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2021/2022 Lineup Ideas


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3 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

This is getting ridiculous. The kid is a top prospect - that’s agreed upon by everyone in hockey -  and in fact the ONLY grade-A prospect in the organization. He was brought in straight from university hockey and parachuted into the playoffs, with zero time to marinade in the AHL. When we did that, I was quite skeptical, predicting that he would start strong and then tail off. Kids need to learn how to be pros, how to walk before they can run. CC had a stronger playoff than I expected and was a pleasant surprise.

 

Obviously, the kid couldn’t be sent down after that. But guess what? He tapered off, starting the season with 1 point in 10 games after having become gradually less noticeable during the playoffs. At that point, the team reverted to what it ideally would have done all along, i.e., have CC put in some development time in the AHL.

 

And for this, fans are now anointing him the new Gilbert Dionne or Paul DiPietro, another Habs developmental failure, at age 20.

 

Worse, some of the same fans who retroactively denounce the Habs for bringing up KK, Galy, Mete, and other prospects “too soon,” are now playing Chicken Little because we sent down Caufield. You can’t have it both ways, guys.

 

I have no problem at all with Caufield learning to dominate night-in and night-out in the AHL. This guy has never played more than 36 games in a single season and we expect him to be a first-line all-star NHL winger over 82 games and (in theory) playoffs? I think he has the potential to be something special, but throwing him to the NHL wolves is NOT the way to get him there.

 

:clap:

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4 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

This is getting ridiculous. The kid is a top prospect - that’s agreed upon by everyone in hockey -  and in fact the ONLY grade-A prospect in the organization. He was brought in straight from university hockey and parachuted into the playoffs, with zero time to marinade in the AHL. When we did that, I was quite skeptical, predicting that he would start strong and then tail off. Kids need to learn how to be pros, how to walk before they can run. CC had a stronger playoff than I expected and was a pleasant surprise.

 

Obviously, the kid couldn’t be sent down after that. But guess what? He tapered off, starting the season with 1 point in 10 games after having become gradually less noticeable during the playoffs. At that point, the team reverted to what it ideally would have done all along, i.e., have CC put in some development time in the AHL.

 

And for this, fans are now anointing him the new Gilbert Dionne or Paul DiPietro, another Habs developmental failure, at age 20.

 

Worse, some of the same fans who retroactively denounce the Habs for bringing up KK, Galy, Mete, and other prospects “too soon,” are now playing Chicken Little because we sent down Caufield. You can’t have it both ways, guys.

 

I have no problem at all with Caufield learning to dominate night-in and night-out in the AHL. This guy has never played more than 36 games in a single season and we expect him to be a first-line all-star NHL winger over 82 games and (in theory) playoffs? I think he has the potential to be something special, but throwing him to the NHL wolves is NOT the way to get him there.

 

 

Not ridiculous at all.  I hope Caufield is the superstar we all want him to be, but as of right now - the comparisons are correct.  What he did outside the NHL doesn't matter at this point.  Just like it doesn't matter for Galchenyuk or Yakupov, etc.

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5 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

This is getting ridiculous. The kid is a top prospect - that’s agreed upon by everyone in hockey -  and in fact the ONLY grade-A prospect in the organization. He was brought in straight from university hockey and parachuted into the playoffs, with zero time to marinade in the AHL. When we did that, I was quite skeptical, predicting that he would start strong and then tail off. Kids need to learn how to be pros, how to walk before they can run. CC had a stronger playoff than I expected and was a pleasant surprise.

 

Obviously, the kid couldn’t be sent down after that. But guess what? He tapered off, starting the season with 1 point in 10 games after having become gradually less noticeable during the playoffs. At that point, the team reverted to what it ideally would have done all along, i.e., have CC put in some development time in the AHL.

 

And for this, fans are now anointing him the new Gilbert Dionne or Paul DiPietro, another Habs developmental failure, at age 20.

 

Worse, some of the same fans who retroactively denounce the Habs for bringing up KK, Galy, Mete, and other prospects “too soon,” are now playing Chicken Little because we sent down Caufield. You can’t have it both ways, guys.

 

I have no problem at all with Caufield learning to dominate night-in and night-out in the AHL. This guy has never played more than 36 games in a single season and we expect him to be a first-line all-star NHL winger over 82 games and (in theory) playoffs? I think he has the potential to be something special, but throwing him to the NHL wolves is NOT the way to get him there.

 

 

Totally agree. It’s not like he is the missing piece to make the playoffs this year. Let him dominate in the AHL - especially when he’s being used in a 3rd line role in the NHL.

