for the entire season ... don't expect that will apply ... a buyout is $1,833,333 for four seasons, so could be a possibility (subject to the hurdle dlbair raised earlier), but unlikely since MB gave up Sergachev to get him (shouldn't matter but likely does) ... I see him being dealt, either for little return or with salary retained for a little something more
   

• Exposing Weber is a tough decision ... moving him would be disruptive to the team "spirit" ... unless of course they are CONFIDENT the Kraken wouldn't take him
   

• Agree that Caufield has replaced Tatar on the depth chart, but Habs were (IMO) already one Top 9 forward short of ideal
   

• Norlinder is likely at least another year away from the NHL and 2-3 more from possibly being Top 4 quality
   

• Don't see Evans as a Top 9 centre (at least yet) ... at least not on a legit playoff team ... expect Poehling will be on the team, maybe shifted to the wing but available to play centre if needed ... in cap terms, Byron is a problem ... he fits best on the 4th line but $3.4M is way too much for that role ... assuming MB can get the overall cap under control, Perry at the right price would make an ideal 12/13 forward on a full roster in that they would be a able to more easily rest him periodically (they couldn't risk putting him on waivers this season). 
   

• Expect KK and Romanov are in the lineup almost every night ... I am more confident with Romanov than KK ... is Jesperi a legit Top 9 centre on a solid playoff bound team or do we again see 19/20 & 20/21 regular-season KK 

 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

31 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

 

Isn't it the other way around?  Everything I've seen so far is that Vancouver really wants to get rid of him.

 

For some reason, I'd thought his cap hit was lower. I agree that $6 mil for him is way off - so I retract my argument. That said, he was a quality performer for Vegas and just proved a poor fit in Van. In hockey terms he would help us.

[BCHabnut]

2 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

Nate Schmidt wants out of Van.

 

we should explore that agressively

After the monster playoff by Chiarot, could you do a straight across trade? This would be a realistic option to balance out the defense. 

[Neech]

19 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

•  

• Expect KK and Romanov are in the lineup almost every night ... I am more confident with Romanov than KK ... is Jesperi a legit Top 9 centre on a solid playoff bound team or do we again see 19/20 & 20/21 regular-season KK 

 

 

I'm taking the approach that this year should have been his rookie year, and that we'll start to see more consistency from his play.  I think his floor is a solid third line C like Eller, but there isn't much to point to (ie. anything elite) to make us think he'll be much more than that.  But I'm pencilling him in for a breakout campaign of *gasp* 40 points.

[Commandant]

Prediction: Habs are gonna go 4 and 4 with protection, protecting the big 4 on D

 

Caufield and Suzuki are exempt.

The four forwards are Anderson, Gallagher, Toffoli and Kotkaniemi.

 

No need to protect Drouin, Lehkonen, Byron, or any of the UFAs. Evans is a fourth liner, if they want him, oh well... we can replace that, but they probably take Jake Allen over him anyways, and I'd rather protect the D over Evans.

 

 

[DON]

Dont really care who coaches, current guy is fine it seems, dont know enough about any french options out there.

I wouldnt protect Weber and highly doubt he would be chosen by Seattle if wasnt.

 

I want a top six upgrade player...that is my short wishlist for upcoming year.

D-core is lacking obviously but is not in need of upgrade as much, especially if can score a few more goals.

 

[alfredoh2009]

3 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Richardson looked go to me, notwithstanding having Cooper eat his lunch in Game One. But it depends how good his French is. Right now it's not either-or, we can keep both.

 

A question: what if we buy out Drouin? Is that an option?

Richardson could not win against TBL and although I like him I would not put him above Dom

[Habsfan89]

Well this didn't take long lol. Here's my take 

 

This team has weaknesses and Tampa exposed them. We need to do up grades on our D core and add more Playmakers on the back end.  I also think we need to improve our centers on the 4th and 3rd lines. As far as our coaching I think if Bergevin stays then DD is his guy, if Bergevin goes then I think it's a whole new coaching staff.

