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Habs vs CBJ Jan 30 2022 7pm


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1 minute ago, Plutarch said:

Think management is going to try and move Petry at deadline?

 

I don't think a deadline deal is possible with his contract. 

 

summer maybe. 

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1 hour ago, Commandant said:

Its increasingly more and more clear that while Petry was the first guy to quit on ducharme, hes not the only one.

Yes. But not all. Suzuki, Toffoli, Lehkonen, Evans, Poehling, Pitlick, Romanov and a few others are still making an effort. Are they playing for Ducharme? Maybe not, maybe it's for themselves or for CH, but they are at least putting in the effort.

 

Noticeably that's a youngish group of players, apart from Toffoli -- the veterans may be more disgruntled on average.

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15 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

Yes. But not all. Suzuki, Toffoli, Lehkonen, Evans, Poehling, Pitlick, Romanov and a few others are still making an effort. Are they playing for Ducharme? Maybe not, maybe it's for themselves or for CH, but they are at least putting in the effort.

 

Noticeably that's a youngish group of players, apart from Toffoli -- the veterans may be more disgruntled on average.

 

That’s pretty characteristic of player rebellions, I believe. Which is why coaches often take good care to keep the veterans onside.

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1 hour ago, tomh009 said:

Yes. But not all. Suzuki, Toffoli, Lehkonen, Evans, Poehling, Pitlick, Romanov and a few others are still making an effort. Are they playing for Ducharme? Maybe not, maybe it's for themselves or for CH, but they are at least putting in the effort.

 

Noticeably that's a youngish group of players, apart from Toffoli -- the veterans may be more disgruntled on average.

 

In the video that GHT120 posted Toffoli wasn't listening or respecting DD either.  i.e. when DD called them all over, Toffoli was on the far side of the ice at the bench near the blue line but he skated across center ice and went to the boards on the other side near the other blue line before he headed towards the circle.  

 

1 hour ago, Commandant said:

 

I don't think a deadline deal is possible with his contract. 

 

summer maybe. 

 

I totally agree and think that it would be fairly hard to move any of them at the trade deadline that still have multi years left on their contract.  

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9 hours ago, tomh009 said:

Yes. But not all. Suzuki, Toffoli, Lehkonen, Evans, Poehling, Pitlick, Romanov and a few others are still making an effort. Are they playing for Ducharme? Maybe not, maybe it's for themselves or for CH, but they are at least putting in the effort.

 

Noticeably that's a youngish group of players, apart from Toffoli -- the veterans may be more disgruntled on average.

 

goaltending let them down this game, those couple of minutes mid-way in the third showed the team had not given up... until Primeau let it that softie

 

Seems Petry is playing as bad as he can to sabotage any trade potential and to stay in Montreal

 

It was good to see #11 and #41 on the ice

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9 hours ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

In the video that GHT120 posted Toffoli wasn't listening or respecting DD either.  i.e. when DD called them all over, Toffoli was on the far side of the ice at the bench near the blue line but he skated across center ice and went to the boards on the other side near the other blue line before he headed towards the circle. 

Yeah, that may well be (I didn't watch the video). But he is still making an effort in the game, even if it's for himself or his linemates rather than for Ducharme. Even against Edmonton, where they didn't score, they shut down McDavid, Yamamoto and Kane, and that takes some effort.

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4 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Seems Petry is playing as bad as he can to sabotage any trade potential and to stay in Montreal

 

There are two ways to deal with this.  One would be to pressbox him.  The other would be to throw him out there for 30 minutes every night to both punish him and maximize the tank effort.  Hard minutes though...zero time on the powerplay.  Either way, he's a bum and I want him gone...but until that can happen, make him pay.

 

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15 minutes ago, sbhatt said:

There are two ways to deal with this.  One would be to pressbox him.  The other would be to throw him out there for 30 minutes every night to both punish him and maximize the tank effort.  Hard minutes though...zero time on the powerplay.  Either way, he's a bum and I want him gone...but until that can happen, make him pay.

