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Oct. 23, Red Wings vs Habs, 7 PM


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Happy for the win, nice for the crowd to get to cheer and obv nice for the players to break the funk… but, they did not play well. Both teams were turnover machines, the Habs would have lost that gas me to most teams.

They still rarely made more than one good pass in a row, barely made some entries and defensive coverage was mediocre. 
The team did seem due for some good luck so that is great but they did not play well enough to win most games.

On back end Petry continues to fight the puck and make questionable decisions/poor passes.

Chiarot played best game of season for himself so far, made some decent break out passes.

Romanov continues to look lost, often out of position. Savard was mediocre at best.

Kulak and Nicky did not loom as scary as suspected and Niku at least showed some skills with the puck and made better passes than we are used to, Kulak made a couple smart rushes and didn’t look too out of place.  
Seems to me last night the d did better at getting puck to forwards but only half the passes were successful (either due to poor pass or forward bungling it) but the consistent problem is poor passes/decision amongst the forwards going through neutral

zone and entering offensive zone, terrible puck management and decision making. The dump and chase comes from these issues and it rarely generates offensive possession just contested pucks. 
Happy for the win but it was still and ugly game and hard to watch.

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12 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

... I loved Perreault’s game, when healthy, he is a solid 3C ...

 

12 hours ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

I fully agree that Perreault could be an real high value pickup - considering the $950K he gets paid ... his career high for goals is 18 ... His career high for assists is 32, and he's done that twice too in 71 & 65 games.   He should be able to get 40 pts with the Habs and he might be able to hit his career high of 45 pts again, possibly surpass that by 5 and get 50 pts.      

 When healthy I agree that Perreault has the skillset to be a good 3C ... but those career highs were 7 (goals) and 5 (assists) years ago ... I am not certain his 33 yr-old back can sustain regular 3C duty ... only time will tell ... fingers crossed.

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5 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

 

 When healthy I agree that Perreault has the skillset to be a good 3C ... but those career highs were 7 (goals) and 5 (assists) years ago ... I am not certain his 33 yr-old back can sustain regular 3C duty ... only time will tell ... fingers crossed.

Or we can go with an unproven AHL centre .... which is not really an option

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4 hours ago, hockeyrealist said:

Happy for the win, nice for the crowd to get to cheer and obv nice for the players to break the funk… but, they did not play well. Both teams were turnover machines, the Habs would have lost that gas me to most teams.

They still rarely made more than one good pass in a row, barely made some entries and defensive coverage was mediocre. 
The team did seem due for some good luck so that is great but they did not play well enough to win most games.

On back end Petry continues to fight the puck and make questionable decisions/poor passes.

Chiarot played best game of season for himself so far, made some decent break out passes.

Romanov continues to look lost, often out of position. Savard was mediocre at best.

Kulak and Nicky did not loom as scary as suspected and Niku at least showed some skills with the puck and made better passes than we are used to, Kulak made a couple smart rushes and didn’t look too out of place.  
Seems to me last night the d did better at getting puck to forwards but only half the passes were successful (either due to poor pass or forward bungling it) but the consistent problem is poor passes/decision amongst the forwards going through neutral

zone and entering offensive zone, terrible puck management and decision making. The dump and chase comes from these issues and it rarely generates offensive possession just contested pucks. 
Happy for the win but it was still and ugly game and hard to watch.

Really? You found a 6-1 victory (to end a 5 game losing streak where they scored 4 goals in 5 games) hard to watch? Are you really a fan of the Canadiens?

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12 hours ago, tomh009 said:

PK suffered from Evans' FO losses; he will need to be working on those.

 

Otherwise the PK personnel are not so much different from last year, Danault is missing, but the combination of Evans, Lehkonen, Armia and Toffoli should be capable. Need to win faceoffs and then work on improving the PK overall. The personnel should be good enough to get the job done.

Let's remember that the Habs were 23rd in the league in PK last season (78.5%) ... they were absolutely SUPERB in the playoffs (91.8%), when Chiarot, Edmundson and Weber were allowed to manhandle opposing forwards ... but we are not only back to regular season rules, but at least temporarily stricter enforcement of cross-checking ... and ... not only is Danault missing, but Weber was the top TOI Hab on the PK last year (both regular season and playoffs) ... some fine-tuning to optimize the PK for the current lineup and rules environment is likely in order.