 

I know we had injuries and guys weren't 100% and a lake of D options so you can't real blame that on DD or the coaching staff can you? I think they did a good job with what they had. 

 

As far as rosters change's I would 

 

Try to resign Danault if he wants over 6mil let him walk.  If we can resign Danault then i would look at trading Kotkaniemi to add a top goal scorer, because we still have Poehling. If we can't resign Danault then we keep Kotkaniemi and go after Laine and take a gamble with him. 

 

Tatar is gone 

Keep Armia 

Hopefully we can get rid of Byron contract to Seattle 

Staal is gone 

Perry is gone 

Keep Lehkonen 

Trade Kulak 

 

Bring in

Niskanen 

take a gamble on Laine

Sign Gruland if Danault goes

 

Lines could look like this 

 

Toffoli  / Suzuki  / Caufield 

Laine  / Kotkaniemi  / Gallagher 

Lehkonen  / Gruland  or Danault  / Anderson 

Evans  / Poehling  or Gruland  / Armia 

 

Chiarot  / Weber

Edmundson  / Petry 

Romanov  / Niskanen  

 

Price 

Allan 

 

That's without making any trades to up grade. But with Poehling in the system and the depth at center in free agency I think we could dangle Kotkaniemi out there and see if we can get an  up grade at our top center. 

 

[Commandant]

Seattle is definitely taking Weber if left unprotected and making him the first captain of the team.

 

They are trying to trade for Duncan Keith to do the same thing.

[Prime Minister Koivu]

Bergevin for me has a clean slate. He identified the players and type of team he wanted and his team went to the Stanley Cup Final. 
 

His past failures including Sergachev (sucks) are no longer counted in my book. 
 

The man made it

 

 

This is coming fast! We need to submit our list in 10 days. I suspect Commandant’s list is correct and while I would expose Weber (with a conversation with the team) to save that cap I can’t see Bergevin doing it. 

[GHT120]

29 minutes ago, Habsfan89 said:

... 

Tatar is gone 

Keep Armia 

Hopefully we can get rid of Byron contract to Seattle 

Staal is gone 

Perry is gone 

Keep Lehkonen 

Trade Kulak 

 

Bring in

Niskanen 

take a gamble on Laine

Sign Gruland if Danault goes

 

Lines could look like this 

 

Toffoli  / Suzuki  / Caufield 

Laine  / Kotkaniemi  / Gallagher 

Lehkonen  / Gruland  or Danault  / Anderson 

Evans  / Poehling  or Gruland  / Armia 

 

Chiarot  / Weber

Edmundson  / Petry 

Romanov  / Niskanen  

 

Price 

Allan 

 

That's without making any trades to up grade. But with Poehling in the system and the depth at center in free agency I think we could dangle Kotkaniemi out there and see if we can get an  up grade at our top center. 

 

 

I would look to re-sign Perry ... but fear the the Leafs might offer enough more than Habs should offer to entice Corey to the Laffs ... if MB can get the cap under control so the Habs can carry a full 22/23 man roster (i.e., at least one a spare forward and one spare defenceman) then IMO Perry would become even more valuable as "game management" would allow him to stay fresh ... this past season that generally would have required putting him on waivers and possibly/likely losing him.

 

Assuming you meant Matt Niskanen, he is an interesting but very risky idea ... he is 34 and currently retired, and as far as I can tell played no hockey this season ... not certain he wants to return to the NHL ... plus his expiring contract was $5.75M ... would he accept a "3rd pairing value" contract?

 

If Laine was willing to take a reasonable one-year deal it might be worth a roll of the dice ... not not certain he would ... not certain he fits well or is worth the type of contract he will likely get elsewhere (even if he doesn't get what he wants).

 

[tomh009]

2 hours ago, Commandant said:

Prediction: Habs are gonna go 4 and 4 with protection, protecting the big 4 on D

 

Caufield and Suzuki are exempt.

The four forwards are Anderson, Gallagher, Toffoli and Kotkaniemi.