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6 hours ago, DON said:

dlbalr, Is this simply required before he can go back to Sweden or prep for actual NHL play? 

 

 

They don't have to go this route - he can go straight from SOIR to regular demotion but that would've sent him back to Sweden.  This allows him to get a few games in Laval and give the Habs some time to evaluate whether he's worth a look or if it's time to send him home.  All this does is buy them a bit more time to decide.

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a

Friday, November 5
Practice
LW C RW
68 - Mike Hoffman 92 - Jonathan Drouin 17 - Josh Anderson
62 - Artturi Lehkonen 28 - Christian Dvorak 40 - Joel Armia
73 - Tyler Toffoli 24 - Adam Brooks 55 - Michael Pezzetta
60 - Alex Belzile 13 - Cedric Paquette 71 - Jake Evans
LD RD G
8 - Ben Chiarot 26 - Jeff Petry 34 - Jake Allen
77 - Brett Kulak 58 - David Savard 35 - Sam Montembeault
27 - Alexander Romanov 20 - Chris Wideman Karel St-Laurent
15 - Sami Niku    

Forwards Brendan Gallagher and Nick Suzuki didn't participate in the on-ice session.

They were both given a therapy day.

 

 

Assume Brooks and Pezzetta filling in for the therapy guys

 

 

 

 
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On 11/4/2021 at 2:12 PM, titanfan said:

Not ridiculous at all.  I hope Caufield is the superstar we all want him to be, but as of right now - the comparisons are correct.  What he did outside the NHL doesn't matter at this point.  Just like it doesn't matter for Galchenyuk or Yakupov, etc.


lol OK.... 

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On 11/1/2021 at 2:13 PM, titanfan said:

Paul Dipietro or Gilbert Dione anyone?

 

One thing I can tell you for sure. If Montreal put Caufield up on the trade market, he would get more back in a trade than Dipietro or Gilbert Dionne ever would have got.  The kid will be a bona fide NHL sniper, he is still young. 

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11 hours ago, DON said:

https://www.nhl.com/canadiens/news/carey-price-will-rejoin-the-canadiens-on-monday/c-327615494

 

Wonder when how soon start a game for Habs?

Couple weeks?

(i assume he was 100% recovered from surgery?)

Habs haven't even seen Price in a month ... no idea what kind of physical condition he is ... let alone the state of his recuperation from knee surgery ... or his general state of mind ... Monday is the "get-to-know-you-again" day for Price and Graham Rynbend (Head Athletic Therapist) and Donald Balmforth (Head Physiotherapist), maybe even Dr. David Scott (Consultant, Sports Psychology) ... I expect two weeks would be the absolute minimum ... and that if Price's knee and physical conditioning are 100%.

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10 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

One thing I can tell you for sure. If Montreal put Caufield up on the trade market, he would get more back in a trade than Dipietro or Gilbert Dionne ever would have got.  The kid will be a bona fide NHL sniper, he is still young. 

 

Think the comparisons being made throughout this thread must be taken in context ... my understanding is they are comparing CC's actual on-ice performance/production this season to past habs ... not suggesting that CC is not more talented or will not eventually/soon likely be more productive than they ever were.

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28 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

 

Think the comparisons being made throughout this thread must be taken in context ... my understanding is they are comparing CC's actual on-ice performance/production this season to past habs ... not suggesting that CC is not more talented or will not eventually/soon likely be more productive than they ever were.

 

But what is the point of making such comparisons, if not to imply that Caufield will have a career similar to those guys? Otherwise, it’s just a completely random comparison with no purpose at all. You might as well make a post pointing out that Max Pacioretty had 6 goals in his first 82 games, and that Jake Evans has 6 goals in 68 games. Well…OK then. That’s true, but what does it tell us? That Evans is bound to become a better goal-scorer than Pacioretty? No? Then what IS the point? There is none. 

 

The career of Gilbert Dionne is completely irrelevant to the career of Cole Caufield.

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1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

But what is the point of making such comparisons, if not to imply that Caufield will have a career similar to those guys? Otherwise, it’s just a completely random comparison with no purpose at all. You might as well make a post pointing out that Max Pacioretty had 6 goals in his first 82 games, and that Jake Evans has 6 goals in 68 games. Well…OK then. That’s true, but what does it tell us? That Evans is bound to become a better goal-scorer than Pacioretty? No? Then what IS the point? There is none. 

 

The career of Gilbert Dionne is completely irrelevant to the career of Cole Caufield.

I don't agree with the comparisons (BTW) but I think the point was to suggest that, based on this season, sending CC to Laval was not such an atrocious or ridiculous decision at this time.

