GDT Dec. 30, Canadiens vs Kotkaniemis, 7 PM

[DON]

2 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

 

1. isolate the team due to COVID-19-22 and do not continue playing: team is not even compliant for pre-season exhibition games (not enough NHL veterans, 1st rounders, etc)

2. send the prospects to Laval and keep them there

3. fill the NHL roster with the Smith-Pelley's of the world if you are going to tank

 

 

Not sure why you are too concerned at the moment.

Players/Owners need to play to make $$ to pay for their mansion's landscaping, is their decision to keep on.

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

11 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

In a year of complete collapse, of course the only hope is a high draft pick. Other than that, the Habs should strive to ice the best team they can every year, while drafting and developing at an elite level. I have no interest in watching us become the Buffalo Sabres, thanks.

 

 

Agree, I don't want us to be like the Sabres either.  A rebuild has to be done carefully as you still need the right veterans to provide mentorship so the rookies learn the right way to avoid the Buffalo/Edmonton situations.  There are teams that have done this well ie. Colorado,  Tampa etc.  These teams should be able to contend for the foreseeable future. That's all you can ask for. 

 

I much prefer the term rebuild to tank but given how this year has gone, tank is the word for this year as everything that could go wrong has gone wrong. 

[alfredoh2009]

The question in my mind is: who are the current veterans that can teach the upcoming rookies and prospects how to win A CUP ?

 

the Habs were building toward that core group last season and it collapsed. Now it looks like the team got nuked to the core and that we are starting from scratch 

Edited December 31, 2021 by alfredoh2009
Changed “year” to “season”

[tomh009]

How to win a Cup ... or at least how to get to the final. Arguably winning the three series including semi-final isn't so much different than winning all four.

 

So, who is left, with playoff-winning experience?

• Savard (won with TB), if still with the team next year
• Toffoli (won with LA), if still with the team next year
• Allen (won with STL, albeit as a backup)
• Price, Edmundson (still on the IR)
• Armia, Lehkonen, Gallagher, Anderson, Petry, Chiarot (whichever ones are left after this season)
• Romanov, Evans, Suzuki, Caufield

[alfredoh2009]

2 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

How to win a Cup ... or at least how to get to the final. Arguably winning the three series including semi-final isn't so much different than winning all four.

 

So, who is left, with playoff-winning experience?

• Savard (won with TB), if still with the team next year
• Toffoli (won with LA), if still with the team next year
• Allen (won with STL, albeit as a backup)
• Price, Edmundson (still on the IR)
• Armia, Lehkonen, Gallagher, Anderson, Petry, Chiarot (whichever ones are left after this season)
• Romanov, Evans, Suzuki, Caufield

 

I think I'll disconnect now and I'll chat again next year (tomorrow if they play).

Today, I cannot see any positives even if I am looking for those.

 

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL FROM THIS POTATO_HEART!!!

Go Habs Go !!!

 

 

[tomh009]

Happy new year, Alfredo!

[hab29RETIRED]

4 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Oh, I agree. This season was hopelessly lost after about 15 games - and maybe before then. A tank is the only option under those circumstances.

 

My wider point, though, is that there is a certain subset of fans that has been crying for a tank job for years, and as a deliberate team-building strategy, not as the consequences of a complete collapse like this year. How often have we heard that we should never be a bubble team; rather we should "blow it all up" and tank hard?

 

THIS is what those fans wanted. Except that a lot of them are now whining about how horrible it is to watch these bums.

 

And they want it over multiple seasons - they just deny this. One of the delusions of the "deliberate tanking" crowd is that one terrible year will do it. You get a high pick and presto! Instant Cup contention. Wrong. (You'd think the Galy/KK disasters would have taught them this, but no). In fact, it usually takes multiple seasons of bottom-feeding suckage - and some teams never come out of it, c.f. Buffalo, or Edmonton for the past 15 years. 

 

In a year of complete collapse, of course the only hope is a high draft pick. Other than that, the Habs should strive to ice the best team they can every year, while drafting and developing at an elite level. I have no interest in watching us become the Buffalo Sabres, thanks.

 

 

 

 

I think we need two years of pain, and given the guys we have, we have no choice.

 

I’ve been saying for that last three years our D sucked, and now we can see how bad the D is. Sure, the Loss of Weber hurt, and makes the ad even worse, but isn’t this around the time most figured we’d see a major decline from him anyways? Losing Edmondson also hurt, but even with him our D would have sucked. We were barely a playoff team in a weak division l, that resulted from a unique situation.  The only real surprise to me is Petry’s level of suckage. I expected the last year of the deal would probably have been bad, but he’s been bad a lot earlier. 
 

I think if we can finally pick up a high-end centre or two over the next two drafts, have Guhle, be a legit top 4, we can get at least back to bubble status in 3 years, and with good management, have a shot at contending. I’d rather have that hope than the “anything can happen” in the playoff approach we have been on.