Neither of those two options will make it easier to trade him though.

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59 minutes ago, sbhatt said:

 

There are two ways to deal with this.  One would be to pressbox him.  The other would be to throw him out there for 30 minutes every night to both punish him and maximize the tank effort.  Hard minutes though...zero time on the powerplay.  Either way, he's a bum and I want him gone...but until that can happen, make him pay.

 

A third option would be to play him “Gustafson minutes” and to  boost his trade value by sheltering him 

That is: offensive starts only, second wave PP, no PK and paired with Kulak playing 3rd pair minutes 

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A fourth option. 

 

Fire the coach that he has quit on, and watch him rebuild his trade value. 

 

This isn't the only reason to fire the coach.  Heck its not even close to the primary reason to do it.  But it could be the icing on the cake. 

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17 minutes ago, Commandant said:

A fourth option. 

 

Fire the coach that he has quit on, and watch him rebuild his trade value. 

 

This isn't the only reason to fire the coach.  Heck its not even close to the primary reason to do it.  But it could be the icing on the cake. 

Petry asked for a trade in December. Confirmed on radio this morning

 

Hughes and Gorton are taking their time and letting the situation fester 

 

Coach is a sitting duck; firing him will not move the needle

 

look somewhere else for a scape goat: problem is not at the ice level

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21 minutes ago, Commandant said:

A fourth option. 

 

Fire the coach that he has quit on, and watch him rebuild his trade value. 

 

This isn't the only reason to fire the coach.  Heck its not even close to the primary reason to do it.  But it could be the icing on the cake. 

Or Petry is just a lockerroom cancer like Subban, that simply needs gone for everyone else's benefit. And what can DD do with an selfish player like that?

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31 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Coach is a sitting duck; firing him will not move the needle

 

look somewhere else for a scape goat: problem is not at the ice level

 

On "move the needle"... depends what move the needle means.  If you want to make the playoffs, of course not.  That said I think that removing him would improve the locker room as this team has quit on him.  A breath of fresh air for the club could be good for the environment and create a place where kids are developing better and vets are playing better (helping trade value). 

 

On "look somewhere else for a scape goat: problem is not at the ice level".... that's your opinion, which is fine... doesn't make it fact though.  (not that my opinion is fact either).  Neither of us can know for sure, but I do think this team has quit on the coach which is a problem. 

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30 minutes ago, DON said:

Or Petry is just a lockerroom cancer like Subban, that simply needs gone for everyone else's benefit. And what can DD do with an selfish player like that?

 

he hasn't been a problem his previous six years with the club.  But even if he is a problem and simply needs to go, he's not the only player who has quit on DD and there is no reason to keep DD beyond this year. 

 

But lets assume you are right, he's a cancer who has to go. If we have to trade him, wouldn't you want him to be playing well so that we can get more value out of the deal? Why would you trade him at his lowest value?

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13 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

On "move the needle"... depends what move the needle means.  If you want to make the playoffs, of course not.  That said I think that removing him would improve the locker room as this team has quit on him.  A breath of fresh air for the club could be good for the environment and create a place where kids are developing better and vets are playing better (helping trade value). 

 

On "look somewhere else for a scape goat: problem is not at the ice level".... that's your opinion, which is fine... doesn't make it fact though.  (not that my opinion is fact either).  Neither of us can know for sure, but I do think this team has quit on the coach which is a problem. 


the NHL is not a development league. Obvious if you look at Primeau, Heart (PHI) and other goalies who were brought in too soon

Caufield is another example

 

A breath of fresh air is what Gorton and Hughes were supposed to be: that new voice that sets the direction and determines the team values

 

 

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IF Petry said he wanted out; and IF the Habs agreed in principle to try moving him; THEN he is being a complete scumbag by stinking out the joint night after night, making it harder for the Habs to get a decent return.

 

If the Habs were non-committal, then I can understand Petry sulking...still unprofessional, though.