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1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

But what is the point of making such comparisons, if not to imply that Caufield will have a career similar to those guys? Otherwise, it’s just a completely random comparison with no purpose at all. You might as well make a post pointing out that Max Pacioretty had 6 goals in his first 82 games, and that Jake Evans has 6 goals in 68 games. Well…OK then. That’s true, but what does it tell us? That Evans is bound to become a better goal-scorer than Pacioretty? No? Then what IS the point? There is none. 

 

The career of Gilbert Dionne is completely irrelevant to the career of Cole Caufield.

 

Agreed. 

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1 minute ago, GHT120 said:

I don't agree with the comparisons (BTW) but I think the point was to suggest that, based on this season, sending CC to Laval was not such an atrocious or ridiculous decision at this time.

 

I don't think that was the point they were trying to make but only they can confirm that.   I don't think anybody (or hardly anybody)  thinks sending Cole to the minors is a bad idea.  He is young, lost a bit of confidence, not a bad thing to send him down for a while. 

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the 3W-10L Habs are projecting to have a lottery pick next draft. Here is my lineup once Edmundson gets back:

1. Leave Caufield  in Laval until at least until until the Olympic break (Feb 23)

2. Leave Poehling in Laval at least until the Olympic break (Feb 23)

3. Make room for Edmundson on the roster by demoting Belzile

 

Hoffman-Suzuki-Toffoli

Anderson-Dvorak-Gallagher

Perreault/Drouin-Armia

Pezzetta-Evans-Lehkonen

Paquette

 

Chiarot-Petry

Edmundson-Savard

Rotate: Romanov, Kulak, Niku, Wideman

 

When Byron returns, wive (or trade) Brooks, unless he earns an NHL spot.

When Price returns, make a trade with FLA to bring back Montembeault on an AHL contract like Dlbalr sugested.

At the trade deadline, which seems really late (March 21), unload UFAs/RFAs for whatever draft picks we can get: Paquette, Lehkonen, Brooks, Kulak, Wideman,

 

Resign: Chiarot, Niku, Pezzetta (if he continues to play well until then)

 

why this lineup?

Dvorak seems to play better with "crash the net" type of players than with finesse players. Plus, Anderson and Gallagher are defensively responsible.

Perrault and Drouin can share the load of centering the 3rd line. If beast-mode Armia shows up, that line will produce. These forward lines give time to Caufield and Poehling to develop in Laval

 

On defense, Niku seems to be a better long-term option than Wideman. Romanov could be sent to Laval if he is not playing enough with Montreal. Kulak and Wideman become trade chips if Niku and Romanov solidify their play.

 

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I predict the Habs will get the #3 overall pick. They will draft a C. Everyone will go cowabunga with optimism and dream of a future where that pivot is a cornerstone. The Habs will bring that pick up at age 19 after he has a nice training camp. When he has so-so results everyone will say “wait five years.” Then his development will flatline. Five years later the pick will be gone. 

 

As is tradition.

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1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

I predict the Habs will get the #3 overall pick. They will draft a C. Everyone will go cowabunga with optimism and dream of a future where that pivot is a cornerstone. The Habs will bring that pick up at age 19 after he has a nice training camp. When he has so-so results everyone will say “wait five years.” Then his development will flatline. Five years later the pick will be gone. 

 

As is tradition.

Or they will finish 9th or 10th, pick a stud dman like Sergechev, or McDonough (ok, so he was the 12th pick), and give them a ay trying to increase the French content, or get the elusive centre.

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10 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

the 3W-10L Habs are projecting to have a lottery pick next draft. Here is my lineup once Edmundson gets back:

1. Leave Caufield  in Laval until at least until until the Olympic break (Feb 23)

2. Leave Poehling in Laval at least until the Olympic break (Feb 23)

3. Make room for Edmundson on the roster by demoting Belzile

 

Hoffman-Suzuki-Toffoli

Anderson-Dvorak-Gallagher

Perreault/Drouin-Armia

Pezzetta-Evans-Lehkonen

Paquette

 

Chiarot-Petry

Edmundson-Savard

Rotate: Romanov, Kulak, Niku, Wideman

 

When Byron returns, wive (or trade) Brooks, unless he earns an NHL spot.

When Price returns, make a trade with FLA to bring back Montembeault on an AHL contract like Dlbalr sugested.

At the trade deadline, which seems really late (March 21), unload UFAs/RFAs for whatever draft picks we can get: Paquette, Lehkonen, Brooks, Kulak, Wideman,

 

Resign: Chiarot, Niku, Pezzetta (if he continues to play well until then)

 

why this lineup?