 

I figured we’d suck, and be around the 75 point mark, but this is beyond that. One thing I think is hard to argue is that MB definitely left the team in a much worse state than he was given when he took the job.

[GHT120]

I think that one thing that makes the losing this season all the more frustrating is with the depleted roster too many players are on the ice recently who are neither of NHL trade value nor "young players" that are hopefully part of the rebuilt team 3-4 years from now.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

It is hard to believe that we are not looking at at least two years of pain. Next year might not be so extreme - but then again, Gorton is probably going to deal away some of our vets, making us worse on paper. Conversely, a new coach will probably mitigate some of the extreme badness we've been forced to see.

 

I agree with Habs29 that this moment was probably inevitable given the combination of aging on the back end and the dismal drafting/development. Rather stunningly, MB achieved the goal of getting the Habs to make a Cup run within the Price/Weber window, but he did absolutely zilch to prepare for the inevitable aging out of Price, Weber, and Petry (just as he did f**k-all to prepare for the equally predictable aging out of Pleks and Markov). I didn't think we'd crash out as hard and suddenly as we have, but in a way, it may be a good thing - it forced ownership's hand and put an end to any thought of desperate patch-up jobs year after year. I hate to say this, but Weber's sad fate was also probably a good thing in pure hockey terms. That contract was one of the worst in all of hockey. 

 

The timeline, to my mind, is now to be heavy duty contenders in 4-5 years, when Suzuki is in his prime (26-7 years old) and still has term left on his contract. I think people always underestimate how long it takes to go from outhouse to penthouse. Also, even if we do emerge as a powerful team, you can expect a couple of playoff flops as the group "learns what it takes" in the postseason.

 

More pain next season, and then, hopefully, a real, if uneven and gradual, upward climb can begin.

[dlbalr]

Who wants to take this afternoon's GDT?

[illWill]

Agreed. I came into this season with much enthusiasm after the Cup run and the new additions. But after a handful of games it was clear that this team is hot garbage without any redeeming qualities to make them enjoyable to watch. I haven't watched a game since October, haven't frequented this thread near as often, or even followed the NHL as closely as usual. To me this whole sport is entertainment first and foremost. Personally I would much rather watch a bubble team fight it out for a playoff spot than to be on board with tanking for any amount of time. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

2 hours ago, illWill said:

Personally I would much rather watch a bubble team fight it out for a playoff spot than to be on board with tanking for any amount of time. 

 

That's fair but the situation we are in now is pretty obvious.  This team is nowhere close to being able to fight for a playoff spot so we need to  look forward to what is the best course of action to make this team competitive over the longer term.  And that is to rebuild which means some short term pain. 

[xXx..CK..xXx]

5 hours ago, illWill said:

Agreed. I came into this season with much enthusiasm after the Cup run and the new additions. But after a handful of games it was clear that this team is hot garbage without any redeeming qualities to make them enjoyable to watch. I haven't watched a game since October, haven't frequented this thread near as often, or even followed the NHL as closely as usual. To me this whole sport is entertainment first and foremost. Personally I would much rather watch a bubble team fight it out for a playoff spot than to be on board with tanking for any amount of time. 

I’m the same. I’ve always preferred, and always will prefer being a bubble team rather than a team finding its way to the basement. The entertainment value is a must and it’s not like I will ever take my future child aside as he excitedly awaits the game after a long day at school and whisper in his ear, “there’s nothing to get excited about Billy, this is a tanking season.” 
 

I am happy that never happened to me in my youth and I hope sport doesn’t develop in such a manner... where players, coaches, management and fans develop a losing mentality... though it already has infiltrated certain subsets of the community. 

[DON]

36 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

I am happy that never happened to me in my youth and I hope sport doesn’t develop in such a manner... where players, coaches, management and fans develop a losing mentality... though it already has infiltrated certain subsets of the community. 

I predicted a 23rd place finish and have watched every game i have been able to and will try to catch the rest till end of year.

Most games are not horrible, with odd stinker not worth watching, but most have at least a couple positives and somewhat entertaining, even if a win is highly unlikely.

Dont buy the losing mentality bit, is simply reality for this particular season anyways. Is no different than September baseball with tons of minor leaguers called up every fall to get some experience or show Mgmt what have to offer.

Sure there is 50 games left to play, but every franchise in sports goes through crappy seasons, just a fact of life...Habs Suck! for this season at least.

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

45 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

I’m the same. I’ve always preferred, and always will prefer being a bubble team rather than a team finding its way to the basement. The entertainment value is a must and it’s not like I will ever take my future child aside as he excitedly awaits the game after a long day at school and whisper in his ear, “there’s nothing to get excited about Billy, this is a tanking season.” 
 

 

Of course you would never say that to Billy. you want young kids to always have hope.  It's better to say something like "it's a big game tonight Billy, if the Habs win they will only be 16 points out of a wild card spot".