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1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Petry asked for a trade in December. Confirmed on radio this morning ...

Until Petry, his agent, Hughes or Gorton confirms the request there is no confirmation ... it is a radio host making claims that a friend of a friends cousin's barber's milkman said so (hyperbole for effect).

 

1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

... Hughes and Gorton are taking their time and letting the situation fester 

Coach is a sitting duck; firing him will not move the needle

look somewhere else for a scape goat: problem is not at the ice level

Clearly the solution is not at ice level (and "the solution" currently is not more wins, just better effort) ... and I think plenty of people are looking at Petry and a few others as scapegoats as well ... I have to wonder what you think Hughes and Gorton should be doing to make the players give a damn and listen to their coach.

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27 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:


the NHL is not a development league. Obvious if you look at Primeau, Heart (PHI) and other goalies who were brought in too soon

Caufield is another example

 

A breath of fresh air is what Gorton and Hughes were supposed to be: that new voice that sets the direction and determines the team values

 

 

 

The NHL may not be a development league for most teams.  When you have 8 wins in 44 games, development becomes the focus of the rest of the season. 

 

The GMs can be a breath of fresh air in the front office.  The dressing room also needs to be refreshed at this point. 

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2 hours ago, Commandant said:

 

he hasn't been a problem his previous six years with the club.  But even if he is a problem and simply needs to go, he's not the only player who has quit on DD and there is no reason to keep DD beyond this year. 

 

But lets assume you are right, he's a cancer who has to go. If we have to trade him, wouldn't you want him to be playing well so that we can get more value out of the deal? Why would you trade him at his lowest value?

Weber likely kept him in-check, as my avatar did with Subban.

 

Do you think Petry would of been as outspoken with Weber as Captain? I do not.

 

FOR SURE I want Petry playing consistently well and 100% effort, not what we have seen for 40+games, pisses me off, if it isnt an actual physical injury causing him to play like a Kulak.

 

Oh well, maybe he is just coasting into retirement or whiny because i want a "ring" mentality and I am getting old?

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If we look back at last season, Petry was MUCH better under Julien than he was under DD.  The fall off happened before Weber left. 

 

There were already issues with Petry and DD last year.... there were issues with DD and KK too. 

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59 minutes ago, Commandant said:

If we look back at last season, Petry was MUCH better under Julien than he was under DD.  The fall off happened before Weber left.

So, Petry had a super start to the season, he was averaging around 0.9 points/game until Julien exited after 23 Feb. That pace continued for another month, until late March, when he went into bit of a dry spell. For the last 25 games his pace dropped to 0.6 points/game -- and I think that period pretty much matches the Habs' late-season tailspin. Did Ducharme piss off Petry and that caused the poor team play? Or the team was losing so Petry got pissed off at Ducharme? Or Petry's play dropped off so Ducharme got on his case?

 

I suspect we'll never know the details. But the 0.9 points/game was WAY above his career average with the Habs of about 0.5; the 0.6 was still a very decent pace.

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2 hours ago, Commandant said:

If we look back at last season, Petry was MUCH better under Julien than he was under DD.  The fall off happened before Weber left. 

 

There were already issues with Petry and DD last year.... there were issues with DD and KK too. 

Petry was solid in playoffs and he had cold spells every year, even under Julien he sucked balls for stretches and we saw lots of glimpses why Oilers got rid of him.

 

If he is pissed at DD, SO F'in WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! he has 20-30 other co-workers to consider, especially when he is supposed to be a leader of the god damn team.

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4 minutes ago, DON said:

Petry was solid in playoffs and he had cold spells every year, even under Julien he sucked balls for stretches and we saw lots of glimpses why Oilers got rid of him.

 

If he is pissed at DD, SO F'in WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! he has 20-30 other co-workers to consider, especially when he is supposed to be a leader of the god damn team.

 

He's not the only one of those 20-30 coworkers who are pissed at DD. 

 

This isn't the first time a coach has lost the room... and it won't be the first time one gets fired as a result. 

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