Dvorak seems to play better with "crash the net" type of players than with finesse players. Plus, Anderson and Gallagher are defensively responsible.

Perrault and Drouin can share the load of centering the 3rd line. If beast-mode Armia shows up, that line will produce. These forward lines give time to Caufield and Poehling to develop in Laval

 

On defense, Niku seems to be a better long-term option than Wideman. Romanov could be sent to Laval if he is not playing enough with Montreal. Kulak and Wideman become trade chips if Niku and Romanov solidify their play.

 

 

1 & 2 ... I agree ... but don't see any reason to keep 8 defencemen ... depending on how Romanov plays between now and Edmundson's return, he may need some time in Laval ... both to get tons of icetime and to get away from this mess ... if he earns staying I would want him to get regular icetime (no less than 4 of 5 games) so Kulak, Niku and Wideman "competing" for two spots (in my mind) ... also open to trading any of them.

 

I agree about taking a good long look at Drouin at centre ... does his "new mindset" allow him to better handle to position, especially since he should no longer be carrying the onerous fan/media expectations that came with his first time at centre.

As for the re-signings ... I agree on Pezzetta ... he is a "bleed bleu-blanc-rouge" type who will be on a deal that can be buried even if he were to get a one-way contract (its just molson's money, so "why not - LOL) ... Niku will depend on how he does the rest of this season, and to some degree how Norlinder looks if he gets a few NHL games and the rest of the season in the SHL and how ready Guhle, Harris and Struble look ... Chiarot is a one-year option for me, if needed, but no more.

 

Byron is an issue ... he will need games to show everyone what he can do ... it may (would be) difficult to move him ... but either this season or in the summer I would prefer this $3.4M 4th liner to move on (likely retaining salary), unless another top 9 winger(s) are moved and he is a "band-aid" for next season.

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I prefer to be more optimistic. They will draft a centre at #3 and he and Suzuki will form a great 1-2 punch for the next 10 years. Plus they will get some extra picks from teams who are under pressure to win this year (ie. Toronto, Colorado, Edmonton etc) and add some more good prospects. 

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9 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

to keep them without having to waive them and risking loosing them for nothing

Obviously try to trade someone first ... but not certain that rotating the bottom 4 defencemen does much for Romanov's development, Niku's "resurrection" (if he is to have any long-term value), or Kulak's trade value (what I expect to end up happening) ... to me Wideman is a journeyman 7/8 defenceman.

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23 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

Obviously try to trade someone first ... but not certain that rotating the bottom 4 defencemen does much for Romanov's development, Niku's "resurrection" (if he is to have any long-term value), or Kulak's trade value (what I expect to end up happening) ... to me Wideman is a journeyman 7/8 defenceman.

Indeed. I would rather send Romanov to AHL where he can play a big role this year, and sit Savard once Edmundson is back. Let's play Petry, Edmundson, Chiarot, Kulak, Niku and Wideman, pairing them for balance. If the season is going to be a writeoff, let's use it to figure out what Kulak, Niku and Wideman can really do. If they end up costing us some games, does it really matter?

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1 hour ago, GHT120 said:

 

1 & 2 ... I agree ... but don't see any reason to keep 8 defencemen ... depending on how Romanov plays between now and Edmundson's return, he may need some time in Laval ... both to get tons of icetime and to get away from this mess ... if he earns staying I would want him to get regular icetime (no less than 4 of 5 games) so Kulak, Niku and Wideman "competing" for two spots (in my mind) ... also open to trading any of them.

 

I agree about taking a good long look at Drouin at centre ... does his "new mindset" allow him to better handle to position, especially since he should no longer be carrying the onerous fan/media expectations that came with his first time at centre.

As for the re-signings ... I agree on Pezzetta ... he is a "bleed bleu-blanc-rouge" type who will be on a deal that can be buried even if he were to get a one-way contract (its just molson's money, so "why not - LOL) ... Niku will depend on how he does the rest of this season, and to some degree how Norlinder looks if he gets a few NHL games and the rest of the season in the SHL and how ready Guhle, Harris and Struble look ... Chiarot is a one-year option for me, if needed, but no more.

 

Byron is an issue ... he will need games to show everyone what he can do ... it may (would be) difficult to move him ... but either this season or in the summer I would prefer this $3.4M 4th liner to move on (likely retaining salary), unless another top 9 winger(s) are moved and he is a "band-aid" for next season.

Chiarot should be a deadline sell off, and we should see if we can move Byron for picks if we retain 50%. We are gong to suck fir at least two years. May as well stock up on picks and prospects.

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