 

No need to protect Drouin, Lehkonen, Byron, or any of the UFAs. Evans is a fourth liner, if they want him, oh well... we can replace that, but they probably take Jake Allen over him anyways, and I'd rather protect the D over Evans.

Do you mean no need, as in Seattle wouldn't be interested in picking Lehkonen or Danault, for example? Or that Bergevin wouldn't care if we lost them?

[tomh009]

6 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

I would look to re-sign Perry ... but fear the the Leafs might offer enough more than Habs should offer to entice Corey to the Laffs ... if MB can get the cap under control so the Habs can carry a full 22/23 man roster (i.e., at least one a spare forward and one spare defenceman) then IMO Perry would become even more valuable as "game management" would allow him to stay fresh ... this past season that generally would have required putting him on waivers and possibly/likely losing him.

Perry has already made almost $90M so far, so the question will be whether he is motivated by money at this point in his career. When he was put on waivers this season, his agent made it clear to other teams that he wanted to continue with the Habs, not anyone else.

[Commandant]

9 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

Do you mean no need, as in Seattle wouldn't be interested in picking Lehkonen or Danault, for example? Or that Bergevin wouldn't care if we lost them?

 

Danault will be a UFA, if he signs with Seattle, he would have signed with them (or someone else) on Free Agency Day anyways, so meh.  If he's gonna re-sign with us, he can be re-signed after the draft.

 

With Lehkonen, he's a bottom 6 checking winger, something that if lost is much easier to replace than a top 4 defenceman.  If we have to replace a player in this free agent class, I'd much rather it be a bottom-six checking player like Lehkonen or Evans than to try and find a top 4 defenceman.  Rarity of supply in the free agent market, convincing them to play in Quebec with the taxes when other teams will be out there, and the flat cap is already hurting their salary means that top 4 D will be hard to replace.  

[alfredoh2009]

47 minutes ago, Commandant said:

Seattle is definitely taking Weber if left unprotected and making him the first captain of the team.

 

They are trying to trade for Duncan Keith to do the same thing.

Then that makes it easier to do. Weber has been a great captain, but the injuries and how his play style needs him to take time off to heal and rest, makes him a prime target to be left open

Petry, Edmundson and Chiarot can take top minutes. A Dougie Hamilton would be a good upgrade on Weber for the team needs

 

Suzuki would be a great captain

 

Kotkaniemi has not shown he is better than 3rdline center, so resign Danault and both Lehkonen and Armia. 
Drouin can be LTIR for the season to clear cap space. 
 

This gives:

Anderson-Suzuki-Caufield

Toffoli-Danault-Gallagher

Armia-Kotkaniemi-Lehkonen(Ylonen)

Vejdemo-Evans-Byron

[*]Drouin-KK-Armia[*if Drouin plays]
 

Edmundson-Petry

Chiarot-Hamilton

Romanov-Kulak(Fleury)

Price

Allen

 

[Habsfan89]

Weber isn't going anywhere. The guy that would be left unprotected would be Byron  with maybe a side deal in place for Seattle to take him. 

[Commandant]

9 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Then that makes it easier to do. Weber has been a great captain, but the injuries and how his play style needs him to take time off to heal and rest, makes him a prime target to be left open

Petry, Edmundson and Chiarot can take top minutes. A Dougie Hamilton would be a good upgrade on Weber for the team needs

 

Suzuki would be a great captain

 

Kotkaniemi has not shown he is better than 3rdline center, so resign Danault and both Lehkonen and Armia. 
Drouin can be LTIR for the season to clear cap space. 
 

This gives:

Anderson-Suzuki-Caufield

Toffoli-Danault-Gallagher

Armia-Kotkaniemi-Lehkonen(Ylonen)

Vejdemo-Evans-Byron

[*]Drouin-KK-Armia[*if Drouin plays]
 

Edmundson-Petry

Chiarot-Hamilton

Romanov-Kulak(Fleury)

Price

Allen

 

 

If you sign Hamilton, great. But Its a huge assumption that we will be able to sign Hamilton.