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3 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Or we can go with an unproven AHL centre .... which is not really an option

Agreed, unless Evans breaks out over the next 10-15 games ... if Perreault can't physically handle full-time 3C duty then it is time to hit the trade market.

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4 hours ago, hockeyrealist said:

Happy for the win, nice for the crowd to get to cheer and obv nice for the players to break the funk… but, they did not play well. Both teams were turnover machines, the Habs would have lost that gas me to most teams.

They still rarely made more than one good pass in a row, barely made some entries and defensive coverage was mediocre. 
The team did seem due for some good luck so that is great but they did not play well enough to win most games.

On back end Petry continues to fight the puck and make questionable decisions/poor passes.

Chiarot played best game of season for himself so far, made some decent break out passes.

Romanov continues to look lost, often out of position. Savard was mediocre at best.

Kulak and Nicky did not loom as scary as suspected and Niku at least showed some skills with the puck and made better passes than we are used to, Kulak made a couple smart rushes and didn’t look too out of place.  
Seems to me last night the d did better at getting puck to forwards but only half the passes were successful (either due to poor pass or forward bungling it) but the consistent problem is poor passes/decision amongst the forwards going through neutral

zone and entering offensive zone, terrible puck management and decision making. The dump and chase comes from these issues and it rarely generates offensive possession just contested pucks. 
Happy for the win but it was still and ugly game and hard to watch.

 

My sad streak of not being able to watch the Habs except in snatches this season continued last night, for various reasons. But it is interesting to read a critical assessment in the midst of the general hosannas of relief that the team finally broke out.

 

It is very encouraging that Niku played well. If only he and/or Kulak could round into good, reliable guys who can be trusted to take a regular shift, it would make a huge difference to the D. Also encouraging that Perrault made a case for himself as #3C (though skepticism is warranted), and that Dvorak and Hoffman scored, while Toffoli and CC each got a point and Drouin continued his strong start. This team is built to live and die by its depth up front. We can’t be carrying a pack of slumping forwards.

 

At the same time, it’s quite discouraging that Romanov and Evans are not, from all reports, having good seasons. Romanov in particular was supposed to be a future top-pairing guy - remember? I have seen absolutely zero signs of that potential at the NHL level. As for Evans, anything a 7th round pick gives us is gravy, but we *were* kinda counting on him to be a top-9 guy with KK gone. Sigh. Their struggles, along with Poehling’s failure to crack the lineup, exemplify why I always caution against expecting huge things out of young players.

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I sort of agree with hockeyrealist.  This was a sloppy game overall. Very happy they stepped up and won, but they don't seem to have any cohesion on the ice. Take the win and build some confidence.  Hopefully a better played next game with the same result.

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36 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

Agreed, unless Evans breaks out over the next 10-15 games ... if Perreault can't physically handle full-time 3C duty then it is time to hit the trade market.

not this year, Brooks and Poehling can be used to spot a game here and there to give Perreault a break

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27 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

[...]

At the same time, it’s quite discouraging that Romanov and Evans are not, from all reports, having good seasons. Romanov in particular was supposed to be a future top-pairing guy - remember? I have seen absolutely zero signs of that potential at the NHL level. As for Evans, anything a 7th round pick gives us is gravy, but we *were* kinda counting on him to be a top-9 guy with KK gone. Sigh. Their struggles, along with Poehling’s failure to crack the lineup, exemplify why I always caution against expecting huge things out of young players.

 

no, Timmins and other Habs management said he was like Emelin but with more scoring potential. He was not drafted to be a top pairing D.

 

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15 minutes ago, BCHabnut said:

I sort of agree with hockeyrealist.  This was a sloppy game overall. Very happy they stepped up and won, but they don't seem to have any cohesion on the ice. Take the win and build some confidence.  Hopefully a better played next game with the same result.

Sloppy? Maybe. Hard to watch? Nope. 
Also, six games is a tiny sample size. Last season they looked great early and faded. Let’s hope that this year is the opposite. Alternatively, if they are going to be bad, I hope that they are really bad. Playoffs or pain for Shane and no mushy middle, please. 

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9 minutes ago, PMAC said:

Sloppy? Maybe. Hard to watch? Nope. 
Also, six games is a tiny sample size. Last season they looked great early and faded. Let’s hope that this year is the opposite. Alternatively, if they are going to be bad, I hope that they are really bad. Playoffs or pain for Shane and no mushy middle, please. 