 

He's already not getting the deal he would have gotten pre-pandemic due to the flat cap. He's already lost money on this contract. Now you are asking him to play in a high-tax environment on this contract?  Why is he signing with us if he has rumoured offers on the table from Carolina, Chicago, and presumably other teams as well? 

 

If Weber leaves and he chooses to go elsewhere, you are left without a top 4 defenceman.  Its a hell of a role of the dice. 

[alfredoh2009]

38 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

If you sign Hamilton, great. But Its a huge assumption that we will be able to sign Hamilton.

 

He's already not getting the deal he would have gotten pre-pandemic due to the flat cap. He's already lost money on this contract. Now you are asking him to play in a high-tax environment on this contract?  Why is he signing with us if he has rumoured offers on the table from Carolina, Chicago, and presumably other teams as well? 

 

If Weber leaves and he chooses to go elsewhere, you are left without a top 4 defenceman.  Its a hell of a role of the dice. 

I may be remembering it wrong g but it seems that you argued:
That we should t trade Tatar because he was our best scorer

Then we should not sign Edmundson because he was just a shut down defenseman

Now Weber must be protected because we may not have a replacement 

 

How are the Habs suppose to build a cup contender if we fall in love without our “past best before date” players

 

Many have complained in how Weber is declining fast.

Hamilton may not sign here, but also Weber may not be picked by Seattle . Percentage of either happening? In the 40% to 60% range

 

Hamilton is the only UFA that is interesting

And here are ten RFAs that met be targeted with an offer sheet or traded for:

Makar,  Quinn Hughes, Pionk,  Heiskanen,  Rasmus Dahlin, Dunn, Hronek,  Gustav Forsling,  Christian Djoos, Dante Fabbro,

Djoos

 

so, yes, I stand by what I said

 

( and sorry if I think you were reluctant on those changes before and I am wrong)

[Commandant]

I said we shouldn't trade Tatar at the deadline because a couple extra draft picks when we already have more picks than we can sign, is not going to make a difference, and there is a possibility he might be needed for depth in the playoffs. 

 

Edmundson i didn't like the signing.  Its one year later. He's played better than I could have hoped. I'm willing to change my opinions given further evidence and admit that one year ago when Bergevin traded for and signed Edmundson, he was correct and I was wrong.   I'm not perfect and fully willing to admit that some of my opinions have been proven wrong and some of the ones I have today will be proven wrong in the future. 

 

I'd love to replace Weber with someone younger.  That said, I think he has trade value and I wouldn't willingly give him up for free in an expansion draft in order to protect Lehknonen who I think has less trade value.  I also think that if he's gone, he needs replacing, and there is no guarantee that any free agent signs with us.  The canes are allowing Hamilton to talk to teams right now, so if he's willing to sign, then sure, but you don't bank on that. 

Also most of those RFAs, their teams will match.  Again like Sebastian Aho, there is no guarantee of getting them.   Also remember that in any offer sheet, you are giving up 2022 draft picks, not 2021 (as the offer sheets come after the draft).  That means we will be going into a tough division and no guarantee of making the playoffs, and the first round pick you are giving up... it could be Shane Wright (who is a prospect on close to a McDavid level) or Matthew Savoie or Brad Lambert (two more superstars available in 2022).  That draft has the best top 3 i can remember.... and if we push to 2023 we are looking at Connor Bedard (who is even better than Wright) and Matei Michikov (a Russian who is breaking Ovechkin's records in his age group).  So those aren't the drafts i want to be throwing around my first rounder in.

 

Yes the team needs to grow, but if you lose Weber without a replacement, you aren't growing, you are taking steps backwards. 

 

 

[hab29RETIRED]

1 hour ago, Commandant said:

I said we shouldn't trade Tatar at the deadline because a couple extra draft picks when we already have more picks than we can sign, is not going to make a difference, and there is a possibility he might be needed for depth in the playoffs. 

 

Edmundson i didn't like the signing.  Its one year later. He's played better than I could have hoped. I'm willing to change my opinions given further evidence and admit that one year ago when Bergevin traded for and signed Edmundson, he was correct and I was wrong.   I'm not perfect and fully willing to admit that some of my opinions have been proven wrong and some of the ones I have today will be proven wrong in the future. 

 

I'd love to replace Weber with someone younger.  That said, I think he has trade value and I wouldn't willingly give him up for free in an expansion draft in order to protect Lehknonen who I think has less trade value.  I also think that if he's gone, he needs replacing, and there is no guarantee that any free agent signs with us.  The canes are allowing Hamilton to talk to teams right now, so if he's willing to sign, then sure, but you don't bank on that. 

Also most of those RFAs, their teams will match.  Again like Sebastian Aho, there is no guarantee of getting them.   Also remember that in any offer sheet, you are giving up 2022 draft picks, not 2021 (as the offer sheets come after the draft).  That means we will be going into a tough division and no guarantee of making the playoffs, and the first round pick you are giving up... it could be Shane Wright (who is a prospect on close to a McDavid level) or Matthew Savoie or Brad Lambert (two more superstars available in 2022).  That draft has the best top 3 i can remember.... and if we push to 2023 we are looking at Connor Bedard (who is even better than Wright) and Matei Michikov (a Russian who is breaking Ovechkin's records in his age group).  So those aren't the drafts i want to be throwing around my first rounder in.

 

Yes the team needs to grow, but if you lose Weber without a replacement, you aren't growing, you are taking steps backwards. 

 

 

If we think we are even close to having a lottery pick - in a new system where less teams are in the lottery for the top picks, we may as well trade Weber and Price, rather than waste two more years while they are useful. We NEED a significant upgrade on D. That means we need to cut salary. If Weber has value, move hime before the draft. If he doesn’t expose him. 
I have zero issue giving up 4 top picks fir Makar. Aho was matched, because the offer was too low. Make it difficult for the Avs to match.

[alfredoh2009]

1 hour ago, Commandant said:

Also most of those RFAs, their teams will match.  Again like Sebastian Aho, there is no guarantee of getting them.   Also remember that in any offer sheet, you are giving up 2022 draft picks, not 2021 (as the offer sheets come after the draft).  raround my first rounder in.

 

I didn’t know it was 2022. I’ll have to rethink my arguments

 

Thanks for sharing that. 

[GHT120]

4 hours ago, Commandant said:

If you sign Hamilton, great. But Its a huge assumption that we will be able to sign Hamilton.

 

He's already not getting the deal he would have gotten pre-pandemic due to the flat cap. He's already lost money on this contract. Now you are asking him to play in a high-tax environment on this contract?  Why is he signing with us if he has rumoured offers on the table from Carolina, Chicago, and presumably other teams as well? 

 

If Weber leaves and he chooses to go elsewhere, you are left without a top 4 defenceman.  Its a hell of a role of the dice. 

 

While I doubt that Hamilton would sign with Habs, one unusual twist to his situation is that back in mid-June Carolina gave him permission to talk to other teams ... so any interested teams should already have some idea whether they have a chance to sign him ... or make a sign&trade deal with Carolina. 

[Prime Minister Koivu]

We should sincerely consider doing this. 
 

 

This is fake of course 

[Prime Minister Koivu]

I’m really surprised by the Weber poll. 60% of us believe he should be exposed to the Kraken and I thought that number would be much lower. 
 

Could Bergevin sell that move to the players or would they be pissed? 
 

I think the players would understand the realities of the cap system. They wouldn’t like it but they would accept it. 
 

 

[alfredoh2009]

1 hour ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

I’m really surprised by the Weber poll. 60% of us believe he should be exposed to the Kraken and I thought that number would be much lower. 
 

Could Bergevin sell that move to the players or would they be pissed? 
 

I think the players would understand the realities of the cap system. They wouldn’t like it but they would accept it. 
 

 

It makes the most sense from the asset management point of view.

 

He is not getting traded, or unsigned. It’s hockey business