 

Having pegged this group as a bubble team at the outset, I believe that the mushy middle is the best to be hoped for.

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7 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Having pegged this group as a bubble team at the outset, I believe that the mushy middle is the best to be hoped for.

Bubble is fine...as long as they are on the playoff side. If they make the playoffs, I will be happy. If they miss the playoffs and get a lottery pick I will be consoled. If they just miss the playoffs and give a decent pick to Arizona, I will be pissed. 

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1 hour ago, PMAC said:

Bubble is fine...as long as they are on the playoff side. If they make the playoffs, I will be happy. If they miss the playoffs and get a lottery pick I will be consoled. If they just miss the playoffs and give a decent pick to Arizona, I will be pissed. 

 

That's about exactly how I feel. No just missing the playoffs. 

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17 hours ago, PMAC said:

Bubble is fine...as long as they are on the playoff side. If they make the playoffs, I will be happy. If they miss the playoffs and get a lottery pick I will be consoled. If they just miss the playoffs and give a decent pick to Arizona, I will be pissed. 

 

15 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

That's about exactly how I feel. No just missing the playoffs. 

 

But come the deadline, or in the couple of weeks leading up to it, if still in a bubble position a crucial decision will have to be made ... buy to improve playoff chances ... sell to add picks and "Pain for Shane" ... or ... stick their head in the sand and cross their fingers that they don't end up giving Arizona the 11th pick.

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Unfortunately, we happen to be in the toughest division with a clear cut top-4 that it's hard to see the Habs cracking.  That leaves us with the wildcard, and unfortunately the Metro might be the deepest division in the league, so there's a lot of competition for the final wildcard spot.  I am (big surprise) pessimistic about our chances.  I also don't think we'll be in the running for 1st overall with the likes of Detroit, Arizona, Anaheim, etc.  

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Obviously, I agree that being on the right side of the playoff bubble is preferable to being on the wrong side of it. The problem, of course, is that being a bubble team - by definition - means that your odds of finishing on either side of the line are roughly even. It's not like the team can just will itself into the playoffs.

 

And being on the bubble also means that you will be unlikely to have a clear-cut position on being a "buyer" or "seller" at the deadline. Being a buyer means trading away picks/prospects. We have a lot of picks, but there is no reason to be especially optimistic about a prospect pool which as recently as last season had Romanov as the second best prospect in the system on most rankings. So dealing away prospects does not appeal. 

 

Meanwhile, being a seller doesn't guarantee the #1 overall pick by any means, although it does afford a chance to add some much-needed prospect talent. But that's the thing about bubble teams - they're generally in the mix to make the playoffs, and unwilling to commit suicide while the playoffs remain a realistic goal.

 

This is basically the dilemma the Habs usually find themselves in. It sucks.

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58 minutes ago, Neech said:

Unfortunately, we happen to be in the toughest division with a clear cut top-4 that it's hard to see the Habs cracking.

At the moment the teams in our division occupy spots 10, 12, 14, 22, 24 and 30, having scored a total of 31 points in 32 games. And Buffalo has the most wins in the division, followed by the Red Wings. :blink:

 

I'm not saying that this is how it'll finish, but I do think there are very few iron-clad guarantees in today's NHL.

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1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

We have a lot of picks, but there is no reason to be especially optimistic about a prospect pool which as recently as last season had Romanov as the second best prospect in the system on most rankings.

Romanov hasn't been impressive (in the six games!) so far this season, but he is still only 21, and has played fewer than 55 NHL games. We don't know, but I do believe that he will most likely yet make a significant improvement.

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On 10/24/2021 at 12:20 PM, BCHabnut said:

I sort of agree with hockeyrealist.  This was a sloppy game overall. Very happy they stepped up and won, but they don't seem to have any cohesion on the ice.

The third period was indeed rather sloppy, but then the conclusion was already a done deal by that time. The first and second periods were significant better in that regard.

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15 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

At the moment the teams in our division occupy spots 10, 12, 14, 22, 24 and 30, having scored a total of 31 points in 32 games. And Buffalo has the most wins in the division, followed by the Red Wings. :blink:

 

I'm not saying that this is how it'll finish, but I do think there are very few iron-clad guarantees in today's NHL.

I had to check:

Florida Panthers           tied for 1st 10pt
Buffalo Sabres             10th          7pt
Detroit Red Wings       12th          7pt
Boston Bruins              14th          6pt
Tampa Bay Lightning  21st          5pt
Toronto Maple Leafs   22nd          5pt
Ottawa Senators         24th          4pt
Montreal Cannadiens  30th          2pt
                                                       46pts/42gms (1.095pt/gm)

 

https://www.nhl.com/standings/2021/league

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Deadline trade candidates are pretty clear if we are out of things.

 

Expiring Contracts 

 

Chiarot should get a nice return especially given how he played in last year's playoffs.  A playoff team should want him, knowing that even if he struggles in the regular season, when the refs put the whistles away in the playoffs he can play a shutdown role and over 20 minutes a night. 

 

Paquette and Perreault are the kind of depth forwards who always move at the deadline. 

 

Lehkonen is an RFA and can also be valuable to a playoff team.

 

Kulak would be a good pickup for anyone with a good analytics dept. 

 

Wideman could be trade bait too.
 

1.5 years left

 

Not sure what value Paul Byron would have, but it would certainly increase if the Habs retained half his contract. 

 

Expiring but likely not trade bait.

 

I'd say Niku likely is not traded.


1) If he plays well enough for other teams to have interest, then the Habs should also be interested in signing him (RFA) long-term.  He's only 25.

2) If he is not playing well enough for the Habs to want to re-sign him, then he won't generate much interest around the league. 

 

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41 minutes ago, Commandant said:

Deadline trade candidates are pretty clear if we are out of things.

 

Expiring Contracts 

 

Chiarot should get a nice return especially given how he played in last year's playoffs.  A playoff team should want him, knowing that even if he struggles in the regular season, when the refs put the whistles away in the playoffs he can play a shutdown role and over 20 minutes a night. 

 

Paquette and Perreault are the kind of depth forwards who always move at the deadline. 

 

Lehkonen is an RFA and can also be valuable to a playoff team.

 

Kulak would be a good pickup for anyone with a good analytics dept. 

 

Wideman could be trade bait too.
 

1.5 years left

 

Not sure what value Paul Byron would have, but it would certainly increase if the Habs retained half his contract. 

 

Expiring but likely not trade bait.

 

I'd say Niku likely is not traded.


1) If he plays well enough for other teams to have interest, then the Habs should also be interested in signing him (RFA) long-term.  He's only 25.

2) If he is not playing well enough for the Habs to want to re-sign him, then he won't generate much interest around the league. 

 

 

Good analysis. No question that Charot would fetch a 1st round pick from a contending team looking for an extra defenceman.  

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3 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

Obviously, I agree that being on the right side of the playoff bubble is preferable to being on the wrong side of it. The problem, of course, is that being a bubble team - by definition - means that your odds of finishing on either side of the line are roughly even. It's not like the team can just will itself into the playoffs.

 

And being on the bubble also means that you will be unlikely to have a clear-cut position on being a "buyer" or "seller" at the deadline. Being a buyer means trading away picks/prospects. We have a lot of picks, but there is no reason to be especially optimistic about a prospect pool which as recently as last season had Romanov as the second best prospect in the system on most rankings. So dealing away prospects does not appeal. 

 

Meanwhile, being a seller doesn't guarantee the #1 overall pick by any means, although it does afford a chance to add some much-needed prospect talent. But that's the thing about bubble teams - they're generally in the mix to make the playoffs, and unwilling to commit suicide while the playoffs remain a realistic goal.

 

This is basically the dilemma the Habs usually find themselves in. It sucks.

I think it’s a bigger dilemma than the usual tank, or remain a bubble miss team.  This year the difference is either we lose our 1st rounder, or have a lottery pick.

 

Last year, in the Canadian/North division, I said at the start of the year that it was out best chance due to the Covid realignment to get to the Semis. That was the most optimistic I have been in a long time.  This year I see zero chance at the playoffs this year. With our 1st rounder at stake, I’d rather do a tank. It’s not going to take much to tank - our D sucks, our centre position is weak, and our #1 goalie is out at least a month.

 

id also look at clearing cap room for the future.  go to Gallagher, ask him if he wants to b me around for a rebuild, and hope he waives his NMC/NTC (can’t remember which).  His cap hit is going to get ugly pretty fast anyways.

 

those getting excited over Saturday are delusional. We were better, but really not that good still. Just better than the other dumpster team we were playing.

 

 

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